What is your preferred shark rig? So far I have only used yakked rigs with smaller 8/0 circles. I need to put together some casting rigs and some bigger yakked rigs for the 2017 season.
For my big rigs I will probably run a sliding trace and a bite leader, with a connector between them. The sliding trace will start with a swivel (it'll be a crane swivel rated in the 600-900 pound range), then 30' of 600 pound mono as the sliding trace, and then another swivel at the end of this. I'm going to double crimp everything on this, with 18" between each crimp. The 18" section will have the #600 mono twisted up, hoping that it will keep the sinker from sliding off of the trace and onto the main line, and also that it will make leadering a little bit easier. There will also be a 300-400 pound coastlock snap swivel on the main section of this rig for the sinker slide.
Then there will be the bite leader. I'm thinking 10' of either single strand wire or cable - what do you prefer here? I'll probably go with the heaviest thing I can get, which is either 900-1000 pound cable, or 360 pound single strand. It'll either be haywire twisted or double crimped with a loop for attachment. At the end will be an 18/0 or a 20/0 circle hook (leaning towards the 20/0), again either double crimped or haywire twisted.
For a connection - I will use a 3/16" galvanized shackle from Home Depot. These seem to be pretty much unbreakable, at least by any fish that I'm catching with a Senator.
Weights will be homemade claw-style weights, I will probably make a few different combinations of sizes. Thinking 4" to 5" long tubes that are 1/2" to 3/4" in diameter, and legs made of 8 to 10 gauge wire.
I don't want this to be a super long post so I will post my casted leader idea in another post.
40 ft of total leader is going to put whoever is on the rod way away up a dune from the action in the dark from the wire man, if the rod man needs to back off. You need to be a bit closer, remember a star drag is going to be more difficult to back off in the dark than a lever, and with the rig you're putting together you're gonna end up in the dirt if the wire man has to let go and you can't respond quickly enough. 12' multistrand 480 cable will be beyond the tail of most anything, crimped to another a ten feet off 200lb mono. This is pretty much what Daron sent me, and he is fishing it on a 14/0 I believe, with 130 or 150 lb mono, and you may rest assured his motor is up to snuff for 50 lbs drag if he needs it if not well more. You can use a length of single strand as bite leader if you wish; there is an ongoing debate of preference here. Daron discussed this a couple weeks back.
I'm sure others will have opinions but I think this rig will be more than heavy enough for your 9/0 spooled with 60 mono running line....anything large enough to require what you detailed is highly unlikely to come in any time soon with 20 lbs of drag from the beach, and you'd have to button down to keep from getting spooled, to the point you may pop off. If you fish 50 lbs of drag, may as well be standing on a wakeboard and get a ride out of it...
Okay, my casted rig will start with a 300-400 pound swivel tied onto the main line. Next will be 6' of 400 pound mono (maybe 300 pound), probably just single crimped, but maybe double. There will be a coastlock snap swivel on here for a sinker slide, probably just those same 300-400 pound ones used on the other rod. At the end of this, I will crimp on a 300-400 pound snap swivel for a connector. I don't think those galvanized shackles will work well on a casted rig - probably a little too heavy.
The bite leader will be simple - 2' of single strand wire, somewhere in the 120-180 pound range. Haywire twisted at both ends, one kept open so it can be connected to the sliding trace, and one with a hook on the end. I will probably go with Eagle Claw circle sea hooks here, the 7/0 size can handle any bull red I come across and any shark that my casting tackle could handle.
Weights will be 3 and 5 ounce snake tongue sinkers for light to medium current, and then I'll build a few lighter claw-style sinkers for heavier current.
For those sized sharks I would go with a #12 bite leader about 14-16 inches long using a 10/-12/0 2X circle hook on one end & a 250# barrel swivel on the other end, both with haywire twists. Then attach a 250# stranded wire leader about 8 ft. long with double crimps to the barrel swivel. Then attach 15 ft. of 200# mono to the barrel swivel with double crimps. Slide on a small barrel swivel on the 200# mono for your slider weight. Use a couple of feet of 30-40# mono for your sinker on that swivel so the sinker breaks off during the fight & you are fighting the fish not the weight. Then on the end of the 200# mono leader attach another 250# barrel swivel. This will all attach to your main line which should have a 350# ball bearing snap lock swivel on the end. The heavier the wire you use the more likely they will shy away from your bait. If you are running into small sharks just use the bite leader attached to the 200# mono. Rudy
Rowdy, some components in that look a bit light to me. Here's my (new) logic with this:
On the 9/0, I'll be targeting any size shark around here that I can't handle on casting gear (currently, that is an Ambassadeur 7000, and will be upgraded sooner or later). Let's put the limit at 5-6 feet on that setup, and that's with a little bit of luck. That means anything over that 5-6 foot mark, I will be targeting on the 9/0. Now, the only 10'+ sharks you have a chance of catching from short would be a tiger or a great hammerhead - in NC, I don't know of many big hammerheads being caught, but tigers are another story. They're not abundant, but they are definitely out there. I have full confidence that once the 9/0 is done, I could handle a 10' tiger with it. Could I go larger? Only time and luck will tell. But for now, let's say that this rig is targeting fish in the 6-10 foot range - meaning I want something right in between my casted rig and my original kayak rig.
To me, that means something done the same way as the heavier kayaked rig, just toned down. 500 pound swivels, same sinker slides, same sinkers, 15' of 500 pound mono, little bit smaller shackle for a connector, about 8 feet of 300 pound wire, and then a circle hook that's roughly the equivalent of a 15/0 or 16/0. That's a finished length of under 25 feet, which is a lot more manageable for both me and the leader man. It should, in theory, be able to handle a 6-10 foot shark pretty well.
Just my thoughts. What's the purpose of the two different wire leaders? wouldn't it make sense to have just the same strength of wire through the entire rig? You would also eliminate having another swivel in there, which is another potential place that the rig can fail.
I know I'm probably overthinking this, I'm almost sure there's no way that the OG shark fishermen ever went through this much trouble just to catch fish. I could throw a length of wire, a sinker slide, and a hook on there and would probably still catch fish fine, lol. But building high-quality rigs to test is part of the fun :)
Hi,
For your casting rig, I would consider it all a bit too heavy duty. We do quite a bit of shark fishing off the beach here in southern Africa, mainly in our competitions, where weight is the scoring factor. While recently we have pretty much moved over to using fixed spool reels (spinners) and braid, we used to do a lot with multipliers (conventionals) and nylon.
First thing you will probably find is that your ABU 7000 is going to be marginal on line capacity, unless you put a lot of braid backing on before switching to mono top shot. Typically, we were using reels like Finnor, Torium and Trinidad 30 or Sealine 50, purely because of the strength of drag and capacity - the drag on the 7000 is going to be a very limiting factor if you get something close to the upper size limits of 5-6'.
The rigs that we cast in either the conventional or spinner reels are as per the picture below' used with a casting leader of 100-150lb braid or mono depending on which reel/line type we are using.
(http://i1381.photobucket.com/albums/ah205/JeriDr/Trace%20Complete_zps4cxhlkrh.jpg?1494458699180)
I appreciate that it is not using circle hooks, but that would be an easy substitute. The total length of wire is about 4-5 feet long, 100lb swivel at the top, crimped stop in the middle, bead and swivel to carry a nylon dropper for the sinker - longer than the remainder of the hook length. Hook length no more than 3 feet long, double hooks, one sliding to mount the bait, and adjustable for size of bait. The wire is simply 135 or 270lb nylon coated 7 strand, single crimped at all junctions.
Over the years I have seen huge amounts of money wasted on rigs and tackle for sharks, going way oversize as soon as the word 'shark' comes into the equation. The rig above we happily cast reasonable distances - 100 metres + (300 feet)with no real problems, and all fished generally on mainlines 40-50lbs. With this type of set up local anglers are quite happy to fish for sharks up to 8 foot or slightly more, with no real problems. The only time we generally use the heavier wire is when we encounter Bluntnosed Sevengill sharks, otherwise 135lb is more than adequate for Copper sharks.
(http://i1381.photobucket.com/albums/ah205/JeriDr/Bronzie%20-%20112.5kg_zpspepnjbed.jpg?1494458699181&1494458729624&1494458737831)
An 8' Copper shark landed on 50lb braid, weighed in at about 100kgs (220lbs) by an angler in my club, during a local competition. The essense is that lighter rigs will cast further and have more flexibility to not deter the sharks, at times they are very much 'eating machines', but others they can be as finicky as a wild brook trout.
Hope this helps.
Cheers from sunny Africa
Jeri
Pretty picture there :)
Wow, thanks for that impressive write-up! Yeah, the Abu is definitely not the best reel for the task - I was planning on about 300 yards of 30# braid with the rest 30# mono on top. I would've liked to have 50# braid underneath, but it won't give me enough capacity. I might have to find an old Jigmaster (like the 505HS that I just got rid of) and load it with 300 yards of 50# braid with 30# mono on top - it would probably make for a much nicer setup.
That is one slick-looking rig, I'll tell you that. I might have to steal the idea, maybe modify it a little bit. Is the sinker fixed in place, or sliding? I will definitely be going with circle hooks - I don't want to risk a shark's life if I don't have to.
Given me a lot of thoughts as to rig design! Thanks for your insight. Oh yeah, awesome shark as well!
The sinker is mounted on the small coil of nylon shown in the picture, so it has limited slide capability, before the shark feels the anchorage. The point to all this, is that the rod is held, and as soon as it starts to pull down and run, you set the hook. This inevitably hooks in the corner of the mourh, very, very rarely anywhere else. The bead infront of the sliding swivel is to stop that sliding swivel jamming over the midway stop crimp.
The real secret is to rig the bottom hook as a stiff rig. Pass the wire down through the eye, then two turns around the shank of the hook, then back up through the eye to be crimped. Pulled tight before the crimping is done, means that the hook point is always pointing in the direction of the wire and mainline - no 'floppy hook' situation. Just to make it tidy, we pop a little heat shrink over the crimp and end of the wire, to stop accidentally spiking on the cut end of wire.
I always look to the words of my angling mentor - fish are not impressed by complexity - keep it simple and tidy.
Cheers from sunny Africa
Jeri
bs, you asked for a recomendation for 7-8 ft. sharks & then compared the rigs I suggested for 10 ft. plus sharks. You asked for suggestions but it seems you just want to rig for a 20 Ft. Great White and fight it with a baitcaster. By the way an 8 ft. bite leader is going to get kinked pretty quick no matter how heavy it is. Why ask if you think you know what to rig? Rudy
Hi 'biggiesmalls',
I would observe that you are perhaps falling into the trap of over designing your end tackle for bigger sharks - a common mistake. The thing is to design things down to the respective components and then balance out the whole set up, usually by going down in size rather than up.
A shark trace is generally made up of two section, the bite piece, which is where the hooks are, and is going to come into contact with the teeth on the beastie. Having biting pieces too long does not achieve anything significant, it just need to be strong enough to withstand the teeth, and long enough that the shark doesn't get beyond the wire, when the bait is in the mouth. So, even for a very large shark, the mouth size is the key dmension, perhaps on some of the much bigger sharks that you anticipate with your 'kayak baits', it would suggest a maximum of 3' long for the wire. As you anticiapte on using circle hooks, once hooked up, there will be no wire inside the shark's mouth, it will hopefully have been hooked int he corner of the mouth.
The next part of the trace deals with the abrasive nature of the skin of the sharks, which is basically microscopic small teeth - so very rough, but not that rough that it warrents the use of wire. Heavy nylon is the way to go here, and the choice of a particular brand of nylon might well improve performance. Generally we previously looked for 'hard' mono, as used by commercial longliners, as it is very resistant to abrasion. The length of the rubbing leader needs to be at least the length of the largest shark you are likely to encounter, plus perhaps a little to be safe. For 10' sharks, I would suggest that a 12' rubbing leader would be more than sufficient. Hard mono is very resiliant, sit down with a piece stretched between your knees, and rub away with some sand paper - see just how long it takes to impact significantly on the strength of the line - you'll be surprised. Then compare your sanding motions as to the very limited rubbing motion that a nylon trace gets when rubbing over shark skin during a long fight.
Now connections between the two sections - biting and rubbing needs to be no stronger that the waekest component - if using 250lb wire, then a 250lb swivel is the most that is going to be needed. As is the swivel that you are going to connect to your main line.
Going over the top in strengths is wasteful, and ultimately hinders the performance of the whole rig, as it all becomes heavy and cumbersome, especially when the sharks are not in a frenzy type feeding mode, there will be times that you experience sharks that will bite quite shyly, almost in a nervous fashion, and this is where overly heavy rigs will certainly hinder your getting a hook up.
Ultimately, you don't want to build a rig that would could get a second job towing small ships, but something that will just deal with the different aspects of the shark fight you anticipate.
As said on our casting rigs, we just use a 100-150lb mono as the rubbing leader when we were using multipliers and nylon. Now that we are using braid and spinning type reels, we just use a rubbing leader of 100-150lb braid (easier to cast). It very rarely gets rubbed through during fights with our long rods that last up to 2 hours.
Small is good, big is not better.
Hope that helps.
Cheers from sunny Africa.
Jeri
Quote from: Jeri on May 11, 2017, 10:15:56 AM
Hi 'biggiesmalls',
I would observe that you are perhaps falling into the trap of over designing your end tackle for bigger sharks - a common mistake. The thing is to design things down to the respective components and then balance out the whole set up, usually by going down in size rather than up.
A shark trace is generally made up of two section, the bite piece, which is where the hooks are, and is going to come into contact with the teeth on the beastie. Having biting pieces too long does not achieve anything significant, it just need to be strong enough to withstand the teeth, and long enough that the shark doesn't get beyond the wire, when the bait is in the mouth. So, even for a very large shark, the mouth size is the key dmension, perhaps on some of the much bigger sharks that you anticipate with your 'kayak baits', it would suggest a maximum of 3' long for the wire. As you anticiapte on using circle hooks, once hooked up, there will be no wire inside the shark's mouth, it will hopefully have been hooked int he corner of the mouth.
The next part of the trace deals with the abrasive nature of the skin of the sharks, which is basically microscopic small teeth - so very rough, but not that rough that it warrents the use of wire. Heavy nylon is the way to go here, and the choice of a particular brand of nylon might well improve performance. Generally we previously looked for 'hard' mono, as used by commercial longliners, as it is very resistant to abrasion. The length of the rubbing leader needs to be at least the length of the largest shark you are likely to encounter, plus perhaps a little to be safe. For 10' sharks, I would suggest that a 12' rubbing leader would be more than sufficient. Hard mono is very resiliant, sit down with a piece stretched between your knees, and rub away with some sand paper - see just how long it takes to impact significantly on the strength of the line - you'll be surprised. Then compare your sanding motions as to the very limited rubbing motion that a nylon trace gets when rubbing over shark skin during a long fight.
Now connections between the two sections - biting and rubbing needs to be no stronger that the waekest component - if using 250lb wire, then a 250lb swivel is the most that is going to be needed. As is the swivel that you are going to connect to your main line.
Going over the top in strengths is wasteful, and ultimately hinders the performance of the whole rig, as it all becomes heavy and cumbersome, especially when the sharks are not in a frenzy type feeding mode, there will be times that you experience sharks that will bite quite shyly, almost in a nervous fashion, and this is where overly heavy rigs will certainly hinder your getting a hook up.
Ultimately, you don't want to build a rig that would could get a second job towing small ships, but something that will just deal with the different aspects of the shark fight you anticipate.
As said on our casting rigs, we just use a 100-150lb mono as the rubbing leader when we were using multipliers and nylon. Now that we are using braid and spinning type reels, we just use a rubbing leader of 100-150lb braid (easier to cast). It very rarely gets rubbed through during fights with our long rods that last up to 2 hours.
Small is good, big is not better.
Hope that helps.
Cheers from sunny Africa.
Jeri
Thanks for the reply Jeri. My thought process is that since there are big sharks around, going with heavier rather than light tackle is better. That's at least the general thought that people go by over here. I believe #19 wire is what a lot of people use for big tigers and hammerheads, with #15 being popular for sharks at 6-8 feet and #10 or #12 more popular for anything less than 6 foot (just going by what I've been picking up here). Downsizing the rig is a very interesting idea, and you've got some nice-looking sharks caught on one of those rigs to match - one thing I've got to ask, exactly how long would one of those rigs last? I'm pretty much definitely set on trying one of them, perhaps modifying them a little bit to match the conditions here. That brings up another question - how similar are African beaches to beaches in the Carolinas? This could be a reason for heavier tackle that's used here.
I am not trying to take the side of "heavy tackle vs light tackle" - I am more interested in learning, and getting it right rather than "my side" being right.
I have just realized - you cast all of your baits, don't you? We will be kayaking lots of baits off the beach, but we will be casting some as well. The kayaked baits will be larger, and a bit tougher in case something big comes along.
This is very interesting, and a little weird to hear - 3' of wire is not something that I'm used to hearing. I've heard anywhere from 4 to 12, and I've seen some 2' bite leaders for casted gear - but 3' max is new to me. Although that's a good point that seems overlooked - with a circle hook, there isn't much of a chance of the wire going in the mouth of a fish. The ONLY case I could think of - would be with a very wide shark, that managed to get hooked in one side of the mouth, then ran towards the beach and managed to get the wire in its mouth - which is a very unlikely situation. It could happen, yes, but it would be a freak incident.
I was definitely planning on some heavy mono after the wire. I believe over here, Lindgren Pitman mono is the heaviest, toughest stuff available for a reasonable price. A 12' leader sounds perfect, plenty manageable for the leaderer, and easy enough to transport too.
It will be interesting to see if the lighter rigs truly do work far better than heavier ones. I know the less metal the better with shark rigs, I have never heard the smaller the better though - like I said, everyone here goes super heavy.
What size sharks have you managed to bring in on the 100-150 pound mono rubbing leader? Also, what size wire do you prefer to use for different sized sharks?
Thank you very much, your posts have been very helpful :)
Quote from: RowdyW on May 11, 2017, 01:23:50 AM
bs, you asked for a recomendation for 7-8 ft. sharks & then compared the rigs I suggested for 10 ft. plus sharks. You asked for suggestions but it seems you just want to rig for a 20 Ft. Great White and fight it with a baitcaster. By the way an 8 ft. bite leader is going to get kinked pretty quick no matter how heavy it is. Why ask if you think you know what to rig? Rudy
Hi Rowdy, thanks for the reply. I'm a little confused what you're saying in the first part -
"you asked for a reccomendation for 7-8 ft. sharks & then compared the rigs I suggested for 10 ft. plus sharks."
As far as the rest - I'm definitely not trying to rig up for a 20' shark, I'm just trying to go off of what I've seen used before. The components were influenced by those used by Tunastick (member on Sharksonthesand) and by BlacktipH on youtube. They both have a "heavier is better" attitude when it comes to things - partly, I think, because when that monster hammerhead or tiger hits their bait, they want to prioritize landing it as quickly as possible without worrying about their gear being damaged. Not a bad thing per se, but with that, 9.9/10 sharks you come across won't be as fun to catch.
That's a good point about the 8' bite leader - if a shark wraps up in it, it'll be kinked badly. I think Jeri's suggestion of 3' max is a good figure, I'll play around with it and see how much abuse it takes to break the stuff.
I'm not trying to come off as rude or anything, just trying to defend the other side of things here (the "go heavy" side) so that ultimately, both have a fighting chance and I can properly determine which will suit the task better. I think I know what to rig (well at least I thought, you and Jeri have given me a few ideas), but I wanted to check on here to see what everyone thought of them. Turns out, they just might be a bit too heavy for my intended uses.
Oh, Jeri - I have a few other questions about your rig if you don't mind me asking.
1) What weights are you using? Standard pyramid weights, claw-style weights, spider-style, or something else? What weight do you find sufficient for your style of fishing?
2) I am a bit confused on the length of the rig in your picture - is there 3 feet of wire there, or 5?
3) What kind of setup are you using to cast these out? Interested to hear what length of rod you're using, and what reel/line setup you're getting 100 yards of distance with.
Well you had better take a closer look at the rods & reels they are using. It looks like you are going to have to trade in that Abu & 9/0 Penn for a 14/0 Penn, or an 80 or 130 2 speed loaded with 200# main line. If you want to catch them quickly & cleanly what you have is not anywhere near enough to cut it humanly. And you will need a 5' 6"-6' rod about 80-130# to start. Rollers optional. Rudy
Yeah, they're using some crazy stuff. Tunastick runs stuff like 14/0 Senators, 12/0 Everols, and 80w Internationals. BlacktipH recommends nothing but Tiagra 130's, but he's sponsored by Shimano now so pretty sure he won't recommend anything except for their most expensive reels. As far as quickly, I think that any shark 8 feet or over will give my 9/0 a run for its money. I plan on loading up with some 60 pound mono that tests well over 60#, which should give me plenty of capacity to work with. Either that, or 50# mono with 50-100 yards of 80# on top.
The current rod I'll be rolling with is a 5'8" 40-80, custom built by John (thorhammer). It's going to be one sweet rod when it's finished, if John chimes in here again I'm sure he'll back me up on that one. It'll have straight turbos, it used to have rollers on it but I went turbos so I had less stuff to gunk up on me and less stuff to do maintenance on.
I have a pair of 9/0s upgraded w/Brian's 7 stack drags, delron under gear/overstack washers, Aluminum frames, SS ProChallenger helical cut gears, SS arms, AlanTani offset handles, and new bearings. The stock aluminum spools hold 650yds of JB solid core 100lb and 150yds of 100lb mono (joined with FG Chain knots). I have them on fully rollered IGFA 80 class Penn Tuna sticks. I look forward to testing them out on some Pelagics.
Just sharing as an option.
John
Thanks for the response John. Yours have much more upgrades than mine will, don't give me any ideas! ;)
I've got Brian's 7 stack, SS main and pinion gear (or at least SS-coated), new arm and handle from Smooth Drags, and a SS gear sleeve from Alan. I'll have mine on a 40-80 pound 5'8" stand up rod from John (thorhammer), with full turbos. My reel's also powder coated. I don't think I'm going with braid, not necessarily because it'll get cut off but more because it's expensive, and I've already put a lot into it.
Hi 'biggiesmalls',
Differences between African beaches and Carolinas?? Both probably have sand, edged with salty water, tides that go in and out, long shore oceanic current and underwatre features like sandbars with gullies - basically probably not a lot, just the species that swim in those waters.
As to how long rigs last, well that would all depend on usage and the number of sharks caught. However, I think that you have mixed up my two posts, one was aimed at cast baits, the next baits taken out by kayak. Nearly all our shark fishing is with cast baits, as this has been determined by our competition rules, which do influence most folks fishing styles and techniques.
To achieve this we mostly use rods between 13' and 15' depending on reel type - we have found longer rods work better with fixed spool reels (spinners). Here in Namibia it is mostly 1 piece rods, but in South Africa they favour 3 piece rods of similar proportions. The rods are nearly all carbon composite construction and depending on the construction designed to cast from 6oz + bait up to 10oz + bait, dependant on the person and the conditions prevailing. As said there has been a huge changeover to fixed spool and braided lines and we are now sing slightly lighter proportioned rods, the favoured are either 7oz + bait or 8oz + bait.
Our main target species is the Copper shark - as per the picture, maximum size is about 8-10' overall length, so we don't have the issues of large Tiger or Hammerhead sharks to contend with in our waters. However, most reels are loaded with braid in the 50-80lb line range, though we formerly used to use nylon in the 40-50lb range and multiplier reels.
As to your other questions, we generally use grapnel/breakaway type sinkers to anchor the larger baits that we cast, due to the amount of cross current that we experience. It is a factor of the power of the water on the bait, rather than on the line that is the issue. Though there are two schools of thought. One suggests large baits soaked for up to 1 hour before refreshing, the other school of thought is smaller baits that are allowed to only soak for 20-30 minutes before refreshing and re-cast to the exact same area. The issue is scent being carried off the bait, acting as the attractant to passing sharks.
The length of the rig in the picture is 5', as that is a dedicated casting rig, which would be knotted to a casting leader of 100-150lb braid. The casting leder would then be tied to the braid main line of 40-50lb braid. We would normally look to have a reelw ith a maximum of 600 metres of main line, as it is not unusual to need nearly all of it, and very occassionally you might just get spooled by something that has an urgent appointment in Brazil!!!
As mentioned above the rods are 14-15' long just to drop the bigger baits out to 100 metres, but for some of our much smaller sharks - sub 6', we would at competition level be looking to present baits much further out, but in those circumstances we would be using a 6oz + small bait, like a mullet head, and be casting to over 150 metres. Distance is king in our fishery, especially at competition time, but for those species, we would down size to 30lb braid to maximise casting opportunity, and reduce the size of the leader strength.
You question about leader strength and wire sizes is very dependant on species. For all our sharks - so sub-10' long we would not experience a problem with the 100-150lb nylon or braid leaders, unless the sea bed had a lot of rocks or reef nearby. Wire sizes are a different matter, for Copper sharks 135lb nylon coated is more than sufficient, have landed them on 90lb 7 strand nylon coated. However, we do at times get a lot of Sevengill sharks which have awesome dentation and then we increase to either 270lb 7 strand nylon coated or 175lb 49 strand plain stainless wire. The point or preference for not using single strand is that it does not present a bait that is mobile and able to move well in the wash of the sea, and it has issues with kinking. This flexibility nature of the hook length wire is also attributed to how we prepare our baits at times, we do on occassions build a bait of cutlets surrounding a central core of floatation material, all bound together with elasticated bait thread. This then presents a bait close to the sea bed, but off the bottom, that moves about and lets scent off more quickly than a static bottom sitting bait - just a local technique that we use especially in cleaner water.
Hope all the above gives you some interesting items to consider when planning your next fishing trip.
Cheers from sunny Africa.
Jeri
Okay, so for comparison - our beaches are pretty much all sand, very few rocks here. Some shells, but nothing crazy. Can't recall how many sandbars are at the spot, but it's nothing ridiculous. I'd imagine the beaches are pretty similar, then.
It looks like I did mix up your posts - I didn't know you were talking about separate kayaked and casted rigs. I don't know if I have access to a 13-15' rod - few people go over 12' here, with maybe the odd 13' rod showing up. As far as our species, we've mostly got sandbar and blacktip sharks that max out at about 6 feet, maybe a little bigger. We also have sand tigers which fight like wet towels but get 8-10 feet, and then bulls which can get 8 feet, duskies that can reach 10 feet, and tigers that can rarely get up to 12 feet. We've got sharpnoses and dogfish that max out at like 3' as well. So it sounds like 9/10 sharks we catch could be caught on the rigs you use.
As far as sinkers, the grapnel sinker you're talking about is what some people call a spider weight here (myself included). This is actually what I was planning on using for casting, so that's good. Then there are bigger ones that people make (I believe Daron has a thread on them) by placing copper wire inside of a copper pipe, and then filling it with lead. These hold super well in any kind of current, and are pretty cheap to build.
Okay, so for your casting rig - you've got a 5' trace of wire with double hooks, sinker dropper, and then maybe 8-10 feet of 100-150 pound mono? Then for a kayaked rig, 3' of heavier wire with a 12' section of heavier mono, either single or double hooks, and the same sinker setup.
What do you feel the advantages/disadvantages of a sliding sinker are, versus a fixed sinker on a breakaway dropper? Do you have a way to get the sinkers back, or do you just leave them? I'd imagine after enough sharks, the sinkers get expensive to replace.
Two other questions off the top of my head - one, what pound mono are you using on the bigger sharks? 100-150 on the smaller guys, then maybe something like 200-300 pound for the larger fish? And two - what's the thought behind fishing with a maximum of 3' of wire for bigger sharks, while there's a 5' trace for smaller sharks on casted setups?
Thanks, and sorry for all the questions :)
Drew
Hi Drew,
Right now we have some species to work with; everything up to and including Sand Tiger, I would happily use my casting rig. We get Sand Tigers down in South Africa, they call them 'Raggies'. On Bulls and Tigers I would increase the wire strength, and possibly the length, but dealing with Tiger sharks on surf rods is for the young and strong. Bull sharks are encountered down in South Africa, called Zambezis, as they occassionally are found up that river system.
The point of the slightly longer wire system on the cast baits is that we do fish near rocks and reef, and it just allows a little more insurance against getting rubbed off on a reef, and something to grab hold of, when leadering the sharks in the surf. On a 'kayak' bait, you are generally looking to drop baits well away from underwater obstructions, so no need for the extra length of wire. I used to do a lot of boat fishing for sharks, and even then only used 18-24" wire sections - never had need for longer.
On the sinkers - do a google search of 'breakaway sinkers' - loads of pictures. We normally get our sinkers back, so not a real issue. But, even then, when you compare the cost of a trip to the sea, food, fuel, bait, etc - the cost of a few sinkers is mimimal. The sliding sinker does allow the shark a limited amount of movement before feeling the sinker drak on the bottom, which when they are wary might mean the difference between a hook up or not. They are not the impulsive instant eating machines people believe, they can be quite sensitive about what they eat at times - hence trying to give the bait a bit of possible movement.
On the issue of leaders, we currently use 100-150lb braid leaders on our casting rigs, and have no problems with the sharks that we catch or the length of the fight. On kayak baits, sure go a little heavier if that makes you feel confident. As said before sit down with some fine sand paper and try and rub through a heavy mard mono leader, it takes a lot of time to significantly compromise the stength.
On the length of rods, our 14-15' are what the local market have adapted to, they are not like typical US style surf rods, which have mostly evolved from spinning. The design and actions of the rods are very different, much more faster tapers (tip only action), while your rods are more through action for ease of spinning. Neither are right or wrong, just look to find a rod blank that has some backbone to be able to cast the weight of bait and sinker you intend to use.
The use of spinner reels and heavy braid is a huge step forward in getting casting distance, but you do have to be aware of the strength of the braid when buying the reel, to find something that matches. Older style multipliers are fine, you mentioned a Jigmaster, but they are limited to only using nylon and have a limit to what you can achieve with the drag. We are generally using bigger spinners which are offering 40lbs + of drag, and at times that is all being used.
Hope that clears up some of your questions.
Cheers
Jeri
Quote from: biggiesmalls on May 10, 2017, 11:55:30 PM
Wow, thanks for that impressive write-up! Yeah, the Abu is definitely not the best reel for the task - I was planning on about 300 yards of 30# braid with the rest 30# mono on top. I would've liked to have 50# braid underneath, but it won't give me enough capacity. I might have to find an old Jigmaster (like the 505HS that I just got rid of) and load it with 300 yards of 50# braid with 30# mono on top - it would probably make for a much nicer setup.
That is one slick-looking rig, I'll tell you that. I might have to steal the idea, maybe modify it a little bit. Is the sinker fixed in place, or sliding? I will definitely be going with circle hooks - I don't want to risk a shark's life if I don't have to.
Given me a lot of thoughts as to rig design! Thanks for your insight. Oh yeah, awesome shark as well!
Just to chime in here, if your idea is to cast with a multiplier, you should look at something other than a Jigmaster. I know you can pimp them with all the extra stuff you can get in the US, but as a fishing tool, out the box a Finnor Lethal 30 is a much better choice, it holds more line and casts very well. Old Toriums and Trinidads are also very good tools, especially a Trini 40. They all also have higher gear ratios which helps a lot if a fish runs in on you.
Drew use a Breakaway bomb; they have them at Island Tackle and I threw them a hundo easily. If youre going to cast heavy bait at night these guys are correct. The only good thing about the Jiggy is the take apart feature. Take plenty of spools. Best look a 9500ss.
John, what exactly is a breakaway bomb? Is it something similar to this:
(https://i.ebayimg.com/00/s/NzY4WDEwMjQ=/z/ZVUAAOSwOgdYnyUl/$_86.JPG)
Or is it something completely different?
I'll be on the lookout for a 9500 or save up for something nicer, there's a few 9500's on eBay for less than $100. Might post something in the for sale forum and see if anybody's got a cheap one, or even just see if somebody's willing to rent me one for a week for the Bald Head trip. Might go with that last option, and then buy an Avet MXL or a Saragosa 10000 or 20000 for the long run, when I've got a little more stashed up.
CapeFish, thanks for the suggestion. I will probably buy or borrow a 9500 for the short run, and then in the long run buy an Avet MXL or a Saragosa 10000 or 20000. Loaded with 50 pound or 65 pound braid, this should be a slick setup for most sharks under, say, 150 pounds.
Jeri, that clears up almost all my questions. I can't think of anything else right now, I'll draw up some pictures of casted/kayaked rigs and post them here sometime later.
Yes, that's it. also look for Mitchell 488. Same size. put in new carbontex and you can out less than $80 on a reel you can actually work on, and will hold probably 500 yds 65 braid, maybe more. I'll take it off your hands when you "upgrade". But see if you can break it first....good luck
Thanks for the advice. Check this out -
http://www.ebay.com/itm/VINTAGE-GARCIA-MITCHELL-488-SPINNING-REEL-FOR-PARTS-/382077499693?hash=item58f597f92d:g:9xgAAOSwaEhZEgGP
Looks like it's missing the side plate on the main body, not even sure if that's replaceable or not. If it is, I might buy it, replace whatever else needs replacing and roll with it for a while. Need to find a rod to go with it too.
How does the breakaway bomb work?
That body will cost you at least 80$ in parts and Fred or Keith to fix. let it ride and get one that's working. but yes that's the reel. I have six, plus a 486. Don't get 388 or 386...too slow.
Breakaway is just that...I add a rubber band if really heavy sea. when a fish takes off and you need to get it back, sufficient pressure will pop the anchor wires out of their divets so they fold down flush and pull out of the sand, sort of like backing over a Danforth anchor will pop it out.
Hi Drew --
You ask good questions that will help many here on the Board.
As to that big Mitchell -- if I could help with any parts, would be glad to do so at no charge to get you going.
But when you are all done, I am not sure it would be half as capable as a Penn 9500SS, or similar large Penn.
I do not have a lot of parts for either of these big spinners -- however, would be glad to help with whatever I may have at N/C.
Keith will have more experience with both the big Mitchells and the larger Penn Spinners.
Lets get his opinions --
Best,
Fred
Drew,
I haven't responded to this post since I've been on Vacation.
A day of Storms and lightning has kept me off the beach today.
Slept in and took the family out to a Nice Dinner.
Everyone has their own opinions on rigs and their functionality as well as durability.
The first thing you have to come to terms with. These are Disposable terminal tackle.
No matter how well you take care of them. After a few days fishing them, they have to be replaced.
The harsh saltwater will eat up any hook, abrade the strongest of line, and just make them sketchy in my opinion.
I've learned a few things from people along the way. I am by no means an expert, but I have full confidence in my rigs, no matter what picks up my bait. As far as casted rigs, I do what I have to make it fit the rod and reel and bait used for the application.
My staple kayaked rig is a Mustad 20/0 with 12' of 480lb cable and a 400lb mono sliding trace. All double crimped and a 1 lb spider weight.
These are very economical to make. I have seen variations, but this is what I use and they get it done.
You can buy these hooks for less that 2 bucks each if you shop around. I Think I gave $50 bucks for a 500 yard spool of the cable.
I only fished this one for a few hours and you can see, the salt is already eating at the finish.
Some people might call this too big, I consider it standard equipment.
Great hook up ratio. I have seen it catch anything from a 3' sharpnose to a 11'6" Great Hammer.
Daron
Hi Drew,
That sinker is the breakaway type, but that particular design are perhaps the most expensive. Normally they are made wholly with lead, with the side divots cast into the body - much cheaper and still effective.
You seem to be bouncing between multipliers and Fixed spools in your reels for casting. I would suggest looking at spinners if you wish to use braid as your mainline. The issue with all reels for shore casting for sharks is capacity and drag capability. While Jigmasters are probably cheap, and can be enhanced, the likes of Avet MXL do not have sufficient drag capability nor line capacity for some of the 'casting species' you are looking at. If you are intent on going the multiplier route, I would agree with CapeFish fully on the virtues of the Finnor Lethal 30, 300 metres of 50lb braid as backing then 300 metres of 0.55mm nylon on top will give you more than enough for most sharks you are likely to encounter, and a drag that doesn't need enhancing; I used them personally and never had a failure, before switching over to fixed spool reels.
If you are going down the road of Fixed spool reels, then again the same basic two criteria are the most salient (drag and capacity), especially if you are using 50lb braid -a point here 65lb braid will not give you much benefit, as you won't be able to pull that kind of strength line more than a good 50lb braid - least of all with a long surf rod. However 50lb braid will give you better casting distance as it is thinner, and greater capacity on your chosen reel. (see the post in the Black Hole section of this forum on how much drag they managed with just a 10' surf rod)
We have gone through a lot of different reels in our local fishery, and some have been found seriously wanting in the specs department, when used in real life and in the slightly more extreme environment of surf shark fishing. Top runners to date have been Van Staal 275, Quantum Cabo 100/120, Penn Slammer III 18000 and the odd well looked after Stella 20000. Second tier of desirability have been Saragosa 20000 & Finnor Lethal 100. Haven't seen the Mitchel 488 or the 486 being used, but their heritage is as a strong reel, but the drag will certainly need to be enhanced to try and get greater pulling power. After that the reels barely last anytime at all, mainly due to failing drags and low strength frames or gears, especially when put under loads of more than 30lbs of real time drag. Personally I use a Cabo 80 or 100 and they have worked well, but a much overlooked reel is the Finnor Lethal 100, highly rated reel on the Alan Hawk scale of reels - especially for the price.
The point of using fixed spool reels is that they will all cast better than using a multiplier - especially for distance when you are going through your learning phase - less problems with sorting out crow's nests when trying to cast bigger baits on a long rod - nearly impossible to throw a crow's nest with a fixed spool. After that hurdle has been overcome, then it is just down to capacity and drag capability.
Try and keep as much of your set up as simple as possible, so that you can concentrate on hooking and then landing the sharks, rather than worry about the strengths of various component. Again, as soon as the word 'shark' comes into the discussion, folks go mad in the strength requirements of everything - all you need is enough to do the job, not double and triple. Because of the dynamics of fishing with a long surf rod, the maximum amount of load you are going to place on any single component is about 30lbs, so add a safety margin, and say 50lbs, and it all starts to become realistic and not super heavy weight and difficult to use effectively.
Hope that helps
Cheers from sunny Africa,
Jeri
Jeri - I will look around for some other of those sinker types. Perhaps I can find something a little bit cheaper to use. I am not really sure if I'd like to use conventional or spinning tackle for this application - good-sized sharks up to 7 feet or so are regularly brought to the beach on both. The Avet MXL is a common surf reel that has handled many a shark in the 6 foot class or larger, anglers generally load it with 300 yards of 40# hollow core and the rest a quality 40# mono, which you can get about 120 yards of for a total of 420 yards (385 meters) of line. Pair this up with an 11' rod rated for up to 8 ounces of weight or so, and you've got a pretty standard-issue setup (at least that I've seen). As far as the drag on this reel, you can get 20 pounds out of it - which is more than enough, and might break 40# line with a large enough fish on.
For spinners, I've seen two types of setup. One is a setup that the guys in FL are using, involving a rod in the 8-9' range that can cast about 6 ounces of weight. Paired with a reel that's about the equivalent of a Saragosa 10000 or 20000 and filled with 50-65 pound braid, this is a setup used more for casting lures to sharks (they rig them with cable and J-hooks). For throwing bait, reels like a Fin-Nor OFS or Penn Spinfisher in the 9500 size come into the picture, loaded with 65 pound braid. These are paired with rods up to 13' that can cast 8 ounces or so, and bring sharks up to 150 or 200 pounds to the shore.
I've been trying to get my head out of the "strength" category and into the "catching" category. It's tough when you've been taught to use the heaviest stuff possible for the past 3 or 4 years, but I'm coming around :)
Daron - that's rough, with the weather. At least you got some rest and spent some time with family, though. How long do you have to fish? I plan on buying all my stuff in bulk, so I don't have to feel as bad when I replace them. I'm not super worried about replacing/losing stuff, but being a broke student it's kinda hard to dump tons of money into it - I have picked up two other jobs over the past few weeks though (Chick Fil A and vinyl sticker cutting), so hopefully I'll have a little more disposable income. My plan is to replace any component of a rig that I don't feel comfortable with. I'm guessing after a week of straight fishing, I'll get a pretty good idea of when a rig is OK to throw back out, and when it's a good idea to replace it. That learning curve might suck though!
Fred - thank you very much for the kind offer. The only thing I am thinking about, is what you said - it wouldn't be able to compare to a Spinfisher or something similar, even if it was completely rebuilt. I also have to decide, spinner or conventional, as well. Certainly both have their positives and negatives, and that is one thing that does really seem to boil down to personal preference. I'll also have to find a rod for this reel as well (unless I just borrow a setup for Bald Head, but either way I will need a rod after that).
Drew,
I buy the bulk of my Terminal Tackle from a company called SNL Corp.
They are in Sebastian Florida and very good to deal with.
You can only place your order my phone with a credit card.
They have no prices on their website, but it only takes an email to get prices on what you want.
They sell a brand of monofilament called Exsum. It is very high quality and the prices are great.
I keep my 14/0 spooled with the 130 lb.
Any other bits I need, I get from Catch All Tackle.
They sell some nice hooks and crimps, as well as sliding trace material I use for my rigs if I get in a pinch.
Awesome, thanks for those sources! Looking at Exsum - seems like from another vendor, a 4,200 yard of 60 pound mono is like $66 - I'd imagine SNL's prices are similar, and that's a pretty good price. Do their lines generally test over what they are rated for? The other line I am looking at is Momoi Diamond, which, for spinning reels and trolling, wouldn't be a good line since it's kinda stiff - but for LBSF I'm sure it would be great. Their 60 pound breaks at 92 pounds, although I get less than a quarter of the amount of line for over $80, compared to Exsum.
How would you suggest spooling the reel? Or rather, what line? I know you don't like braid too much fro LBSF, so I doubt you'll end up recommending any of those. Straight mono options I have seen include:
-Straight 50 pound mono (825 yards of line)
-Straight 60 pound mono (720 yards of line)
-Straight 80 pound mono (530 yards of line)
-Straight 100 pound mono (425 yards of line)
-50 pound mono with a 100-yard topshot of 80 pound mono (770 yards of line)
-60 pound mono with a 100-yard topshot of 80 pound mono (685 yards of line)
As far as braid goes, there are too many options to list here. However, I scoured Pier and Surf, Sharks on the Sand, Texas Shark Fishing, and South Florida Shark Club forums for ways that people have spooled their 9/0's with braid, and compiled them in this spreadsheet here. I may actually do this for all the Penn Senators, and post it here, just as a resource for people. Check it out for the 9/0 below:
http://bit.ly/2rbpRqQ
The last time I bought Exsum, their price on a 5lb spool of 200lb and 130 was 60 bucks each.
I think those reel capacity numbers are misleading. Todays modern mono is much smaller in Diameter and stronger.
I currently have all my 9/0's spooled with 80lb mono. Sufix mainly.
I have made 200 yard drops with it and still had 3/4 spool left.
The best way to spool a reel for Land based Sharking is JB Hollow core on first and then the mono for best capacity.
That is what all the serious shark fisherman use.
I just choose straight mono for the time being.
Quote from: Shark Hunter on May 13, 2017, 04:21:45 PM
The last time I bought Exsum, their price on a 5lb spool of 200lb and 130 was 60 bucks each.
I think those reel capacity numbers are misleading. Todays modern mono is much smaller in Diameter and stronger.
I currently have all my 9/0's spooled with 80lb mono. Sufix mainly.
I have made 200 yard drops with it and still had 3/4 spool left.
The best way to spool a reel for Land based Sharking is JB Hollow core on first and then the mono for best capacity.
That is what all the serious shark fisherman use.
I just choose straight mono for the time being.
That's a pretty great price, they're great. Were you the one on the document a few minutes ago? Sorry for that, didn't finish typing the message - I meant to say that you could stay on while I changed stuff up, but I scared you off to quick I guess ;D
The figures on there are done with Berkley Big Game and PowerPro Solid, I will list different mono and braid choices on the document and determine whether they are larger or smaller. This way, you can have an idea of whether you will have more or less line on your reel. Many mono lines are thinner than BBG so figures should be higher for those lines.
Okay, here's something for the 12/0.
http://bit.ly/2pvXAPm
On each of these, you'll see a note saying to "check this page" for different line diameters. I have not finished up yet, but I will link that page into each of the sheets when I am finished.
I've got the 14/0 and the 16/0 finished, that I will post soon. Aside from that, I will be doing:
4/0
4/0 wide
6/0
6/0 wide
10/0
As Daron says, some of these capacities seem a bit short. Having the diameter of the line (in this case PowerPro and Big Game) would be useful. I believe there is a conversion tool (given line diameters) somewhere on the forum.
I use one from a fishing company in Thailand, there are a bunch of them floating around.
The capacities are based off of Berkley Big Game and Powerpro Solid (Hi-Seas mono for 150 and 200 pound mono). If one used Jerry Brown hollow core, you could likely fill it with much more braid than stated. I might expand this a bit to an interactive program where you can select your line of choice, reel of choice, and then it will give you spooling options for the reel. That might be a lot of work though!
The ones that sharkman sent me! I hope to test them out very soon.
I know a bunch of boats in the NorEast using Exsum lines on their commercial and charter reels. For the price, it can't be beat I'm told. I want to give it a try but only need a couple of hundred yards as I do fish with spectra and the Exsum would only be top shots.
Bryan, let me know what size you need. If I end up buying it in the same size, I'll spool some up onto an old leader roll and send it to you.
Here is a pic of my casted rig, or what it will look like when completed. I'm using a crappy camera still, but you should at least be able to see the general idea of what it will look like. Specs:
-8' of 100-150 pound mono
-Swivel no heavier than 150 pounds or so
-Sinker assembly will be a crimp, bead, lighter swivel, 3-4' of mono, and a grapnel sinker
-Bite leader will be 4-5' of 135 pound nylon-coated wire
-Hooks will be dual 7/0 Eagle Claw circle sea hooks
-End hook will be fixed in place and crimped, other one will be free-sliding
As far as the kayaked baits - what if I were to just keep the same as the casted rigs, with slightly heavier components. 270 lbs wire, 200-300 pound mono (12' rather than 8'), heavier swivel, bigger hooks, same wire length. Let me know what you think about this one.
Also, Jeri - what strength nylon/mono do you use on the sinker drop line?
If you don't mind (I know I've been asking a lot of questions of you, feel free to say no if you don't want to) - could you post a sample packing list for a beach trip? I know I'll have to modify mine a little bit since we'll have kayaked baits, but yours would be a great starting point.
Drew,
I think you perhaps missed a point about cast leaders/traces when using mono as your reel main line. The swivel that carries the sinker dropper, runs on the mono rubbing section, not the wire. This allows your wire section to be isolated, and whatever length is easy to cast. Alos the sinker now has a much longer running capability, to allow for shy sharks to not reel the weight of the sinker.
I presume you are going with 40-50lb mono as main line, and in the case of 100lb mono leader, the join/knot between the main line and leader is reasonably small, and doesn't impinge too much on the rings/guides on the rod during the cast. When you move up to 150lb leader, the knot starts to get quite big, and can have serious effect on the rings/guides at the upper end of the rod. One solution is to change out the rings/guides to size 16 - a drastic solution. The other is to change the leader to a wind-on with a dacron loop at the end. Now a doubled main line can be joined to the wind-on by loop to loop method, and is a much smaller join - and no problems with casting this joint through the rings/guides on the rod. The wind-on in this case would end in a snap swivel of some robust design, to clip on the wire trace section and hooks. The sinker dropper swivel and associated beads would run on the wind-on.
Hope that makes sense.
On the sinker drop line, we use a length slightly longer than the hook/wire length, and hang the sinker clip on the outside of the bottom hook. Now the sinker and bait are in one unit to allow for reasonable aerodynamics in the cast, and then once it hits the water, the sinker clip releases from the hook, and the two components seperate, and do their respective jobs. So, with a 4' steel trace length, a 5' weak nylon sinker dropper - say 40-50lbs.
Sample Packing List for a Beach Trip????? That is almost impossible to do, how long are you going? What would you want on the list, all the equipment for the day, or just 'casting tackle'?
A typical day of competition fishing, I would take 2 rods, 1 as a spare. 2 reels, both loaded with appropriate line. Focussing purely on sharks, I would take about 5 sinkers and 3-4 complete traces. A very spare hooks, wire, crimps and swivels to make up traces on the beach if things went bad, and I was getting cut off a lot. Most folks take way too much on trips - 'just in case', and 99% of the time all that spare gear comes home un-used. A little bit of everything is not too bad an idea, but not the whole tackle shop.
Hope that helps.
Cheers from sunny Africa.
Jeri
Okay, that makes much more sense now - I was kinda wondering why the sinker was on the wire, with a 3' trace of wire that doesn't seem like it would serve much purpose to have it sliding. I'll re-draw some diagrams and hopefully get better pictures of them too.
As far as the packing list, I've got one made up for now, I will post it here soon. I don't think it's too much, but I'm looking for things that I don't need to bring so I can take them off. I don't want to bring anything if it can't fit either in a backpack or on top of the kayak.
Okay, here is my packing list I have developed. Please let me know if you think anything could be removed, or if you think I've forgotten anything.
Terminal Tackle
6 full kayaked rigs (consisting of sliding trace of mono, and cable bite leader)
4 full casted rigs (consisting of sliding trace of mono, and cable bite leader)
10 heavy snap swivels (for connecting sliding traces to bite leaders)
12 sinkers (all grapnel sinkers, 6 bigger and 6 smaller for kayaked/casted)
Spare terminal tackle (4 or 5 of each hook, 2 or 3 of each swivel, maybe 15 crimps or so, two spare spools of cable, and skein of 40-50 pound mono)
Some simple bait fishing stuff (4 pre-made bottom rigs, 4 pyramid sinkers [4 oz's], and some #2 j hooks and 1/0 circles)
Tools
Linesman pliers (for cutting cable)
Needlenose pliers (for unhooking baitfish)
Stainless steel dehooker
Tail rope
Tape measure (vinyl-style, not the reel-type)
Camera
Dexter Tiger Blade knife (for rays and other big baits)
Dexter Bait knife (for small baits)
2x Lights (trying to decide between a combination of flashlights and healamps, or just healamps)
Probably extra batteries for headlamps
MAYBE bolt cutters (hoping that my linesman pliers can cut my hooks instead because bolt cutters are heavy)
Random Things
Sunscreen
Zero gravity chair
Towel
4x Sand spikes (made of conduit with a PVC spike inside)
4x Rods (4000 spinning setup for bait, some conventional rig for casting, the Black Mamba 9/0, and then hopefully a rented/borrowed 12/0)
Kayak
Cooler (probably two, one for bait and one for food/drinks)
Things I am considering bringing - would appreciate feedback on these
Tent cot (for night trips)
Wool blankets (for colder night trips)
Heavy sleeping bag (for really cold night trips)
Waders (not likely)
Rain coat
Sand socks (I just wear crocs normally, not sure if these are worth it)
Bug spray
Gold Bond powder
Sunglasses
Hat
Cell phone
Gloves (heavy duty for leader man)
Light sticks
Dexter fillet knife (for cleaning fish to eat)
Let me know what you think about that list. Valuable/dry items will be kept in a dry box in a backpack, everything else will be in a backpack (there will be one tray box for surf stuff), everything else will fit onto the kayak. I'm still going through and deciding on things on the bottom list. I might also bring along plugs and a few other things for surf gear.
Drew, where is your first aid kit? Life jacket?
Good idea Rudy. Perhaps something like the following - simple but sweet.
https://www.amazon.com/First-Aid-Kit-Emergency-Backpacking/dp/B01M5BDK7F/ref=sr_1_3_a_it?ie=UTF8&qid=1495131118&sr=8-3&keywords=7x4+first+aid+kit
Then maybe a few more fishing-specific things - like peroxide, burn spray (for jellyfish stings), hot hands (for stingray barbs), duct tape, and definitely a cell phone with a GPS app on it.
Forgot to add the stuff about the kayak as well. That "mini-list" includes a milk crate to put in the back (with carabineers on it, clip the rig onto it and then throw your bait in the milk carton, makes running baits a little more organized), three life jackets (one for the kayaker, plus two for anyone who helps launch the kayak), and a paddle. Nice and easy.
Also forgot - I'll have a bucket harness with a plate as well. That should be everything. Hopefully, I can slim it down even further.
Hi Drew,
Apart from the kitchen sink, it looks like you might have everything except the gun to shoot stray bears!!!!
The only small thing I might add to your tools for fishing, would be a small (4") engineers warding file to just dress the points of your hooks should they get a little dull.
Cheers from sunny Africa,
Jeri
Lol, if I were able to carry a gun I probably would ;)
It's not as much stuff as it looks like - sunglasses, first aid kit, camera, etc all will fit in a dry box, which will fit in a backpack. Everything except the rods, sand spikes, chair(s), and cooler(s) should fit in the backpack - and I know that all of those things, except maybe the cooler(s) will fit on top of the kayak. So basically, it's a kayak with stuff on top, a backpack, and a cooler or two.
Good idea on the file - I'll pick one up soon. Also planning to get a leader binder for my shark rigs.
Speaking of hooks, what size hook do you use on your rigs?
My preferred rig is a 6-8' trace of 300 lb mono, aluminum sleeves double crimped on each end. Some I rig with a sinker slider, or carolina style egg sinker along the mono trace. Bite leader is usually a doubled and twisted trace about 8-9" long. I dont recall the hook size, its been a while since I made one. I have found the long mono trace gets far more bites than a similar trace of heavy cable. And I dont see the point in using 400+ lb rated swivels and snaps on a rig that will likely never see more than 30 lbs of drag. Ive straightened out a few 130 lb swivels under 25-30 lbs of drag on a big shark, but they never failed. I have since moved up to 180 lb swivels, and they arent bending either now.
I have caught half a dozen tigers over 8' on those rigs without a failure. Only lost one to a 14'+ hammerhead, after it drug my 80 lb braid across a wreck and broke it off. The line broke about 100 yds away from the leader...