Okuma's numerous models have head spinning.
I was looking at the Azores and comparing it with the Makaira spinning reel.
DFD - Azores has a felt drag vs the Makaira has a CF drag
Is this just cost saving? I am guessing the bottom DFD is huge or of funky design.
I am looking for a low speed beefy reel that is not going to require me to sell one of my kidneys, for fishing off the pier or jigging for salmon.
The price point for the Azores is very attractive,
For jigging should I go for a size 40?
The Makaira costs 5 times as much. Chalk and cheese comparison. I suspect more time and effort goes into building the Makaira's rotor, for example, than the entirety of an Azores.
I have a 20k and I would confidently pitch baits to Marlin with it. I bought it to target Yellowtail in the 80-100lb bracket. Even the 10k would be such massive overkill for Salmon; there would be no sport in it and there are reels that would be much nicer to fish in appropriate weight classes - the Makairas are a bit of a brick.
All of this said, the Azores is an excellent value proposition. Especially if you could find some carbontex washers to replace the felt ones with.
if there's no secondary A/R in the 40-size, maybe next size up is well worth $10 more
Boon,
lol, true, I was comparing the DFD system, on closer inspection, the bottom drag washer is CF in both, and in the Azores the top drag material is felt, that should be a simple task to swap out.
Do you have braid with a mono top shot on your 20k?
Phil,
Good point, I see that, size 55 vs size 65,
65 has a lot higher drag rating a little bit heavier, hmm, decisions, decisions.
Danke!
Quote from: Gobi King on August 28, 2018, 10:00:57 PM
Do you have braid with a mono top shot on your 20k?
390m of 100lb solid core multi-colour braid with maybe 5m of 100lb mono on top. If I ever have to use the full potential of the reel I suspect the rod will explode unless I point it straight at the fish. But I will probably be pulled overboard first, or drop the rod. 30kg of drag is not for playing games with small fish. At the moment I only have mine preloaded for around 20kg of drag.
Boon, what knot is used for the braid > mono connection?
and Mono > hook
I use an improved Albright/RP/Alberto/JC for the spectra to leader and a uni or springer to tie on the terminal tackle.
Mark covers the most used, better mono to braid connections. I like the RP to tie long & short leaders . Tied right with quality mono it will come close to to breaking at it's rating. Sometimes surpassing it. But I've not achieved that with any dependable regularity... Jeff
EDIT: I meant the FG & not RP / Royal Polaris knot I dont no why I have so much trouble keeping the names straight... Jeff
Anything that doubles the mono is old-school - weak and bulky compared to the modern finger-trap style knots.
PR knot if I have time on my hands to tie it. FG knot if I'm in a hurry or on a wobbly boat (braid -> leader).
If I'm jigging, I use the AG chain knot to attach the leader to a ringed grommet. If I'm livebaiting, usually just a 5-turn Uni knot.
I like the FG but I've never tied one I've been happy with. I have a lot of confidence in the Improved Albright, RP, etc and I usually use a short leader so the knot isn't going through the guides.
I like to run 5m or so of leader. The time of largest risk for contact with the boat is in that very last bit of the fight, when the fish can change the angle faster than you can get the rod over the side. 100+lb mono or fluoro will survive touching the chine/keel as long as there isn't too much load on, where even heavy braid will pop or at least be compromised if the fish takes another run.
EDIT: It also gives the deckhand something to grab to get control of the fish if we're planning to release it and don't want to sink a gaff. Taking a wrap on braid is a terrible thing to have to do.
Thanks a bunch guys, I have knot anxiety since I have ventured into 50 lb plus mono leaders.
These newer knots are super sleek, they pass through the guides well.
I love the springer knot for tying the hook, it is fast to tie, I love it how it holds with heavier mono.
I found that the springer knot does not work that well for braided rope in a sailboat, I tried the springer knot to attach the jib sheet to the bottom of the jib, well at the first major gust, off came the jib sheet :o
boon, I like the longer leader idea, works well for pier fishing too, I lost a red last year when the braid touched one of the post.
jeff, lol, you are doing much better than I am, I have quite a bit of difficulty with the knots
mark, im albright is what my charter guy uses for his mono/braid for the dipsey diver rods, they pass find through the guides. this is with 25 lb mono, they have the tag end cut flush.
I am going to try a few of these,
I've tested a lot of these knots while fishing & casting repeatedly. The FG tied & finished well is the best I've used for this.
Some knots should never pass through the guides repeatedly or possibly ever.
However any & all knots joining braid to leader that pass through guides should be checked often. My experience has been they all will eventually come undone when repeatedly passing through the guides during a cast. Maybe not as bad using a spinner. I use conventional 90% of the time.
Covering these connections with a pliable glue like the fly Fisher fellas use or covering the both leading edges with floss helps a lot.
A properly tied FG should have no issue being cast with a rod through proper guides well over 50 times. Guide size & transition plays a major role here. This probably is considerably more using a spinner
I know we are talking about spinners but I'll pass this along.
On two of my conventional rods I built it is a complete non issue. This using 40 - 80 mono line joined 60 - 100 braid for leader or short top shot.. Jeff
I have a Mak 20k and I've used an Azores 65 on the Marlas IV out of Puerto Vallarta since the use Okuma. All I caught were trigger fish and other small fish. Brendan got a 30# YFT on a popper and no problems landing it on the Azores. There's no comparison between the Mak and the Azores. The Mak is a high end expensive super spinner for large strong fish while the Azores is at best a mid range spinner inexpensive reel. For what you outlined the Azores will certainly get the job done just fine with the stock drags.
Quote from: Gobi King on September 01, 2018, 01:35:30 PM
im albright is what my charter guy uses for his mono/braid for the dipsey diver rods, they pass find through the guides. this is with 25 lb mono, they have the tag end cut flush.
Charter guys might end up tying a whole lot of knots in a day so I can understand why they would tie one that is reliable when tied in a hurry, simple knot that is hard to get wrong, and in those line-weights unlikely to make a huge difference unless you needed all of those 25lb on a fish.
The first few times I tied the FG and PR were incredibly frustrating; I was left thinking it was a complete waste of time and that the knot couldn't be trusted. But if you persist with it, it doesn't take a long time or a lot of knots to get pretty repeatably good at them, and their strength will astound you. The very important thing to keep in mind is that the knots "settle" quite a lot, and if the wraps slide off the tag end when it's settling, that's game over. You can reduce this by making sure the wraps are tight - when tying an FG I cinch the wraps down every 3 or 4, and by pulling decently hard on the knot before clipping the tag end. Once those wraps lock in though, they aren't going anywhere.
A while back I was fishing 80lb braid FG'd to a 100lb mono leader that was uni-knotted to a swivel; I got hung up in the reef and had to pop it; the 100lb mono broke at the swivel which should give you some idea of the relative strength of a good FG.
I ended up with 2 Azores, size 80, I plan to get 2 more in size 55.
I also picked up couple of coronado 55s.
What is the black plastic gasket between the hand and the spindle? is this needed?
I loaded the coronados with 50 lb braid. I am going with 100 lb braid on the Azores. both of them will get mono leaders.
Boon, I will attempt my first fg knot later today :-).
If you haven't already bought the braid I would just put 80lb on them, unless you really really need the slight increase in abrasion resistance.
And I'm 99% sure that the plastic spacer thing in the handle can be thrown away; loosen the handle off a little and it should slip right out.
10-4 on 80 lbs, I have huge stash of 80 lbs ;D
Thanks for confirming I can toss that gasket.
Taking the reels and line along to gulfshores for this weekend's trip, I plan on loading it in the hotel tonight.
That plastic piece doesn't appear in the schematic. It's probably just there to protect the reel from getting banged up in shipping.
I've been looking closer at the Azores reels. For the money is there a sturdier reel made ?
I believe they beat out the Diawa BG's not sure how they compare with the new Penn other than the Penn cost more.
The internals on the Azores looks really good to me. In fact I was very impressed with it's features & performance even more so when you see what they cost... Jeff
Quote from: Rivverrat on November 10, 2018, 06:48:30 AM
I've been looking closer at the Azores reels. For the money is there a sturdier reel made ?
I believe they beat out the Diawa BG's not sure how they compare with the new Penn other than the Penn cost more.
The internals on the Azores looks really good to me. In fact I was very impressed with it's features & performance even more so when you see what they cost... Jeff
Jeff,
I agree, I like the double dogs and the price is really good.
I bought mine off ebay with the 15% off coupon of something they had back then.
I did not get to fish with mine as I ended up using my Okuma bait runners [post coming later tonight with fishing report]
I plan to swap out the felt drags with CF ones, the dfd drag is CF already. I think I will attempt the drag swap right now :-).
I used penn drag, 6-965 drags, the size was near enough but I think the cf drag was not as thick as the felt ones,
I am going to load braided line tonight and test the max drag ;D
Quote from: Gobi King on November 10, 2018, 04:16:17 PM
I used penn drag, 6-965 drags, the size was near enough but I think the cf drag was not as thick as the felt ones,
I am going to load braided line tonight and test the max drag ;D
You can double up each drag washer until the stack height is the same as the original factory one.
Quote from: Rivverrat on November 10, 2018, 06:48:30 AM
I've been looking closer at the Azores reels. For the money is there a sturdier reel made ?
I do not know of a modern spinner that is more robust for the $$. A store here is clearing out the old silver ones in the 55 size for ~100USD which seems like a deal to me.
Quote from: boon on November 11, 2018, 09:59:26 PM
Quote from: Rivverrat on November 10, 2018, 06:48:30 AM
I've been looking closer at the Azores reels. For the money is there a sturdier reel made ?
I do not know of a modern spinner that is more robust for the $$. A store here is clearing out the old silver ones in the 55 size for ~100USD which seems like a deal to me.
Boon, thanks for this reply. Always good to check my thoughts against what others think on certain reels.
You can easily find the 65 size for $84. The 55 goes for $94... go figure.
Quote from: Gobi King on September 18, 2018, 02:53:24 PM
Boon, I will attempt my first fg knot later today :-).
This is the easiest way to tie an FG I have found
www.youtube.com/watch?v=qQmUN0L4F6c
Quote from: Porthos on November 11, 2018, 06:44:14 PM
Quote from: Gobi King on November 10, 2018, 04:16:17 PM
I used penn drag, 6-965 drags, the size was near enough but I think the cf drag was not as thick as the felt ones,
I am going to load braided line tonight and test the max drag ;D
You can double up each drag washer until the stack height is the same as the original factory one.
Tried a the drag with 1:1 replacement with CF penn drags, the drag amount and adequate for my needs, my drag scale only goes to 25#s so that is plenty ;D
FG update:
Huston we have success in tying a FG knot.
I loaded 200 yards 50# solid spectra on my metaloid 5II, and I wanted to load 50# mono topshot.
I was using a kite rod to load the braid on to the metaloid manually (need to work on my auto loader). Sitting at the dining table I tied the other end of the braid to the chair arm and did my 20 turns of the mono around the braid pulling it tight after a few turns.
Then I did a few half hitches, and then I tested the knot, wow, I could not believe it, that sucker did not even budge. I could not remember how to finish off the knot, so I replayed the video. I wanted to do couple of double half hitches or whatever they are called, right as I was winding my 2nd double half hitch, I older go up and tripped on the kite rod and I ended up with a half hitch at the top of the knot, totally in the wrong direction, I frantically tried to undo it, but the braid started to fray. I trimmed off the tag ends and reeled on the mono till the reel was full and cut off the leader in to a loop and put a sticker won the reel "need to redo fg" and called it a night.
Finishing - I saw video which show a Rizzuto finish to a FG knot. Anyone try the Rizzuto finish to a FG? What do you guys suggest for a finish to FG knot?
Once I've done the wraps, I do 4 alternating half-hitches around both the braid and leader, then 4 alternating hitches around the braid only, then a 3 turn Rizzutto to finish.
Quote from: boon on December 02, 2018, 11:29:14 PM
Once I've done the wraps, I do 4 alternating half-hitches around both the braid and leader, then 4 alternating hitches around the braid only, then a 3 turn Rizzutto to finish.
Boon, Danke!
If you go with hollow braid you can simply splice the topshot into it - no knots - no problem ;)
All my spinners with line have solid braid with a mono top shot. Since every spin rod I have is at least 7 ft, the top shots are at least 14'. I cast with all of them. The RP knot is used for mono top shots up to 15lb. For 20lb and above, I use a hollow core connection with the nub nail knots as described here:
http://alantani.com/index.php?topic=23566.0
Every one of the hollow core connections for my 20lb, 40lb, 60lb, and 80lb spinner setups heldup for the entire 8-day SOA charter this year. The top shot on the 40lb setup was eventually reduced to a little under one rod length due to cutoffs and numerous reties; it will be bumped up to three rod lengths for next year's 8-day.
Quote from: Tiddlerbasher on December 03, 2018, 07:40:55 PM
If you go with hollow braid you can simply splice the topshot into it - no knots - no problem ;)
I really like hollowcore, but splices are a hideous thing to do on the water, especially if it's a bit rough or there's a hot bite and you're rushing. The FG, I can tie in a couple of minutes and consistently get good strength. Some very good fishermen I know run hollowcore and will splice a leader in at home but if they bust off on the water they'll tie an FG or PR knot.
I am still learning knots and I have not successfully spliced hollow core yet (1st attempt with grandma's crochet needles was a bust :P).
I have already loaded 100 lb solid braid on to 1 of the reels,
Hollow Core, the lightest I have is 80 lb hollow core, I am guessing the hollow core will be a bit thicker than the solid,
I am not averse to either, but I agree with boon, that in a pinch, tying a knot will be fast.
Grandma volunteers at my youngest girl's elementary school and teaches crochet, she has a whole bunch crochet needles, so I thought I try my hand at splicing mono into hollow core ;D, darn needles were too thick ::)
I bought some splicing needles from charbait
sorry, I am behind, the girls have been under the weather, need to take grandma to the doctors in a bit, I will give the fg with finish mentioned by boon a shot later today.
Thanks again,
Bryan sells threading needles for hollow core. Dominick
IMHO, we fishermen tend to make a fetish out of knots. Considering you'd normally be fishing at 20 to 30 lb of drag at max when fishing 80 lb, you'd still be well safe even if your Albrights break at 55lb.
I used to tie my leaders with a 30-turn Albright and later graduated to the FG. Never have any of my Albrights, or any of the other knots failed me. The only exception have been improperly tied FG's in the beginning that slipped open.
As long as you are able to do a few angling knots properly, you should be good. The debate on the best knot is more of a topic of interest when you're stranded in your living room because of bad weather!
Quote from: ijlal on December 15, 2018, 11:37:14 AM
IMHO, we fishermen tend to make a fetish out of knots. Considering you'd normally be fishing at 20 to 30 lb of drag at max when fishing 80 lb, you'd still be well safe even if your Albrights break at 55lb.
I used to tie my leaders with a 30-turn Albright and later graduated to the FG. Never have any of my Albrights, or any of the other knots failed me. The only exception have been improperly tied FG's in the beginning that slipped open.
As long as you are able to do a few angling knots properly, you should be good. The debate on the best knot is more of a topic of interest when you're stranded in your living room because of bad weather!
I will turn that on it's head: if you only need 30lb of drag to catch the fish, leave the 80W game reel at home, spool something with 50lb braid (or less) and go catch it with that. Tie good knots and you should be able to put 30lb of pull through a (really) good 50lb outfit all day.
The "1 third drag" rule is for mono and the old knots we used to use that gave you about 50% on a good day. With braid and modern knots, you may as well just go down about 3 sizes in the outfit you're using and have a whole lot nicer time fishing. The good knots let you fish lighter gear, not pull harder on heavier gear. The exception is if you're fishing from a party boat at anchor and you need a whole lot of abrasion resistance.
Seriously, we have guys out here targeting striped marlin out to 300lb or so on Makaira 10's with 30lb braid. People routinely catch them with a Tiagra 30W and 30lb mono, so there's no reason why the modern equivalent wouldn't work. It gets pretty spicy if you hook a larger blue though...