Newell - pinion gear frozen to spool!

[dylan]

Hi all,

I'm working on some Newells ( mostly S229-5).  The pinion gear appears to be rusted/frozen to the spool shaft -- so I have one big loose assembly of spool and the metal plate with all the workings.  When I pull on the spool I can see the pinion gear is pulling on the yoke.  There's NOT enough room to wiggle the spool out.  I have doused it with Liquid Wrench and it is soaking...  Any suggestions?

I need to get some rubber covers for my pliers so I can grab the pinion gear firmly w/o damaging it  and wiggle.  
Interestingly, one of these reels was actually in pretty good shape except for this problem!!

Thanks,
Dylan

[dylan]

Update:

Got them off.  Took them into work and used a press.  One of them broke loose (also it was doused w/ liquid wrench for 24 hrs).  The other one was stuck.  Rather than bend the yoke, I attacked it w/ a Dremel tool w/ cutting bit...then realized I was sacrificing the pinion gear anyway, and I was able to turn it relative to the spool w/ pliers.  back to the press and it came out.  Note to self -- don't hammer on the end of the spool shaft.  It'll deform (mushroom)!! 

I suspect this is a common failure for Newells.  2 out of 3 for me.   Hopefully these reels get annual service now and this doesn't happen again.

[alantani]

ouch!  the newell pinion gears are $20.  a full penn jigmaster main and pinion set is cheaper.  you might consider switching over.  always hated newell gears anyway.  alan

[dylan]

Alan,

I see you had already answered my question here, in "Pitfalls and ...":  http://alantani.com/index.php?topic=520.0

I was thinking a Jigmaster gear pinion gear might work. . . from your post, then I can switch over to Jigmaster gears, if I do it as a pair? 
What's different w/ the Newell gears?

Thanks!!
Dylan

[alantani]

newll gears have a 5:1 ratio, they are all stainless steel and a gear set costs $50 by the time you're done.  i think a 4:1 jigmaster gear set is only $15.  alan

[franky]

I just had my first bout with one of these "frozen pinion on the spool shaft" episodes!!!  I lost!  

The customer's reel was a salvaged 546 sideplate screwed onto a 550 body.  The reel was so corroded that in the process of removing the sideplate, one of the sideplate screws broke because it was frozen in the reel base.

I then removed the bridge screws and saw the frozen pinion on the tiburon spool.  I figured that since the reel was so far gone that if I could separate the pinion, I could either fix the reel or have the guy salvage the nice tiburon aluminum spool.  After soaking the pinion with wd-40 for a couple of nights with failed success, I closed everything up and told the person that the reel is too far gone and it would cost more money to chase the problem.  If he wanted to tamper with the frozen pinion and risk damaging the tiburon spool shaft, that would be on his ownis.  It was bad enough that the reel base needed replacement because of the broken frozen screw....but to pursue further and risk the added cost of a new pinion and a new spool....

At that point, he knew when to draw the line and concluded that it would be cheaper to simply get another reel.  I suggested that he should just disassemble the reel and salvage what ever parts that he could salvage and use it as a "replacement parts reel".

Geezzzz, I cannot imagine that someone would allow their reels to sit without washing the salt off and applying the proper grease and oils.  This stuff is nasty!!!  Gotta know when to say...this is beyond fixing!

Thankfully the customer was understanding about the lack of maintanence on his behalf.

To the fisherman and fisherwomen....please, if you're going to pack away your reels for a while, or better yet, immediately after each fishing session, please hose down your equipment with fresh water.  Also, it is cheaper and a lot less of a headache in the long run if you maintain your equipment every so often or have someone professionally service it for you.  

 

[Bryan Young]

Franky,

WORD!

Thanks for sharing.  I think most of us here realize that maintaining reels is very important.  It's elsewhere that counts.  I guess we are starting somewhere with Alan's generosity of this website and free information from all participating members.  Now, we just gotta share this information with our clubs and local fisherman.

I've always wanted to go to a fishing tournament/derby to see a reel repair booth set-up.  The problem will definitely be parts.

Aloha,
Bryan

[alantani]

a bit part of the problem is stainless against stainless.  they rust together pretty quick.   

[franky]

Thanks for sharing.  I think most of us here realize that maintaining reels is very important.  It's elsewhere that counts.  I guess we are starting somewhere with Alan's generosity of this website and free information from all participating members.  Now, we just gotta share this information with our clubs and local fisherman.

Aloha,
Bryan

Yes Brian, absolutely correct.  Most of us on this site are aware of proper maintanence (thank goodness  )...I just shared my experience to bring awareness to some of those who are starting out with fishing and/or surfing the websites to see what is involved with reel maintenance.  Yes, its awesome and fun...but on the other hand there are the nightmare stories that many of us "reel maintainers/reel servicers" encounter. 

Speaking of nightmare stories, I believe that many of these shared nightmare stories are the very ones that teach us the most. 

Thanks a million to Alan and all the folks on this site for providing all the valuable information and expertise!  This site is beyond generous and offers things that most books don't.....real life expertise and support.  Wow, at first, I thought newells were the easiest reels to maintain.  After trying to tackle this frozen pinion gear on the spool shaft....I was totally humbled  and I found a new level of respect for guys like Alan and all the other reel serviceing people.    Not easy bro....

a bit part of the problem is stainless against stainless.  they rust together pretty quick.   

Hi Alan. 

I was amazed how stainless against stainless would or could be such a problem.  I always thought that having two of the same metals together is okay.  However, having two different kinds of metals touching each other would be a problem due to electrolysis.  In either case, got to keep the pinion gear and the spool shaft lubed.

[alantani]

um, i just found a box of newell parts...........

[broadway]

         Got myself a frozen spool situation on a 229-5 as well.  I'm unable to get the right sideplate off, and it seems the bearing cap won't budge either way so I think the bearing is corroded to the shaft.  The reel has lots of rust, and the left side spool bearing is toast.  How would I be able to free the spool shaft when I can't get any tools or even a view beyond the bridge plate?  Where would I spray liquid wrench to be able to free it up? thanks
Dom

[franky]

         Got myself a frozen spool situation on a 229-5 as well.  I'm unable to get the right sideplate off, and it seems the bearing cap won't budge either way so I think the bearing is corroded to the shaft.  The reel has lots of rust, and the left side spool bearing is toast.  How would I be able to free the spool shaft when I can't get any tools or even a view beyond the bridge plate?  Where would I spray liquid wrench to be able to free it up? thanks
Dom

Hello Dom,

Oh my!  You got one of those huh? 

Based on my previous shalacking with one of those "frozen pinion to the spool shaft" ventures, I don't know if I'm the right person to offer suggestions 

Anyway, heres my 2 cents....

First off, we both know that the fiber drags in the gearbox is history!  That being said, I would remove the four bridge screws and see if I could lift the bridge plate just a little.  I would then use the small straw that comes with the WD-40 can (or you could attach the straw to the Liquid Wrench can) and spray a lot of it in there and just let it sit for a day and repeat again on the second day.

After that, I would try my hand at trying to take off the bearing cap again.

Good luck. 

[Norcal Pescador]

Hey Dom -
I'm with franky on this one. You may have already done all of this, but here goes. Remove everything you can from the outside of the reel: left bearing, ALL screws, handle, eccentric lever, spacing sleeve, etc.  Now you may be able to twist the reel apart by holding the left and right sideplates and pulling or tapping gently (or not so gently) with a mallet and a small piece of wood or a chopstick. Give it the franky treatment and squirt some Liquid Wrench, WD-40, or Break Free into any hole. After soaking for a day, try pulling it apart again. Is this one of those 25 reels you told me about? If so, tell the captain to start planning on buying a replacement reel and that you're now charging him by the hour.
If all else fails, get bigger chopsticks.
Rob

[Alto Mare]

If all else fails, get bigger chopsticks.
Rob
[/quote]
Or do yourself and the Captain a favor and put that reel to rest . By the way, how's that foot coming along?

[Bryan Young]

Regarding the spool and pinion gear, I was working on something, but I cannot remember what.  We used to soak it in liquid wrench or WD-40.  Then heat it up with a propane torch, and while hot spray more liquid wrench or WD-40, and repeat.  Concentrate on heating the pinion gear and cool the shaft with the lubricant.  The heat was used to expand the pinion gear metal, and the lubricant was used to cool the shaft (contracting the shaft).  Although the expansion and contraction was in microns, it allowed the lubricant to seep between the pinion gear and spool shaft.  Repeat this several times.  This should loosen up the pinion.

Another option is to put the spool on a lathe and file the pinion gear off.