Buying used 30 year old reels

Started by GClev, June 13, 2016, 02:19:06 PM

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GClev

This is meant as an interesting entry point for a conversation on instincts and wisdom that come with old age and experience.  

"When the man with money meets the man with experience, the man with experience gets the money, and the man with the money gets the experience."

I recently found three old Internationals for sale as a package on another fishing site advertised as "Cal Sheets, meticulously maintained."  A little background on the seller. "I fish every week."  "I'm in the industry."

I sent a private message to the seller.  Sold.  Call me.  Phone number.  His PMs, as I suspected, are pushed to email on his cell.  He received them almost instantaneously.  Tic Toc.  Two days.

I send another message:  "Seller's Remorse??"

Forum Private Message in the AM from the seller: "I'll call you in an hour or two."

Hanging by my phone (landline)....  day passes... next day... morning passes...  I send another message, "Phone fail?"

I find his same reels, the same seller, for sale on Ebay for a few dollars more and send the following via Ebay question: "Can you tell me what is written on the sticker Cal puts in every reel and what kind of drag plate is in this reel, asbestos, HT100, or DuraDrag?"

Reply from seller via Ebay messaging is almost instant: "What sticker are you talking about? I'm selling these reels for a friend who passed. I don't know the answers to these questions "  

Seriously that is an exact quote.  Now I don't currently own a Ouija board or commune with the dead, so I sense a bit of false logic here.

Phone call... finally....  Pleasantries, blah blah, explaining the missed phone rendezvous.  "I'm so busy.  Things are so hectic.  I work one week.  I fish one week."  I quickly consider what job is week on/week off and in the industry?  I don't ask.  TMI.  That's cool.  More questions and I tell him I'm the guy on Ebay who asked about the Cal Sheets sticky labels and the Penn drag plates.  I'm still trying to match up his claims, reality, and the reels he has in hand.

It's pretty clear by now he knows absolutely nothing about Penn Reels, Cal Sheets's reels, these reels, or their maintenance schedule.  So I ask the hard question.

"Are these your reels?"

"They belong to a friend of mine who is dying of cancer." Now the dead guy is only dying, or if you are a fan of "Princess Bride,"  mostly dead but not "all" dead.  (Not to demean anyone who is suffering from any debilitating disease, but past experience and regular viewing of episodic television have made me a skeptic of vague, non-specific cancer claims in the name of fundraising.)  So I asked about the friend and his health.  

"A friend who passed or a friend of yours who is dying of cancer now?" citing the two conflicting statements.  I did not understand his reply.  The owner may still be drawing breath.  So it was only natural to ask.

"So is there any chance that I could speak to the actual owner."

"No, I can't even speak to him and I don't have his phone number."  Huh?  Seriously, that is, to my best recollection, exactly what he said.

He still wants to sell these reels. He knows little or even nothing about them.   He does not own them nor does he actually know their owner.  But they're meticulously maintained.  I am confused... not really.

Now maybe I have paid for too much experience in my previous lives.  I'm certainly curmudgeonly and misanthropic.  Maybe, I'm just mean.  My skepticism is now bleeding through the phone line.  It would be a giant leap of faith sending any kind of money his way by any means at this point and I make that clear.  He still wants to meet me and sell these reels.  I conclude that driving to San Diego unarmed or alone for a sale in some Burger King parking lot is probably not a wise option.

I like old Internationals enough to offer to buy these reels through a third party escrow.  I'm thinking Cal Sheets might be a good intermediary and he might be able to confirm their provenance.  He can look at the reels, check his records, appraise them, and hold them while I pay for them.   I don't mention that I know Cal too well, having been thrown together many times on multiple 18 and 20 day trips.  Seller... NO WAY.

If anyone else is interested in these Internationals, they're still for sale.  Subsequent posts by the seller tout both his expertise with Cal Sheets's internal labeling and a knowledge of Penn drag plates.  

My alternate third party observer might be the Orange County Sheriff.

If I were ever to ignore all the red flags and my own internal bs-O-meter for the sake of saving a few bucks on some 30 year old fishing reels, please shoot me.

SoCalAngler

Not trying to go off topic but but what size Int. are you looking for? I have a Int. 50 two speeded by Cal for sale and I'm in OC also. The drags are CF and you can see Cal's sticker in the pics.

http://alantani.com/index.php?topic=17574.0

Shark Hunter

GClev,
Did you already pay the guy for the reels? If so, what kind of payment? You have to have a backup plan when buying reels from people you don't know.
No trying to rub salt in your wounds, just seeing if I can help.
Life is Good!

foakes

You are right, GClev --

Too many red flags here to keep track of -- for me at least, time to back away -- and be thankful not to get any further involved.

While there are some opportunities for bargains on ebay, CL, and other venues -- there are also many more possibilities to be dealing with dishonest sellers...

Too harsh? ... With the advent of amateur eBay sellers, Craigslist scammers, smartphones, and anonymous internet transactions just to get your money with non-existant or grossly misrepresented items -- let the buyer beware.

Anyone with a cellphone and web access can be a seller.

And, gone are the days of honest, old fashioned transactions -- between honorable sellers and fair buyers -- to a great extent.  There are of course exceptions -- but unless a deal is easy and straight-forward -- these exceptions are somewhat rare.

As a rule, you will never go wrong by dealing with someone you know by good reputation on this site -- or someone you have a good feeling about.

There is unfortunately, a Moral Chasm in our society nowadays -- and we must learn to navigate away from wasting time and effort on these types of transactions.

Sometimes, we are better off dealing with a fair and knowledgeable person -- and getting a good value on a well represented item.

Just my observations and opinions.

Best,

Fred
The Official, Un-Authorized Service and Restoration Center for quality vintage spinning reels.

D-A-M Quick, Penn, Mitchell, and ABU/Zebco Cardinals

--------

The first rule of fishing is to fish where the fish are. The second rule of fishing is to never forget the first rule.

"Enjoy the little things in Life — For someday, you may look back — and realize that they were the big things"
                                                     Fred O.

alantani

yeah, don't make eye contact, back away slowly, find the nearest exit and leave.   :-\
send me an email at alantani@yahoo.com for questions!

STRIPER LOU

All good Advice here Gclev!! There will be other opportunities. Sound's like a pass. Or as said, one can look here as there is a great bunch of people on this site! Put out a post and you may be surprised what you come up with.
Regards,  ..  Lou

Maxed Out

  A huge red flag for me is someone selling something on eBay while offering to sell it privately also. eBay has a good system to protect buyers from less than legitimate sellers, which is why I will sometimes roll the dice on eBay, but not on a private sale unless I've previously done business with them or the seller gets a thumbs up from a third party I know and trust.

  My advice would be to pass on these reels. Penn mass produced them and more will come along from a better, more reputable seller.

Ted
We Must Never Forget Our Veterans....God Bless Them All !!

fishgrain

#7
i have heard similar comments from sellers (buyers too i guess), about how they do this and that, fish their 20 stellas all over the world but barely have time to even return an email

(aren't there long plane rides full of down time going from panama to pv to hawaii to aus lolololol)

i see it as people with something to hide like to put up smokescreens, so they can vanish behind them when it suits their needs.

in contrast people who wish to participate in a long term exchange where everyone wins, are usually pretty straight forward and naturally inspire good feelings in others, instead of the opposite.

And if someone who cares messes up, honest mistake, they usually are willing to walk across hot coals to make it right, because it burns THEM to disappoint someone when it relates to what they care about. in this case, fishing of course. we can all relate to our love of that



I don't see too many people who stay in the business for 10 years that don't have a genuine passion for helping other people through fishing tackle.




mley1

I've baught several reels off EBay. If a seller fails to answer any question satisfactory and timely I pass. Good pics are a must. Good seller ratings are helpful, but I will take a chance if they respond well to questions. I've gotten some nice reels at good prices that way. I've done a few trades and buys through forums as well. I have gotten some nice reels that way too. The hunt is always fun.
Good luck fishing,

Marty

philaroman

Quote from: GClev on June 13, 2016, 02:19:06 PM
...Now the dead guy is only dying, or if you are a fan of "Princess Bride,"  mostly dead but not "all" dead...

too bad you couldn't send Fezzik (Andre THE GIANT) to complete the transaction w/ honest answers & favorable terms  :o

mley1

The scammers that always tickle me a bit are the ones who send you an email stating they'll take the reel. They explain they are out of state, or out of country, and want to send you extra money for the trouble of having a shipping company pick the reel up. Usually, the offer involves a cashiers check, or some other type of payment that can be faked. And, you know they're scamming when they say they'll offer you a 100 more than your asking, just to hold it for their pickup man. Most of the time, if you watch the language used in the email you can tell they're not American. Or, if they are, they speak poor English. I've gotten several emails, and even some text messages from unknown numbers that were like this here recently, as I've had a few reels for sale. My response is usually to tell them sure I'll sell the reel to them. Give your pickup man CASH, and I'll give him the reel in exchange for the cash. Or, I'll tell them to send PayPal friends and family. Most of the time the scammer then disappears. Sometimes, they'll make one last effort to convince you their offer is legit, and they'll try again to convince you that you must take payment in the fashion they suggest. BYE BYE SCAMMER!!!

I must admit it is fun messing with them sometimes though.  ;D
Good luck fishing,

Marty

ez2cdave

Quote from: GClev on June 13, 2016, 02:19:06 PMIf I were ever to ignore all the red flags and my own internal bullshit-O-meter for the sake of saving a few bucks on some 30 year old fishing reels, please shoot me.

You need one of these . . .


mizmo67

We get scammers contacting us from both selling and buying aspects.
Have to pay attention!

Example last year. Multiple emails like this one, names changed, all wanting to buy and ship to Singapore

QuoteDear Sir/Madam,

I need your confirmation before I am placing an order at your store / Company . Firstly, i would like to know, do you accept international customers and able to ship overseas ? Is it possible to ship to Singapore with fedEX,UPS or DHL delivery Express ? And Do you accept credit card to complete order payment ? Please specify credit card type which acceptable to complete the payment.

Thank, Your prompt reply will be greatly appreciated and i'm looking forward to hear respon from you ASAP .

Best Regards.
Jose Vera
Singapore

I point said types of individuals here
"All information about purchasing, shipping, etc., can be found in our Help Center:
https://scottsbt.zendesk.com/hc/en-us"

Some go away immediately, sometimes you get something like this

QuoteDear ,

I'm afraid to place an order through your webstore directly and my bank has
advised me to refuse all online transaction to avoid from credit card
stealing.So, Can you process via email and charge my card manually on your
credit card machine ? ,it has different matters if you can running my card on
your credit card machine,You can an authorize my credit card before you
dispatched my order and I will responsible for credit card surcharge fees as
well.And I'll call my Bank for authorize My credit card for it. I hope you can
understand with my situation.

Thank, Your prompt reply will be greatly appreciated and i'm looking forward to
hear respon from you ASAP .

Best Regards

You could tell the first one was a copy paste...all the verbiage was the same.
And the reply in broken English wanting to bypass the protections of our online card processor?

Yah...no..thanks..


~Mo

Maureen Albertson :)
Scott's Bait & Tackle / Mystic Reel Parts (Formerly PennParts.com)
Contact Me Via Store Website Please!
Orders/Support# +1 (609) 488-4637 (parts ordering or troubleshooting)
customerservice@mysticparts.com

Dominick

You'd think with all the money these scammers make they would hire English editors for their emails.  Dominick
Leave the gun.  Take the cannolis.

There are two things I don't like about fishing.  Getting up early in the morning and boats.  The rest of it is fun.

mley1

Quote from: Dominick on August 27, 2016, 06:53:55 PM
You'd think with all the money these scammers make they would hire English editors for their emails.  Dominick

I know, right. Most recently I got one for an xbox I'm selling. The same principal applies. It looks like this:

"Thank you for the response according to the description, am
okay with the  price and the condition pasted on letgo. I am ready to
make instant purchase. My mode of payment would be in  cashier Check
and i will arrange for a local pick up as soon as you get the check,
because that is the only convenient means for me and due to my work
frame i can not be able to get there and i promise everything will go
smoothly.I really wish to be there to check out the item but i don't
have chance because am very busy person (DOCTOR). Concerning the
pick up, i will arrange for it after you receive the payment and it
clears... Pls get
back to me with below info so that i can proceed with the
payment immediately if you are selling to me.

Full Name:
Address: Not P.O.BOX
City:
State:
Postal Code:
Total amount for the item
Phone Number: That i can send text
Item Name
Email
last price

And as soon as this is provided, the payment will be overnight to you
and i will let you know when its mailed out. Thanks and i hope we
handle this in good faith while waiting to hear from you. i will add
an additional $50 so that you can hold it for me till the check reach

Thanks


--
Hello is the item still for sale ?

Mrs Sandra Lopez"

And, most of the time, if you try to check their email addy you'll find it's a fake or spoofed, and untraceable. Or, once traced it will be from over seas. I wonder just how many folks are scammed by these people. It really doesn't take much to recognize the scams.
Good luck fishing,

Marty