Penn Trade Reels

[sdlehr]

Hi Crow,
The "Surf Angler" is modeled after the Penn #15. It was like the other trade reels - given another name, perhaps chosen by the company selling the reel. Edward K Tryon's Kingfisher brand, Sears' J.C.Higgins, etc., all were reselling rebranded reels from Penn. I have wondered how much these reels cut into Penn's profits... it's the age-old idea of cutting the price and making up the difference in sales volume... it worked for the trade companies, not sure how well it ended up working for Penn.

[Tightlines667]

Hi Crow,
The "Surf Angler" is modeled after the Penn #15. It was like the other trade reels - given another name, perhaps chosen by the company selling the reel. Edward K Tryon's Kingfisher brand, Sears' J.C.Higgins, etc., all were reselling rebranded reels from Penn. I have wondered how much these reels cut into Penn's profits... it's the age-old idea of cutting the price and making up the difference in sales volume... it worked for the trade companies, not sure how well it ended up working for Penn.

Good explanation and points Sid.

I would ad that it must have worked out great for Penn given the periods, and numbers of trade reels produced as well as the overall sucess of the company.  I think early trade accounts such as Schultz, and Tryon (Kingfisher) will likely critical in providing needed startup capital for tooling, and production-related costs.  Later accounts, such as J.C. Higgens, may have been less crucial to the company.  It seems like, mostly lower cost reel were offered here.  So, the name of the game must have been, as you say , the ability to fill larger orders, and expand markets.  I wonder if this was of greater profitability for Penn or Sears?  Sears certainly overcomplicated the brand by remembering the reel models and parts numbers, in a mostly non-sensical fashion, I might ad.  Trade accounts seemed to have played a more significant role in the company's early history.

John

[sdlehr]

Back in the day, who would have paid full price for a Penn if they could get the same reel with a different name for 1/2-2/3 the price (I pulled those fractions out of thin air, but I think they are probably close)? I presume Penn considered this and took pains to prevent their trade reels from being displayed side by side with their own brand, but I do not really know this to be fact. It would've been to Sears' advantage to display them together, I don't really know if Penn dealt with this or not.

[Crow]

      Thanks for the info ! I have a #15 coming (e bay) , so I can make a close comparison.  I would suppose, that in the time frame these reels were offered , with the depression, the idea of a fisherman saving a buck...or two...on a reel was a big thing. And, if Penn was putting their "Penn Named" reels in the tackle stores, the Tackle Stores, themselves wouldn't have liked having the hardware store, down the street selling "Penn Reels".....but "Surf Angler"...even tho it was the same reel....didn't bother them as much...after all, it wasn't a 'Penn", just a "cheap imitation"(at least that's what they told their customers, I'll bet !). I suppose Penn, themselves felt it was better to sell "unbranded"...and make $.50 per, rather than the $1.00 profit on their "branded" reel, just to keep Pflueger, Ocean City,and the other makers from getting ALL the "trade" business. As you said....volume sales make for cheaper production costs !
       Another question.....Did Penn do any "war work" ? I know a great many companies either switched completely to producing war products, or, devoted most of their capacity to the war effort. Bomb sights, artillery fuses, aircraft parts, ...whatever.....were a big deal in the early 40's.

[oc1]

http://www.whitefishpress.com/bookdetail.asp?book=190
Apparently, no one knows exactly what they were doing during the war years.  Mike says "documentation is elusive".
-steve

[sdlehr]

     I have a #15 coming (e bay) , so I can make a close comparison.

What you'll find is that they are absolutely identical down to the very last detail except for the name on the head plate...


.... and you would think that by now, some 75+ years after the war, we would be able to know what was manufactured in the Penn plant during the war. If Mike hasn't been able to find out, it must be that none of the original Penn employees are still around from those days... which is understandable.... the youngest would be around 90-ish.

[Penn Chronology]

and you would think that by now, some 75+ years after the war, we would be able to know what was manufactured in the Penn plant during the war. If Mike hasn't been able to find out, it must be that none of the original Penn employees are still around from those days... which is understandable.... the youngest would be around 90-ish.

I will ask someone that may know more than we do about war production. I have to do it with snail mail, so an answer could be down the road or not.

War production was so secret that businesses that were manufacturing for the government sometimes did not know what they were making. They build an item or part to a particular spec; but, they very often did not know what the item did. One maker of war products was Frank Perez, the maker of the beautiful Perez reels. He was given a contract to manufacture five items, the government one used one of the items, the other four were fake. He never knew which of the five items was the real one.

[coastal_dan]

Very interesting Mike - Thanks for that.

[sdlehr]

Very interesting Mike - Thanks for that.

x2

[Crow]

   My "#15" arrived today, and, as you said.....they are sisters! Except for a "filed down" foot (probably to fit a smaller reel seat), and a different "badge"...samo-samo. They even both have the brownish "fleck" in the knob material ( I thought it was paint spatter , until I saw that both had it !).
   War time production....and "Patriotism "has always interested me.....I worked (32 years) at a local "Steel & Wire" mill, and the old signs, from "back in the day" were still posted ( We Can Do It !, etc.)It's a shame it takes something like a World War, to get the whole country "heading in the right direction, and working together"!

[oc1]

I bought a model 15 to get the full spool of unused cuttyhunk line and to see how that clutch works.  Pull the handle out to disengage.  It must not have gone over too well because the model was only around for a few years.
-steve

[Crow]

   Well, it IS rather "cumbersome", but, it works !  I did fish with the "Surf Angler" last night(maybe 20 casts), and by the time I put it up, and "fished modern", I was getting sort of used to it ! LOL !

[sdlehr]

It must not have gone over too well because the model was only around for a few years.
-steve

Wasn't there a letter from Pflueger to Penn about this clutch mechanism? Pflueger threatened Penn and Otto Henze's response was to discontinue this mechanism in favor of the eccentric clutch that we have come to know and love.... probably not so much as a result of the threat as much as the superior design.... I think this story is outlined in Mike's blue book... pretty sure I'm remembering it correctly. If not, Mike will be along late tonight

[Penn Chronology]

Wasn't there a letter from Pflueger to Penn about this clutch mechanism? Pflueger threatened Penn and Otto Henze's response was to discontinue this mechanism in favor of the eccentric clutch that we have come to know and love.... probably not so much as a result of the threat as much as the superior design.... I think this story is outlined in Mike's blue book... pretty sure I'm remembering it correctly. If not, Mike will be along late tonight Smiley

Yes there was such a story. Pflueger was nasty when it came to law suits. They were a old, really big company that probably had lawyers on retainer. They accused many companies of Patent Infringement just to cause trouble. The case against Penn was dropped and a disclaimer was placed on the patent in Penn's favor.

[sdlehr]

That was the part of the story I forgot, Henze actually owned the patent! He would've won any suit but discontinued the mechanism voluntarily because he had devised a better one! That Otto was a shrewd dude.

If I've got this story right, couldn't Henze have sued Pflueger if he had wanted to?