Daiwa BG Saltwater 2016: Service Tutorial and First Look

Started by johndtuttle, August 26, 2016, 10:30:02 PM

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Vjtrey1

Hi guys is there anyone has extra side plate screw? I Just need 1 thanks. I'm willing to buy it.

Porthos

Call up Daiwa...they'll probably send you 1-2 screws gratis.

Vjtrey1


gary760

I have 3 daiwa BG
3000 very quiet and very very smooth
5000 very quiet and very smooth
Those reels are every bit as smooth as my shimanos
4000 not quite so quiet and smooth and when the anti reverse is switched
On it makes a faint squeaking sound when the handle is turned slowly,
The sound stops when I turn the handle faster.
The reel is new, but spooled up, I have no intention of returning it because
I don't think this will be noticeable in actual fishing.
But...... I have seen this squeezing on the 4000 mentioned elsewhere with
No reel ( see what I did) solution.
Can any one help

johndtuttle

Quote from: gary760 on July 16, 2021, 07:31:25 AM
I have 3 daiwa BG
3000 very quiet and very very smooth
5000 very quiet and very smooth
Those reels are every bit as smooth as my shimanos
4000 not quite so quiet and smooth and when the anti reverse is switched
On it makes a faint squeaking sound when the handle is turned slowly,
The sound stops when I turn the handle faster.
The reel is new, but spooled up, I have no intention of returning it because
I don't think this will be noticeable in actual fishing.
But...... I have seen this squeezing on the 4000 mentioned elsewhere with
No reel ( see what I did) solution.
Can any one help

I'd get a drop of oil under the rotor into the clutch and on the spool shaft.

gary760

Yes I went with that John before I posted. I  took the rotor off, removed the anti revearse bearing assembly, bit of oil on the assembly, internal sleeve and shaft, a bit more grease on the shaft. Still the same very faint squeak
When the handle is turned slowly with the anti reverse on no squeak when the
Anti reverse is off. The 5000 is fine ( no on off anti reverse) the 3000 with
On off anti reverse is smoother and quieter than a $100 dollar reel has any
Right to be.

nelz

If the sqeak starts when you switch on the AR, then it stands to reason, it must be the AR. Perhaps the oil did not reach into the "squeaky wheel"?  ;D

I would try, (with the roller bearing removed) coating the AR sleeve with light oil and inserting it into the roller and manually rotating it until you're sure the oil has coated all the rollers. If they are the spring loaded type, a thin coat of oil shouldn't cause slipping. You might actually be able to hear the sqeak spinning it in hand before the oiling.

johndtuttle

#112
Quote from: cbar45 on September 15, 2016, 03:46:44 PM
Thanks for this review johndtuttle. From photos it appears the 5000's main shaft does not step down in diameter at the point where it runs through the spool?

On a 8000 that portion of main shaft is super thin relative to the size of the spool and reel in general--thinner even than what you see on the tiny BG-10 (3.3 versus 3.7 mm). My other first impressions of the 8000 though, were favorable. As you say time will tell.


chad

This has actually turned out to be prophetic: The main shaft thinness is a weak point in this design with bent shafts from tugging on bottom snags being distressingly common.

That and the wide open pinion assembly leading to corrosion issues.

The Saltist addresses that with a mag-seal if you can live with it. But the thin shaft remains problematic.

I'll be giving the BG MQ a look soon.

johndtuttle

#113
Quote from: Glos on May 03, 2017, 04:31:01 PMOn a 8000 that portion of main shaft is super thin relative to the size of the spool and reel in general--thinner even than what you see on the tiny BG-10 (3.3 versus 3.7 mm). My other first impressions of the 8000 though, were favorable. As you say time will tell.




I`ve asked alan hawk about that, after I have seen it here, and this is ( part of ) what he answered:

"The 8000 is advertised as having 15kg of max drag, and in the review I rated it a little lower at 12kg. The shaft is perfectly capable of handling this amount, so you should be fine" .

My thought of the reason is that they needed every millimeter of space for maximum capacity of the spool..
I would like it to be thicker, but hey..

and also, lower gear ratio would be much better, for me, no more than 3.9 : 1 is fast enough


This is a case of being right and wrong at the same time.

I trust that the main shaft can hold up to the drag and not bend per "Alan Hawk's" assessment and many people's actual use. But this doesn't take into account your average googan fisho.

When we hook the bottom there are very many reels (ie nearly all) that do not make enough drag to break off the super strong braid on the reel we've spooled. Ie many guys will spool a reel with say, 20# braid that actually breaks off at 40lb. Not many small reels make enough drag to bust off 40# so we palm or thumb the spool to lock it down to break off.

One has to be very careful to then pull straight back to spare rod and reel some of the excessive load. The bent shafts reported were probably guys palming the spools and then jerking like mad to try and free their hooks. This scenario is probably on the spectrum of "abuse" but the margin for this abuse may be too slim on Daiwa's part.

Possibly a classic case of cheaper to replace bent main shafts for googans rather than engineer a better part that costs and weighs more. Needless to say with proper technique for breaking off "Alan Hawk" is probably right. But I don't hear tales of bent shafts too often from other designs that may have more googan proof main shafts yet are condemned as too heavy.

philaroman


can't expect manufacturers to account for gross user error,
especially not during a general make-it-lighter trend
here's my vague, unqualified benchmark for adequate shaft strength/diameter:
consider a scenario that may happen less often to pros, but still happens!!!
let's say top of spool smacks rock/rail, HARD, while most vulnerable at top of oscillation

  • spool sustains enough damage to be swapped & shaft is OK, ready for spare spool = GOOD DESIGN!!!
  • spool is minimally damaged, fully functional, yet shaft is bent, then it's WAY too thin = BAD DESIGN!!!

johndtuttle

#115
When light weight is a pre-eminent goal we will perhaps see many of the above scenarios.

However, read "AH's" review of the Battle III with brass or even stainless gearing. There will be no shaft issues and it has vastly better salt protection of the pinion assembly et al....but will pay a weight penalty.

The Battle III (or especially the DX) a better reel, imo, at that price point for more guys. It truly is a return to the Penn of yore.

johndtuttle

Quote from: johndtuttle on July 11, 2023, 02:17:37 PMWhen light weight is a pre-eminent goal we will perhaps see many of the above scenarios.

However, read "AH's" review of the Battle III with brass or even stainless gearing. There will be no shaft issues and it has vastly better salt protection of the pinion assembly et al....but will pay a weight penalty.

The Battle III (or especially the DX) a better reel, imo, than the BG at price point for more guys. It truly is a return to the Penn of yore with economy and toughness.

Porthos

#117
Quote from: johndtuttle on July 02, 2023, 12:28:24 AMThis is a case of being right and wrong at the same time.

I trust that the main shaft can hold up to the drag and not bend per "Alan Hawk's" assessment and many people's actual use. But this doesn't take into account your average googan fisho.

When we hook the bottom there are very many reels (ie nearly all) that do not make enough drag to break off the super strong braid on the reel we've spooled. Ie many guys will spool a reel with say, 20# braid that actually breaks off at 40lb. Not many small reels make enough drag to bust off 40# so we palm or thumb the spool to lock it down to break off.

One has to be very careful to then pull straight back to spare rod and reel some of the excessive load. The bent shafts reported were probably guys palming the spools and then jerking like mad to try and free their hooks. This scenario is probably on the spectrum of "abuse" but the margin for this abuse may be too slim on Daiwa's part.

Possibly a classic case of cheaper to replace bent main shafts for googans rather than engineer a better part that costs and weighs more. Needless to say with proper technique for breaking off "Alan Hawk" is probably right. But I don't hear tales of bent shafts too often from other designs that may have more googan proof main shafts yet are condemned as too heavy.

Personally, I fish my spinners based on spool capacity rather than factory-rated max drag as most spinners will have much higher factory-rated drags than their intended max listed line class.

I bought the BG 6500 based on Alan Hawk's review in time for the 2017 SOA Charter. It was designated for the 40lb slot given it's spool capacity with 50lb braid main...would maybe fish 50lb top shot in a pinch if needed but so far haven't. Have never exceeded 13lbs drag from top-of-spool, and the reel fishes today as well as it did out-of-the-box in 2017. Had I gotten a BG 8000, it would have occupied the 50lb slot with 65lb braid given I wanted at least 400yds of braid main...but for 50lb, I went with the all metal Fin Nor LT100...felt better with a metal rotor vs. the BG's graphite one.

So with 13lbs drag for the BG 6500, and 16lbs drag for a BG 8000, neither gets close to Alan Hawk's 26.4lbs (12kg). If following my rule-of-thumb 2/3 of factory max of 33, the max I'd ever fish them would cap at 22lbs...putting the BG 8000 in the 60lb class of my spinner arsenal which I chose NOT to do. My second LT100 got the 60lb slot.

IMHO (and actual practice), fishing spinners with a reasonably appropriate line class and well below their factory-rated max drags mitigates any weak/failure points that a manufacturer chose NOT to disclose. My old-school conventionals, however, I choose to hot rod since they came into existence before CAD/CAM, and have a higher chance of being over-engineered to handled their marketed line classes back in their day.

As always, YMMV...

JasonGotaProblem

Devil's advocate: if you only fish a reel within its design parameters you're just lugging around excessively heavy hardware to do a job that could be accomplished by abusing something lighter.

And if it's a quality reel, it'll take that abuse just fine.
Any machine is a smoke machine if you use it wrong enough.

Porthos

#119
Quote from: JasonGotaProblem on September 04, 2023, 11:24:51 PMDevil's advocate: if you only fish a reel within its design parameters you're just lugging around excessively heavy hardware to do a job that could be accomplished by abusing something lighter.

And if it's a quality reel, it'll take that abuse just fine.

By the above logic, a Daiwa SALTIGAG8000H (23.1 oz), with its 55 lb max drag rating, can be a 100lb reel, which you can then do night drop fishing with for SoCal BFT...hmm. Be more than happy to be fishing next to you, but I'll be using a Okuma Makaira MK-30000LS (39 oz) using just 30lbs of its factory-rated 66lbs max.