What's your preferred shark rig?

[biggiesmalls]

What is your preferred shark rig? So far I have only used yakked rigs with smaller 8/0 circles. I need to put together some casting rigs and some bigger yakked rigs for the 2017 season.

For my big rigs I will probably run a sliding trace and a bite leader, with a connector between them. The sliding trace will start with a swivel (it'll be a crane swivel rated in the 600-900 pound range), then 30' of 600 pound mono as the sliding trace, and then another swivel at the end of this. I'm going to double crimp everything on this, with 18" between each crimp. The 18" section will have the #600 mono twisted up, hoping that it will keep the sinker from sliding off of the trace and onto the main line, and also that it will make leadering a little bit easier. There will also be a 300-400 pound coastlock snap swivel on the main section of this rig for the sinker slide.
Then there will be the bite leader. I'm thinking 10' of either single strand wire or cable - what do you prefer here? I'll probably go with the heaviest thing I can get, which is either 900-1000 pound cable, or 360 pound single strand. It'll either be haywire twisted or double crimped with a loop for attachment. At the end will be an 18/0 or a 20/0 circle hook (leaning towards the 20/0), again either double crimped or haywire twisted.
For a connection - I will use a 3/16" galvanized shackle from Home Depot. These seem to be pretty much unbreakable, at least by any fish that I'm catching with a Senator.
Weights will be homemade claw-style weights, I will probably make a few different combinations of sizes. Thinking 4" to 5" long tubes that are 1/2" to 3/4" in diameter, and legs made of 8 to 10 gauge wire.

I don't want this to be a super long post so I will post my casted leader idea in another post.  

[thorhammer]

40 ft of total leader is going to put whoever is on the rod way away up a dune from the action in the dark from the wire  man, if the rod man needs to back off. You need to be a bit closer, remember a star drag is going to be more difficult to back off in the dark than a lever, and with the rig you're putting together you're gonna end up in the dirt if the wire man has to let go and you can't respond quickly enough. 12' multistrand 480 cable will be beyond the tail of most anything, crimped to another a ten feet off 200lb mono. This is pretty much what Daron sent me, and he is fishing it on a 14/0 I believe, with 130 or 150 lb mono, and you may rest assured his motor is up to snuff for 50 lbs drag if he needs it if not well more.  You can use a length of single strand as bite leader if you wish; there is an ongoing debate of preference here. Daron discussed this a couple weeks back.

I'm sure others will have opinions but I think this rig will be more than heavy enough for your 9/0 spooled with 60 mono running line....anything large enough to require what you detailed is highly unlikely to come in any time soon with 20 lbs of drag from the beach, and you'd have to button down to keep from getting spooled, to the point you may pop off. If you fish 50 lbs of drag, may as well be standing on a wakeboard and get a ride out of it...

[biggiesmalls]

Okay, my casted rig will start with a 300-400 pound swivel tied onto the main line. Next will be 6' of 400 pound mono (maybe 300 pound), probably just single crimped, but maybe double. There will be a coastlock snap swivel on here for a sinker slide, probably just those same 300-400 pound ones used on the other rod. At the end of this, I will crimp on a 300-400 pound snap swivel for a connector. I don't think those galvanized shackles will work well on a casted rig - probably a little too heavy.
The bite leader will be simple - 2' of single strand wire, somewhere in the 120-180 pound range. Haywire twisted at both ends, one kept open so it can be connected to the sliding trace, and one with a hook on the end. I will probably go with Eagle Claw circle sea hooks here, the 7/0 size can handle any bull red I come across and any shark that my casting tackle could handle.
Weights will be 3 and 5 ounce snake tongue sinkers for light to medium current, and then I'll build a few lighter claw-style sinkers for heavier current.

[RowdyW]

For those sized sharks I would go with a #12 bite leader about 14-16 inches long using a 10/-12/0 2X circle hook on one end & a 250# barrel swivel on the other end, both with haywire twists. Then attach a 250# stranded wire leader about 8 ft. long with double crimps to the barrel swivel. Then attach 15 ft. of 200# mono to the barrel swivel with double crimps. Slide on a small barrel swivel on the 200# mono  for your slider weight. Use a couple of feet of 30-40# mono for your sinker on that swivel so the sinker breaks off during the fight & you are fighting the fish not the weight. Then on the end of the 200# mono leader attach another 250# barrel swivel. This will all attach to your main line which should have a 350# ball bearing snap lock swivel on the end. The heavier the wire you use the more likely they will shy away from your bait. If you are running into small sharks just use the bite leader attached to the 200# mono.            Rudy

[biggiesmalls]

Rowdy, some components in that look a bit light to me. Here's my (new) logic with this:

On the 9/0, I'll be targeting any size shark around here that I can't handle on casting gear (currently, that is an Ambassadeur 7000, and will be upgraded sooner or later). Let's put the limit at 5-6 feet on that setup, and that's with a little bit of luck. That means anything over that 5-6 foot mark, I will be targeting on the 9/0. Now, the only 10'+ sharks you have a chance of catching from short would be a tiger or a great hammerhead - in NC, I don't know of many big hammerheads being caught, but tigers are another story. They're not abundant, but they are definitely out there. I have full confidence that once the 9/0 is done, I could handle a 10' tiger with it. Could I go larger? Only time and luck will tell. But for now, let's say that this rig is targeting fish in the 6-10 foot range - meaning I want something right in between my casted rig and my original kayak rig.

To me, that means something done the same way as the heavier kayaked rig, just toned down. 500 pound swivels, same sinker slides, same sinkers, 15' of 500 pound mono, little bit smaller shackle for a connector, about 8 feet of 300 pound wire, and then a circle hook that's roughly the equivalent of a 15/0 or 16/0. That's a finished length of under 25 feet, which is a lot more manageable for both me and the leader man. It should, in theory, be able to handle a 6-10 foot shark pretty well.

Just my thoughts. What's the purpose of the two different wire leaders? wouldn't it make sense to have just the same strength of wire through the entire rig? You would also eliminate having another swivel in there, which is another potential place that the rig can fail.
I know I'm probably overthinking this, I'm almost sure there's no way that the OG shark fishermen ever went through this much trouble just to catch fish. I could throw a length of wire, a sinker slide, and a hook on there and would probably still catch fish fine, lol. But building high-quality rigs to test is part of the fun

[Jeri]

Hi,

For your casting rig, I would consider it all a bit too heavy duty. We do quite a bit of shark fishing off the beach here in southern Africa, mainly in our competitions, where weight is the scoring factor. While recently we have pretty much moved over to using fixed spool reels (spinners) and braid, we used to do a lot with multipliers (conventionals) and nylon.

First thing you will probably find is that your ABU 7000 is going to be marginal on line capacity, unless you put a lot of braid backing on before switching to mono top shot. Typically, we were using reels like Finnor, Torium and Trinidad 30 or Sealine 50, purely because of the strength of drag and capacity - the drag on the 7000 is going to be a very limiting factor if you get something close to the upper size limits of 5-6'.

The rigs that we cast in either the conventional or spinner reels are as per the picture below' used with a casting leader of 100-150lb braid or mono depending on which reel/line type we are using.



I appreciate that it is not using circle hooks, but that would be an easy substitute. The total length of wire is about 4-5 feet long, 100lb swivel at the top, crimped stop in the middle, bead and swivel to carry a nylon dropper for the sinker - longer than the remainder of the hook length. Hook length no more than 3 feet long, double hooks, one sliding to mount the bait, and adjustable for size of bait. The wire is simply 135 or 270lb nylon coated 7 strand, single crimped at all junctions.

Over the years I have seen huge amounts of money wasted on rigs and tackle for sharks, going way oversize as soon as the word 'shark' comes into the equation. The rig above we happily cast reasonable distances - 100 metres + (300 feet)with no real problems, and all fished generally on mainlines 40-50lbs. With this type of set up local anglers are quite happy to fish for sharks up to 8 foot or slightly more, with no real problems. The only time we generally use the heavier wire is when we encounter Bluntnosed Sevengill sharks, otherwise 135lb is more than adequate for Copper sharks.



An 8' Copper shark landed on 50lb braid, weighed in at about 100kgs (220lbs) by an angler in my club, during a local competition. The essense is that lighter rigs will cast further and have more flexibility to not deter the sharks, at times they are very much 'eating machines', but others they can be as finicky as a wild brook trout.

Hope this helps.

Cheers from sunny Africa

Jeri

[Tightlines667]

Pretty picture there

[biggiesmalls]

Wow, thanks for that impressive write-up! Yeah, the Abu is definitely not the best reel for the task - I was planning on about 300 yards of 30# braid with the rest 30# mono on top. I would've liked to have 50# braid underneath, but it won't give me enough capacity. I might have to find an old Jigmaster (like the 505HS that I just got rid of) and load it with 300 yards of 50# braid with 30# mono on top - it would probably make for a much nicer setup.

That is one slick-looking rig, I'll tell you that. I might have to steal the idea, maybe modify it a little bit. Is the sinker fixed in place, or sliding? I will definitely be going with circle hooks - I don't want to risk a shark's life if I don't have to.

Given me a lot of thoughts as to rig design! Thanks for your insight. Oh yeah, awesome shark as well!

[Jeri]

The sinker is mounted on the small coil of nylon shown in the picture, so it has limited slide capability, before the shark feels the anchorage. The point to all this, is that the rod is held, and as soon as it starts to pull down and run, you set the hook. This inevitably hooks in the corner of the mourh, very, very rarely anywhere else. The bead infront of the sliding swivel is to stop that sliding swivel jamming over the midway stop crimp.

The real secret is to rig the bottom hook as a stiff rig. Pass the wire down through the eye, then two turns around the shank of the hook, then back up through the eye to be crimped. Pulled tight before the crimping is done, means that the hook point is always pointing in the direction of the wire and mainline - no 'floppy hook' situation. Just to make it tidy, we pop a little heat shrink over the crimp and end of the wire, to stop accidentally spiking on the cut end of wire.

I always look to the words of my angling mentor - fish are not impressed by complexity - keep it simple and tidy.

Cheers from sunny Africa

Jeri

[RowdyW]

bs, you asked for a recomendation for 7-8 ft. sharks & then compared the rigs I suggested for 10 ft. plus sharks. You asked for suggestions but it seems you just want to rig for a 20 Ft. Great White and fight it with a baitcaster. By the way an 8 ft. bite leader is going to get kinked pretty quick no matter how heavy it is. Why ask if you think you know what to rig?         Rudy

[Jeri]

Hi 'biggiesmalls',

I would observe that you are perhaps falling into the trap of over designing your end tackle for bigger sharks - a common mistake. The thing is to design things down to the respective components and then balance out the whole set up, usually by going down in size rather than up.

A shark trace is generally made up of two section, the bite piece, which is where the hooks are, and is going to come into contact with the teeth on the beastie. Having biting pieces too long does not achieve anything significant, it just need to be strong enough to withstand the teeth, and long enough that the shark doesn't get beyond the wire, when the bait is in the mouth. So, even for a very large shark, the mouth size is the key dmension, perhaps on some of the much bigger sharks that you anticipate with your 'kayak baits', it would suggest a maximum of 3' long for the wire. As you anticiapte on using circle hooks, once hooked up, there will be no wire inside the shark's mouth, it will hopefully have been hooked int he corner of the mouth.

The next part of the trace deals with the abrasive nature of the skin of the sharks, which is basically microscopic small teeth - so very rough, but not that rough that it warrents the use of wire. Heavy nylon is the way to go here, and the choice of a particular brand of nylon might well improve performance. Generally we previously looked for 'hard' mono, as used by commercial longliners, as it is very resistant to abrasion. The length of the rubbing leader needs to be at least the length of the largest shark you are likely to encounter, plus perhaps a little to be safe. For 10' sharks, I would suggest that a 12' rubbing leader would be more than sufficient. Hard mono is very resiliant, sit down with a piece stretched between your knees, and rub away with some sand paper - see just how long it takes to impact significantly on the strength of the line - you'll be surprised. Then compare your sanding motions as to the very limited rubbing motion that a nylon trace gets when rubbing over shark skin during a long fight.

Now connections between the two sections - biting and rubbing needs to be no stronger that the waekest component - if using 250lb wire, then a 250lb swivel is the most that is going to be needed. As is the swivel that you are going to connect to your main line.

Going over the top in strengths is wasteful, and ultimately hinders the performance of the whole rig, as it all becomes heavy and cumbersome, especially when the sharks are not in a frenzy type feeding mode, there will be times that you experience sharks that will bite quite shyly, almost in a nervous fashion, and this is where overly heavy rigs will certainly hinder your getting a hook up.

Ultimately, you don't want to build a rig that would could get a second job towing small ships, but something that will just deal with the different aspects of the shark fight you anticipate.

As said on our casting rigs, we just use a 100-150lb mono as the rubbing leader when we were using multipliers and nylon. Now that we are using braid and spinning type reels, we just use a rubbing leader of 100-150lb braid (easier to cast). It very rarely gets rubbed through during fights with our long rods that last up to 2 hours.

Small is good, big is not better.

Hope that helps.

Cheers from sunny Africa.

Jeri

[biggiesmalls]

Hi 'biggiesmalls',

I would observe that you are perhaps falling into the trap of over designing your end tackle for bigger sharks - a common mistake. The thing is to design things down to the respective components and then balance out the whole set up, usually by going down in size rather than up.

A shark trace is generally made up of two section, the bite piece, which is where the hooks are, and is going to come into contact with the teeth on the beastie. Having biting pieces too long does not achieve anything significant, it just need to be strong enough to withstand the teeth, and long enough that the shark doesn't get beyond the wire, when the bait is in the mouth. So, even for a very large shark, the mouth size is the key dmension, perhaps on some of the much bigger sharks that you anticipate with your 'kayak baits', it would suggest a maximum of 3' long for the wire. As you anticiapte on using circle hooks, once hooked up, there will be no wire inside the shark's mouth, it will hopefully have been hooked int he corner of the mouth.

The next part of the trace deals with the abrasive nature of the skin of the sharks, which is basically microscopic small teeth - so very rough, but not that rough that it warrents the use of wire. Heavy nylon is the way to go here, and the choice of a particular brand of nylon might well improve performance. Generally we previously looked for 'hard' mono, as used by commercial longliners, as it is very resistant to abrasion. The length of the rubbing leader needs to be at least the length of the largest shark you are likely to encounter, plus perhaps a little to be safe. For 10' sharks, I would suggest that a 12' rubbing leader would be more than sufficient. Hard mono is very resiliant, sit down with a piece stretched between your knees, and rub away with some sand paper - see just how long it takes to impact significantly on the strength of the line - you'll be surprised. Then compare your sanding motions as to the very limited rubbing motion that a nylon trace gets when rubbing over shark skin during a long fight.

Now connections between the two sections - biting and rubbing needs to be no stronger that the waekest component - if using 250lb wire, then a 250lb swivel is the most that is going to be needed. As is the swivel that you are going to connect to your main line.

Going over the top in strengths is wasteful, and ultimately hinders the performance of the whole rig, as it all becomes heavy and cumbersome, especially when the sharks are not in a frenzy type feeding mode, there will be times that you experience sharks that will bite quite shyly, almost in a nervous fashion, and this is where overly heavy rigs will certainly hinder your getting a hook up.

Ultimately, you don't want to build a rig that would could get a second job towing small ships, but something that will just deal with the different aspects of the shark fight you anticipate.

As said on our casting rigs, we just use a 100-150lb mono as the rubbing leader when we were using multipliers and nylon. Now that we are using braid and spinning type reels, we just use a rubbing leader of 100-150lb braid (easier to cast). It very rarely gets rubbed through during fights with our long rods that last up to 2 hours.

Small is good, big is not better.

Hope that helps.

Cheers from sunny Africa.

Jeri

Thanks for the reply Jeri. My thought process is that since there are big sharks around, going with heavier rather than light tackle is better. That's at least the general thought that people go by over here. I believe #19 wire is what a lot of people use for big tigers and hammerheads, with #15 being popular for sharks at 6-8 feet and #10 or #12 more popular for anything less than 6 foot (just going by what I've been picking up here). Downsizing the rig is a very interesting idea, and you've got some nice-looking sharks caught on one of those rigs to match - one thing I've got to ask, exactly how long would one of those rigs last? I'm pretty much definitely set on trying one of them, perhaps modifying them a little bit to match the conditions here. That brings up another question - how similar are African beaches to beaches in the Carolinas? This could be a reason for heavier tackle that's used here.

I am not trying to take the side of "heavy tackle vs light tackle" - I am more interested in learning, and getting it right rather than "my side" being right.

I have just realized - you cast all of your baits, don't you? We will be kayaking lots of baits off the beach, but we will be casting some as well. The kayaked baits will be larger, and a bit tougher in case something big comes along.

This is very interesting, and a little weird to hear - 3' of wire is not something that I'm used to hearing. I've heard anywhere from 4 to 12, and I've seen some 2' bite leaders for casted gear - but 3' max is new to me. Although that's a good point that seems overlooked - with a circle hook, there isn't much of a chance of the wire going in the mouth of a fish. The ONLY case I could think of - would be with a very wide shark, that managed to get hooked in one side of the mouth, then ran towards the beach and managed to get the wire in its mouth - which is a very unlikely situation. It could happen, yes, but it would be a freak incident.

I was definitely planning on some heavy mono after the wire. I believe over here, Lindgren Pitman mono is the heaviest, toughest stuff available for a reasonable price. A 12' leader sounds perfect, plenty manageable for the leaderer, and easy enough to transport too.

It will be interesting to see if the lighter rigs truly do work far better than heavier ones. I know the less metal the better with shark rigs, I have never heard the smaller the better though - like I said, everyone here goes super heavy.

What size sharks have you managed to bring in on the 100-150 pound mono rubbing leader? Also, what size wire do you prefer to use for different sized sharks?

Thank you very much, your posts have been very helpful  

[biggiesmalls]

bs, you asked for a recomendation for 7-8 ft. sharks & then compared the rigs I suggested for 10 ft. plus sharks. You asked for suggestions but it seems you just want to rig for a 20 Ft. Great White and fight it with a baitcaster. By the way an 8 ft. bite leader is going to get kinked pretty quick no matter how heavy it is. Why ask if you think you know what to rig?         Rudy

Hi Rowdy, thanks for the reply. I'm a little confused what you're saying in the first part -

"you asked for a reccomendation for 7-8 ft. sharks & then compared the rigs I suggested for 10 ft. plus sharks."

As far as the rest - I'm definitely not trying to rig up for a 20' shark, I'm just trying to go off of what I've seen used before. The components were influenced by those used by Tunastick (member on Sharksonthesand) and by BlacktipH on youtube. They both have a "heavier is better" attitude when it comes to things - partly, I think, because when that monster hammerhead or tiger hits their bait, they want to prioritize landing it as quickly as possible without worrying about their gear being damaged. Not a bad thing per se, but with that, 9.9/10 sharks you come across won't be as fun to catch.

That's a good point about the 8' bite leader - if a shark wraps up in it, it'll be kinked badly. I think Jeri's suggestion of 3' max is a good figure, I'll play around with it and see how much abuse it takes to break the stuff.

I'm not trying to come off as rude or anything, just trying to defend the other side of things here (the "go heavy" side) so that ultimately, both have a fighting chance and I can properly determine which will suit the task better. I think I know what to rig (well at least I thought, you and Jeri have given me a few ideas), but I wanted to check on here to see what everyone thought of them. Turns out, they just might be a bit too heavy for my intended uses.

[biggiesmalls]

Oh, Jeri - I have a few other questions about your rig if you don't mind me asking.

1) What weights are you using? Standard pyramid weights, claw-style weights, spider-style, or something else? What weight do you find sufficient for your style of fishing?
2) I am a bit confused on the length of the rig in your picture - is there 3 feet of wire there, or 5?
3) What kind of setup are you using to cast these out? Interested to hear what length of rod you're using, and what reel/line setup you're getting 100 yards of distance with.

[RowdyW]

Well you had better take a closer look at the rods & reels they are using. It looks like you are going to have to trade in that Abu & 9/0 Penn for a 14/0 Penn, or an 80 or 130 2 speed loaded with 200# main line. If you want to catch them quickly & cleanly what you have is not anywhere near enough to cut it humanly. And you will need a 5' 6"-6' rod about 80-130# to start. Rollers optional.         Rudy