Lament of 114h

Tom McKinney · October 18, 2014, 05:25:11 PM

In the last few months I have built or rebuilt about a dozen Penn reels. Mostly senators or jigmasters and many were simply piles of parts from stash I had acquired. I really love working on them. I like making them better and stronger. I like hunting for clean used parts on line for good prices that turn ugly step sisters into Cinderella.

I opened up a pair of Daiwa 600h reels yesterday. I had worked on this type before but the building of so many Penn reels recently, including the multiple as employ of some because something moved or didn't seat right really made me stop and think. The Sealine is just such a darn superior reel. It's the same concept IMHO but executed so much better especially in term of being able to service and assemble. And you can't buy a tiburon frame because they come with such a nice darn frame already.

So my 114h sits, all red and shiny with new rings, new aluminum bars and set of Bryan's drags and some kind of new tangled handle. I'll use it on the new boat, but I'll know it's three cousins, more plain in looks, and not as much fun to mess with inside are sitting there working just well if not a little smoother and stronger, especially now that Bryan has drags in stock.

Oh and did I mention that one of the 600h reels of $40 shipped and there is absolutely not a single thing wrong with it.

foakes · October 18, 2014, 05:57:52 PM

These old Daiwa Sealines are simply excellent winches -- no chance of a frame bend or tweak -- overbuilt interior components -- strong, cheap, and ugly -- all good in my book!

Occasionally a company will come out with a line of reels that are overbuilt and under-appreciated. I believe the Sealine series is one of these.

I have a couple of 900s, just waiting for me to get around to a good upgrade and service. This will include a good drag stack, and a stronger torquing handle with a more comfortable crank knob. That's about all you ever need to do to these old soldiers.

Great reel for halibut.

Good work on all of the Penns -- show us some pics when you get a chance...

Best,

Fred

Shark Hunter · October 18, 2014, 10:06:06 PM

I have to agree with you Tom. As much as I love my Senators. The Sealines are no slouch. I only have two. A 600 and 900H.

Ron Jones · October 18, 2014, 11:29:53 PM

I really like Diawa reels, my Millionaire CX-V went to Cedros and caught 100s of mackerel 6 at a time and my graphite 20 brought in my biggest ling to date. But to be fair, I don't think we are looking at everything when it comes to the 600H/ 114H.

On this forum their has been questions about replacing the 600H gear sleeve due to rounding over from excessive drag. The "guessed" drag was greater than 30#s, but that was with a factory drag stack and I'm not sure a factory drag stack would get there.

Every Diawa reel I have ever fished or read about needs to be kept very clean to fight off corrosion. I'm guessing their alloys are selected for strength as opposed to corrosion resistance.

Their are more handle arms available for the Penn reel, this may or may not be a concern.

Their are multiple gear ratios available for the 114H.

So, I think I can make this qualified statement: The 600H is a superior reel to the 114H out of the box, but the 114H with gears, sleeve and other available upgrades is the best 6/0 reel money can buy for a lot less money that others. (In my not so humble opinion, their isn't a lever drag reel that is superior to a star drag and multiple main gears are silly. I came to fish not drive a F1 race car.)

Ron

floating doc · October 19, 2014, 04:35:57 AM

I love my sealine reels. I've got a 50H, 450H, 600H and a 900H. I will confirm that I rounded the sleeve on my 600 with one of Bryan's drag upgrades, but still managed to get a nurse shark that outweighed me off the bottom and to boatside with the wounded reel.

day0ne · October 19, 2014, 05:26:52 AM

Quote from: noyb72 on October 18, 2014, 11:29:53 PM

On this forum their has been questions about replacing the 600H gear sleeve due to rounding over from excessive drag. The "guessed" drag was greater than 30#s, but that was with a factory drag stack and I'm not sure a factory drag stack would get there.

Every Diawa reel I have ever fished or read about needs to be kept very clean to fight off corrosion. I'm guessing their alloys are selected for strength as opposed to corrosion resistance.

Their are more handle arms available for the Penn reel, this may or may not be a concern.

Their are multiple gear ratios available for the 114H.

So, I think I can make this qualified statement: The 600H is a superior reel to the 114H out of the box, but the 114H with gears, sleeve and other available upgrades is the best 6/0 reel money can buy for a lot less money that others. (In my not so humble opinion, their isn't a lever drag reel that is superior to a star drag and multiple main gears are silly. I came to fish not drive a F1 race car.)

Ron

A few comments.
I can't speak for the rounding off of the gear sleeve as I have never had that problem with a Sealine, but I can speak for the other points. I've never had any corrosion problems on the aluminum parts of a Sealine and looking at all the ones on ebay, don't see any problems there. Maybe other Daiwa's corrode but I've never seen the problem on a Sealine, and I have about 10 of them.

There can't be more handle arms for Penn's because in most cases, the handles interchange. I'm using Penn (actually Tiburon for Penn) handles on my 400's and 600's.

IMO, the Sealine's have a superior gear ratio to the Penn's (3.1:1 vs 2.8:1) and don't need other gear ratios as much as the Penn's do, hence not many available.

So, after upgrading the 114H, you basically have a stock 600H with a better sleeve, that cost a lot more money. I also believe the 600H is capable of more drag once the drag is upgraded. BTW, they are real pretty when powder coated.

As for your opinion of lever drags and two speeds, well, you're entitled, but I'll keep on using both, as they have their place.

Porthos · October 19, 2014, 05:46:36 AM

Have three 600H's and one 400H (am on the hunt for a 30H and a 300H to round out my "envisioned ideal" set.)

All were bought used for a total that was just shy of $190--so less than $47.50 a reel. The factory 1-piece aluminum frames come in either silver (earlier models) or anodized dark gray (later models)--no need for any aftermarket frames. After an initial wipe down with WD-40, none of the frames, plates, or rings showed any signs of corrosion. The original design of the Sealine H's come from a bygone era, so the alloy compositions appear to be different than those of newer Daiwas that are more prone to corrosion.

All three 600H's have Bryan Young's 5+1 stack (though I may swap out the +1's to delrin's for the 2015 season); the 400H has HT-100's in 3+1 config.

As dayOne stated, the 600H gear sleeves are compatible with 6/0 and 9/0 arms.

All my Sealine H's were on the 2014 SOA trip:

Staring from the Fin-nor LT100, they are on the 3rd, 4th, 7th, and 8th setups (400H, 600H, 600H, and 600H, respectively). After a fresh water spray-down and wiping, they are none the worse for wear.

Four Sealine H reels and all upgrades averaged less than $74 per reel. In comparison, my Penn 27 and 970 averaged $110 per reel.

day0ne · October 19, 2014, 09:23:34 PM

One other thing. The parts for the Sealine's are much, much cheaper than the Penn's

Ron Jones · October 19, 2014, 10:04:43 PM

Apparently I wasn't clear. I really like the Sealine 600H. I agree that you get much more for your money with them compared to a 114H. However, money not withstanding, a tube framed 114H with SS gear sleeve, Pro Gear high speed gears, especially if you can find the hex version, double stainless dogs and upgraded bearings will be a superior reel. I doubt anyone could practically fish the two reels to the point of failure, but the SS gear sleeve alone makes it stronger, not to mention the stainless gears.

Again, you will have spent more money, but that isn't always the first consideration.

By the way, your 27 is still the most fun I can remember with a fishing reel.

Ron

Tom McKinney · October 19, 2014, 11:09:51 PM

Oh crap! You guys just cost me a bunch of money. I had no idea that 6/0 handles would fit and now that I do I will have to buy some. Cannot stop. LOL

Shark Hunter · October 20, 2014, 03:18:40 AM

Ok,
I can't take it any more. I went through a 114H wide last night I bought for a Benjamin. I left it completely stock. It has a 5 stack and is a very capable reel.
I am a Penn Man through and through! Is there a wide sealine?
No Lamenting Here. Don't hate, Celebrate!

Porthos · October 20, 2014, 03:24:39 AM

Quote from: noyb72 on October 19, 2014, 10:04:43 PM...By the way, your 27 is still the most fun I can remember with a fishing reel.

Ron

Was happy to share and glad you enjoyed it! Good to know I was not crazy and that somebody else appreciates the benefit of hot rodding a 27.

Course, Sal one-upped me with the double-dog.

I picked up an eBay 29-100 chromed brass spool for just a little over $12 and will be rebuilding the MAROON 27 I also have. This one will NOT be getting the SS gear sleeve or P16 anytime soon--it will have the standard posts and be JUST a 20lb reel.

Quote from: Tom McKinney on October 19, 2014, 11:09:51 PM
Oh crap! You guys just cost me a bunch of money. I had no idea that 6/0 handles would fit and now that I do I will have to buy some. Cannot stop. LOL

This is the cheapest option I found and bought:

http://www.ebay.com/itm/Replacement-T-Bar-Handle-with-Molded-Knob-Fits-PENN-Senator-6-0-114-114H-9-0-115-/311134601474?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item4871114102

...though I suspect you are looking for something more "substantial" from Adam, Alan, and/or Lee.

floating doc · October 23, 2014, 12:17:52 PM

There isn't a wide 6/0, but I do have the wide 4/0 (450H).

ez2cdave · September 05, 2017, 05:25:23 PM

Quote from: floating doc on October 23, 2014, 12:17:52 PM
There isn't a wide 6/0, but I do have the wide 4/0 (450H).

Yes, it's an old thread . . . But it brought back a memory about wide Sealine H reels !

I have always wished that Daiwa would have produced a 650H, a 950H, and a 1200H . . . Alas, it never happened.

If they had made those reels, they would have been EPIC !

Tight Lines !

boon · September 06, 2017, 12:04:52 AM

Quote from: noyb72 on October 18, 2014, 11:29:53 PM
In my not so humble opinion, their isn't a lever drag reel that is superior to a star drag and multiple main gears are silly. I came to fish not drive a F1 race car

Again, just my 2c, but once you fish a Talica or Saltiga Lever Drag (despite Alan's reservations about the sideplate design).... the old-style star-drags really do show their age.
I think it's super cool what can be done with a 114H nowadays, but the new generation lever drag reels just leave them for dead.