Mitchell 314 -- Question

Started by wfjord, October 28, 2017, 07:25:05 PM

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wfjord

I picked up this little Mitchell 314 locally for $15, serviced it and loaded it with some with 8# blue Ande Back Country monofilament. A nice, sweet cranking little reel.  As I was cranking new line onto the reel spool, I noticed the reel was loading the line onto the spool in a way that there was more at the bottom and gradually less at the top of the spool.  The transition on the spool of more line to less line takes place so evenly and perfectly that at first I thought it might be designed to do that to cast further, but then got concerned it could cause the line to drop off the spool, which it actually started doing to some extent.

Does anyone have any thoughts on this? Is it normal or a malfunction?



paulo57t09

#1
Putting line on a spool has always been like black magic to me.  I can get it on the spool OK, but I always manage to get it all twisted up.

Now that you know my level of expertise on the subject, it looks to me like there's too much line of your spool.

Also, looking at the schematics of the 314, it appears that they have planamatic gearing like the big salt water reels.

I am familiar with the salt water reels (the 302 in particular) and (AFAIK) the planamatic gearing assembles only one way.  I've never had a 314 apart, but maybe what you're seeing is an incorrect assembly issue with the gears.

wfjord

When I'm putting new line on a spinning reel, I always crank it so it comes off the new line spool counter-clockwise and it spools on with little to no twist.  Cranking it off clockwise will cause it to twist badly.  The problems I get with line twist is with doing a lot of casting, even with a swivel.

I may indeed have a little too much line on the reel, but I left slightly over an eighth inch space between the line and top edge of the spool (measured it). Some of the wider coils of line have dropped down towards the front of the spool making it look more overfilled.  I've never had that problem on any of my other spinning reels.  For a light/ultralight class reel, this 314 has a wider spool (particularly at the bottom) and holds a lot of line.

As this, so far, is the only Mitchell I've taken apart and serviced, it's entirely possible there is an incorrect assembly issue with the gears.  As far as I could tell everything went back together smoothly the way it came off, but being only about seven months into learning to service and repair all my reels, anything is possible--or better yet, probable.

foakes

#3
With the planamatic gears where the spool bobs up and down at different intervals -- just assemble the gears at a different point -- in relation to position and spool shaft -- and see how that works.  Might need to do it a couple of times to improve it.

Also, make sure the spool is all of the way down on the shaft.

Also make sure that there are no extra under-spool spacer washers.

The line lay should be even and flat from front to back -- and it should be 1/8" under the lowest curve of the upper lip -- regardless of where it spools onto the bottom.

All should be even.

This is an easy problem to fix.

These 314/315's have the better line lay system -- as compared to the more common 304/305.

Best,

Fred
The Official, Un-Authorized Service and Restoration Center for quality vintage spinning reels.

D-A-M Quick, Penn, Mitchell, and ABU/Zebco Cardinals

--------

The first rule of fishing is to fish where the fish are. The second rule of fishing is to never forget the first rule.

"Enjoy the little things in Life — For someday, you may look back — and realize that they were the big things"
                                                     Fred O.

wfjord

Fred,
Thanks for the tips. There's a lot I wasn't seeing in this reel.  I tried resetting the gear numerous times, and currently have the gears out, but now I'm starting to take a closer look at the spool.  I made several observances here:

With the planetary and satellite gears removed, the slide goes down further. The prominences protruding from the interior side plate of reel body keep the gears from moving the slide further towards the end --that seems to be the way it's supposed to be.  So now the spool...

The spool seems to lock down onto the axis/shaft in the rotor okay, but maybe not quite far enough down.  Looking into the hole on the bottom side of the spool, the end of the shaft tube is slightly off center from the "teeth" inside the bottom of the spool; also it's making a rubbing noise on the shaft. I'll need to remove all the line (tomorrow) in order to take the spool apart to make sure all the spool parts are centered and correctly assembled. That might resolve the problem. (I had previously taken the spool apart when I serviced the reel.)

I'll let you know what I find after I get the spool checked out, but for tonight I've got to hit the sack early.

wfjord

The spool looks to be okay ---it fits down on the shaft and locks into place properly. No under-washers in contact with the bottom of the spool. In the bottom of the rotor is the hex nut, bail trip, a small steel washer and a thin brass or copper washer/shim.  Tried removing the washers from under the bail trip to no effect. The reel is still loading the spool heavier at the bottom.



 

foakes

Some pics would likely help --

Could be something as simple as a bent bail.

Best,

Fred
The Official, Un-Authorized Service and Restoration Center for quality vintage spinning reels.

D-A-M Quick, Penn, Mitchell, and ABU/Zebco Cardinals

--------

The first rule of fishing is to fish where the fish are. The second rule of fishing is to never forget the first rule.

"Enjoy the little things in Life — For someday, you may look back — and realize that they were the big things"
                                                     Fred O.

Midway Tommy

Quote from: foakes on October 30, 2017, 02:53:12 PM
Some pics would likely help --

Could be something as simple as a bent bail.

Best,

Fred

Or a bent bail trip arm or worn bail plate. As Fred indicated, it doesn't take much misalignment of the bail line guide to stack additional line at the base of the spool. 
Love those open face spinning reels! (Especially ABU & ABU/Zebco Cardinals)

Tommy D (ORCA), NE



Favorite Activity? ............... In our boat fishing
RELAXING w/ MY BEST FRIEND (My wife Bonnie)

wfjord

I'm hoping to get some photos posted later this evening.

It's a nice little reel with not many parts, and the first planamatic reel system I've encountered, but the solution hasn't been obvious and it's starting to get the best of me.

happyhooker

I believe the Mitchell 309 I got a couple of weeks ago has planamatic gearing.  When you crank the handle to retrieve, watch how the spool kinda hesitates & reels in at a varying pace--that's the planamatic at work. It is hard to describe, but the spool does not move at a uniform pace.  But, I'm suspecting it shouldn't stack line at the back of the spool likes yours is doing, wfjord.

Will look forward to your additional info later.

Frank

Midway Tommy

#10
Quote from: happyhooker on October 30, 2017, 09:56:05 PM
I believe the Mitchell 309 I got a couple of weeks ago has planamatic gearing.  When you crank the handle to retrieve, watch how the spool kinda hesitates & reels in at a varying pace--that's the planamatic at work. It is hard to describe, but the spool does not move at a uniform pace.  But, I'm suspecting it shouldn't stack line at the back of the spool likes yours is doing, wfjord.

Will look forward to your additional info later.

Frank

Here's an example of how it is supposed to work.

Love those open face spinning reels! (Especially ABU & ABU/Zebco Cardinals)

Tommy D (ORCA), NE



Favorite Activity? ............... In our boat fishing
RELAXING w/ MY BEST FRIEND (My wife Bonnie)

handi2

#11
If all else fails you can shim the rotor up. This will raise everything else. How many shims are on the shaft before putting the rotor on?

How many shims under the bail trip? Put those on the shaft before the rotor.


OCD Reel Service & Repair
Gulf Breeze, FL

wfjord

#12
Keith, I was thinking shimming the rotor might be helpful.  I don't have a shim that would fit it --the shim would have to be wide enough to go over the pinion which is built into the rotor.
There is one small shim and a steel washer between the hex nut and the inner rotor surface. They won't fit anywhere other than on the threaded end of the tube that extends from the body section up through the pinion and into the rotor.


Most recently today, I've been working again at resetting the main gear to see if it makes differences with the position of the middle satellite(?) gear with the two knobs, but it's really impossible to know because there's no way to see their positions.  So far nothing has worked.

This is probably way more photos than anyone wants to see, but maybe one of them will be helpful.































oc1

The bail and line guide is not perpendicular to the spool.  That can mess up the line lay.  I don't know what the bail stop looks like but it could be worn or hammered down from the bail slamming shut.
-steve

Bryan Young

That is one pretty reel.  I only knew of the 304.  I wasn't aware of at 314.

Can't help with your line issue.  Sorry.
:D I talk with every part I send out and each reel I repair so that they perform at the top of their game. :D