Grease

[jurelometer]

  You guys have caused me to try and think. Always trouble. So, what are we trying to accomplish when we grease gears? I know we use grease generally to protect surfaces from water,and a lubricant of some sort to reduce friction in bearings.But the actual meshing surfaces of the teeth transmit power. As noted, grease is squeezed out-rejected- by the mating surfaces,but I'm wondering if any kind of slippery in the teeth is a bad thing,causing sliding forces where they shouldn't be. Which is worse-friction from dry tooth surfaces with full power transmission or the friction from slippery tooth surfaces as a result of the power transmission? In other words,what's most sensible-grease all surfaces and let the teeth decide how much grease to keep? Grease all but the teeth,and film them with a liquid/spray like corrosion-x? Or -can't be right- run 'em with dry teeth? Or does any of it make a difference? Who thinks what?

Would you drain the oil from a transfer case on a truck axle and run it dry?  No.  A fishing reel does not have a case to hold the oil or lubricant around the gears, grease/oil/lubricant does more than just corrosion control. It also aids the smooth contact of metal surfaces as they mate reducing metal on metal wear reducing excess friction and reducing excess temperatures.

^^^This!

Gear teeth have a specific curved shape (search on this site or elsewhere for involute gear) to enable a constant even transmission of power.  The teeth surfaces "roll" across each other in a manner similar to plain bearings.  So the reason to lubricate is the same as any other rolling surface.  Think of a gear tooth as the love-child of a bearing and a lever.

As for  TSI 301,  the folks here that do a lot of reels really like the stuff for situations like spool bearings where the additional friction from grease viscocity would hurt casting performance.  As is typical for  lubricants  targeting the consumer market, The TSI web site is short on technical information,  providing  some successful use cases (mostly guns) but no real guidance on when the product should/should not be used.
   
Thin-film lubricants like TSI 301  have been  around for decades,  but it doesn't seem that they are wiping out the market for greases.   I would guess that thin film lubricants work better when the surfaces are more consistent and the load is lower.   Big giant gears on heavy machinery probably need a thicker film to "level out" high spots and create a more consistent surface interface.  Where fishing reel gears fit on this spectrum, I dunno.  But the odds probably get better as the reels get smaller.

-J

[wfjord]

Thin-film lubricants like TSI 301  have been  around for decades,  but it doesn't seem that they are wiping out the market for greases.   I would guess that thin film lubricants work better when the surfaces are more consistent and the load is lower.   Big giant gears on heavy machinery probably need a thicker film to "level out" high spots and create a more consistent surface interface.  Where fishing reel gears fit on this spectrum, I dunno.  But the odds probably get better as the reels get smaller.

-J

Good point about the odds probably getting better as the reels get smaller.

All in all, the TSI321, as mentioned, works exceptionally well as a gear lube in my baitcasters and smaller conventional reels. For my larger spinning & conventionals I think I'm contented to stay with the Yamaha blue/CorrosionX mixture, at least on the gears ---but experimentation is part of the fun!

In regards to gear teeth, apparently TSI works better or worse depending on the reel:

My old Mitchell spinners all have a small degree of audible gear noise which may be due to the three steel (or aluminum??) gears meshing in the reel --all were lubed with a Yamaha/CorrosionX mixture earlier this year. Two days ago I disassembled one of the 300s, cleaned out all the grease and relubed it completely with TSI321.  The result was that the gear noise was much worse, so I cleaned all the internals again and re-lubed with Yamaha/CorrosionX to get it back to "normal."

   

   

[oc1]

I think of that grease that is squished out of the gear teeth as being a grease reservoir that can be pulled back into the gears when things heat up a little.  Don't know how much that really happens though.

I know what you mean about TSI (and also Reel-X) oil making gear noise.  Gear noise can be disconcerting, but you have to wonder if noise equals wear.  If you cover up the noise, do you really reduce the wear or do you just cover up the wear?

One thing about using only oil and no grease is the reel is easier to clean.  Splash a little solvent on it and the oil is gone.  Grease takes longer to dissolve and scrub away.  Picking the blue grease out of the corners and then slapping new blue grease on everything when finished cleaning feels like busy work.  Dig a hole and then fill it back up again.

-steve

[alantani]

yeah, sometimes i'll clean out a "marginal" bearing, lube it with TSI 301, put it back in the reel and then have the bearing echo all through the reel.  it's a great lubricant, but TSI 301 and TSI 321 will not help you hide any defects.