cracking thick Belleville

Started by Brian A, April 25, 2013, 09:26:24 AM

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Brian A

Howzit.  I tried searching and reading but couldn't find anything.  When i ulua fish, i usually run tight drag on Newell 300, 500, and 600 series.  The thick drag Belleville always cracks almost every year.  Is there a better replacement from penn or McMaster that can handle?

Mahalo and Aloha

Bryan Young

Aloha Brian,

There are other options, but cost for the quantity, it's hard to beat Penn Parts or McMaster.

You many need to revise your drag stack to give you more surface area.  You really do not need to have any bellevilles for the drag #s you are looking at.

Bryan
:D I talk with every part I send out and each reel I repair so that they perform at the top of their game. :D

Brian A

Bryan,

Can you or anyone recommend a washer from either place?  I think i heard the 113h works.  Not sure. 

Mahalo

Bryan Young

I know that the 300s utilize jigmaster size drags if that helps.
:D I talk with every part I send out and each reel I repair so that they perform at the top of their game. :D

Brian A

Yup, i heard of a penn part for that drag system too, that may work, but i gotta find that info again.




QuoteYou really do not need to have any bellevilles for the drag #s you are looking at.

Reading this several times, do you mean eliminate the Belleville on top the stack, and add it or other light tension washers between the star and the handle?

Newell Nut

The Penn 505 fits the Newell 200 thru 400 series perfectly. I just bought some from Penn Parts and they are cheap too.

I think the 113H will fit the 500 and 600 but waiting for Keta to confirm that for me. I only have one Newell Belleville for the 500 in my bench. I have never broken one but I have bought reels that have them missing.

bluefish69

Newell Nut

The part 3 for the Bevelle you were talking about is 18-505. I have them in all 30 of my Newell's. You also get a bit more drag with this part.
I have not failed.  I just found 10,000 ways that won't work.

Newell Nut

That one works really well and I bought some after you confirmed the number for me. Thanks for that tip. I sent Keta the dimensions for the 500 series and waiting to hear back from him if the 113H belleville is the same size as the 500.
The 18-505 would work but it is a smaller OD than the 500.

Bryan Young

#8
Quote from: jaybri on April 25, 2013, 03:17:38 PM
Yup, i heard of a penn part for that drag system too, that may work, but i gotta find that info again.
QuoteYou really do not need to have any bellevilles for the drag #s you are looking at.

Reading this several times, do you mean eliminate the Belleville on top the stack, and add it or other light tension washers between the star and the handle?
You can add just spacers if you are cranking down on the drags that much. 

BTW, are you cracking the Newell Belleville washers?  That is common.  for the 300, you can use what Keith had advised for the Jigmaster below:

Quote from: Keith K on March 19, 2013, 03:09:37 AM
So I took apart my Newell 322, because I knew I had one of these in there...



Here it is: http://www.mcmaster.com/#standard-disc-springs/=lxtz8x

Mine is:
-ID--.405 in
-OD--.82 in
-Thickness--.035 in
-Height--.0625 in

For Stainless it looks like part # 9713K425
:D I talk with every part I send out and each reel I repair so that they perform at the top of their game. :D

Brian A

yeah Bryan, cracking um. more on the 5 and 600 series cause where i use the 300s i can let the fish run a little, but still kinda tight so i decrease spits.

Quote from: Keith K on March 19, 2013, 03:09:37 AM
So I took apart my Newell 322, because I knew I had one of these in there...



Here it is: http://www.mcmaster.com/#standard-disc-springs/=lxtz8x

Mine is:
-ID--.405 in
-OD--.82 in
-Thickness--.035 in
-Height--.0625 in

For Stainless it looks like part # 9713K425

Just ordered...

Cool, i will consider between the penn parts and mcmaster for the 300s.  I will continue to research for the 500 and 600 series newells, but i think i will go no belleville on top if i fish before i find an answer. guarantee gonna have to have a bigger spacer though. nothing like it cracking when fishing and you have no pressure and bits of metal all ova da place inside.   >:(


small kind off topic:

Quote from: Bryan Young on January 10, 2011, 05:55:55 AM
Here's the drag configuration:



Here is the SmoothDrag Configuration:

     Five #18 Carbontex, 0.5 mm thick (Center was bored out to 11 mm ID)
     Three Keyed Washers, 0.9 mm thick
     Two Eared Washers, 0.9 mm thick



The original washers were:
     Three HT-100s, 0.8 mm thick
     Two Keyed Washers, 1.06 mm thick
     One Eared Washer, 1.06 mm thick
     One Bevelled Spring Washer



The new SmoothDrag configuration should fit in the normal jigmaster main gear with the remaining 2 washers (keyed and carbontex) sitting above the edge of the main gear.  This will not be an issue since the eared washer is engaging the main gear.

anyone successful with 5+1 in the 300 newells?

how about 5+1 in the 500 newells?

mahalo for the fishing reel ohana

Bryan Young

I have them in my PG255s with Newell 200 series gears, so it should work in your reel.
:D I talk with every part I send out and each reel I repair so that they perform at the top of their game. :D

franky

#11
Quote from: Newell Nut on April 25, 2013, 05:40:24 PM
I sent Keta the dimensions for the 500 series and waiting to hear back from him if the 113H belleville is the same size as the 500.
The 18-505 would work but it is a smaller OD than the 500.

Right now, I'm looking at all three pieces:
1. Part#3-144 (small newell belleville spring)
2. Part#5-145 (large newell belleville spring)
3. Part#18-970(Penn 113H Tension spring)

The two newell belleville springs both have the same inside diameter approx 7/16".
The penn 113H tension spring has a larger size inside diameter at approx 9/16".

The penn 113H outside diameter is very close to the outside diameter of the small newell belleville spring.

The height of the two newell belleville springs are very similiar.  The height of the Penn 113H is slightly shorter, but very close.

Based on my observation, if you use the penn 113H tension spring in the newell 500 or 600 gearstack, you'll get a lot of side to side movement from the tension spring because of the bigger inside diameter.

If the penn 505 part has the same inside diameter as the jigmaster, then I would use that part instead.  Even if the outside diameter is smaller than the large newell belleville spring, it does not matter because the pressure would still be put onto the center part of the drag washers.  In other words, I have successfully put the small newell belleville spring into the newell 500 drag stack and it worked very well.


franky

As for the thin belleville springs on the outside by the star and the handle....I give up on those!  :(


bluefish69

Quote from: franky on April 25, 2013, 08:12:22 PM
As for the thin belleville springs on the outside by the star and the handle....I give up on those!  :(



No one that I know uses either the Wavy Washer or the Bevelle Washer from Newell any where in the 200 - 400 Series reels. They Crack and or Rust
I have not failed.  I just found 10,000 ways that won't work.

Keta

They turned my irrigation water on 3 days early and I'm unpluging culverts.  I'll try to check this evening unless I'm flooded.
Hi, my name is Lee and I have a fishing gear problem.

I have all of the answers, yup, no, maybe.

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