Canned Salmon Recipe

[jigmaster501]

The pathogen of concern is Clostridium botulinum. The non-proteolytic forms Type E and Non Proteolytic B and F do not off gas when toxin is formed. Subsequently there is no way of knowing if the toxin is formed. The proteolytic forms are just as dangerous but can produce odors indicating toxin formation. The problem comes in when there is no longer any competition of microflora which happens during cooking and you have an anaerobic environment which is canning.

If someone is going to do this at home with home pressure cookers, get a recipe from a food scientist with Low Acid Canning Knowledge or a university extension office (University of Alaska provides canning guidance) and FOLLOW IT EXACTLY. If you can't do one part of it, don't do any of it....

The size of the pieces, amount of liquid, head space, amount of salt, sugar,  species  and fat content all are relevant and have various effects on the heat penetration, inhibition of toxin formation, etc.

One of the largest issues is that of EVISCERATION. The gills and intestinal tract of fish is loaded with Clostridium botulinum spores in addition to other pathogens. Proper evisceration is essential to drastically reduce the levels of spores that need to be inactivated.

I made a Fish Evisceration Video a few years back to provide guidance to the regulatory community and seafood industry on how to properly eviscerate a fish.

It can be found at www.afdo.org. Go to resources and click on Fish Evisceration Video.

Commercial sterility is a 12D kill of pathogens of public health significance which is 99.9999999999 kill..... The ambient temperature that you store your jars after canning matters as thermophilic microorganisms can reek havoc on a properly canned product.

Keta, If the modern canning guides say to cook longer and at higher pressure.. Do so. The risk is not worth the reward. If you feel that your process has better flavor, have it  looked at by a food scientist with Low Acid Canning knowledge. There might be something that you are adding that might be providing adequate inhibition of toxin formation. It is worth a look if you just don't want to cook it longer.

In Seattle, the Seafood Products Association is run be Chris Resendes. He can likely hook you up with someone to review your process.

The sad reality with canning is that if something goes wrong, the likelihood is you will die.

[Keta]

Wrong, lawyers have destroyed our country.  90 min at 10psi worked for over 100 years.

[jigmaster501]

It has nothing to do with lawyers. It is all food science. Canning is still the deadliest home processed food out there today as it was 100 years ago.

[Tightlines667]

You might be surprised to hear I worked as a food scientist, and senior microbiologist for about 3 years.  It's true there are alot of nasty 'bugs' out there, but as with most safety-related risk aimed at the general public, the actual risks are much less then what is portrayed.  Salmonelia, E.Coli 0157:H7, Listeria, and the like actually occur much less frequently then you would believe.  I have tested tens of thousands of food samples and swaps taken from factory equiptment, and it was exceedingly rare for one to come up 'hot' and be confirmed.  Cross contamination of multiple samples in that given run were also rarer then one would think dispute the virulent nature of these organisms.  However, a single instance requires immediate and far reaching action that typically results in the recall of millions of dollars worth of product, and shutting down or severely limiting production of product.  These are all necessary steps, and the US is a leader (in many ways) in commercial food safety.  I am just saying the actual risks to an indivual are (even one who might practice poor food management/preparation techniques) are much less then might be percieved.  By all means try to limit your exposure, and minimize these risks by using 'best practices'.

Clostridium botulinum spores can survive being cooked at 10 PSI for 90 minutes, and may propagate in an aerobic environment, especially when stored in the presence of accessible moisture, and at room temperatures, but the actual likelihood of contamination, and further propagation in wild harvested product is very low.  Proper care and storage will reduce, and if cooked at the proper temperature, all but eliminate these risks.  

I have a friend that is the federal seafood inspector for the Pacific islands region, and despite the occurrence of improper care practices in handling fresh, wild-caught fish product, there has been a very low instance of contamination despite the hundreds of thousands of lbs of raw product consumed annually.

Jig knows what he is talking about...

"I spent 14 years as a food safety regulator. Also published a paper titled "Surface Pathogen Elimination Practices for Ready-To-Eat Fishery Products".

I am a Seafood Processing Subject Matter Expert, Manufactured Food Processing Subject Matter Expert, Retail Food Processing Subject Matter Expert, Certified Fisheries Professional, Seafood HACCP Trainer, life long fisherman and someone who has a responsibility of keeping others from acquiring a foodborne illness." 

*Copied from a previous thread

and I for one, am glad to have you here at AT sharing some of your knowledge and expertise.


I am in no way trying to undercut or belittle your advice/concerns.  I just think a little 'real' world perspective is in order when it comes to matters of public safety. 

Just my opinion.

[Dominick]

Wrong, they lawyers have destroyed our country. 

Lee I respect your opinion on a lot of subjects but in this case you are dead wrong.

Keta, If the modern canning guides say to cook longer and at higher pressure.. Do so. The risk is not worth the reward.

The sad reality with canning is that if something goes wrong, the likelihood is you will die.

Everyone should heed this advice.  Jigmaster showed his credentials so he knows what he is talking.  You can do it your way for 100 years but it only takes one wrong toxin to kill you.

  By all means try to limit your exposure, and minimize these risks by using 'best practices'.

Clostridium botulinum spores can survive being cooked at 10 PSI for 90 minutes, and may propagate in an aerobic (sic) environment, especially when stored in the presence of accessible moisture, and at room temperatures, but the actual likelihood of contamination, and further propagation in wild harvested product is very low.  Proper care and storage will reduce, and if cooked at the proper temperature, all but eliminate these risks. 

Jig knows what he is talking about...

"I spent 14 years as a food safety regulator. Also published a paper titled "Surface Pathogen Elimination Practices for Ready-To-Eat Fishery Products".

I am in no way trying to undercut or belittle your advice/concerns.  I just think a little 'real' world perspective is in order when it comes to matters of public safety. 

Just my opinion.

Here is another expert weighing in.  For your own and your family's health follow their advice.  John please explain your "real world perspective."  Are you trying to say because not many people get sick and/or die that one need not worry about.  This is a totally serious subject with dire consequences for sloppiness.  Dominick

[jigmaster501]

Tightlines and I could talk for hours about things like this.

I do agree with real world perspectives and I do understand what he is talking about.

The issue that I am worried about is that Tightlines and I have the experience to make those real world decisions that most of the general public have not the opportunity to acquire.

If I or Tightlines were to be with you guys and looking at all the intrinsic and extrinsic factors associated with the batch of product that you guys were making we might say that certain things are ok because we know what control factors we are working with.

It is true that the instances that these illnesses occur aren't that frequent but the consequences are still the same.

I going to see if I could find a process authority for Low Acid Canned Foods to come on here and provide some minimum standards for everyone to do when canning at home.

I know I drive many people nuts with my food comments but I would rather drive people nuts than to here that someone here passed away and saying something could have prevented it.

With the pacific rim canned fish, I am sure that your friend will tell you that those canned products are

[Tightlines667]

Dominick,

I guess I am just trying to say sometimes safety regulations, and related laws have much higher cost to benefit or are overly restrictive/costly for very little demonstrable results.  

This only applies to some, actually most provide obvious benefits.  US food processing facilities are some of the cleanest, and most monitored I am aware of.  I have had the oportunity to tour a pork processing, and 2 different seafood processing facilities, and have been impressed with the measures taken to ensure food quality and safety.  Also, testing, and examination the many samples taken from facilities around the Midwest region show that the facilities are doing a commendable job of maintaining a clean, 'bug free' environment.  

Handling, storage, and processing of wild-harvested products by individuals is not monitored any where near this.  It is left largely up to the individual as to how to process, store, and consume their product.  By 'real world' I am just saying sometimes simple common sense will work wonders.  For instance, I think most of us can do a pretty good job of determining when some food item we have been storing is no longer safe to eat.  We don't need detailed labratory analysis, or some form of quality assurance to determine this.  

The few deadly or really bad bugs that exist out there, are much rarer then we are lead to believe.  It's true the cost of not adhering to the strictest food safety guidelines can be great, but IMHO if one uses some common sense (maybe educated by some recommended guidelines) to reduce risk your exposure will remain sufficiently low.

I have never heard of a case of bad food poisoning, parasitic infection or the like from any of the many friends/family that I have known, or those preceeding me despite many processing, storing, cooking, and consuming much of their own products for a long period.  They did not need published studies or guidelines to accomplish this...just some common sense.  Granted my sample here is only hundreds of thousands of instances of product and not the million(s) needed to find an instance of infection.  

On the other hand, spend anytime in a 3rd world country, and you will likely get a chance to experience the detrimental effects of food (or water) product that has been improperly cared for.  

One thing I have noticed is when one travels around the county side harvesting wild game, regulations have limited storage options, and in some ways, restricted transportability with increased required tracability of product.  For instance, many hotels, motels, restaurants, etc. will no longer allow you to store wild-harvested/processed product in their freezers due to regulation.  Just a few years ago, I never ran into this problem.  I blame overly restrictive regulation in lue of common sense practices.

I am not suggesting one throws caution to the wind here.  I just don't like the seeming increase in public opinion opposing wild-harvested products due to 'scare tactics' lacking reel 'meat'.  

I may have this whole thing a bit mixed up, and bear in mind this is only my current personal opinion.

BTW, here are a couple of links to some of the aforementioned statistics and guidelines (this stuff may be better served in a different thread).  We may he getting a bit off of topic here?

Here is a book on the topic...

http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/books/NBK114501/

and a quick excert..
"In the United States, an estimated 46 million foodborne infections occur each year, along with 250,000 hospitalizations and 3,000 deaths (Scallan et al., 2011a, 2011b)"


According to this stat..you would have greater then a 1 in 10 chance of contacting a food-bourne infection annually in the US... seems a bit high to me?

Risk factors..

https://www.google.com/url?sa=t&source=web&rct=j&url=http://www.fda.gov/downloads/Food/FoodSafety/RetailFoodProtection/FoodborneIllnessandRiskFactorReduction/RetailFoodRiskFactorStudies/UCM224682.pdf&ved=0CCQQFjABahUKEwjbhai_iqrIAhUQmYgKHdmFAQk&usg=AFQjCNEBPCOgOabnQmERKErQ3n8_h2p_fg


FDA guidance and info...

http://www.stopfoodborneillness.org/pathogen/botulism/


Here is a botulism-related excerpt..

"In the United States an average of 145 cases (of food bourne Botulism) is reported each year.  Of these, aproximate 15% (22) are foodborne.  ....usually caused by home-canned foods."

Although it is easy to find numerous studies, papers, resources on the risks of food bourne illnesses/pathogens and even the occurrence in wild harvested product, it is very hard to find an actual number of how much wild game us consumed annually.  It appears to be somewhere on the order of 500,000,000 meals of annually, which is alot considering the current population of the US is roughly 319,000,000.  

So even considering under-reporting, 22 to say 100 cases of food-bourne botulism out of 500 million plus meals means your risk is roughly. 0.0000002%.  That means on average you would need to consume 1,000,000 meals to get sick from botulism...at 15,000 meals/person/lifetime (barely possible) that is 67 lifetimes of eating wild game every other day of your life to get infected.  In actuality the incidence of botulism in people who consume wild game is many orders of magnitude less.

Pretty quick/dirty math here based on unverified stats, but the point is many of these things (incidence of food bourne illness, toxin/lead accumulation to the point if having health impacts, ect.) are much rarer then we are lead to believe.  Risk is lower then percieved.  

Still good to follow best safe practices, guidline, and recommendations, but don't forget about some basic common sense.

[Keta]

Millions of pounds of home canned fish and game have been consumed when using 90 min at 10psi.  If it did not kill the bacteria most of the people in rural SE Alaska would have died 50 years ago.  120 min. over cooks the fish.

Don't be stupid and try to eat jars with bulging lids or off smell but I've never seen a jar that had a good seal go bad, some far beyond sane shelf life.

[AlasKen]

This is an interesting topic so I will throw in my 2 cents.  I love wils alskan canned salmon.  I think there are a number of isues that directly impact the quality of product.  I will share my thoughts based on my personal experience.  The quaity will start when the fish is caught.  We bonk them and bleed them when the enter the boat.  We use the gill method.  We will either filet them on the boat or gut them depending on what we have going on and planned for them.  Usual is using a clean cutting board and full fillets in a callon zip lock.  Eith one fillet or one fish to a back depending on species and size.  This makes it easy if check by fish and game.  We also keep all the carcusses as well for identification.  If we have to fold the filet we fold sking to skin.  If added 2 filets to a back we go skin to skin.  We use little if any sea water during this process to the actual filet but clean the board before each fish.  This goes on ice immediately.

Whe we get home an package this my technique is to freeze my filets.  I will repackage from zip lock bags to vacuum bags.  I will remove the skin and wipe with paper towel if there is dirt an debris.  I do not rinse them in fresh water, ever.  I think  this helps with flesh texture, at least that s my personal experience.  I will freeze for at least 72 hours before smoking or canning.  I thaw in the frig before cooking, canning, smoking or making sushi.

For canning I use 1/2 pints wide mouth.  That is because that is the amount that works best.  I sometime use pints but never quarts.  Just my preference.  I can them no skin, no bones.  Again just preference, no safety issue.  My wife doese not like the skin or bones, when my wife is happy I am happy.

I use the UA standard of 100 minutes at 10 lbs for thawed fresh.  I just loosely pack it with 1" of head space.  I add a couple of Jalepeno rings or some green chile or a teaspoon of salsa for flavor.  No salt.  10 lb, 100 minutes.

For smoked I smoke it about an hour or 2.  Cut it to size and loosely pack.  I process it with no added liquid or flavoring.  95 minutes at 10 lbs.  This is what I do after talking with UA extension office.  So far so good.

I do think a lot of the processing technique and time has an element of being overly cautious.  I do think this is the result of a concern with being sued.  I personally would not be concerned with 90 minutes as I think the time is "over engineered"  Just my personal  belief but I still go a little more as well.  Ken     

[jigmaster501]

The pressure and time is to allow for heat penetration. We could put ground fish or large fish chunks in a can. The density of the pack and the size of the chunks all play a part in how heat penetrates into the coldest portion of the container. Where that is depends on a few factors and that is why large scale cannery sometimes employ rotating  retorts that constantly slosh the can around during processing.

Another issue with food statistics is how many food borne illnesses or deaths are unreported.

The person was old, they must have died of natural causes..... This happens quite a bit, especially in rural areas where 1 person and not a cluster might die. None the less they are still important as I would look at everyone on here as being just as important.

The issues with bloating cans and smell is that depending on the botulism type, you can have a perfectly looking jar that smells great but is loaded with toxin and you won't know at all.

Let me talk to a few people to get a canning expert on here.

If you get a recipe from the University of Alaska, I would go with that. Just follow it to the letter.

[Steve-O]

Good stuff about safe canning practices! As I mentioned in my post in BOLD, I live at 4500'ASL so I adjust time and pressure for altitude when canning and we do can a lot of garden produce...but not a lot of meat or fish. But when we do, we follow the rules from start to finish.

I like Ken's comments on taking care of the fish from the second they are landed. Get the blood out. Get the fish dead ASAP. The practice of Iki Jime has been a bar raising for me and the fish I harvest. My coworkers still gut, scrape and clean theirs IN the river. Yuck! I see too many not even bleed theirs or leave them on a stringer in the water for hours and hours. I have tubs of ice in the back of my vehicle ready for the fish as soon as I limit out.

Here at home, I mostly practice C.P.R. since Carp is my target but NOT my tablefare.

[AlasKen]

I did a bit more digging and found the UAF Extension service PDF's I use.  I will supply links below but here it is in a nut shell

Fresh Refrigerator cold Salmon or other fish
No liquid, salt or spices required, can be used for flavor if desired.
Pack straight sided wide mouth jar, either pint or 1/2 pint with fish vertical and leaving 1 inch head space
Vent for 10 minutes
Process for 100 minutes at 10 lbs of pressure if using a weight and 11 lbs pressure if using a dial.
The above is for up to 1000 feet above see level.

Smoking before canning
Smoke for ~2 hours for best results.  Looking for a reduction in weight of 12.5% (method for calculation provided in PDF.  This is for best consistency and not for safety)
Salmon should be packed in pints for best results.  Placed vertical with 1 inch head space.
Process for 110 minutes at the same pressure above.

I have no idea why smoked salmon is supposed to be processed for an extra 10 minutes.

http://www.uaf.edu/files/ces/publications-db/catalog/hec/FNH-00223.pdf

http://www.uaf.edu/files/ces/publications-db/catalog/hec/FNH-00128.pdf

So this is a recommended method that is deemed safe.  This may not be the only safe method.  I do know that over time the processing times on many items has gone up 10 minutes or so.  I have seen some old extension service pamphlets that had 90 minutes as the recommendation.  What caused the change I do not know.  I think everyone must decided what is best for them.  I am just sharing this info as one approved method.  YMMV.  Ken

[Dominick]

Thanks Ken. Interesting stuff in the instructions.  I was always interested in canning and I might start pretty soon.  Good discussion all around.  Dominick

[TomT]

I have canned untold cases of salmon, albacore and in Baja--yellowtail and dorado.  I know and was taught by "old timers" in coastal CA.  I have never NEVER even heard of anyone canning fish for 120 minutes.  So, if you are worried about the pressure canning time being over 90 minutes, my advise is to NEVER accept a gift of home canned albacore or salmon because it will NOT meet those specifications.  Since before there was commercially canned products of any kind, the people have preserved their produce and some meats by canning. Every one that I knew in my family canned their produce, etc for many generations--including me and including before pressure cooking. I am almost 75 yrs old, I have had LOTS of friends die in car wrecks and cancer--a few even by heart attacks.  Maybe I have lived a protective life, but I have NEVER had a relative, friend or acquaintance or someone that someone i knew who knew, etc, die from eating improperly canned food.  There is a huge population of the world that eats all kinds of meats, including fish, raw.  I repeat RAW!!  Now I have heard of some health problems, even death, from eating raw (especially fish) meats.  I personally did not eat sushi or sashimi until I was over 70 years old.  It's still not my favorite, but if it killed even a low percentage of the people who eat it, we would have millions of Asian, Hawaiians. Mexicans and lots of other people that would no longer be with us.  No one can make these choices for you, but you.  But again, if you are against these canning practices, please NEVER, NEVER again accept a gift a home canned salmon, because i can almost guarantee you that it will NOT be cooked over 90 minutes.  Above is personal opinion and not based upon any fact except the opinion of an old man.
TomT

[Steve-O]

Thanks Ken. Interesting stuff in the instructions.  I was always interested in canning and I might start pretty soon.  Good discussion all around.  Dominick

Go for it! Dominick. You'll never eat factory canned fish again after you open a jar of your canned catch.

Like Lee said, open the jar, eat with a fork. I do that with Ritz and Tabasco. Now my mouth is watering.

And I'm fresh out! I do have two jars of halibut, though. ...and some Ritz. And my sweetheart bought me a Special Stock personalized gallon of Tabasco sauce a few years ago and it is aging superbly in a climete controlled dark pantry. Very rich, smooth, earthy with just the right heat and low salt flavor that Texas Pete, Tapatio, and all the others lack.

Back in the day Tabasco was aged 3 years in oak barrels. Nowadays? The package says aged 3 seasons....what?