Line Lay

[Scattergun2570]

I have this Shimano Sahara FA,and it lays line worse than any reel I have ever seen. I have tried one shim,two shims,3 shims,braid,mono,nothing works.. how the heck could this reel lay line so poorly?

[philaroman]

spool shims & line type don't effect the oscillation mechanism, which is obviously messed up...

things to check:
1) damaged oscillating gear (RD 5213) OR slider (RD 6640) OR the little "skirt" of teeth on the main gear that engage the oscillating gear
2) loose screw (RD 3665) that attaches slider to main shaft
3) bent main shaft -- the very bottom that goes into the slider
4) wrong part -- a different Shimano slider may well be same size as RD 6640 & fit perfectly, but have a shorter/longer "stroke" for a shorter/taller spool

[Scattergun2570]

spool shims & line type don't effect the oscillation mechanism, which is obviously messed up...

things to check:
1) damaged oscillating gear (RD 5213) OR slider (RD 6640) OR the little "skirt" of teeth on the main gear that engage the oscillating gear
2) loose screw (RD 3665) that attaches slider to main shaft
3) bent main shaft -- the very bottom that goes into the slider
4) wrong part -- a different Shimano slider may well be same size as RD 6640 & fit perfectly, but have a shorter/longer "stroke" for a shorter/taller spool

Do you think those things are possible on a reel that's seen almost no use? No one has ever been inside it.

[wfjord]

Anything is possible with mechanical things put together by humans.  I'm still relatively new at all this, but after recently overhauling and fixing a Sahara 4000 and a 2500 I can understand how any of those things philaroman listed could be the probable culprit.

[philaroman]

Do you think those things are possible on a reel that's seen almost no use? No one has ever been inside it.

premium Japanese -- not likely
budget Malaysian -- have seen duds straight from factory

also, the slider could be gummed up, so it seems to work but doesn't travel its full range...  that WOULD be from use/age

[steelfish]

for my undestanding those spinning reels were not "braid-ready" at least on the oscilation spool line lay.
that model was made on the monofilament line era and since the braid line is so thin now when the reel lay the line on the spool you can see the oscilation pattern, nothing wrong with that it will cast good enough.
so, I might be wrong but seems that you have some option:
- live and use it like that
- use mono line
- use thicker braid line
- change the reel for a more modern one that lays the line smooth and pretty flat on the spool.

[thorhammer]

a no-cost fix would be to strip the line all off in the yard down to the knot (spool off the reel) and the hand wind 30 yards or so  in the middle of the spool, taking care to rotate the spool every few wraps because ergonomically you will wind at a bit of slant. you are in effect building up a détente  / arbor so the line lay will be proud over the center, which at the end should make it flush (or at least better). then put spool on and wind up under tension

[steelfish]

a no-cost fix would be to strip the line all off in the yard down to the knot (spool off the reel) and the hand wind 30 yards or so  in the middle of the spool, taking care to rotate the spool every few wraps because ergonomically you will wind at a bit of slant. you are in effect building up a détente  / arbor so the line lay will be proud over the center, which at the end should make it flush (or at least better). then put spool on and wind up under tension

that how you deal with the same "problem" of line layed on the spool with hour-glass pattern on Van Staal reels.
you build-up by hand a big bulky bump in the center of the spool and then let the reel fill the rest on its stock oscillation pattern.
new Van Staal reel lay down the line on a flat and smooth pattern because of the braided line

[philaroman]

IMHO, none of the jury-rigging or "use as is" suggestions will work for that Sahara (more to it than uneven line lay)...  besides, I thought we were here to repair/rebuild 

to me, it looks like the spool is not oscillating far enough in either direction; there is no line being wound just under the lip & at base of arbor; whatever line is there, slid off adjacent winds -- hence, the camel humps, rather than simple gap in the middle.  "as is" you may get fully functional sub-par performance w/ thick mono...  w/ skinny braid -- do birds like $10 chartreuse nests?

[wfjord]

I've tried a fishing buddy's Saharas and the line lay (braid) was perfectly even on them. I liked them enough I even thought about getting one myself and switching to braid.  Seems like it'd be more practical to take a peek inside first to make sure the internals were in proper working order before removing and rewinding line.

[Scattergun2570]

for my undestanding those spinning reels were not "braid-ready" at least on the oscilation spool line lay.
that model was made on the monofilament line era and since the braid line is so thin now when the reel lay the line on the spool you can see the oscilation pattern, nothing wrong with that it will cast good enough.
so, I might be wrong but seems that you have some option:
- live and use it like that
- use mono line
- use thicker braid line
- change the reel for a more modern one that lays the line smooth and pretty flat on the spool.

Mono and different Braid was already tried,,no good

[Scattergun2570]

a no-cost fix would be to strip the line all off in the yard down to the knot (spool off the reel) and the hand wind 30 yards or so  in the middle of the spool, taking care to rotate the spool every few wraps because ergonomically you will wind at a bit of slant. you are in effect building up a détente  / arbor so the line lay will be proud over the center, which at the end should make it flush (or at least better). then put spool on and wind up under tension

I thought about doing that lol and then I figured I was probably wrong as usual,but hey now that you said it I feel better.

[Scattergun2570]

IMHO, none of the jury-rigging or "use as is" suggestions will work for that Sahara (more to it than uneven line lay)...  besides, I thought we were here to repair/rebuild  

to me, it looks like the spool is not oscillating far enough in either direction; there is no line being wound just under the lip & at base of arbor; whatever line is there, slid off adjacent winds -- hence, the camel humps, rather than simple gap in the middle.  "as is" you may get fully functional sub-par performance w/ thick mono...  w/ skinny braid -- do birds like $10 chartreuse nests?

Ok so I tore it down...I cannot see any damage to either gear..but I did find two things odd. One of the  shims that were behind the bearing on the main gear was mangled,and keep in mind this reel was used like once.
Also,when I had only the oscillation gear left in the reel,I saw what appeared to be an Allen in the middle of it,but it was nothing but an empty hole. I tilted the reel body and it just fell out. After this I looked at the schematic,and it appears that the screw that goes through the oscillating slider should screw into the reel body,but it does not exit the slider. Soooo,there's nothing holding that gear nice and tight..also,there is no shim behind the oscillation gear either. I have only been inside Daiwas,and they always have that,,so this gear just rides against the reel body.  Your thoughts please..

[wfjord]

There's not a screw that fits into the center of the oscillating gear. That little screw locks the end of the main shaft to the oscillating slider. The little knob on the oscillating gear fits into the slot in the slider and the position of the shaft and slider assembly keeps the oscillating gear in place.

I found the same crumpled shims over the main gear on both of the Saharas I recently disassembled and replaced them. It may need an additional washer there as a spacer.

[Scattergun2570]

There's not a screw that fits into the center of the oscillating gear. That little screw locks the end of the main shaft to the oscillating slider. The little knob on the oscillating gear fits into the slot in the slider and the position of the shaft and slider assembly keeps the oscillating gear in place.

I found the same crumpled shims over the main gear on both of the Saharas I recently disassembled and replaced them. It may need an additional washer there as a spacer.

Where can I get shims? And do you feel any of this is responsible for the line lay issues?