Reels from China?

[Bora]

Hello all,

I am curious about this question too. And I have found little consistent information. I have seem some praise them as value monsters that can disrupt the big guys, others dismiss them without trying them. Here is my two cents. Caveat is that I have a sample of one here, and this is only my opinion.

I got a Piscifun spinning reel about one and a half years ago. I wanted a light reel for stream and river fishing. I was using a Pflueger President 4000, so wanted to try something lighter for long days out. The Pfluger I still have and use [15+ years], no issues, and also Made in China...

So I bought the 3000 Carbon X model for about US$60. There was some kind of promotion and it came with a second shallow spool, always nice. I like research and wanted to find more about this company before. Whatever was online looked like sponsored content. Anyways I decided to take a chance at this price.

Here is my evaluation:

I will admit, one reason I bought this reel was looks. Yes, I am a functionalist at heart, but it doesn't hurt if it looks good too. This one looks good to me in all black, and it has a skeletonized spool [machined, they claim...] attractive and probably saves weight too. Basically looks like Daiwa Tatula to me, maybe this was the inspiration. They would call this a 'homage' in the watch industry.

The weight of the reel is as advertised, about 220g, almost half the weight of my Pfluger. So far so good. It has good hand feel, and the screw-in handle and EVA knob is solid with minimal play. I also like the operation of the bale, solid and reliable trips. The drag is smooth too. They claim 10kg max - not sure if this number means anything in practice but no complaints yet.

At the beginning the reel was fine but I started hearing gear friction soon. I opened to check it out and the reel was very dry inside. I have similar experience with watch movements supplied from China - they can work well and some are based on expired Swiss patents, but they come dry and need to be lubricated proper. Lubing and even shimming didn't get rid of the gear nose, so I suspect it is down to loose manufacturing tolerances. There have not been any major failures otherwise, except that the drag knob clicker broke so now I have a quite drag adjustment. Fine.

After a full service, I can confirm 'specflation'. I refer here to inflation of technical specifications, or at worst, false advertising:

- 10 stainless steel bearings: I found 10 but some [less critical ones] were plastic. Yes, keeps weight down, but misleading.
- Carbon fiber body: It is made of some composite but not carbon fiber. Don't worry I was not expecting a carbon fibre reel for $60, just to give the example.
- Salt rated: Yes it has a seal on the drag. But nothing on the handle, and nothing on the shaft [and spool is skeletonized, like a said]. I don't do any salt fishing so not huge deal. But looks like they started the job and not finished it. Confusing.

Overall the reel had potential. Especially at 60USD range. But this is a competitive market segment. If I could repeat, I would not buy this specific reel. I cannot get over the spec-flation. Sorry if I am too critical, especially at this price point. For some this is not a lot of money, for some maybe not. Besides, my reference point in another Made in China machine [Pfluger President] at a similar price point. So I think there is a meaningful difference between 'Chinese Reels' and 'Made in China Reels'. If I had to fish for my life tomorrow, I choose my 15 yr old Pfluger over a new Pisicfun, no question. If the fish bite is another problem!

Finally, already mentioned by Fred and others long term value and sourcing parts for this kind of reel would be an issue. This is probably why after searching this forum for what look like popular Chinese tackle brands I found little results. I speculate these reels are not really made to be repaired, so not big surprise there is relatively little talk about them on this kind of forum.

All best

Bora

[MarkT]

Most Penn reels are made in China including my Fathom and Battle reels. Made in China doesn't mean junk... where are most iPhones made anyway?

[foakes]

There are a couple of ways of looking at these modern Asian reels compared to perhaps a Penn, or another brand that has tight tolerances that will not degrade due to cheaper alloys and weaker components —-

First...the most expensive reel you will ever buy is the one that doesn't work.

Second...the best value reel you will ever buy is the one that doesn't need replacement.

One last thing —- with the exception of cosmetic, trim, and plastic bling parts —- every other spring, bearing, bail, handle, and gears —- are manufactured by (3) companies in China.

All of these other brands are just the basic parts slapped together with enough colorful sleek plastic to attract the fisherman with the wallet —- not necessarily to fish effectively for a half century, or more.

A company decides to come out with a reel or a series of reels —- and just sources parts from the lowest bidder that month.

You will never need to be concerned about getting replacement parts in the future —- because there is no customer support or replacement parts available.

Having said this, there are many good companies and brands from Asia and China (Penn, Shimano, Daiwa, Pflueger, DQ, etc.) But most of them are not copycats —- they are solid, established firms that have moved production to Asia in order to keep up with the competition and stay in business.  Around 25% of the Asian reels fall into this class —- the other 75% are a waste of money and disposable.

Best, Fred

[Bora]

Most Penn reels are made in China including my Fathom and Battle reels. Made in China doesn't mean junk... where are most iPhones made anyway?
[/quote

Completely agree. This is my point also. I have just a feeling that quality control is better and product promises are more realistic, when it's made in China for an already established brand compared to a new brand. There is quality coming out of
China no question.  And here we can replace China with other country + other product. It's difficult to get market share as a new player, especially with relatively consolidates supply chains. What is the best way to do that i leave to the experts. In my case if they promised less I would probably be more content with the product. I can evaluate only on the expectations they gave me from the start. They all do it, but there are degrees.

[Rancanfish]

I really dislike Chinese products. They have taken over hardware production and I curse them every time a nut or bolt just twists right off or corrodes quickly. Stainless? A joke. I check every pkg for the 'Made in China' label and put it back if I have any other option.

I love my Penns but have zero Chinese reels. I wish there was a way to restore the American quality I remember. All that said, I did buy some freshwater TICA reels that served me well for a few years. Oh well.

[Midway Tommy]

Ditto Randy!

I never buy anything made in China and never will, no matter the cost, as long as I have another option. I only have 3 "made in China" Abu Garcia Cardinal 3 & 33 NIB collectable (because of their rarity) Shelf Queens. Fortunately, since I have 500+ vintage spinning reels to choose from, I'll never have to resort to buying a spinning reel that was "made in China" to use.

[handi2]

Those are an Accurate copy.

[Gfish]

Interesting. The latest superpower/empire on the scene, China. If they haven't already, will they ever put out any real high-quality, real expensive consumer products?

[Midway Tommy]

Those are an Accurate copy.

What are "an Accurate copy", Keith?

[Reeltyme]

For those of you who think that bringing new participants into the sport of fishing is a good thing, disposable Chinese reels, spincast reels and Mickey Mouse combos have their place.  If the entry point is too pricy then nobody will give the sport a try.  Personally, I think the sport should be more expensive and elitist and all reels should be machined by hand.
-steve
 :)Gota throw my 2 cents in on this subject. First, any newbie to the sport should seek out a nice used combo that hasn't been abused. If it's a little older, it's a good chance it's better quality. Then if they don't like fishing (shudder) they won't feel bad about dumping a bunch of money. As for China reels,,, I believe they produce some of the best home decoration items at very reasonable prices and should stick to what they do best. 80's and older quality reels which are readily available and mostly American made, is the best way to go in my opinion. I have heard the "it's to heavy" argument and firmly believe a little exercise to strengthen your arms would be a better choice than a light weight Chinese reel!

[handi2]

The conventional reel shown is an Accurate copy.

When I bought the UNDERHEAD spinning reel it was an Accurate copy too.

[Shellbelly]

Interesting perspectives, folks.  The segment of the market overlooked here are the folks that fish a week or less per year.  They buy cheap combos from the convenience store or bait shop or Wallyworld...whatever... and do their thing. (OR they borrow your stuff and step on it)  There are lots of people in that market segment and an enormous amount of fishing stuff is made in Asia just for them.  There's no aspect of compromise there.

Those who fish for weeks or months per year have a much different perspective.  We have expectations formed by the use of quality stuff and the wherewithal to take care of it.  We know at the point of sale when we're compromising stainless for some alloy and metal for plastic or composite.  We also know when the quality is adequate but is not excellent like it used to be....more importantly... like it should be.

What used to be excellently mass-produced now has to be custom-built.  What is mass-produced in Asia is more often just good enough or less. 

[JasonGotaProblem]

I gotta say, people ask me frequently what reel to buy. And as I've gotten more experienced at reel work I find it harder to give a good answer. They wanna get it new on Amazon not eBay or Craigslist. But most of it sucks.

[Bora]

Certainly! I think having more choice at more price segments is a good thing, in general.

I do not know if the fishing space is more or less 'democratic' now than it used to be, or probably just seems to be so... Thinking for example of DAM Pirate reels, even Mitchell 300s, but not an expert on this and not sure how their prices compare across generations.

Anyways they say "democracy is a slow process of stumbling to the right decision instead of going straight forward to the wrong one." True in politics and in fishing I think. So I am enjoying stumbling along and learning new things.

[JasonGotaProblem]

Don't get me wrong, it's not all bad. In 2016 the BG (made in China) redefined what a $100 reel looked like. That changed the expectations of the fishing public, and the entire tackle industry shifted in response. This was unequivocally a wonderful thing.

When people ask me now about affordable spinners, I tell them to get a shimano spheros. Coincidentally those are made in Malaysia not China.