Grouper Junior — WIP

oc1 · April 23, 2020, 04:03:50 AM

Quote from: Decker on April 22, 2020, 10:25:08 PM
The roughness is cyclical, and seems like the gears.

With every revolution of the handle or every revolution of the spool?
-s

Decker · April 23, 2020, 04:15:44 AM

Dang, but I think I figured it out! I have the wrong main gear — not a 5-149. The main I have has 40 teeth. With a 113h pinion having 13 teeth, the 5-149 should have about 13x2.7 or about 35 teeth to get the 2.7 ratio. I should have just rolled the pinion over the edge or the main to see they didn't mesh. So, now I need a 5-149 main.

No shame in learning from mistakes.

And BTW, this fun!

oc1 · April 23, 2020, 04:32:11 AM

Good sleuthing.
-s

Donnyboat · April 23, 2020, 07:23:18 AM

Ay Joe your right into it man, an inspiration to all of us, looking forward to your end resalt, good luck, cheers Don.

mhc · April 23, 2020, 10:22:46 AM

Sounds correct Joe - I just counted the teeth on a photo of 5-149 and got 34, give or take a few. I don't think I've got another 5-149 - it would take forever to get to you at the moment anyway.
You could try filing 5 of the teeth off the gear you have

Sorry, couldn't resist it.

Mike

Decker · April 23, 2020, 12:34:15 PM

Quote from: mhc on April 23, 2020, 10:22:46 AM
Sounds correct Joe - I just counted the teeth on a photo of 5-149 and got 34, give or take a few. I don't think I've got another 5-149 - it would take forever to get to you at the moment anyway.
You could try filing 5 of the teeth off the gear you have Sorry, couldn't resist it.

Mike

Yeah, it's just as well, Mike. The teeth come from crocodiles down there don't they?

I couldn't wait and ordered the gear from Florida last night.

Appreciate the encouragement, guys! Cheers!

mo65 · April 23, 2020, 01:06:16 PM

Quote from: Decker on April 23, 2020, 04:15:44 AM
Dang, but I think I figured it out! I have the wrong main gear — not a 5-149. The main I have has 40 teeth.

Joe,
You're not going to believe this. I looked at those pics you posted last night for a long time. I compared them to pics of my 149 gear project. It seemed like there were more teeth on your gear...but it was late...and I was beat. I just shook my head and turned in. Now when you get that correct gear there will be a lot more dremeling!

Decker · April 23, 2020, 01:35:57 PM

Quote from: mo65 on April 23, 2020, 01:06:16 PM
Quote from: Decker on April 23, 2020, 04:15:44 AM
Dang, but I think I figured it out! I have the wrong main gear — not a 5-149. The main I have has 40 teeth.

Joe,
You're not going to believe this. I looked at those pics you posted last night for a long time. I compared them to pics of my 149 gear project. It seemed like there were more teeth on your gear...but it was late...and I was beat. I just shook my head and turned in. Now when you get that correct gear there will be a lot more dremeling!

Hey Mo, many thanks for looking out for me! Yes, more dremeling!

Seems like to test the dremeling clearance, a good method is to attach the bridge with main gear (without yoke,jack, etc.) and tighten the star so that the gear can be turned. Is that how you do it? ON second thought, the yoke should probably be in place for the correct main gear vertical positioning.

P.S. I plan on double-dogging assuming that I can keep the head plate in one piece.

mo65 · April 23, 2020, 01:54:02 PM

Quote from: Decker on April 23, 2020, 01:35:57 PM
Seems like to test the dremeling clearance, a good method is to attach the bridge with main gear (without yoke,jack, etc.) and tighten the star so that the gear can be turned. Is that how you do it? ON second thought, the yoke should probably be in place for the correct main gear vertical positioning.

P.S. I plan on double-dogging assuming that I can keep the head plate in one piece.

Yes, that is how I did it, BUT, make sure to tighten all 4 bridge screws when testing. I tried to take a shortcut by only using two screws...big mistake. The bridge wasn't fully seated in it's final position and I had to disassemble those double dogs and the whole damn works for more grinding.
Also...I was enlightened by another spiritual vision last night. I suddenly remembered Ted posting a trivia question: "What was the smallest Penn to feature side access drags"? You guessed it...the Senator 2/0! Maybe that open gaping hole is the easy answer to this mod!

Decker · April 23, 2020, 01:59:39 PM

Quote from: mo65 on April 23, 2020, 01:54:02 PM
Also...I was enlightened by another spiritual vision last night. I suddenly remembered Ted posting a trivia question: "What was the smallest Penn to feature side access drags"? You guessed it...the Senator 2/0! Maybe that open gaping hole is the easy answer to this mod! [/color]

Wow, that is a revelation. I have a 113H with the outside access drag cap, but have never seen it on a 2/0.

mo65 · April 23, 2020, 02:09:12 PM

Quote from: Decker on April 23, 2020, 01:59:39 PM
Quote from: mo65 on April 23, 2020, 01:54:02 PM
Also...I was enlightened by another spiritual vision last night. I suddenly remembered Ted posting a trivia question: "What was the smallest Penn to feature side access drags"? You guessed it...the Senator 2/0! Maybe that open gaping hole is the easy answer to this mod!

Wow, that is a revelation. I have a 113H with the outside access drag cap, but have never seen it on a 2/0.

I'm not saying it would require no dremel work...but I think it's safe to say a whole lot less. Wish I had one of those plates in my parts...I don't even have an outside access 2/0 in my collection. An outside access 3/0 plate would work too. Maybe message Ted.

Decker · April 23, 2020, 02:19:36 PM

I'll wait and see what happens with the dremeling, Mo. The biggest limitation of the head plate mod is on the outer edge. As long as I can keep it looking decent, the ring will hold the plate together, I think. But if I break through, maybe using the outer access cap could help with the repair.

Alto Mare · April 23, 2020, 03:12:47 PM

The bit you are using it very hard to control, I use something similar to these:
https://www.ebay.com/itm/324086490739
Your but will cut you if you touch your skin, the ones I'm showing shouldn't.

Just be careful if you're going to use yours.

Another thing I've noticed it that the gear sleeve is too far off center.
This could be related to the plate or bridge.
Tolerance changed a little as Penn moved along with their parts.
With that said, if the spacer sleeve slides up and down when the bridge is assembled, this would not be an issue.

I'm not sure if the bit I'm showing has a cutting tip, that's what you would want.
I wasn't able to find the exact one I use, the one I'm showing is very close.

By the way, I've been using my bit for 6-7 years and it still cuts.

Sal

Decker · April 23, 2020, 03:29:15 PM

Quote from: Alto Mare on April 23, 2020, 03:12:47 PM
The bit you are using it very hard to control, I use something similar to these:
https://www.ebay.com/itm/324086490739
Your but will cut you if you touch your skin, the ones I'm showing shouldn't.
Just be careful if you're going to use yours.

Another thing I've noticed it that the gear sleeve is too far off center.
This could be related to the plate or bridge.
Tolerance changed a little as Penn moved along with their parts.
With that said, if the spacer sleeve slides up and down when the bridge is assembled, this would not be an issue.

Sal, thanks. That bit looks good. I've been doing okay with mine at the slowest speed.

Yes, the sleeve is off-center, and it is definitely related to the 113 bridge. According to what Mike said, the 66 bridge won't work. I didn't mention it before, but I filed the outer plate opening a little to make the sleeve fit. Assuming it will work, I should probably figure out a way to close the opening on the opposite side, to prevent salt water or sand intrusion, etc. Maybe I could mold and sand some epoxy.

Decker · April 23, 2020, 05:38:32 PM

Ted (Maxed Out) sent me this pic of a 111 with outer drag access cap: