Powder Coating

[oldmanjoe]

Trying out another color Joker Jewel on a Modified 440

Joker Jewel
This is a smooth, high gloss clear coat with a heavy amount of vibrant, color-shifting metallic flakes. These intense color shifting flakes change between green, pink, purple, orange, and light-red colors.

 

[oldmanjoe]

Shot Joker Jewel on a 275-330 today . This color is hard to put in pictures , it looks green most of the time .
 Out of the oven it showed more purple , as it cooled it when more green . At different angles the colors appear.

[foakes]

Sharp reel, Joe!

Best, Fred

[jgp12000]

Matching line too is over the top! what's left to do.

At the end of Tom Brady's career & 7 Super Bowls "Now What"?

[oldmanjoe]

Matching line too is over the top! what's left to do.

At the end of Tom Brady's career & 7 Super Bowls "Now What"?

I want to perfect the detail work , turn powder into liquid and paint the detail lines and bake it .
     The badges would really pop !!

Sharp reel, Joe!

Best, Fred

How close are you to start cooking ?   I do realize that you have newer factory painted parts , and hard to justifie stripping paint .

[jurelometer]

I want to perfect the detail work , turn powder into liquid and paint the detail lines and bake it .
    The badges would really pop !

I have messed with the Columbia liquid product.  You blend in the powder and paint with a brush.  It doesn't turn into something like the liquid paint that we are used to, more like powder suspended in a solution.  I found it hard to work with and not very satisfying.

One technique that sort of worked for me is to brush  on just the unblended liquid and the to spray the powder over it while the liquid is still wet.  I used one of the mini sandblaster style airbrushes to apply powder.

The powder will mostly just stick to spots where the liquid was applied.


-J

[oldmanjoe]

I will try the Columbia liquid powder solution , the next time I order Powder .

  I am using Acetone to make liquid  now .  So far I like it  .  I can paint with a brush and let dry and do clean ups when I go to wide or outside the lines !!

  Another tool is a powder buff

[JasonGotaProblem]

Ok I'm talking out my spray nozzle here but I had an idea re: detail work. Why brush it on? Couldn't you dump/spray/put a ton of powder on and brush off the excess before baking? I'm usually missing something.

The joker looks cool though.

[oldmanjoe]

Ok I'm talking out my spray nozzle here but I had an idea re: detail work. Why brush it on? Couldn't you dump/spray/put a ton of powder on and brush off the excess before baking? I'm usually missing something.

The joker looks cool though.
[/quote
Yes you can pile it on , than spread it out .   But it hard to get it even coated . even a paint brush will have a small static charge and makes it hard to get clean lines .

[JasonGotaProblem]

Pressurized air maybe? Isn't the metal electrically charged when you spray it on? So won't some stick either way?

I guess I'm picturing the way I did my son's thor hammer where I put on thinned 5 min epoxy let it get tacky and dusted on mica powder. (I was cleaning shiny stuff out of the far corners of my garage for months after, so word to the wise there)

[jurelometer]

Ok I'm talking out my spray nozzle here but I had an idea re: detail work. Why brush it on? Couldn't you dump/spray/put a ton of powder on and brush off the excess before baking? I'm usually missing something.

The joker looks cool though.

Yes.  I do this a bunch for making two color lures.  A damp q-tip is a nice tool. But you can't do detailed work, and it is difficult to to get every bit of the excess powder out of all the nooks and crannies, pores, etc.
Temporarily masking with painters tape during application is another option if the work is not too detailed.

A  bit more on the options:

Maybe Joe will figure out a process that works for him, but this is essentially using powder in a method that is in conflict with its fundamental properties. Powder is a coating, not a paint.

This is a bit of a simplification: Liquid urethane paint is a combination of urethane and solvents, the urethane is dissolved into the solvent, and this dissolved urethane in contact with the surface tends to get sticky right after you apply it, so you can apply the liquid paint some precision. The solvent evaporates fairly quickly, and the urethane hardens.

The powder used in coating is just the urethane paint in powder form with no solvents.  You need to have an even, fairly exact depth of the powder to stick to the part long enough  for it to melt and fuse to itself and the part when exposed to heat in the 350-400F range. 

This is usually achieved by attaching a negative electric charge to the part and a positive electric charge to the powder as it is released from the sprayer.  The powder sticks lightly to the part due to the residual static charge. On smaller parts like reels, you often don't have to spray multiple sides, the powder cloud will wrap around the back side of the part and coat everything. If you blow on the powder, you can dislodge it. The bond is very light before curing.

A part just sitting around can have enough static charge that a bit of loose powder might stick to it.  So the process of painting details on the part with a special wetting agent (like Columbia Powder Water) and then dusting with powder will tend to have a bit of the equivalent of overspray. A little bit of the powder can stick to other areas.

In my experiments, using the recommended method of first mixing the powder into the wetting agent gives you a less than satisfactory "paint", as the powder doesn't dissolve.  The solution is either too thin to  leave an adequate layer or too lumpy, and has a short work time. It doesn't  seem to want to stick evenly unless you are applying to a blasted surface with some tooth.

BTW-  there are additives like pearls, micas, and glow in the dark pigments that can successfully be blended with powders and applied normally. This can be fun.

-J

[jtwill98]

Have you considered using High Temperature Powder Coating Tape or Kapton tape used for masking sensitive connectors while hot air soldering of electronic components? 

I suspect simple strait lines like those you tried for the Pink Floyd  logo look on one of your reels would be a good candidate for TekLine Glass Cloth High Temperature Powder Coating Tape.

Kapton tape might also work as its is good up to 300-400 degrees Celsius. It's is inexpensive, easily cut and might work to mask off areas for a multi-stage finish (masking before a "green bake", then adding a second coat before the final cure.

You might want to experiment with a some sheet metal using some stencils or Cricut (if your wife has one) or similar device to cut the masks on the Kapton tape and apply the masks prior to powder coating.

[jurelometer]

Have you considered using High Temperature Powder Coating Tape or Kapton tape used for masking sensitive connectors while hot air soldering of electronic components? 

I suspect simple strait lines like those you tried for the Pink Floyd  logo look on one of your reels would be a good candidate for TekLine Glass Cloth High Temperature Powder Coating Tape.

Kapton tape might also work as its is good up to 300-400 degrees Celsius. It's is inexpensive, easily cut and might work to mask off areas for a multi-stage finish (masking before a "green bake", then adding a second coat before the final cure.

You might want to experiment with a some sheet metal using some stencils or Cricut (if your wife has one) or similar device to cut the masks on the Kapton tape and apply the masks prior to powder coating.

Good ideas.  These are used.

  Kapton tape is used, and is even sold by powder coating suppliers.  I have some, but don't use it much.

It is useful for keeping hot melting powder from flowing into spots where you don't want it, but the powder can form an unsightly ridge at the edge of the tape.  And taping over a previously applied coat can damage the surface during heating.

For multicolor work, using painters tape during the application process, and then removing to tape before baking is preferable for me, but I am usually coating lures and not doing precision work.


The folk that powder coat those stainless mugs use a Cricut or similar vinyl cutter to make a mask.  They leave the vinyl mask on for a short time at the beginning of baking the part, pulling up the vinyl before it melts.  This method leaves a cleaner edge without a ridge. They do this to make nice clean colored logos.  Haven't tried this myself.

IMHO, none of the hot masking techniques are great for multicolor work. But  I never tried very hard to perfect the technique.

-J

[jurelometer]

There is one other technique that I haven't tried but want to:  dye sublimation.

After powder coating the part, a laser or inkjet printed reversed image is pressed against the surface, the part goes into the oven, and the dye in the printed image transfers, and is permanently bonded into the powder coating.

There are special powder coats, papers and toner/inks that can be used, but some folks figured out how to do it Joe-style, with standard laser prints, and powder coating, with varying degrees of success.  I have seen some that have come out very nice.

-J

[oldmanjoe]

Ok I'm talking out my spray nozzle here but I had an idea re: detail work. Why brush it on? Couldn't you dump/spray/put a ton of powder on and brush off the excess before baking? I'm usually missing something.

The joker looks cool though.

Dave I am so glad you take the time to write out explanations and theories . I do agree with you   

Yes.  I do this a bunch for making two color lures.  A damp q-tip is a nice tool. But you can't do detailed work, and it is difficult to to get every bit of the excess powder out of all the nooks and crannies, pores, etc.
Temporarily masking with painters tape during application is another option if the work is not too detailed.

A  bit more on the options:

Maybe Joe will figure out a process that works for him, but this is essentially using powder in a method that is in conflict with its fundamental properties. Powder is a coating, not a paint.

This is a bit of a simplification: Liquid urethane paint is a combination of urethane and solvents, the urethane is dissolved into the solvent, and this dissolved urethane in contact with the surface tends to get sticky right after you apply it, so you can apply the liquid paint some precision. The solvent evaporates fairly quickly, and the urethane hardens.

The powder used in coating is just the urethane paint in powder form with no solvents.  You need to have an even, fairly exact depth of the powder to stick to the part long enough  for it to melt and fuse to itself and the part when exposed t

Ok I'm talking out my spray nozzle here but I had an idea re: detail work. Why brush it on? Couldn't you dump/spray/put a ton of powder on and brush off the excess before baking? I'm usually missing something.

The joker looks cool though.

Yes.  I do this a bunch for making two color lures.  A damp q-tip is a nice tool. But you can't do detailed work, and it is difficult to to get every bit of the excess powder out of all the nooks and crannies, pores, etc.
Temporarily masking with painters tape during application is another option if the work is not too detailed.

A  bit more on the options:

Maybe Joe will figure out a process that works for him, but this is essentially using powder in a method that is in conflict with its fundamental properties. Powder is a coating, not a paint.

This is a bit of a simplification: Liquid urethane paint is a combination of urethane and solvents, the urethane is dissolved into the solvent, and this dissolved urethane in contact with the surface tends to get sticky right after you apply it, so you can apply the liquid paint some precision. The solvent evaporates fairly quickly, and the urethane hardens.

The powder used in coating is just the urethane paint in powder form with no solvents.  You need to have an even, fairly exact depth of the powder to stick to the part long enough  for it to melt and fuse to itself and the part when exposed to heat in the 350-400F range. 

This is usually achieved by attaching a negative electric charge to the part and a positive electric charge to the powder as it is released from the sprayer.  The powder sticks lightly to the part due to the residual static charge. On smaller parts like reels, you often don't have to spray multiple sides, the powder cloud will wrap around the back side of the part and coat everything. If you blow on the powder, you can dislodge it. The bond is very light before curing.

A part just sitting around can have enough static charge that a bit of loose powder might stick to it.  So the process of painting details on the part with a special wetting agent (like Columbia Powder Water) and then dusting with powder will tend to have a bit of the equivalent of overspray. A little bit of the powder can stick to other areas.

In my experiments, using the recommended method of first mixing the powder into the wetting agent gives you a less than satisfactory "paint", as the powder doesn't dissolve.  The solution is either too thin to  leave an adequate layer or too lumpy, and has a short work time. It doesn't  seem to want to stick evenly unless you are applying to a blasted surface with some tooth.

BTW-  there are additives like pearls, micas, and glow in the dark pigments that can successfully be blended with powders and applied normally. This can be fun.

-J

Dave I am so glad you like to write you explanations and theories , You are spot on .