Rod and Reel Setup theory

[BogueSounder]

Hi, you have been getting blitzed with good information. That said, some of us are visual learners. I thought I would at least give some pics to illustrate what I think others are saying. I hope it is helpful. Gents, please correct me if my pics misrepresent what you are trying to tell him. None of the pics are mine, just google grabs:

Egg sinker (described in Ron's 'Noyb' reply). Used in carolina rig, etc.


Ron's rig suggestion I think:


Keta's weight slider:


I don't fish on party boats, so I don't have much to offer from that perspective. I do use the slider that Keta mentioned on my boat, and from shore. They work well in bottom fishing applications in the southeastern US.  I second using the lightest weight possible for the conditions. Try chatting with the guys that are catching all the fish on your party boats...maybe on the way in, not during the bite? Must be some etiquette there?

Good luck,
Mark

[BogueSounder]

Ruben,
Another thought regarding terminal tackle and rigs. This site is no doubt the best place on the interwebs to discuss everything rod and reel. However, there are people on here from everywhere that fish for every species imaginable in many different ways...which is part this site's beauty. But, you may learn more regarding the specifics of tackle rigging from a more regional forum?  I assume you are in the northeast based on your name?

Stripers online may have some good info for you to search as well, for example:
http://www.stripersonline.com/t/601168/what-rig-for-bottom-fishing-party-boat-in-the-cape


You may already know all this, so ignore my posts if so. Hope you get on em. The bite is on fire down here.

Mark

[Mandelstam]

If I feel the vibration of him talking, I'll consider the rod. I have not found the same sensitivity with ugly sticks. 
Regarding the tigers, I know a lot of people fish them and have not heard a negative thing about them

Interesting ...

X2
Good tip Bryan! Never thought of that...

[Mandelstam]

Not sure about 320. I measure my 310 max drag around 9lb.
So goes by the 30% theory, I'll be using main line around 30lb, with a rod with power curve(90 degree) slight more than 10lb for lightness, or 30lb for in case I thumb the spool when desperated.

I don't understand.  The GTi 320 I think has a 13lb max drag?  So what is a

a rod with power curve(90 degree) slight more than 10lb for lightness

Take the rating from the manufacturer with a pinch of salt.
For reel I do my drag test at with 1/2 spool of line. For rod slowly I mount the reel on, and did load test with a drag check and see what load does it take to bent the rod 90 degree.

A power curve example from fox sports

This is not helping becasue I didn't help the original statement.
What is a

a rod with power curve(90 degree) slight more than 10lb for lightness

?

Think of the rods line rating in lbs. When loaded with that weight the rod bends in 90 degrees. That is the rods power curve. A rod rated 20lbs bends 90 degrees when loaded with a weight of 20lbs.

[Bryan Young]

If I feel the vibration of him talking, I'll consider the rod. I have not found the same sensitivity with ugly sticks. 
Regarding the tigers, I know a lot of people fish them and have not heard a negative thing about them

Interesting ...

X2
Good tip Bryan! Never thought of that...

There's a lot I look at in rod selection.  # of guides, guide placeent, alignment on spline, .

I will also bring in my reel that I intend to use with the rod and ask if I can string the rod to see the bend and also attach the intended weight on the line to see the relaxed bend.   I asked the sales person to hold the line and make like a fish so I could see the bend and reactio of the rod through my hands.  I probably look at a at least 50 rods before I will buy one  the curse of a previsous rod-wrapper.

[Keta]

Keta's weight slider:

That's what I was referring to.   I use 2 beads and a snap swivel rather than the plastic slider and a 36" mono dropper from the slider to the lead.

[Ron Jones]

This is not helping becasue I didn't help the original statement.
What is a rod with power curve(90 degree) slight more than 10lb for lightness?

Think of the rods line rating in lbs. When loaded with that weight the rod bends in 90 degrees. That is the rods power curve. A rod rated 20lbs bends 90 degrees when loaded with a weight of 20lbs.

First, forget everything you ever learned in school and realize that rod rating was established by completely uneducated beach bums looking for a marketing ploy. That may not be absolutely true but it will put you in the right mindset. If you start worrying about Watts law you'll never ever catch a single fish.

Also, the 90 degree comment isn't exactly true. Rods have several characteristics that are important. Unfortunatly different manufacturers use the terms that describe those characteristics interchangeably. You will hear and read terms like power, speed and line rating. I have found that many of them mean very little more than a general guide.

If you notice, the Tiger lite and Seeker you started this thread with have overlapping line ratings, but very little else in common. They both will pick up a 30 pound weight and bend to 90 degrees at totally different places on the rod.

Ron

[Bryan Young]

Ruben, carbon fiber drags can take the heat, and drag grease makes it smoother especially if the drags get wet. Drag grease keeps water out of the fibers of the drag washer.

Lets start with felt, cork, and canvas. They can only take so much heat then starts to burn or glaze. This will result in loosing drag, kind of like hot brakes for your car. Then if water gets into the fibers, when the drag heats up, the water expands making high spots making the drag jerky. Lie warped rotors for your disk brakes.

Hope this helps.

[Ron Jones]

Carbon fiber is superior for it's wear resistance and lack of friction as opposed to it's strength. It's weave also maintains grease well. As an added bonus it doesn't absorb heat well nor does it have significantly different friction characteristics when it does get hot. Formula one race cars use carbon fiber brake disks and pads and we use carbon fiber drag disks for the same reason.

Ron

[Ron Jones]

Apologies, I meant to type lack of degradation of friction. Greased carbon fiber also has little to no difference between initial friction and running friction. This is vitally important, especially for larger fish.

Ron

[Keta]

The CF material was designed for automatic transmission plates and is far superior to the drag materials of the past.

[day0ne]

The CF material was designed for automatic transmission plates and is far superior to the drag materials of the past.

I understand that the HT-100 carbon fiber comes from jet aicraft brake linings.

[tpilk]

AH - Yes, that would be true.  I spoke to the smoothdrag people.  It just amazes me.  How does someone make a business out of making something as obscure as replacement washers of fishing reels?

Ruben

That's a fair question. What amazes me is how thousands of Stella's (spinning reels) get sold at better than $1,200 a pop? I guess the answer is there is a heck of a lot of money tied up in this little "hobby."

As to Smooth Drag, I've bought her washers in not only the US, but several shops in both Singapore and Thailand and I'm sure she supplies many more. She's Global!

As to original drag washer materials...Alan went through an old Penn 940 for me and it had original leather washers. Of leather, canvas, cork and felt, I think I've had the best luck with canvas and felt, though canvas doesn't like water intrusion either (original TLD's would lock up tight when the drag got wet). That said, CF has been night and day improvement. It will be interesting to see what comes next in the evolution...

[Krabby Patties]

I usually come home from a grouper trip with bruised up arm pits and ribs from setting the hook and cranking them up from below while the other three on the boat might catch one fish to my four.
I drop the line down and raise the rod top slightly then crank up the slack. Next I watch how much the boat is rocking and raising with the swells while keeping my line just snug to the bottom. Then I take up as much lime as I can so I'm still comfy when my side of the boat is highest and the rod tip is lowest. I basically do a miniature jigging motion between feeling the weight and not feeling it. As soon as I feel a night I set the hook as hard as I can and start cranking. I'm not jigging the weight off the bottom and not giving it slack as much as just going from tight to not tight while raising and lowering the rod with the rocking of the boat. Hope that makes sense. Not tooting my own horn but I catch more fish this way than anyone on the boat with the same bait and set ups.

[jbackos]

For sea bass and porgy, I use a self built Lamiglas Musky rod (2-8oz.) with 30 lb. braid. The reel is either a Calcutta/Cardiff 400 or an Abu 7000. I can feel everything with this outfit and it doesn't beat you up.

I rig a bank sinker, with two hooks (hi-low). I keep the hook leaders short for better control and quicker hook sets. I tie a knot in the sinker drop so I can break the sinker off if I get snagged. This rig (20-30 lb fluorocarbon, total length 24") is tied directly to the braid using a ball bearing swivel.

Fluke are a different story. You need flexibility to avoid pulling the bait out of the fluke's mouth when they follow the bait. For party boat fishing I use an IGFA 20 lb class black with a moderate action and 20 lb mono. The rig is a fish finder with a 3' foot leader. The reel is any conventional depending on the size of fish anticipated.