I want to play around with making a larger lightweight fly reel knob for winding tuna. I haven't been able to find a source for the extra-hard, high density foam that is used for reel knobs. Does anybody have an idea on where I can get my hands on some, especially in smaller quantities?
-J.
I have used bicycle handlebar grips like this from Amazon/Ebay. Just being a pair ensures small and cheap quantities.
The only problem is quality varies alot :(
(https://alantani.com/gallery/29/9780_11_10_19_3_25_24_297311159.jpeg)
This particular colour closely matches the Tiburon electric blue anodising.
Quote from: Tiddlerbasher on October 11, 2019, 10:30:33 AM
I have used bicycle handlebar grips like this from Amazon/Ebay. Just being a pair ensures small and cheap quantities.
The only problem is quality varies alot :(
Thanks!
The hole is too large for my purposes. Is the hardness the same as commercially made reel knobs?
Still looking...
-J
maybe, grips for hiking/wading staffs
the really hi-tech, expensive, collapsible ones
As I said the quality varies - good - bad - indifferent :-\
But it's a cheap option to try ;)
I might have some scraps floating around. I'll check when I get home. I can send some to you to see what magic you can work with it if you like.
Mike
I've got a 2" chunk of eva that might work for you. The ID is 3/8". OD is 1 1/4". If you want it, shoot me a pm with your address and I'll send it to you.
Quote from: Fishy247 on October 13, 2019, 02:48:24 PM
I've got a 2" chunk of eva that might work for you. The ID is 3/8". OD is 1 1/4". If you want it, shoot me a pm with your address and I'll send it to you.
Thanks for the generous offer Mike, but I need something solid or with a hole no greater than 1/4 inch.
Update: I tried making one with the hardest EVA fishing rod grip material that I could find, but it was still too soft.
-J
I would ask Maxed Out, Ted, he might be able to help you source some.
Best,
Dom
This may help
https://www.amazon.com/AmazonBasics-High-Density-Roller-18-inches-Speckled/dp/B07BH1PSW1/ref=sr_1_20_sspa?gclid=EAIaIQobChMI0u
You could also build up a existing knob or wood form with sheet craft foam and contac cement.
I made a cover for one of my handles that had chunks missing with 3 mm foam with several colors.
hmmm... cover up undesirable existing knobs w/ better surface material, you say?
now, what would stick to old Shimano Septon(?), that's gone "gummy" ???
Thanks for all the ideas folks. The 2 lb psi craft foam is not hard or dense enough. The hardest rod handle foam I could find was Batson's. the stuff is so hard that it won't stretch over the blank and has to be reamed, but it is still not hard enough for my purposes.
By looking at his photos, it appears that Max was using eva rod handle foam for knobs, at least at first. There was a comment about switching from eva to foam, which was confusing, as the eva stuff is also a foam. Maybe he meant polyethylene or polypropylene foam?
It might be easier to just turn down an existing aftermarket hard foam reel knob. I am only making one or two.
Quote from: philaroman on October 14, 2019, 10:31:46 PM
hmmm... cover up undesirable existing knobs w/ better surface material, you say?
now, what would stick to old Shimano Septon(?), that's gone "gummy" ???
My guess is that those hard rubbery knobs that go gummy are made from a urethane compound. Some chemical (sunblock?, repellent?, degreaser/solvent?) changed the molecular structure on the surface into something a bit gooey ( I.e., not tightly bonded), which means that even if you could find a compound that could adhere to the surface layer, the surface layer is not well bonded to the rest of the knob. I think that you are out of luck unless there is a magic chemical that will transform the molecular structure on the surface back to something non-gooey. This seems unlikely.
I would ask Shimano what causes the knobs to go gummy, and whether it is covered under warranty.
-J
I'm not sure what you're after, but Divinycell foam from the boat-builder supply is hard enough that you cannot compress it with your fingers. You could probably mark it with your fingernail though. The high density one is about 16 lbs/cu.ft.
http://www.diabgroup.com/en-GB/Products-and-services/Core-Material/Divinycell-H (http://www.diabgroup.com/en-GB/Products-and-services/Core-Material/Divinycell-H)
-steve
Hi Dave --
When looking around for other things out in the storage container this morning -- came across a couple of lugs of rod handles and material. Found a couple of Fenwick brown grips that are nearly impossible to compress more than slightly.
Some have a 1/4" ID through hole -- however, found (2) new ones about 12" long with very small ID's -- possibly 1/8" to 3/16". They are Fenwicks, very hard, and new in the packages.
You are welcome to them if you think they might work.
N/C, for you, of course.
Let me know.
Best,
Fred
Thanks Fred, but I think I need something harder than the hardest rod handle foam. Greatly appreciate the offer, though!
Steve: I will keep my eyes open on finding a sample of divinicell. I expect the stuff would be plenty hard, but am wondering about chemical and abrasion resistance.
-J
Quote from: jurelometer on October 20, 2019, 05:16:18 PM
am wondering about chemical and abrasion resistance.
-J
PM your address and I'll mail you a piece to play with. With a thin coat of resin it would be tough.
-steve
A bit left field maybe - but if you've a knob shape you like cover it with shrink wrap/Xrap :-\
there's this playdough "stuff" ??? ...mentioned somewhere(?) on here
you get reasonable time to shape it & then it sets/cures
don't know if the result is hard/dense/durable enough for reel knobs
might work w/ a metal frame/skeleton & you mold a knob onto it
Quote from: oc1 on October 20, 2019, 07:10:43 PM
Quote from: jurelometer on October 20, 2019, 05:16:18 PM
am wondering about chemical and abrasion resistance.
-J
PM your address and I'll mail you a piece to play with. With a thin coat of resin it would be tough.
-steve
Thanks for the offer Steve, but I think I need something on the rubbery side, just not too elastic.
Quote from: philaroman on October 21, 2019, 04:15:42 PM
there's this playdough "stuff" ??? ...mentioned somewhere(?) on here
you get reasonable time to shape it & then it sets/cures
don't know if the result is hard/dense/durable enough for reel knobs
might work w/ a metal frame/skeleton & you mold a knob onto it
Sugru. It has the tear strength and adhesion of silicon caulk, of which it it is sort of a derivative. Not very durable. A bit too rubbery.
BTW: I did find a a nice UV resistant rubbery urethane that looks like a good candidate for pouring hard rubber knobs, maybe a replacement for those Shimano/Avet/ etc. knobs that got sticky. A sample held up well after 9 months sitting out in the sun in my backyard. Just need to do some chemical resistance testing.
Appreciate all the brainstorming and sample offers! I will post a follow-on that describes what properties I am looking for and why.
-J
So a bit more on what I am up to:
Most fly reels, including big game reels do not have an anti reverse mechanism. The knob is mounted directly on the edge of the spool, with a counterweight opposite to provide balance. When the fish takes line, the spool and knob starts spinning backwards. It is a bit of an art to pull your fingers out of the way before the knob spins around and whacks you. once you get into bigger fish, the chance of injury is quite real.
The better knob designs allow you to more easily pull your fingers clear to the side while you are still releasing the grip. But there is a tradeoff. These designs require a smaller diameter, smooth knob that does not stick out too far, making it hard to wind under load. This was originally not a big deal in most cases, as fairly light leaders were deployed (20lb max), and the rod was used to lift the fish.
But fly rods are terrible lifting tools. Big game fishers resort to "heavy" rods that are a pain to cast very frequently, but they fish in situations that do not require much casting distance (e.g., flopping the fly into the trolling spread when a marlin pops up - if the boat is out of gear but still moving, the IGFA counts this as a cast fly and not trolling ??? , but I digress.) Add in a bit of boat maneuvering to cause some planing, and a large fish can be landed.
But if you want to cast to and land larger fish with a fly rod from a drifting or anchored boat, the reel has to do some of the work. This is especially true with Tuna. I haven't caught loads of yellowfin on the fly, but so far, I have found that over the thirty pound mark, keeping the tuna's head pointed upward during the spiral gets increasingly difficult (the rod and fly line are too elastic to make pumping very effective), and the fight can turn into a ridiculous (IMHO) stalemate. I think I have tried all the bluewater fly rod fighting techniques, and some work well for me until this last stage of the fight.
Rather than switch to a 14wt, I want to improve my ability to wind the reel under a bit more load. This means a proper winding knob, with the following properties:
1. Large enough to to grip with more than the fingertips.
2. Light enough as to not cause a balance problem with the counterweight.
3. A shape that allows line that gets trapped around the knob to be easily cleared(especially when clearing slack line after hookup - it has happened a few times to "this guy I know")
4. Less fatigue factor when gripping tightly.
5. Reasonably easy to release knob when fish runs.
6. Durable: abrasion/tear/UV/ chemical exposure resistance.
7. ( bonus) Less finger damage if the knob whacks the finger during a run.
So EVA, or something similar fits the bill. It is light enough that I can make a larger knob without causing balance issues. It has just the right amount of grip that I am looking for, and it is light and soft enough, that if it does whack my fingers, I should have a lower risk of breaking a finger or loosing a nail.
I made a prototype with the hardest rod grip foam that I could find, but it deformed more than I wanted when subjected to the amount of gripping force that I would use to wind a big fish. It seems that a width between .4 to .5 inches is about right. A length of 1.25 inches is best for winding, but I don't think the post is strong enough, so I have to go a bit shorter.
I have a couple of conventional reels with the new hard EVA foam knobs, and that material looks just about perfect in terms of what I am looking for.
Since I would just be making a couple for myself, I think am going to bite the bullet and just buy a couple aftermarket conventional reel replacement knobs, turn them to shape, and sleeve the shaft to fit my reels. Finding the raw stock material would be better, but I am guessing it will require weeding though several options, samples, and then a bulk purchase.
But if there is a good source for small amounts of extra hard EVA stock, i suspect that other folks here might find it useful for making custom knobs as well.
-J
What about this type of product - I know this is a UK company, but there should be similar in the US.
It would certainly be cheap enough to try :-\
https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Yoga-Block-Set-EVA-Foam-Brick-With-D-Ring-Stretch-Strap-Belt-Core-Balance/113909172969
or for a natural product
https://www.ebay.co.uk/p/Mirafit-2-X-Cork-Exercise-Yoga-Block-Fitness-stretching-Aid-Brick-Gym-pilates/18007802690
or just fit one of these
https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/EVA-Fishing-Reel-Handle-Knob-Baitcasting-Reel-Knob-Reel-Grip-Component-Parts/153184151769?hash=item23aa7ca8d9:m:mSFuGlUrSjRgk-UMfvJHe_A
After reading what you are trying to do , some things come to mine . Can you post some pictures of the knob that you have now and the prototype that you feel might work ?