Sometimes fly fisherman's will come up to me and say I make my own flys,,,,,, :) ya I got a friend steve"oc1"and he makes his own line,,,,, :o ok what knot do you use with leader to hook,,,,, ??? And they ask me what do you use,,,, :( bimini twist,,,,,, ;) hehe,,,I want to see that,,,not really i use a improved clinch and I run the line throw eye 3 times before,,,,,,, ;D
I use a San Diego jam knot Bennie, you should try it. Somewhat similar to what your using but stronger. For heavy line a double San Diego Jam.
Bimini isn't too hard to tie especially in braid, you should try it, makes a nice loop. Amaze your friends too,like a card trick. It just looks hard
Quote from: Benni3 on April 18, 2020, 06:16:58 AM
Sometimes fly fisherman's will come up to me and say I make my own flys,,,,,, :) ya I got a friend steve"oc1"and he makes his own line,,,,, :o ok what knot do you use with leader to hook,,,,, ??? And they ask me what do you use,,,, :( bimini twist,,,,,, ;) hehe,,,I want to see that,,,not really i use a improved clinch and I run the line throw eye 3 times before,,,,,,, ;D
For tying a monofilament leader or tippet to the hook eye of the fly I usually just use a plain old simple uni-knot in
most of my fishing and sometimes I might go through the hook eye a couple of times. It's worked well for me and I can't recall ever having one break.
Quote from: wfjord on April 18, 2020, 05:22:40 PM
For tying a monofilament leader or tippet to the hook eye of the fly I usually just use a plain old simple uni-knot in most of my fishing and sometimes I might go through the hook eye a couple of times. It's worked well for me and I can't recall ever having one break.
I have to agree...the basic uni-knot never fails me. I've tried them all though, remember the "knot wars" videos, lots of great info there. 8)
This is the one that seems to be the most common based on my research, but I never use it! Always use clinch or improved clinch.
If you are tying the leader snug to the eye of the hook, it is important that whatever knot you use does not skew the fly off center, especially with very small/light flies. It might be less noticeable with light tippet, but it is still there. I guess that a snug knot makes sense for very small flies (trout), where you want the fly to lay out perfectly aligned with the leader. It certainly is the preference. I haven't fished freshwater with those tiny flies in over a decade, so I am a bit rusty on this topic. The SD jam knot is a great knot, but it might be a bit too bulky for the trout guys. Same goes with running the leader several times through the eye.
I use a loop knot almost exclusively. It allows the fly to swing freely, and can help the action. The only loop knot that I use in mono/fluoro for tying to flies is the Kreh nonslip loop. The tag lays down with the leader, which helps minimize fouling, picking up weed, and punching a hole in your thumb when you are using hard mono. The Kreh loop is also a great knot for making a loop on lures and live bait hooks to keep the leader from restricting movement.
I know a couple guys that just use the clinch knot for everything, and they still catch fish, but since I can see the difference in how a fly tracks, I think the loop does makes a difference.
-J.
Alberto knot for braid or mono main line to thicker shock leader for surf casting. It's not a complex as the FG, and I can tie it in the dark. Slips through guides pretty well.
Whoops, this is a fly fishing board ::)
Flyline to tapered leader nail not, tapered leader to flyline nail knot, tippet to tapered leader double uni. I have slipped the flyline into hollow 80 Spectra backing and served it like a L2L topshot.
It's that tiny little tag end nub of mono sticking out of the knot that causes all the grief. If it wasn't so dark you could seize it.
-steve
A leader nail knotted to the tapered end of fly line works nicely. But if you have to re-tie a new nail knot each time you need to change leaders you lose a bit of fly line taper that adds up over time, and good fly lines get expensive. It's best to leave enough of the old leader butt attached to the fly line to tie a perfection loop in the end. That way, whenever you need to put on new leaders in the future, you're already set up for a loop-to-loop connection.
The leader configuration for me is generally this:
1) Nail knot or Albright knot for attaching a leader, or better yet --a short piece of mono attached to the end of the flyline with a perfection loop on the other end, then you can make a...
2) Loop to loop connection to attach the monofilament leader. Then a...
3) Double surgeons knot to tie on a fine tippet for trout fishing.
For bass & stripers I make a leader out of two or three pieces of monofilament, tied together usually with either blood knots for the upper two sections and a uni-to-uni knot for the bottom section. The leader might consist of, for example, a 25lb, 20lb, & 15lb length --or whatever & however many sections, lengths and strengths you need it to be. Experiment with it and see how it casts. I usually make those leaders shorter overall than the 9' fine tipped tapered leaders I use for trout.
Some fly fishermen prefer welded loops or braided loops on the front end of a fly line. A lot of fly lines come from the manufacturer with a loop built into it. It's personal preference, either can work fine and everyone has their own reasons for liking or disliking them. I've used them, but I usually end up snipping them off and attaching a piece of mono for a loop to loop. Just my preference. I do have a new 5wt Orvis DT line that a seller sent me with a reel I bought from him several months ago that has a built-in end loops and so far I like it enough that I haven't wanted to cut it off.
For fly lines 6 or 7wt up to a 9, I feel better about using an Albright for tying leader and backing to the fly line. I used an Albright on one of my 5wt lines a couple days ago.
Hehe,,,,, ;) the members here know there knots,,,, :D but trout unlimited members,,,,,, :( Walking around with $1000,,,,$2000 of gear with a attitude,,,,, :D telling me about flys,,,hatches,,,aquatic insects,,,,,, 8) but ask them what knot they use,,,,they dont know and as many of there flys I have pulled out of big trout noses,,,,now that funny,,,but should I show them how to tie a knot,,,,,,,, ;D
Quote from: wfjord on April 19, 2020, 12:57:32 AM
if you have to re-tie a new nail knot each time you need to change leaders you lose a bit of fly line taper that adds up over time, and good fly lines get expensive.
I never thought of that, for as much as I use them I don't have to worry.
Quote from: Keta on April 19, 2020, 04:41:11 AM
Quote from: wfjord on April 19, 2020, 12:57:32 AM
if you have to re-tie a new nail knot each time you need to change leaders you lose a bit of fly line taper that adds up over time, and good fly lines get expensive.
I never thought of that, for as much as I use them I don't have to worry.
I have to change full leaders several times a day for the type of fishing that I do. I never thought that
Quote from: Benni3 on April 19, 2020, 04:22:53 AM
Hehe,,,,, ;) the members here know there knots,,,, :D but trout unlimited members,,,,,, :( Walking around with $1000,,,,$2000 of gear with a attitude,,,,, :D telling me about flys,,,hatches,,,aquatic insects,,,,,, 8) but ask them what knot they use,,,,they dont know and as many of there flys I have pulled out of big trout noses,,,,now that funny,,,but should I show them how to tie a knot,,,,,,,, ;D
Ask 'em about Turle, Davy, and Kreh knots :)
Turke knot -the knot ends up on the shank of the hook instead of in front of it. I think that they use the Turle for those tiny dry flies with upturned or downturned eyes, so that the knot doesn't tip the fly down.
The Davy knot is just a figure 8. Doesn't use up much tippet, and you can even undo and retire the same knot. A very light knot. Also useful for tying flies to knotable wire for pike and muskie. But for any subsurface fly over a size 8, or any popper fly, I am going with the Kreh/Nonslip loop.
If I was going dry fly trout fishing for fun, I would try out the Davy, so I could change my fly frequently without having to add more tippet all the time.
I could never figure out why somebody needed a $700 fly rod to cast 30 feet, and a $400 reel to hold the fly line. But that is trout fishing for you... If I am fishing with a group, I want to be the guy with the cheapest, most beat up gear. Then the pressure is on the other guy :)
-J
The fly shop in Port Angeles installs a pre made loop in the end of the fly line. Don't know how else to explain it and haven't watched him do it, but it makes attaching a leader really easy. I've caught a bunch of steelhead with it. The whole tapered thing doesn't seem that big of a deal either if you are using floro. One day I broke off everything and didn't have anything to replace the rig. I used a surgeon's loop in the end of 15# floro and tied it to a big streamer (I think it was a deceiver) about 6-7ft long leader. Steelhead and sea-run cutthroat didn't seem to notice that I didn't have 3 pieces of line.
On the rare occasion that I wet a fly, I still use a leader and tippet, but I'm not certain that I need it.
The Man
Turke knot -the knot ends up on the shank of the hook instead of in front of it. I think that they use the Turle for those tiny dry flies with upturned or downturned eyes, so that the knot doesn't tip the fly down.
-J
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A friend of mine used to snell tippet straight to a hook and then tied the fly over the hook for anything as small as a midge. He would even tie 3-4 on a single tippet, hardest part was keeping them straight up and down so they swim right he would say. All I know is that he could catch fish.
The Man
Quote from: Ron Jones on April 19, 2020, 06:14:07 AM
One day I broke off everything and didn't have anything to replace the rig. I used a surgeon's loop in the end of 15# floro and tied it to a big streamer (I think it was a deceiver) about 6-7ft long leader. Steelhead and sea-run cutthroat didn't seem to notice that I didn't have 3 pieces of line.
The Man
You don't have to have 3 pieces of line. I often use just two, but the bottom section needs to be the weak link, primarily for the reason that you don't lose everything. A single level line would work just fine otherwise.
Quote from: jurelometer on April 19, 2020, 06:12:45 AM
I could never figure out why somebody needed a $700 fly rod to cast 30 feet, and a $400 reel to hold the fly line. But that is trout fishing for you... If I am fishing with a group, I want to be the guy with the cheapest, most beat up gear. Then the pressure is on the other guy :)
-J
My go-to 8-weight rod is an old 8'6" BassPro White River CV that I bought used for $50 from a guy fifteen years ago. Probably the best rod purchase I've ever made, and I've caught my biggest fish on it. It turned out to be such a light, strong, super smooth casting rod, and such a pleasure to use that I've never had the urge to look for a better 8wt. Years later when I was looking for another one just like it for a backup, I read that BassPro had made some less than desirable changes to that model and at some point discontinued it.
I do have some high end trout rods, but I got every one of them from fly shops on close-out for half price or better (NOS) when the manufacturers discontinued them for newer models. Same with a lot of my reels. It's older stuff and still top notch, but then I'm drawn to vintage gear. The latest new high end fly gear is way out of my ball park. Not to say I wouldn't consider buying it if cost was no issue.
Quote from: Ron Jones on April 19, 2020, 06:14:07 AM
The fly shop in Port Angeles installs a pre made loop in the end of the fly line. Don't know how else to explain it and haven't watched him do it, but it makes attaching a leader really easy. I've caught a bunch of steelhead with it. The whole tapered thing doesn't seem that big of a deal either if you are using floro. One day I broke off everything and didn't have anything to replace the rig. I used a surgeon's loop in the end of 15# floro and tied it to a big streamer (I think it was a deceiver) about 6-7ft long leader. Steelhead and sea-run cutthroat didn't seem to notice that I didn't have 3 pieces of line.
On the rare occasion that I wet a fly, I still use a leader and tippet, but I'm not certain that I need it.
The Man
I knew if we kept at this long enough, Ron and I would agree on something :) Ron and I are in the minority on straight shots (leaders that is).
For 90% of my fishing, I use a single straight section of tippet. Kreh loop on the back, and a Kreh loop on my fly at the front. If the tippet is stronger than the fly line (30-40 lb), I tie a short section of 20 on the back as a fuse. Absolutely no reason for a tapered leader on a big subsurface fly.
If you are going for a record, there are complicated IGFA rules for leader construction, and the bite tippet usually has to be short (12 inch?).
Tapered leaders do not do much to help unroll the cast cleanly unless the fly is very light. Some folks use furled/twisted lines to make up the back two thirds of the leader. It will help turn over a larger fly better, but it is not much more quiet or invisible than the fly line. A shorter leader works fine, and if you can double haul correctly, the line speed will help unroll the leader better than any tapered leader.
There are places for a long tapered leader. If you are fishing calm flats for spooky fish, and you have to land a small fly gently and accurately, a properly constructed tapered leader does help.
-J.