remember the first rule in the army - never volunteer for anything! please welcomed our newest moderator, sid!!!!!
Quote from: sdlehr on April 03, 2016, 05:01:48 AM
I don't know if there is a better place for this post.
I know this is a reel repair/maintenance site primarily, but secondarily we are all things reels, and tertiarily(? is that a word?) we are all things fishing. There are a lot of Penn enthusiasts here, and, dare I say, a few collectors as well. I'm proposing a new discussion board primarily for information pertaining to dating vintage Penn reels. This is information that isn't easy to find the way it is currently scattered about the site. For me it would be nice to have a resource where one could go to find information about chronological changes that came out with each reel or reel family as they evolved over the years. IF this gets set up right it could end up being a valuable reference source for a lot of people.
So, first, is there interest? I'll put out my name to moderate if a moderator is needed. I don't have a command of the information; so if Ray or Mike or Ted or John are interested in moderating I'd be fine with that (that is not meant to be an all-inclusive list, it's just the guys that come to mind first). After a few years it might be possible for someone who just bought a Penn Long Beach with a particular type of side plate and handle, clicker, etc. to go to a Long Beach discussion and find the criteria for that reel to date it's production to a relatively narrow time frame. It's possible that I'm way out in left field and this isn't feasible. That would be something I'd want to know now. I think maybe flow diagrams would be a good way to organize the information; one flow diagram for each reel model. If you're not familiar with flow diagrams I can provide an example.
If there were a way to separate out each model, so that we can have cumulative contributions to chronological information for each model, with multiple contributors, well, that would be a valuable resource for many collectors such as myself that are just starting out and need help.
I think some discussion ought to occur about whether we should try to do this, as well as what might be the best way to set this up. Likely there will be a bit of trial and error involved. This is something that is an obstacle for me at times; I get a reel and I know it's a vintage model and I want to know when it was produced, and for now the only way I have to get that information is to read for hours and hours hoping I find the information I am looking for or post pics and description and ask others for help. I find this information confusing, because what may be true for one family of reels may be totally different for another. I know there is a lot of ambiguous information out there for a lot of reels.
So I'm hoping to open up a discussion regarding the last paragraph and what people think about trying to develop this sooner to help keep AT.com on the cutting edge of reel husbandry!
What does everyone think? I'm especially interested in the folks that know a lot about this - would you like your own section to be able to help the rest of us to understand what you do and how you do it? And would it be nice for someone to be able to come to this section in a few years and run through a flow diagram and be able to date the chronological age of their reel?
Please let me know what you think of this idea...
Sid
Congrats Sid
Congratulations Sid :)
welcome sid, great idea!
Welcome Sid! What a great idea. I actually was looking for something like this a few weeks ago when I was trying to put dates on some of the 114H production changes. I started a spread sheet for some of them, never could pin a date on when the side plates changed from maroon to red. Please feel free to correct anything below.
1963 -1964 Black side plate 114H limited production
1964 Maroon side plate, external drag access
1985 internal drag access, marroon color
???? Red color change
1994 Half frame design, same screw pattern, red color
2001 full frame design, screw pattern change, red color
2008, H2 Chinese models
Bill
Welcome Sid, excellent idea!
.............Lou
Excellent choice, Alan!
Sid,
Passion is the mortar that holds bricks together -- thus buildings are constructed.
Great idea.
Plus, it was either make Sid a Moderator -- or the way he was going -- he was going to start his own website anyway!
Best,
Fred
Sid. Sid? Where did Sid go? 🤔🤔🤔🤔🤔
😱😱😱😱😱 Alan, did you scare Sid off by making him a Moderator? 😱😱😱😱😱
🎣🎣🎣🎣🎣. I bet he's fishing. 🎣🎣🎣🎣🎣
😂😂😂😂😂Kinda reminds me of Fred. Make him a moderate and he takes off for a few right after that. 😂😂😂😂😂
Thanks for the welcome, guys. I'm going to need a lot of help from a lot of you; I do not have a command of the information about to be revealed on this board (but my desire to have that command is what gave me the idea for this board). Before we get to business it would be good to set up some kind of structure so we get off to a good start. A lot of this information is presented chronologically in Mike Caccioppo's books; if you haven't already received your copy both are available from Whitefish Press, and I believe also directly available from Mike, who is a member here. Since a lot of the information is already available in one form, I'd like to propose that we take a different approach and organize by reel. Maybe the subject line of each post should be the reel and model number (for easy reference at a later date). Then, for instance, if I buy a Sea Ford 250-yard reel I should be able to browse all the posts under Sea Ford 250-yard and read what others have said about that model and how it changed over the years.
In the end there will be multiple posts with the same or similar titles for the same reel; that can't be helped. But it's still a decent way to organize this information in a useful way (I think).
So I'm interested in hearing others' ideas about what I've written above - do you think it will work? Is there a better way?
I'm honored and humbled to be asked to do this. Even though I volunteered.... :) If anyone with better understanding of this information wishes to be moderator I'm happy to give it up. I want the information that is about to be presented here; I don't need to be the one moderating it.
So, please let me know what you think about all of this. And away we go!.... for now the title subject should be the reel and model # in question unless we decide on something else.
Sid
I'm here, Bryan :) We were typing at the same time. No fishing this morning; I've been under the weather the past few days.... a GI bug... had to work two days with abdominal cramps and what often comes along with it. I slept in this morning. I think I'm on the mend.
Sid
Quote from: Bryan Young on April 03, 2016, 04:25:00 PM
Sid. Sid? Where did Sid go? 🤔🤔🤔🤔🤔
😱😱😱😱😱 Alan, did you scare Sid off by making him a Moderator? 😱😱😱😱😱
🎣🎣🎣🎣🎣. I bet he's fishing. 🎣🎣🎣🎣🎣
😂😂😂😂😂Kinda reminds me of Fred. Make him a moderate and he takes off for a few right after that. 😂😂😂😂😂
Right you are, Bryan --
And I am taking off for another 30 days in about 3 weeks!
Fortunately, there will be wi-fi coverage in most of the places we will be staying at -- so you will not be rid of me that easily.
Besides, Alan asked me to keep an eye on you...because it is more than a full time job for just one guy.
Best,
Fred
Congratulations Sid! ;D
There is no giving up now Pal. Its all on your shoulders! ;)
I think you are the right Man for the Job.
All the best with this little project. This could end up being a full time job.
Mike
Congrats! 8)
Hahaha. Congratulations buddy.
Quote from: bluefish69 on April 03, 2016, 05:02:31 PM
All the best with this little project. This could end up being a full time job.
Mike
Mike, if I had to find all the information myself it would be more than a full time job. I've got a lot of help (I hope). Moderating should be a piece of cake.
Sid
Congratulations Sid, While I am not into collecting and restoring older Penn reels, I respect those who do as they are one of a kind. I do wish I still had some of them that I owned though the years but you cannot turn the clock back.
I am sure you will do a thorough job with this forum.
Scott
Congratulations on your new forum Sid!
Randy
and...congratulations Sid!
Steve
Congratulations Sid.....it will be a piece of cake with all the support I`m sure you will get.
Basto
Sid, I have congratulated you privately, but I haven't posted it here.
Congratulations!!!.... you'll fit right in, or should I say have... :)
Welcome aboard!
Sal
Thanks, Sal. I'm doing my best.
Sid
Thanks for doing this Sid.
Perhaps all the relevant "Penn" posts on the Antiques/Collectibles forum could be transferred here, just to start things off?
Chad
I thought about that, Chad, but I was thinking the new board might be best organized with one thread for each reel model # so that there won't be 20 posts scattered all over about the same model. First I've got to figure out how I can move things around and consult with the more experienced moderators about how this might best be done. If I am able to copy posts to the new board but also leave them in their original location that might work great - but I don't know if that can be done. Stay tuned. I'm going to start setting stuff up probably tomorrow.
Sid
Greetings Sid, (and other old Penn aficionado's)
Here's a little jewel I picked up recently at a garage sale for a pretty sweet price. ($40)
It's a 146 L Squidder that the gal claimed belonged to her grandfather and was never used.
After I cracked it open, I found the pictured drag stack.
I believe I saw these green drag washers installed in a JM many moons ago, (possibly old Smoooth?) but having CRS at my age, I may be wrong.
I was wondering if anyone could help me i.d. the vintage of this reel, and if it is all original or not.
The only thing that was missing from the box was the tube of Penn lube.
Thanks!
Shoe
(http://i292.photobucket.com/albums/mm6/akadashoe/0c561e2b-a799-45d3-89e6-68ed5e80efff_zps4utqirlr.jpg) (http://s292.photobucket.com/user/akadashoe/media/0c561e2b-a799-45d3-89e6-68ed5e80efff_zps4utqirlr.jpg.html)
(http://i292.photobucket.com/albums/mm6/akadashoe/146%20STACK_zpsw3vylykz.jpg) (http://s292.photobucket.com/user/akadashoe/media/146%20STACK_zpsw3vylykz.jpg.html)
(http://i292.photobucket.com/albums/mm6/akadashoe/91237c40-6893-4bc8-b8c9-956584abd492_zpskqpnzusy.jpg) (http://s292.photobucket.com/user/akadashoe/media/91237c40-6893-4bc8-b8c9-956584abd492_zpskqpnzusy.jpg.html)
That is a steal, Shoe --
You should be ashamed of yourself...and go pay that lady another $35!
It certainly looks unused.
Among many reel mechanics and folks who knew about reels -- the smoothies were an upgrade from the Penn factory drags of that time -- possibly mid 80s to 90s?
So likely, either her Grandfather, or the shop he purchased it from upgraded the drags in anticipation of using the reel.
Now, we have evolved even further -- thanks to Alan and others -- and discovered that CF drags greased with Cal's are basically a lifetime drag system that is buttery smooth through all pressures.
So if anyone needs any new old smoothies -- I probably have a few hundred.
All this reel needs -- (3) new CFs, Cal's Drag Grease, and a complete disassemble, grease with Penn Blue or Yamaha Marine, oil, and use it.
If you are going to shelf it -- just a set of CFs, very light grease and oil.
Nice find...
Best,
Fred
Shoe, I answered your question here http://alantani.com/index.php?topic=17567.0
Sid
Thanks Fred!
Yes, I'm a bad boy...... ;D
Actually, she wanted $50, so I told her if she would throw in the new 29M spool, we had a deal! :D
I have ct's greased with Cal's in all my other Penn reels, so this one will remain stock until someone offers me the farm. haha
Shoe
(http://i292.photobucket.com/albums/mm6/akadashoe/new%20146%20metal%20spool_zpsrar9pp2v.jpg) (http://s292.photobucket.com/user/akadashoe/media/new%20146%20metal%20spool_zpsrar9pp2v.jpg.html)
Interesting concept Sid. I will be watching to see how this grows and joining in.
Thanks, Mike. This is a better, more interesting place with you here.
Sid
First let us look at the criteria.
To be able to take a random Penn reel from any time period and basically determine its origins.
So maybe, the first consideration would be what was made in what year? Once the year category is established, then a separate thread for each model of that year with the particular considerations of that model for that year.
The end result would be a flow of years, each year category would include threads containing the specifics about the each model made in that year. This is only a suggestion. Since I cannot commit to moderate any of this because of my own commitments, I only suggest. :-\
Quote from: Penn Chronology on April 08, 2016, 05:29:23 PM
So maybe, the first consideration would be what was made in what year? Once the year category is established, then a separate thread for each model of that year with the particular considerations of that model for that year.
So Mike, if I understand your idea, under each reel heading there would be a series of year headings.... I don't thing the software we're using will support that very easily... and is not much of that information already in your book(s)? Maybe I'm misunderstanding; but it's my hope that in a few years there will be enough information under each reel heading for someone to take the data and do with it what I'm thinking you're suggesting.
Sid
Don't listen to me, I have been thinking out loud. That is a dangerous habit of mine. I see the list you have started. That is fine and when info starts rolling in it should become a great resource.
Are the Special H Senators going to be included on this board? Or, are they not vintage enough?
Bill
Quote from: Long Enuff on April 09, 2016, 06:36:55 PM
Are the Special H Senators going to be included on this board? Or, are they not vintage enough?
Bill
Now that someone has asked, I can include them if you wish. I'm not sure there's one correct definition of "Vintage". Maybe we ought to ask Randy? I wasn't going to include them, but that was just my preference and I'm not doing this just for me. Give me a little time to work them into the boards; this setup is taking a little more than the hour or two I had originally thought...
Sid
Just want to let everyone know I am aware that my photos are messed up. I've been reorganizing and changed some photo paths. If you could help by letting me know in which threads photos are missing I can go back and fix things. I'm just afraid I won't find all of them and I could really use a little help. I almost broke the 12-year old rule when I discovered what had happened. Actually, in my head, I did.
Sid
Sid, you're doing a stand up job on organizing all this vintage info. So interesting...I get lost in it and hours pass. And Mike is a walking Penn encyclopedia, then toss in Sal's knowledge, and Fred, and John. I'm learning so much, thanks a million fellas! 8)
Not sure if it applies to reels but vintage is anything over 25 years old up to 50years old then it's considered antique.
Like many of us!
Hi,
Has anyone heard from Sid recently, or is there something I don't know?
62 guests and members viewing this board - Sid (and Mike) what have you started!!
Martin
QuoteHas anyone heard from Sid recently, or is there something I don't know?
62 guests and members viewing this board - Sid (and Mike) what have you started!!
I am here. Have suffered some backward motion but I am not dead yet. Still kicking. Try to respond to things as my time allows. Don't count me out.
I do not answer for Sid. I assume he is around here somewhere.
I will be releasing a new book about Ocean City reels. That is where Otto Henze learned his trade, so without OC, there would be no Penn. I felt a strong urge to do a OC history book and wound up doing two. The second one will be Photos and all the OC catalogs (the second book will be released at a later date with a two volume hardcover Limited Edition) if all goes well with the first release. A project that I have been into for a number of years. Will do a separate post when the book is available. I believe first volume has gone to press.
Quote from: Deepennz on October 22, 2019, 11:10:35 PM
Has anyone heard from Sid recently, or is there something I don't know?
This was discussed about six months ago and Alan had heard from him. He is just doing other things.
-steve
Sid hasn't officially posted anything since February.
I wish him only the best and hope he makes a comeback. ;)
Quote from: Shark Hunter on October 24, 2019, 07:38:38 AM
Sid hasn't officially posted anything since February.
I wish him only the best and hope he makes a comeback. ;)
Ditto,
Miss his enthusiasm and input......
Hope all's well Sid......
Col