I've just started fiddling with an old 113H. The overall condition is fine but the slotted screws are pretty messed up. You can still screw them in and out but I guess it's just a question of time before the slots are too worn. That got me thinking if you couldn't use a hex socket screw instead? Maybe even in SS. Good or bad idea? The screws are going into a Tiburon frame.
Anyone know what kind of threads are used for the 113H side plate screws? As we use metric threads here in Sweden I have to do some online shopping probably.
/Karl
Sifvert Skruv, Lindhagensgatan 53 i Stockholm.
Sorry, i used to go there every week, but very seldom nowadays.
Incidentally, cylindrical head screws won't meet the försänkning in the sideplate rings very nicely; it just looks... funny. Countersunk hex screws often have a larger head than their slotted counterparts, so that won't fit very well either. I suppose if you had a lathe you could change that, but...
.
Quote from: Mandelstam on April 12, 2013, 02:48:49 PM
Anyone know what kind of threads are used for the 113H side plate screws? As we use metric threads here in Sweden I have to do some online shopping probably.
/Karl
5-40 UNC.
Anyone know a source other than Penn for these csk head machine screws in stainless steel?
Quote from: Robert Janssen on April 12, 2013, 03:11:46 PM
Sifvert Skruv, Lindhagensgatan 53 i Stockholm.
Sorry, i used to go there every week, but very seldom nowadays.
Incidentally, cylindrical head screws won't meet the försänkning in the sideplate rings very nicely; it just looks... funny. Countersunk hex screws often have a larger head than their slotted counterparts, so that won't fit very well either. I suppose if you had a lathe you could change that, but...
.
I know about Sifvert! Haven't been there as I live in Malmö. Must be an awesome place! :D
Yes, I was thinking about countersunk socket screws. Too bad the head is too big.
Quote from: Irish Jigger on April 12, 2013, 03:43:52 PM
Quote from: Mandelstam on April 12, 2013, 02:48:49 PM
Anyone know what kind of threads are used for the 113H side plate screws? As we use metric threads here in Sweden I have to do some online shopping probably.
/Karl
5-40 UNC.
Anyone know a source other than Penn for these csk head machine screws in stainless steel?
Thanks Tom! I'll shop around and see what I can find. If anyone know of a source pls let me know! I really hate slotted screws and would love to be able to use hex screws instead.
Hmm... Round head would look nice.
(http://www.bikeline.se/bilder/artiklar/14-0232.jpg)
Quote from: Robert Janssen on April 16, 2013, 12:07:04 PM
Hmm... Round head would look nice.
(http://www.bikeline.se/bilder/artiklar/14-0232.jpg)
Yea definitely!
I'm thinking of trying to get some cylindrical screws and then with a ghetto lathe (bolted down screwdriver and a file) try and create the countersinking. I've found some stainless screws that I'm about to order.
Quote from: Robert Janssen on April 16, 2013, 12:07:04 PM
Hmm... Round head would look nice.
(http://www.bikeline.se/bilder/artiklar/14-0232.jpg)
Yes they would, but only on the left side plate. You wouldn't be able to move the eccentric lever, unless you find a way to keep them flush :-\
Quote from: Alto Mare on April 16, 2013, 04:15:28 PM
Yes they would, but only on the left side plate. You wouldn't be able to move the eccentric lever, unless you find a way to keep them flush :-\
See, that's why you make a post here before you go and do something stupid! Thank's for the heads up Sal, hadn't thought of that. But I'd still would like to try it out, at least for the other screws. Because the problem with the lever only applies to one screw right? I guess maybe you could keep that one original...
I think I at least have to try it out for myself, if nothing else just to get it out of my head.
Quote from: Mandelstam on April 12, 2013, 04:03:46 PM
Quote from: Irish Jigger on April 12, 2013, 03:43:52 PM
Quote from: Mandelstam on April 12, 2013, 02:48:49 PM
Anyone know what kind of threads are used for the 113H side plate screws? As we use metric threads here in Sweden I have to do some online shopping probably.
/Karl
5-40 UNC.
Anyone know a source other than Penn for these csk head machine screws in stainless steel?
Thanks Tom! I'll shop around and see what I can find. If anyone know of a source pls let me know! I really hate slotted screws and would love to be able to use hex screws instead.
Cannot help with the hex drive screws, but I use phillips drive screws from here:
http://www.mcmaster.com/#machine-screw-fasteners/=mmtkwj (http://www.mcmaster.com/#machine-screw-fasteners/=mmtkwj)
They work well and look nice.
Quote from: VW on May 06, 2013, 04:45:41 PM
Cannot help with the hex drive screws, but I use phillips drive screws from here:
http://www.mcmaster.com/#machine-screw-fasteners/=mmtkwj (http://www.mcmaster.com/#machine-screw-fasteners/=mmtkwj)
They work well and look nice.
Thanx for the tip! Do the 82 degree countersink fit the reel's countersink?
/Karl
This has been the question for some time now. All the SS screws (82* or other) I've found and or tried just dont seem to fit the rings well. If someone could come up with this screw which fit well even a Philips head would be an improvement.
Bob
Quote from: BMITCH on May 06, 2013, 11:01:01 PM
This has been the question for some time now. All the SS screws (82* or other) I've found and or tried just dont seem to fit the rings well. If someone could come up with this screw which fit well even a Philips head would be an improvement.
Bob
I've measured the countersink angle on my side screws (scanned in 600dpi, drawn and measured in AutoCad) and they are 82 degrees spot on. The head is 5.25mm (0.20") wide and 3mm (0.12") high.
I'll keep searching, will give a shout if I find anything that fits.
The fit is not perfect, but I do not think it is really noticeable either. Do not have a close up pic but the 112H and 113H reels shown here have the screws in place.
http://alantani.com/index.php?topic=5431.0 (http://alantani.com/index.php?topic=5431.0)
Quote from: VW on May 07, 2013, 07:34:40 AM
The fit is not perfect, but I do not think it is really noticeable either. Do not have a close up pic but the 112H and 113H reels shown here have the screws in place.
http://alantani.com/index.php?topic=5431.0 (http://alantani.com/index.php?topic=5431.0)
Thanks for the pics!
I have a contact (industrial designer with full metal workshop) that I'll talk to and see if we can't think of a way to customize a cylindrical head hex screw. In my head I think that it could work and look good as well.
VW, I saw your beautiful reels on the other thread. I too am putting flat head Philips screws in now. I'm just not real comfortable with them extending out a bit. It's not horrible,but. I guess for now there is a trade off for this.
Karl, I would love to see what you come up with. Thanks
Bob
I think I have found a way to overcome the objection many have expressed to using the flathead screws I use and have recommended. And it is easy to do.
The problem is the head OD is larger then the Penn oval head screws. This leaves the rim of the head overhanging the countersink in the trim ring. I decided to try to reduce the OD by creating a bevel.
I used an old Penn frame post to hold the screw and chucked that in a drill press. If the screw had a lot of wobble/runout, was usually able to get it running true enough by loosening and tightening the screw a few times. Then held a file at 45 degree angle against the rim while turning the post/screw at a fairly slow speed. Started with a coarse file, then switched to a finer one to remove the burr at the new rim and lightly touch the bevel a couple of times. You need to move/stroke the file when cutting, otherwise the couple of teeth actually touching and cutting will clog up with chips and stop cutting. The technique does not require much pressure, just light contact and keep the file moving.
(https://imageshack.com/a/img594/6669/smgr.jpg) (http://imageshack.com/i/gismgrj/)
I purposefully made a smaller bevel on the middle screw. One could probably make a more rounded profile, more like an oval head. I think it would be more difficult to make them all about the same. I like the appearance of the bevel and will continue to use it.
Alto Mare has a pic somewhere on the forum showing these screws on a reel with Accurate sideplates. The screws do stick out a lot and I understand why one would find it unacceptable. I cannot say this method would solve that problem, but it might.
VW, excellent. I already have the SS screws now you've shown what I thought could be done. I'm doing all my penn's like that. Thanks for the pictures. Great work! ;)
Bob
wow! that actually looks very, very nice!!!!!! :o :o :o
Very nice!! Thanks for showing!
Thanks Alan. It's very easy and quick to do.
I just use the standard Penn csk screws,(now in s/steel) not cheap,no trouble and they always look good.
I have tried everywhere to obtain a cheaper alternative but without success.
another photo of the month!
Quote from: VW on June 25, 2013, 05:39:17 PM
(https://imageshack.com/a/img594/6669/smgr.jpg) (http://imageshack.com/i/gismgrj/)
Penn does have Torx screws on their new Int. reels, you can order them from Scott's
Quote from: turboal on August 06, 2013, 11:35:31 PM
Penn does have Torx screws on their new Int. reels, you can order them from Scott's
That's interesting. Do they only fit Internationals?
Bump.
What's the latest on screws? Anyone find a good replacement?
Would these screws fit?
http://www.ebay.com/itm/25-PIECES-5-40-X-1-4-THRU-1-STAINLESS-FLAT-SOCKET-HEAD-CAP-SCREW-BOLT-/301344622726?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&var=&hash=item46298a0886
I get all my 5-40 SS Screws from McMaster & Carr. They have all sizes lengths. All heads except Oval that a lot of reels have. I back Grind them like one of the pictures, it takes the edge off.
Mike