These old large Mitchell Salt Water 302 spinners are notorious for salt damage, fused screws, pitted parts, and other major issues.
They are typically used very successfully for surf and pier fishing -- consequently they receive a lot of dunking or salt spray applications. And if not cleaned and lubed thoroughly and regularly -- will become inoperable.
Client emails and sends a 302 to me for servicing, because the bail would not release properly. Would like it serviced while I have it on the bench. No big deal so far.
After receiving it, I realize that it needs almost every part to be replaced due to corrosion and salt burn.
The guy is a really nice and fair fellow -- so I offered to restore to new with mostly new parts -- for just a few more bucks.
Ended up replacing every part except for the pinion key #81404 on the pink paper.
It was easier that way -- and the reel would be something both the client and myself could be proud of.
Actually, kind of funny -- and I will post a pic when it is done later today.
Aside from all of the technical stuff -- There are only (2) ways to service a reel properly -- the right way and the wrong way. The Alan Tani way is the first one...
Great old workhorses.
Best,
Fred
Eeek! :o For those of us familiar with these grand old reels, this is THE Part from Hell, LOL ;) :D
(http://alantani.com/index.php?action=dlattach;topic=19726.0;attach=26751;image)
~A~
I'm opening up the one from Lee soon. Any play by play you can give would be great.
Ron
No play by play, Ron --
This one is done -- ready to mail back.
Don't lose the drive key in the grease when removing -- like Aiala said, those are easy to lose -- they are so small.
On the two set screws that hold the pinion bearing in place -- if they will not come out easy -- don't force them, soak for awhile -- then using a hard tipped tiny screwdriver with a good handle grip -- ease them out. If this happens badly -- you will be looking to drill and retap the frame housing. Nothing ends up too good here, if not careful.
Grease pretty heavily any place that you had trouble disassembling because of salt fusing -- such as the bearing cup, screw threads, etc.
Drag stack is critical regarding the order -- it is overly complicated -- and all parts must be clean and smooth.
Show us a pic or two when you can.
Do not worry about messing up, if the reel is encrusted badly -- I have plenty of parts I can send over to you.
Best,
Fred
Nice thing about 302/402's--Penn 155 soft washers are a perfect fit...:)
(http://i25.photobucket.com/albums/c100/unchained_colors/Mobile%20Uploads/20160501_170949.jpg) (http://s25.photobucket.com/user/unchained_colors/media/Mobile%20Uploads/20160501_170949.jpg.html)
I'll be in the Mitchell Museum Sunday for my 302.
Mike
So,
I thought the 302 only used 3 washers. There is enough room to put in a 5 stack?
Ron
Quote from: noyb72 on November 12, 2016, 12:02:55 AM
So,
I thought the 302 only used 3 washers. There is enough room to put in a 5 stack?
Ron
Yes--if you leave out the two clicker and ratchet washers, while adding a few keyed and eared.
Of course, the drag will then be silent but much smoother--especially in the upper range.
You could always do a 3-stack with 155 CF washers and retain the clicker.
In the late 80s, right before we switched to graphite reels, the old man bought a brand new Mitchell 300 that didn't click when you reeled. I thought the sorcerer that made that happen must have been very powerful. Have always wanted one, now I'll make my own.
Ron
I have 4 302's I am going to fix up, Fred has already helped me out with some parts, my question is this. Is the pinion bearing the same as the one on the 406?? If so how do i stop from losing half the bearings as I have done at least once? Last time i did one on a 406 it took me an hour to get them all in, roughly 15 or 17 of them if I remember correctly.And twice while trying to reinsert the pinion I dumped them again.Of course I never found those. Frustrating to say the least. For that one I used oil in the grooved washer I will call it for lack of knowing the correct name.It seemed to help I think, I just didn't want to use grease in the bearing as I wont be dunking it and I fear the grease will attract sand and salt as well as making it a little less smoothe.. Am I wrong guys? Should i just leave it in, which wasn't easy if I wasn't careful. Seemed like I needed 3 hands Any thoughts or tips would be greatly appreciated.
Thank you
John
Quote from: Aiala on November 11, 2016, 06:53:49 PM
Eeek! :o For those of us familiar with these grand old reels, this is THE Part from Hell, LOL ;) :D
(http://alantani.com/index.php?action=dlattach;topic=19726.0;attach=26751;image)
~A~
Yup. My late '60's 306 got that part. Took me awhile to figure out what it was or did. The 302 looks like a much better reel, esp. the drag system.
Gfish
These reels are what I cut my teeth on being a pier fisherman starting very young. Like Fred stated there is only one right way to assemble these reels.
Some guys will pack the handle side full of grease to lessen the noise from the anti reverse dog. All you have to do is lessen the tension on the spring. A much better way. When they leave my shop you can barely hear them.
The 5 Penn 6-155 drag washers will fit the spool perfect without the clicking washers as stated above. The drag will be super smooth.
My father would get me a new Mitchell each Christmas.
So I am working on a 302, probably going to sell it since I have a few of them, but my favorite one I will keep .Anyway my question is what do I use to get the paint out of the nooks and crannies. I've been using my dremmel but it is eating my sanding kit and it doesn't get all the way in. If I force it , I leave some marks that are a #### to get out. On the rotor I am leaving some paint on because I like the way it looks. Maybe I should leave as is now or does it look crappy. Check out the bent spindle!
John --
Either leave the paint in the nooks and crannies -- or do what I do -- take all of your painted parts down to a local powder coater or radiator shop.
Have them dip them in the cleaning tank in their spare time -- mine does it while I wait. Maybe $5 a reel cash on the side to the guy. Take them back home and polish them up. For me, Dremel brushes have their place -- but for this operation -- they are too expensive, damaging, tedious, and not as effective.
Will the axle/spindle I sent you work -- or do you need another?
Best,
Fred
Here is a post I made on another board a while back about paint removal using a self cleaning oven that may be of interest:
QuoteI just wanted to throw this out there because it is something at least worth discussing in my opinion. There are several potential problems with this method but I used it on the reel pictured with outstanding results so I would say it is something worth looking into.
I will start out by saying this wasn't an incredibly expensive or valuable reel that I tried this method on. If it messed it up I wasn't going to lose any sleep over it. The result looks a lot like what you would get using an extremely gentle blast media, so I was pretty impressed.
To strip the paint on this reel pretty much effortlessly, I used the self cleaning function on my oven.
Now there are some potential problems with this and I am not encouraging others to try it. I am simply looking to open up the topic for discussion.
Potential problems:
1) not all ovens are the same, some could possibly get hotter than mine...maybe even hot enough to melt aluminum
2) toxic fumes. Not sure about that one. I would assume this paint was some sort of oil based enmel and the amount on the reel is probably pretty small. Again I just don't know how much of a concern that it should be. To be safe, it would probably be best to use an old oven in a well ventilated shop and possibly wearing a respirator. I don't know if all of that is necessary or not. I did mine in the house just turning on the vent hood.
3) potential to warp the metal being heated. In an effort to prevent this, I heated up the oven with the parts in it starting from the lowest setting and gradually increasing to its highest baking setting over the course of 15-20 minutes. I then turned off the bake function and set the oven to self cleaning. I only left my parts in the oven for 40 minutes before cancelling the self cleaning function. After that time, I allowed the parts to cool on their own in the closed oven for a few hours, again to try and prevent thermal shock/warping.
4) also burns off lubricants. This is a good thing when repainting It is a bad thing for oilite type bushings. I removed the bushing from the reel to prevent damaging it.
5) dissimilar metals being heated together. There were 2 steel parts I left in. One was a friction fit pressed in steel pin in the crank handle and the other was a steel pin that the anti-reverse dog pivots on. I actually lightly oiled these pins in hopes that the oil would burn and make a semi protective coating kind of like seasoning a cast iron skillet. That appears to have happened. I don't know how much of a potential problem it is to heat dissimilar metals together.
When I did this, I wasn't really sure how hot my oven gets so I used foil under the parts and watched carefully for any signs of melting of the foil. It didn't harm the foil in the 40 minutes I heated the parts using the self cleaning function in my oven.
The reason I did this process is because I tried removing the paint with a nasty chemical striper with very little luck. I also tried a heat gun and it wasn't working well and I worried about warping when heating small areas. I decided a gradual heat up and cool down evenly in the oven might be a better option. I had used the self cleaning feature to clean up old nasty cast iron skillets in the past with great success so I thought it may work well for paint removal as well. It did a great job for me in this case.
One note to add, this process didn't seem to harm any anodizing. I didn't think it would and I don't believe it did. I checked continuity of the anodized parts and there is none just as it should be.
Does anyone else have any thoughts, questions or concerns about doing this?
I would love to hear any feedback, positive or negative. This may be a good option or a bad option of others but I think it is worth examination.
All nooks and crannies paint free ;D
With the thin metal side plate of a Mitchell, warping could be an issue. I don't know because I haven't tried it. Just wanted to throw that out there in case anyone else wanted to experiment with this method at some point. I wouldn't try it on anything valuable until you had thoroughly tested out the method for yourself and feel confident in it.
You are right, Kevin --
Try it yourself on easy to replace parts.
But for me, I don't like or want heat and dangerous chemicals around the shop -- some I have to use, but carefully.
So generally a $20 bill taped to a 12 pack, and a trip into town -- takes care of 4 reels for me.
Best,
Fred
It will discolor chrome badly too so no chrome parts should be heated. Fred is right, if you have a professional nearby who can do it for you for a fair price, that is the way to go. I was just throwing the oven thing out there as a possibility that actually worked quite well for me in case anyone else wanted to try it out and report back.
Quote from: The Fishing Hobby on May 11, 2017, 07:12:51 PM
It will discolor chrome badly too so no chrome parts should be heated. Fred is right, if you have a professional nearby who can do it for you for a fair price, that is the way to go. I was just throwing the oven thing out there as a possibility that actually worked quite well for me in case anyone else wanted to try it out and report back.
I think Alan Tani has some experience using kitchen appliances to 'clean' reels, though this may have been the dishwater.
His wife provided some 'feedback', if memory serves.
;)
John
Haha, I better do some searching thorough past posts!!!
Ha!..... Glad I'm a collector "purist" and don't have to deal with paint removal or modifying. I prefer them, especially the oldies, just the way they came from the factory, even if they show a lot of wear. Wear on an older reel, IMHO, just opens the door for a few reelly fish...y...stories! ;D
Thanks Fred
I do believe I have a spare, but if I don't I will let you know. I will have to search for a guy in my area. Great idea. If I used the oven I would be afraid of hurting everybody in the house, making them sick.
Thanks guys
John
I have a pile of the shafts also if needed. I started on these in the 60's.
Sorry just noticed I called the axle/shaft a spindle. Thankfully you guys know what I meant!
John
Looks like I'm going to need a couple 302 axles/ shafts....
handle nut snapped off-- can I use the handle or just the shaft off any large frame Mitchell to replace it? would like to use a chrome plated 400 series
Right, Florida --
A lot of the large frame handles and crank parts will interchange.
Sometimes you need to play around with a few different parts to get it right.
Depends on the era the reel was manufactured in -- a few changes over the years.
Best,
Fred