Hello,
I am new to bait casting reels. I just picked up a 6501c3 from the swap meet for $20. The foot was broken off so I took it to savon tackle in santa fe springs ca for repair. Got it back with a new frame and all serviced.
I like the reel but want to customize it and make it a lot better, what are my optins ?
Can I swap the side plates for flat covers like the 6000 trophy ones ?
What can I swap?
What are some budget mods?
What are the best mods?
Should I get a better reel to start with or is sinking $100 into this one pointless ?
Any help would be greatly appriciated,
Thanks and keep up the good work
Well first you should find out what save-on did first then if you plan to fish it, swap the drags for greased carbontex. The difference will be like night and day.
Other than that, I wouldn't change a thing. They are great reels.
all savon did was replace the frame and clean and oil it
AR bearing or anti reverse dog?
C3 should be a dog
I think the newer ones have AR bearings. Mine are so mixed up I can't tell what they originally were.
Oh... All of my C3s have a dog and my C4s have ARBs.
I don't know how to tell the two apart? I know that it is all polished, and has 6plactic (hats)? The white brakes I think think they are called?
Also what are the benefits of having a magnet on the domed side plate side?
And can I convert it to accept flat side plates with a mag?
Like I said if I dump $100 into it what should I change and add?
Does the handle have any backward movement? If so it's a doged reel, if not it's an AR and you can add a dog. Upgrade the drag to Carbontex, a larger handle on it and a ceramic pawl. The ABU guys can help with more.
I wouldn't bother with maging a ABU, they cast well as is.
Here's my AR bearing 5601C4 with an AR dog installed.
(http://i54.photobucket.com/albums/g104/IGFA19Keta/Reels/6501II.jpg)
yeah mine does not reel backwards
Quote from: Rekles on March 11, 2013, 02:59:15 PM
yeah mine does not reel backwards
Hi. As you can see in Keta's image above, He's set it up JB style (jerkbait)....there's a one-way clutch bearing in the handle boss, and a conventional mechanical dog on that post on the brake plate. When you say it does not reel backwards..is there an instant reaction, no slight backwards movement of the handle, or will the handle move backwards about 1/8 turn. Too bad you did not keep the reel foot. The number seen on it would have been a pointer to the drawing for your reel.
As to modifications: you have several questions in the posts. The answer to most of them is yes, if you are familiar with what needs to be done, have the coin to buy all the parts, and the tools to do the work.
I would begin by opening as many 01 drawings from foot number 99 on up to present day. 6501's, 6601's, etc... so you can get a feel for what you want to do, and what will fit where. As Bryan advised, I would switch out the drags, add a ceramic pawl, and get out there to enjoy the product.
Present day Abus use the carbon drags. an upgrade from the graphite/teflon washers. They cost three times as much from Abu. Dawn at smoothdrag may well have them for less, unsure. You can quickly check that out.
And, as you advised, your centrifugal force system is present day 6-puck, with two engaged from the factory.
You quite possibly may already have the carbon washers. Open any tutorial for the 6 sized abu here at Alan's site, and have at it. If plain drag washers:
If you want to stick with factory, open a drawing for a record..any record...the rn61, etc. I suggest the record, because it's easy to locate, which narrows your search thru the drawings to see the number. Make note of the idler gear as well...you can buy one for your reel if you like..there's a ball bearing in it. (The other reason to use the Record drawing.)
If you want more reel candy, open the drawing for the 6 sized Mag-X reels...and see the worm. Dual ball bearings. If you want just the one bb, open the drawing for the 6-sized C4. It has one bb. If you opt for these options, ensure you buy the worm shroud as well, as the plain one you have won't let the bb inside it.
As regards your exploration for flat side plates for dual cast caps, these get spendy real fast... a pair of flatties will run you more than all the other mods put together. If colour is unimportant, you can buy just the right hand plate, and the rest of the items to make the plate work. Unlesss you luck out and the flat plate can be found to match your crank plate. Abu makes lots of colour options.
Quote from: Ken_D on March 11, 2013, 05:32:10 PM
Present day Abus use the carbon drags. an upgrade from the graphite/teflon washers. They cost three times as much from Abu. Dawn at smoothdrag may well have them for less, unsure.
She does.
Quote from: Rekles on March 11, 2013, 06:47:44 AM
Also what are the benefits of having a magnet on the domed side plate side?
And can I convert it to accept flat side plates with a mag?
Like I said if I dump $100 into it what should I change and add?
\
There are no LH mag reels, according the home page of Ambassadeur. You will need to have aftermarket parts fitted. Same answer for the flat plates.
View this youtube clip.... it explains Lenz's Law on eddy currents, and how mag reels operate.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Pu2iov14xHI The magnet/s set up opposing eddy currents, which inhibits rotation.
Steve send a treasure trove of information for hotrodding that I found very interesting.
Quote from: Steve Logan
Bryan,
On Alan's website you and Keta are advising a fellow about upgrades to an Abu 6501 C3.
The newer reels have AR bearing (which he says he has), and the newer reels also have "Carbon Matrix" carbon fiber washers, which from all I have seen and heard do not need upgrading to Carbontex unless damaged. It appears that Abu started using Carbon Matrix washers when they changed the spool to hourglass shape. If Carbon Matrix is what he has, just clean and apply Cal's grease. Even if it uses Carbon Matrix drag washers, there is a fiber washer under the gear that could/should be replaced with a carbontex one (Alan probably knows which one).
Other upgrades are possible. The first should be Alan's standard teardown, cleaning and TSI application to the entire levelwind and the spool bearings.
Next would be upgrading to ball bearings in the levelwind like the C4 (Jerry at hooklesscom has dual bearing levelwinds refered to here http://www.hookless.com/images/6C5LW.jpg), and then ball bearings in the nylon levelwind gear like the Abu Record.
see http://www.learntocatchcatfish.com/abu-garcia-c3-c4-model/
http://www.stripersonline.com/t/658997/abu-garcia-6500cs-rocket-silver-custom-built-6500cs-c5-rocket-high-speed
Next comes supertuning, which he might prefer to pay someone to do. Involves fine grit sandpaper and simichrome polish to several surfaces that spin.
For supertuning, see
http://super-tuning.home.mindspring.com/i1a.html
http://www.thetacklesmith.com/reelsupertuning.htm
http://www.thetacklesmith.com/extremesupertuning.htm
Most of this is probably excessive and not necessary. Abu's cast well out of the box (as Keta mentioned regarding magging). Clean and TSI the entire levelwind and spool bearings, and that should be good enough.
(One of the supertuning articles indicated removing the nylon gear from the spool and drilling a portion of the hole a little bit larger, claiming that it originally contacted the shaft and outer race of the bearing. Interesting.)
I mention all this not to dump it all on the fellow who just wants his abu tweaked a little. I thought that maybe one of you guys with more experience might one day gather this all together into a supertuning tutorial (or try to get one of the above supertuners to do one to post).
Thanks,
Steve
Quote from: Keta on March 11, 2013, 06:28:50 PM
Quote from: Ken_D on March 11, 2013, 05:32:10 PM
Present day Abus use the carbon drags. an upgrade from the graphite/teflon washers. They cost three times as much from Abu. Dawn at smoothdrag may well have them for less, unsure.
She does.
This I knew, but I was wondering if Dawn's are less than the factory. Regret the confusion. Factory ones are about 2.75 each, compared to about 85 cents for the older ones. Are Dawn's less than. Up here, the factory ones are slightly less, because of all the adds: postage, exchange, price, etc.
I haven't priced them from ABU, Dawn is too easy to deal with.
Wow thanks a bunch for all the info, are the 6501 and 6500 frames the same or completely different? Also I bought it with no foot so I will tear it apart and investigate.
So just to clarify most 6500, 6000, and 6600 are pretty much the same with only minor or no differences?
can anyone tell me the benefits or pitfalls for the 6 puck break as opposed to the 2 puck break ?
Quote from: Rekles on March 11, 2013, 08:16:55 PM
Wow thanks a bunch for all the info, are the 6501 and 6500 frames the same or completely different? Also I bought it with no foot so I will tear it apart and investigate.
So just to clarify most 6500, 6000, and 6600 are pretty much the same with only minor or no differences?
The frames are different. The posts are reversed between the right and the left. If I had a lefty, I could show you...sorry.
Quote from: Rekles on March 11, 2013, 10:18:31 PM
can anyone tell me the benefits or pitfalls for the 6 puck break as opposed to the 2 puck break ?
with 6, you get more braking than 2...6 would be better because you can have either 6, 4, or 2. I would not use them unbalance. They should always have an opposite one, and therefore, run in pairs. Myself, I have taken all of them off on all of my abus. simple reels. Never realy had much backlash issues. But then again, I'm not tournament casting.
ok so after looking at some schematics i think i am able to add the auto 2 speed gearing too?
I fish 90% salt water, would this be worth it?
I'm really sorry but i cant help but pic your brains, this forum is full of answers and this reel is fully customizable. I think i might pick up another one and have a father son project reel soon.
Quote from: Rekles on March 12, 2013, 01:25:44 AM
ok so after looking at some schematics i think i am able to add the auto 2 speed gearing too?
I fish 90% salt water, would this be worth it?
I'm really sorry but i cant help but pic your brains, this forum is full of answers and this reel is fully customizable. I think i might pick up another one and have a father son project reel soon.
Forget that....the 2 speed is a totally different beast. Obselete, parts getting scarce, and unless (to use the hackneyed expression) I am sadly mistaken, they never MADE a LH 2 speed !!
You really should be opening schematics, to get a feel for what fits what and what interchanges. The best collection of drawings I'm aware of (for this type of search) is at Nutter Reel. They are arranged by year, and in a long list, so you do not have to keep opening pages and clicking drawings.
http://tinyurl.com/4juru6w
Quote from: Rekles on March 11, 2013, 08:16:55 PM
Wow thanks a bunch for all the info, are the 6501 and 6500 frames the same or completely different? Also I bought it with no foot so I will tear it apart and investigate.
So just to clarify most 6500, 6000, and 6600 are pretty much the same with only minor or no differences?
Yup.. Yes the frames have to be different, because the plates bolt on opposite sides of same, from the right hand type... 8) Lh frames are the same, within the family sizes, 4-5-6-7, as are the right hand frames 4-5-6-7 sizes. Meaning any 6 lh frame will fit any set of lh. sideplates..in the family. With modifications, Cutting a slot for the cast clutch, you can use 66 plates on a 65 frame, and vice versa. Oops... I missed Bryan's post above....
I am guilty of lots of posters out there.. repetition of the same info !! Ever see the Fedex commercial??
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zNCrMEOqHpc
This set is organized nicely as well:
http://schematics.planetseafishing.com/abu/multiplier/abu-ambassadeur.html
Quote from: Keta on March 11, 2013, 01:40:02 PM
Does the handle have any backward movement? If so it's a doged reel, if not it's an AR and you can add a dog. Upgrade the drag to Carbontex, a larger handle on it and a ceramic pawl. The ABU guys can help with more.
I wouldn't bother with maging a ABU, they cast well as is.
Here's my AR bearing 5601C4 with an AR dog installed.
(http://i54.photobucket.com/albums/g104/IGFA19Keta/Reels/6501II.jpg)
I have two abus, 6500c3 and 5000c
I love them both and both has power handles and carbontex drags and I was wondering how to improve the AR cuz mines have a IAR not dog, after checking this post from Lee I will order two dogs
thanks buddies
Quote from: Keta on March 11, 2013, 01:40:02 PM
Does the handle have any backward movement? If so it's a doged reel, if not it's an AR and you can add a dog. Upgrade the drag to Carbontex, a larger handle on it and a ceramic pawl. The ABU guys can help with more.
I wouldn't bother with maging a ABU, they cast well as is.
Here's my AR bearing 5601C4 with an AR dog installed.
(http://i54.photobucket.com/albums/g104/IGFA19Keta/Reels/6501II.jpg)
this is what I do to mine!
Quote from: steelfish on January 20, 2016, 01:59:44 AM
Quote from: Keta on March 11, 2013, 01:40:02 PM
Does the handle have any backward movement? If so it's a doged reel, if not it's an AR and you can add a dog. Upgrade the drag to Carbontex, a larger handle on it and a ceramic pawl. The ABU guys can help with more.
I wouldn't bother with maging a ABU, they cast well as is.
Here's my AR bearing 5601C4 with an AR dog installed.
(http://i54.photobucket.com/albums/g104/IGFA19Keta/Reels/6501II.jpg)
I have two abus, 6500c3 and 5000c
I love them both and both has power handles and carbontex drags and I was wondering how to improve the AR cuz mines have a IAR not dog, after checking this post from Lee I will order two dogs
thanks buddies
kind of old thread, but my 6500c3 doest have the post to add the AR Dog (mine comes with IAR), do you guys installed the post too or your reel already came with the post and IAR bearing?
I don't think anyone mentioned it, but I added the power handle to mine.