I love tinkering with and rebuilding Ambassadeur's. I've also found them to be my preferred light/medium surf casting reel, especially in the CT configuration. I've converted some vintage Ambassadeur CL's to CT's in the past using parts from a UK based tackle shop, but parts plus shipping to my home in Florida can be a bit pricey. In most cases, after considering the price of a used 5500/6500, a CT conversion bar and studs, possibly a mag, and the replacement of any worn parts, and shipping, I'd probably be better off with a new Akios S-Line. However, the process of restoring and modifying the reel is something I really enjoy.
I'm seeking additional details on DIY CT conversions, all the way down to making my own CT kit (bar and studs). I think this will provide me with two benefits, first by saving on the cost of premade CT kits, and second by adding another layer of involvement to my process. I think I possess the tools and shop skills to get this done, but before I dive in, I wanted to reach out to the community with some questions and for guidance.
Has anyone on the forum successfully DIY'd a CT kit? Any recommendations? Can the existing top crossbar be cut and cleaned up to be used as studs? Are there any US based sources for CT kits? Any pointers are greatly appreciated.
Thanks in advance,
Michael
Greetings, sir, from Minnesota,. See you've been registered awhile to the site & glad to hear from you. Can't help you much with your inquiry, but I'm thinking there are other folks on this site who can. Looks like an interesting niche.
Frank
Well this is exciting, we seem to have at least 3 things in common.
1. I'm also in FL
2. I've been toying with the idea of doing my first CT conversion.
3. I've also been slowed down by the price tag.
Yes, we can begin the summary of any of my attempts with "Florida man with no experience attempts _____"
And with that established, I find myself wondering what is the difference between a conversion kit, and some well chosen threaded barrels, perhaps cut to length, and a few well chosen washers?
(Hack the top bar, replace level wind assembly with an appropriate threaded barrel, screwed in from both ends)
Good to have you on the forum! I did my Abu 5000 without ordering anything. I hacked the top bar and made studs from those and glued them with epoxy. They look good but they do show brass since they are chromed brass, but no big deal. For the CT bar, I just removed the pawl and glued the worm gear to the housing and then glued the whole thing to the frame. Yea, it's permanent but its very stout.
I bought a couple CT conversion kits from a guy here in the US a few years ago. Unfortunately I don't remember the name. The price was more than reasonable. Hopefully someone will chime in with a name
It was nothing fancy but we'll made SS bar and studs
The only place I know of that carries CT bars is Blak Dog Tackle in England. The prices aren't too bad but shipping may be a different story. Jerry Foran used to sell them here stateside but he closed up shop from my understanding. His website hookless.com is still up but I'm not sure if he's still doing business.
Jerry foran, that's the one, bummer he closed
Kurt, that looks great! I imagine Tom could turn out CT bars in his sleep- I propose we ask him: Cortez Conversions.
To OP: Watching this closely; Kert and I have discussed this a lot, and BeachBob will aslo have some input when he sees this.
John
Shipping from Blakdog is not too bad, or it wasn't last time I ordered from them, they are very fair, and very nice people. They sell some quality upgrades and finding any parts over here for long casting in the U.S is difficult at best.
Quote from: thorhammer on November 29, 2022, 02:48:56 PMKurt, that looks great! I imagine Tom could turn out CT bars in his sleep- I propose we ask him: Cortez Conversions.
To OP: Watching this closely; Kert and I have discussed this a lot, and BeachBob will aslo have some input when he sees this.
John
Thank you, John. That was my first stab at it and that reel has caught some really big fish out of the surf!
Quote from: Breadfan on November 28, 2022, 05:08:51 PMGood to have you on the forum! I did my Abu 5000 without ordering anything. I hacked the top bar and made studs from those and glued them with epoxy. They look good but they do show brass since they are chromed brass, but no big deal. For the CT bar, I just removed the pawl and glued the worm gear to the housing and then glued the whole thing to the frame. Yea, it's permanent but its very stout.
This is a great idea for a permanent conversion that requires no extra parts!
Quote from: tincanary on November 29, 2022, 01:38:58 AMThe only place I know of that carries CT bars is Blak Dog Tackle in England. The prices aren't too bad but shipping may be a different story. Jerry Foran used to sell them here stateside but he closed up shop from my understanding. His website hookless.com is still up but I'm not sure if he's still doing business.
Yep, I emailed Jerry. He replied saying he is out of business and unsure of where to source any CT conversions in the States.
I've ordered from Blak Dog in the past. They are an awesome shop with fair prices. It's about $30 to get a single CT conversion bar and studs shipped, which isn't terrible at all; however, I'm planning on converting at least a few reels and I'm really set on DIYing these kits now. The bar itself seems fairly straight forward- stainless bar stock cut to spec and tapped on either end to accept machine screws. The studs, on the other hand, appear to be a little more difficult. Its gonna be tough, if not impossible to locate studs with the 'collar' near the head of the stud that seats in the actual real frame. A 'collar' could probably be added to male and female studs though...
What stops something like this:
https://a.co/d/cQa83fB
From being the replacement for the bar if cut to size? I imagine a stainless version would be ideal.
Quote from: JasonGotaProblem on November 28, 2022, 04:53:19 PMWell this is exciting, we seem to have at least 3 things in common.
1. I'm also in FL
2. I've been toying with the idea of doing my first CT conversion.
3. I've also been slowed down by the price tag.
Yes, we can begin the summary of any of my attempts with "Florida man with no experience attempts _____"
And with that established, I find myself wondering what is the difference between a conversion kit, and some well chosen threaded barrels, perhaps cut to length, and a few well chosen washers?
(Hack the top bar, replace level wind assembly with an appropriate threaded barrel, screwed in from both ends)
Glad to see another FL based casting reel user. The surf anglers in my neck of the woods (Treasure Coast) almost exclusively use spinners.
I've done a few CT conversions, and I can definitely say its worth the price for the kit from the UK. I'm looking at converting several more reels though, and for the price of multiple kits, I think I'd be better off sourcing hardware like you described and possibly having a hand at some minor reel engineering.
There is a youtube channel called "Team Hard Life". In his video list, he visits a tackle shop in Texas that specializes in surf and distance casting tackle. I can't remember it's name. An English man owns it and is a record holder. That video will tell you the shops name, he is a source of Euro parts and rods.
Mebbe Dad's Ole Tackle, but they don't have CT kit.
Jason, that for sure looks like it would work.
I sourced some aluminum tubing at M-C; I think I can tap it easily, prolly to M5 since I have bunch of hexdrive button head M5's, which would be low profile in the plates. Black Dog has SS cage plugs 10 for 8 bucks or so. For my personal use I think Imma order some of the plugs and make a few kits up with the spacer. I need a couple other things from BD anyway which would amortize shipping a bit.
I bought a kit once and thought it was a rid-off for the price. Next time, I just threw away the levelwind worm, carriage, idler and shield and moved the top bar down to where the levelwind had been. As I recall, some small washers and a bit of filing was all that was needed to secure the bar where the levelwind had been. Then add in some magents. ABU leaves plenty or room for them under the hood.
I do not play with these reels , but if you are looking to replace the level wind with a bar .
I might use a stain less tube and tap that OR .
Stain less tube and then slide a stain less steel stud inside the tube to give it the bulk dia .
Stainless threaded rod maybe cheaper and you can cut to your length . Just some ideas
https://www.onlinemetals.com/en/buy/stainless-steel/0-25-od-x-0-035-wall-x-0-18-id-stainless-round-tube-304-seamless/pid/12913?variant=12913_12_0&gclid=Cj0KCQiAm5ycBhCXARIsAPldzoW9cCocFYqYzcePZmBClagm2L1
https://www.ebay.com/itm/373544343935?_trkparms=amclksrc%3DITM%26aid%3D1110006%26algo%3DHOMESPLICE.SIM%26ao%3D1%26asc%3D243418%26meid%3D99f92dc0f1c84693ab39dc9d8db62379%26
Quote from: 0119 on November 29, 2022, 08:22:29 PMThere is a youtube channel called "Team Hard Life". In his video list, he visits a tackle shop in Texas that specializes in surf and distance casting tackle. I can't remember it's name. An English man owns it and is a record holder. That video will tell you the shops name, he is a source of Euro parts and rods.
Breakaway?
https://www.breakawaytackleusa.com/
Quote from: day0ne on November 30, 2022, 09:49:20 AMQuote from: 0119 on November 29, 2022, 08:22:29 PMThere is a youtube channel called "Team Hard Life". In his video list, he visits a tackle shop in Texas that specializes in surf and distance casting tackle. I can't remember it's name. An English man owns it and is a record holder. That video will tell you the shops name, he is a source of Euro parts and rods.
Breakaway?
https://www.breakawaytackleusa.com/
[/float
I think that's it. It was in that area of Texas. I contacted them for Rocket Fuel Liquid Grease after Jerry closed up. I miss Jerry, hope he is well and happy.
Have you considered replacing the LW cage with a designated CT cage rather than hacksawing a good LW one to fit aftermarket conversion bars?
The cost will be similar and having the ability to revert back to using a LW again for those times reel could be used for bait fishing where line guiding manually becomes tiring can be a good option to still have further down the road. ;)
Quote from: Fish-aholic on November 30, 2022, 12:02:14 PMHave you considered replacing the LW cage with a designated CT cage rather than hacksawing a good LW one to fit aftermarket conversion bars?
The cost will be similar and having the ability to revert back to using a LW again for those times reel could be used for bait fishing where line guiding manually becomes tiring can be a good option to still have further down the road. ;)
You're not wrong in concept. My logic though is I have 2 5000C laying around. So if i screw it up or get sick of it i have a spare.
Quote from: Fish-aholic on November 30, 2022, 12:02:14 PMHave you considered replacing the LW cage with a designated CT cage rather than hacksawing a good LW one to fit aftermarket conversion bars?
The cost will be similar and having the ability to revert back to using a LW again for those times reel could be used for bait fishing where line guiding manually becomes tiring can be a good option to still have further down the road. ;)
Sorry, but not even close. Custom CT conversion bar is 20 bucks plus shipping. CT cages are 4X that if not more, when you can find one, and billet frames are a hundred for Rocket and go from there. If you find good CT cages for 20 bucks I'll take 50 right now.
Quote from: thorhammer on November 30, 2022, 01:11:42 PMQuote from: Fish-aholic on November 30, 2022, 12:02:14 PMHave you considered replacing the LW cage with a designated CT cage rather than hacksawing a good LW one to fit aftermarket conversion bars?
The cost will be similar and having the ability to revert back to using a LW again for those times reel could be used for bait fishing where line guiding manually becomes tiring can be a good option to still have further down the road. ;)
Sorry, but not even close. Custom CT conversion bar is 20 bucks plus shipping. CT cages are 4X that if not more, when you can find one, and billet frames are a hundred for Rocket and go from there. If you find good CT cages for 20 bucks I'll take 50 right now.
This is the reason I did it myself. Finding a ABU CT cage is difficult. Paying shipping from England for modifying just one reel was another reason. But, making a CT reel with the existing parts was very satisfying.
Michael, keep us posted and with pics of what you do....there's a couple of us with vocal interest but there are others just reading too.
Kurt, if my idea comes out decently, Imma shoot you a couple to try to break.
Quote from: Breadfan on November 28, 2022, 05:08:51 PMGood to have you on the forum! I did my Abu 5000 without ordering anything. I hacked the top bar and made studs from those and glued them with epoxy. They look good but they do show brass since they are chromed brass, but no big deal. For the CT bar, I just removed the pawl and glued the worm gear to the housing and then glued the whole thing to the frame. Yea, it's permanent but its very stout.
it looks pretty cool and Im bet it works even better, I was tempted to do something similar years ago, but at the end, in my local beaches it doesnt matter if you cast 60yds or 130yds cuz the way the tide works here you will get the same kind of fish, the sea star to get deep and alive from the 300yds or 500yds :o :o
we need to drive 2hrs south or so to get better chances to catch something worthy from the beach.
short note: the tide here goes up and down with a range of 500yds or so when is low tide, leaving the sea floor exposed so you can made some long walks but mostly everything is dead or empty as the dry sand of the desert, this happens two times per day so, you can imagine there is no much living creatures in that zone even with high tide, your only chances to catch something is when the high tide is coming and when it stops for few hours until start to get back again, eventho I live in from of the sea if I want to catch something worthy I need to drive few hours as if I was any other city boy >:( >:(
PS: what glue you used to put the worm gear housing permament?
Partially related, just because I know the abu folks who would know the answer are reading this thread:
Are there any higher ratio gears that'll fit in my '73 5000C? As i think about this more I'm not sure i wanna cast super far on a reel that retrieves at like 12" per turn.
And Alex, my thoughts are that I would walk out at low tide and cast from there, see what's out even further. But that's just my unreasonable optimism at play.
Quote from: thorhammer on December 01, 2022, 02:04:33 PMMichael, keep us posted and with pics of what you do....there's a couple of us with vocal interest but there are others just reading too.
Kurt, if my idea comes out decently, Imma shoot you a couple to try to break.
Thorhammer, I have an old 5000 that needs a complete overhaul. Since I'll already be tearing into this reel, I'm gonna use it as the test subject for my CT idea. I'll post updates and photos as I work through this.
eReplacement Parts sells the 6500CT frames for a bit under $100. I know you have a 5000C but it's just an idea I thought I'd throw out there then you could get a 6500 spool and axle and be done with it. Yeah it's spendy compared to a CT kit, but I feel like the CT frame would be more rigid versus adding bars and plugs to an older frame.
Quote from: JasonGotaProblem on December 01, 2022, 05:33:24 PMAnd Alex, my thoughts are that I would walk out at low tide and cast from there, see what's out even further. But that's just my unreasonable optimism at play.
tried that several times, the true is when tide is going down and kind of stops, its not like if you will cast into 30ft deep hole on a 50yds cast or even on a 100yds cast, the water is still pretty low /shallow for several yards, the blue water is still far from a good cast, since the tide moves pretty long two times per day the current is pretty strong when the tide is going up or going down, no even a 8oz spider weight will hold with the strong current of the tide, so after several tries I gave up, so no surf fishing on the local beaches, two hours south is just start to get better on beach fishing.
Low Tides
The bay of San Felipe is found 3 meters above sea level.
At Low Tide, the water can back out up to 2 kilometers, this way exposing around 7 kilometers of a sandy bottom, offering the opportunity to walk over the ocean and enjoy the beautiful landscapes of this port, making this activity, a unique experience.
The low tides of San Felipe are ideal for clam searching, the only thing you will need is a rake or a good shovel and there you go, explore!https://sanfelipe.travel/en/low-tides/
Quote from: Breadfan on November 28, 2022, 05:08:51 PMPS: what glue you used to put the worm gear housing permament?
I used the Pro Paste epoxy from Mudhole. It stays where you put it and it does not run. It also dries very hard. I use it for reel seats mainly, but I am finding other uses for it!
Quote from: thorhammer on December 01, 2022, 02:04:33 PMKurt, if my idea comes out decently, Imma shoot you a couple to try to break.
Love to try them!
Quote from: JasonGotaProblem on December 01, 2022, 05:33:24 PMPartially related, just because I know the abu folks who would know the answer are reading this thread:
Are there any higher ratio gears that'll fit in my '73 5000C? As i think about this more I'm not sure i wanna cast super far on a reel that retrieves at like 12" per turn.
I think they do Jason, maybe start a new thread with a schematic so we can figure it out. I've upgraded newer Abus so hopefully it can be done.
I found an older thread that described exactly the swap i wanna make. I am again blessed by the knowledge base that is this forum. It just took some effort because all the search terms are words that come up a lot in conversation.
Edit: meant to post the link
https://alantani.com/index.php?topic=11068.0
this is a very interesting topic. I might try it. One that kills me from doing this is I have damaged so many gear sets catching rock cod with 4-5# of drag to bring up them lines. If the gears were stronger, I'd definitely give it a go.
Quote from: Bryan Young on December 03, 2022, 01:21:09 AMthis is a very interesting topic. I might try it. One that kills me from doing this is I have damaged so many gear sets catching rock cod with 4-5# of drag to bring up them lines. If the gears were stronger, I'd definitely give it a go.
Rocket Reel Company out of England makes a set of 5.3s with a stainless main gear and hardened bronze pinion. It's a recommended upgrade I do for the king salmon and musky fishermen where I live. Never had a set come back in feeling like a coffee grinder. They are noisy gears, but smooth and tough. https://www.therocketreelcompany.com/product/gear-set/
I'm enjoying this topic and understand what going on, but I can't figure out what the terms, CL and CT stand for. Im sure its something obvious but its annoying me second guessing. A couple of quick searches produced nothing. Please clear-up this vocabulary problem I have, and Thanks for all the input on an interesting topic.
There's a sticky with AbU nomenclature in this section
C= bearings
L= Level wind cage or frame
T= Non-level wind cage or "open cage", some say "Tournament Cage" or "Tournament Frame".
So, A CL is bearings and Level wind cage.
and a CT is bearings with an open cage, or non level wind cage.
I think I have this right.
Thank you, Swami805! clarity is a wonderful thing!I found the sticky page
Quote from: Bryan Young on December 03, 2022, 01:21:09 AMthis is a very interesting topic. I might try it. One that kills me from doing this is I have damaged so many gear sets catching rock cod with 4-5# of drag to bring up them lines. If the gears were stronger, I'd definitely give it a go.
This has me asking questions not pertaining to this thread so I think I'll start another.
Quote from: thorhammer on November 30, 2022, 01:11:42 PMQuote from: Fish-aholic on November 30, 2022, 12:02:14 PMHave you considered replacing the LW cage with a designated CT cage rather than hacksawing a good LW one to fit aftermarket conversion bars?
The cost will be similar and having the ability to revert back to using a LW again for those times reel could be used for bait fishing where line guiding manually becomes tiring can be a good option to still have further down the road. ;)
Sorry, but not even close. Custom CT conversion bar is 20 bucks plus shipping. CT cages are 4X that if not more, when you can find one, and billet frames are a hundred for Rocket and go from there. If you find good CT cages for 20 bucks I'll take 50 right now.
$80 plus for stock Abu CT cages? They are nowhere near such costs here in the UK where I reside. You could buy a excellent condition reel 2nd hand with a CT cage already on it for that kind of money and have change left over.
I did so a month ago having bought an excellent conditioned blue Abu 6500CT elite for $79 (£65 posted).
Different market here in the UK when small baitcasting reels are converted and used for tournament casting. Sorry to hear the availability and cost is not the same on your side of the pond :-[
[/quote]
$80 plus for stock Abu CT cages? They are nowhere near such costs here in the UK where I reside. You could buy a excellent condition reel 2nd hand with a CT cage already on it for that kind of money and have change left over.
I did so a month ago having bought an excellent conditioned blue Abu 6500CT elite for $79 (£65 posted).
Different market here in the UK when small baitcasting reels are converted and used for tournament casting. Sorry to hear the availability and cost is not the same on your side of the pond :-[
[/quote]
That's a damn good deal.
Looks like I forgot to take those threaded sleeves out of my shopping cart when I ordered some Christmas gifts. I guess I'll be making my own after all.
Quote from: Fish-aholic on December 06, 2022, 11:57:31 AMQuote from: thorhammer on November 30, 2022, 01:11:42 PMQuote from: Fish-aholic on November 30, 2022, 12:02:14 PMHave you considered replacing the LW cage with a designated CT cage rather than hacksawing a good LW one to fit aftermarket conversion bars?
The cost will be similar and having the ability to revert back to using a LW again for those times reel could be used for bait fishing where line guiding manually becomes tiring can be a good option to still have further down the road. ;)
Sorry, but not even close. Custom CT conversion bar is 20 bucks plus shipping. CT cages are 4X that if not more, when you can find one, and billet frames are a hundred for Rocket and go from there. If you find good CT cages for 20 bucks I'll take 50 right now.
$80 plus for stock Abu CT cages? They are nowhere near such costs here in the UK where I reside. You could buy a excellent condition reel 2nd hand with a CT cage already on it for that kind of money and have change left over.
I did so a month ago having bought an excellent conditioned blue Abu 6500CT elite for $79 (£65 posted).
Different market here in the UK when small baitcasting reels are converted and used for tournament casting. Sorry to hear the availability and cost is not the same on your side of the pond :-[
I think the CT, Rockets, etc. in general were a lot more available in UK than here. On the rare occasion a Mag Elite surfaces, it's 150 USD and has been fished. Haven't seen a Blue Yonder pop up in a long while that wasn't beaten down. Casting 8-n-bait and not using braid is sort of a niche market- some in the Northeast and some in Florida, but the majority are concentrated on the NC Outer Banks for drum fishing. While you're standing shoulder to shoulder at The Point in Buxton, it seems like a lot of people, but in reality, the numbers aren't that high for people throwing them vs. spinning reels which ware used universally. In the 80-2000's there weren't many magged reels readily available here besides the Magpowers and Magforce, plus centrifugal SLOSH. There were even still an amount of Squidders on the piers and beach 20 years ago. When the 525 Mag came out a lot of people went that way, including me. Now you've got Omoto, Akios, Squall, Fathom, Siegler, and others besides the used market and people modifying their own like us. I'd love to find them at your prices :)
Quote from: JasonGotaProblem on December 06, 2022, 12:42:41 PMLooks like I forgot to take those threaded sleeves out of my shopping cart when I ordered some Christmas gifts. I guess I'll be making my own after all.
Please post updates if you get a change to try this out. I've have not been able to devote a lot of time to my CT conversions plans since I posted, but I do have a plan for a jig so that I can drill and tap stainless rod stock to make a heavy duty CT bar. I just got a great deal on a gently used, new style C3 6500 which has got me motivated to get it converted before the Pompano really start heating up here.
I'm thinking about using a long hex head bolt to go all the way through, and will look for or create a shorter nut for the other side if needed.
Not gonna lie though my wife is giving birth in a few days so this may not be an immediate project.
Don't think that a through-bolt will give you much in the way of structural support.
If you guys are looking to just ditch the levelwind, and are willing to leave in the top bar, then you just need something that provides the same amount rigidity as the worm cover/crossbar. it looks to me like the top crossbar helps lock the side crossbars into place, so if you remove trhe top, things might get a bit less rigid.
In other words, epoxying in the worm may not buy much in the way of rigidity unless the the worm cover/post was subject to flexing, which seems unlikely. The reel is probably just as strong if you simply removed the worm. No custom work required.
Things only get tricky if you want to remove the top bar, and/or make the frame more rigid.
I think that from a mechanical engineering standpoint, the rigidity is going to be determined by the combination of the contact surface area between the crossbar and the inside of the frame and the total surface are defined by the outline of the crossbar/frame contact area.
That aftermarket bar increases the surface area by having a rod that is a larger diameter next to the frame, and then tapering to a smaller diameter, presumably to minimize line slap on the cast. The kit also has a jumbo flathead screw to get some purchase on the hole to hold the crossbar against the frame.
Another technique would be to make a larger flat crossbar, something like what was used on the stock CTs. Top and bottom crossbar screws would be even better, but would leave holes if you ever wanted to convert back.
I bet Tom at Cortez could make a really nice one piece frame. I also wonder if just a single piece foot/crossbar would be an option, or if it is too hairy to remove the original foot from the frame sides
Doing this all from a foggy memory of ABU internals, so take this with a grain of salt.
-J
Quote from: jurelometer on December 09, 2022, 11:41:41 PMAnother technique would be to make a larger flat crossbar, something like what was used on the stock CTs. Top and bottom crossbar screws would be even better, but would leave holes if you ever wanted to convert back.
-J
I like this idea best so far. Now, if we could think of a way to do this without needed to do specialized machining... Although, it does not have to be round you could use a thick walled pipe that matches the round circumference of the frame, cut what you need out of it and tap it. Yes, it would leave holes if you wanted to go back but parts frames are cheap.
If we only had someone on here that had ever produced crossbars and had the experience....
Those of you who are familiar with looking at such diagrams, will know how bad my sketch is. But basically I'm thinking 2 thin-ish horseshoe shaped plates connected by 2 bars. Though I guess it's not so different from being a full frame at that point. Basically utilize the rear cross bar to add rigidity by building a box
I've fished several reels with the level wind and top bar removed, never felt like rigidity was a concern. The bar across the front is really there to make the reel not look weird, anything will work.
The Man
Does any one have one of these bar kits ,that they can post a picture of .
I think i found the kit at . https://hookless.com/ Kinder makes seance but looks like it`s a fat bar .315 diameter ! I see the screw on one end and the other end looks like a screw and washer . The stud picture looks better , not sure how it`s suppose to be used . Is this a two bar kit were as the upper groove line guide bar is replaced also? Two pictures from hookless and one that i took measurements from a 550 plus . I would make a bar with a tenon and nail head on one end and screw to hold it in the frame on the other end .
Gee, it's been a long time since I contempleted this. That bar with the groove for the levelwind guide wire has to come out of there too. Right? Cut it out but leave a nail head and the stud to screw to the right side plate cup.
An interesting thread that has brought back memories of discussions in the UK angling press from many years ago when CT frames were unheard of and the UK long-distance casting fraternity were doing their own conversion of level-wind Abu reels (generally 6000 size).
As you'll know, the problem with level-wind reels is the retarding effect of the level wind on distance casting plus the inability to hold the reel spool firmly with the thumb during the cast because the crossbar gets in the way.
Abu listened and eventually brought out CT versions of the 6000 (red plate for bushings and black plate for ball-bearings). I'm no expert on the many variations, but I believe there was the 6500 that had a higher gear ratio than the original 6000 and the CT version of it had blue plates. Later the 6500 Mag Elite with magnets and dark green plates appeared; probably the best of the bunch.
Good luck with the DIY!
First attempt. Less than $2 spent so far. Gonna spool it up today with 15# braid and see what it can do.
Not pictured was the hour I spent counter-sinking the frame and filing down that cap because the plate fits directly up against the frame and the main gear is directly on the other side. Tried to do some testing with it kinda dry assembled and it doesn't work at all until those two match up perfectly.
Also that piece is non-anodized aluminum. So this is curre tly now a freshwater only build. But that'll change.
Spooled up with 200 yds of 20# nomad braid. This was a good call. It casts great. Way better than with heavier braid and a level wind.
That's very nice Jason. The next step is to get one of those Ambassadeur plastic snap-on spool arbors. It will replace almost a hundred yards of line and weight less. That is, unless you are the optimistic type with high expectations.
I wouldn't worry about the saltwater. Going over it with a green scrub pad every few months (without disassembly) will get the oxide off.
Quote from: oc1 on December 17, 2022, 04:50:27 AMThat's very nice Jason. The next step is to get one of those Ambassadeur plastic snap-on spool arbors. It will replace almost a hundred yards of line and weight less. That is, unless you are the optimistic type with high expectations.
great advice. I have one installed already. Many thanks to Keith. I'm not made of braid money. That's my backing.
I have some ceramics I may install, but no rush.
So I went thru this guy again. Trimmed down the peg a bit further and added a shim to the the other side to get the spacing just right. I put in the ceramics with some TSI and polished the spool shaft a bit. Lots of free spool now. I may try to add some magnets but I seem to cast this guy fine without them.
I did an apples to apples comparison with the lure I was using the reel with before I did the CT conversion. It's different line, but I'm throwing a 3/8oz soft plastic AT LEAST 30% further. So.to quantify that with a 6' rod I was throwing a 3/8oz lure about 60 yds before I did the ceramics.
Below is the the head that i filed down next to an unmodified one.
And the stock handle from a 27SH seems an appropriate fit for now.
I dug up and measured measured my old and abused 6500 and the ID spacing between the frame sides was so dead on at 46 mm that my digital calipers only showed at most .02 mm difference, which is like .001 inch, a higher degree of accuracy than you could afford to specify in an anodized aluminum frame.
As shipped by ABU, all these frames are probably ridiculously square, which is the most important thing for casting distance, as it keeps the ball bearings running down the center of the grooves, minimizing resistance.
Removing posts, and replacing posts with a spacer or bolt that pulls the frame inwards, decreases support, and more importantly will be "pinching" the frame sides inward, risking alignment failure. You are relying on the remaining posts to keep the frame square.
To do this right, the replacement spacer has to be very accurate in length, square (level face) on the ends, and in combination with the screw, place pressure on both faces of the frame side.
The other option is to simply remove the levelwind and try not to screw up the frame alignment by tightening the replacement post very much, and give up some rigidity.
Joe had some good advice on doing this closer to the right way by using a hollow rod. McMaster Carrr sells stainless 8mm spacers and long screws that could be used. You will still have to figure out a way to cut down and finish the spacer to exactly the right length and square - but this will be easier than boring and tapping a solid rod dead square unless you have access to a metal lathe.
I think that Joe's method has the best chance for success without special equipment. If you want to use tapped holes, I would still use the hollow rods or spaces in either aluminum or stainless, and use the existing hole as a pilot for your tap drill.
If you use Aluminum rod, 6061 would probably be preferable to some of the general purpose alloys sometimes used for these products. For stainless, 316 is preferable of 301 or 303, but it is trickier to work with. Most reel screws are not 316 either, so it is not the end of the world.
Hope this helps,
-J
Nice work. You should try that on an 11' with 4 oz and I expect you might spool it with practice.
I ordered the blakdog conversion kit last night. I realized I'm lurking around local hardware stores trying to reinvent the wheel to save a few bucks trying to make a better version of what I already made, but the actual better version is for sale for not that much money online. So I just bought the dang thing to save on gas.
But I do intend to strap mine to my 10' surf rod sometime while I'm home on my very generous paternity leave, and try to see my spool arbor again.
I decided to make another one. When I bought this 4500C3 without looking at line ratings, I guess in my head i assumed since it was a smaller reel it was set up for lighter line than the 5000C. Nope, just less line cap. So I said goodbye to the levelwind assembly and I'm gonna fill it up with 15# braid and see what it'll do.
I also did carbon drags, the bearings in it are good but ceramics are on the way. I also stole a smaller drag star from one of my 5000C because the flat star was running into the curved handle. This reel came with 5.3 ratio gears.
I was considering putting a steel main in and setting this one up for power, but then I saw the plastic/graphite foot and said maybe not. Oh well it'll still be good for bass.
Also the eBay seller I bought this from is also a member here. I may need to reach out and ask about the history of this one. It cleaned up just great and for the price it's awesome. But why was there legit mud inside of it?
Watching this thread with extreme interest!
Just curious about Abu modding: is there a reason to make tungsten carbide spindles for the 6500s? A local tackle shop claims to be stocking these.
Quote from: Barishi on February 25, 2023, 01:13:56 PMJust curious about Abu modding: is there a reason to make tungsten carbide spindles for the 6500s? A local tackle shop claims to be stocking these.
Less likely to bend? Where is "local"
Quote from: JasonGotaProblem on February 25, 2023, 02:16:42 PMQuote from: Barishi on February 25, 2023, 01:13:56 PMJust curious about Abu modding: is there a reason to make tungsten carbide spindles for the 6500s? A local tackle shop claims to be stocking these.
Less likely to bend? Where is "local"
Singapore. We gotta small community of sportscasters. Some guys crazy enough to chase big game on 6500s, one managed a 35kg ray on mono line.
While strength is one matter, if a hard running fish were to pull drag on a 6500, would the gears not strip before the spindle bends?