I have a 113H Special that I am having a hard time identifying. I look at Mystic and it says the 113H with a clicker is newer (1996). Then, I read reels with external drag access are older which this has. Also, the schematic shows a collar and felt washer on top the drag stack but instead this has a solid collar without the felt washer. What am I missing?
Yeah, I think that is a rare typo on the Mystic site. I have 3 of that model and none of them had the felt washer, including the one I originally purchased new back in the 70's. While "dating" Senators can be a somewhat inexact science, that is about the vintage of the one you have. I have always been partial to that model, don't ask me why I don't really have a good reason. :D - john
Do yours have the clicker as well?
It also has the thick drags (3). I assume the 6-113HSP will work to replace.
Yes, all mine have clickers, I do not know that I have ever seen one without. Side note I have a 114H external drag model and it actually has the felt. Those thick washers in yours are the originals, I would go with a complete set of metals and CF as well, but that is just me. And definitely use Cal's on them. - john
In all these years I've never have come across a 113H without a clicker. I'm sure there must be some but probably the left plates were switched for clicker plates. On the reels with outside accessable drags & a washer & felt, that part is no longer available. If it is missing I just use keyed washers as spacers. In fact I just chuck them & use extra keyed washers instead. I think the reels with outside accessable drags were produced from 1963-64 to about 1972. It used to be that all of the 113h's with OAD's had heat treated steel main gears, but so many of them have had parts exchanged that most are not original anymore and I find many of them with bronze main gear. Rudy
Thanks John and Rudy! I got the clicker info from the Mystic site. They have a separate parts list for with and without clicker. To replace the drags I'd have to get full set of 5 metals and CF correct? Only have 3 of each now. Also, I don't think there would be room for a felt washer and collar. The spacer is solid and flat on the bottom. I reackon that's a moot point though if they're not available.
When you reassemble it if the tophat washer is to low then you will have to shim it with keyed washers. The top edge of the tophat washer should be just slightly above the plate when light pressure is on the drag stack. Shimming is a mix & match deal with different thickness washers.
So I guess it's best to get the new drag stack then see how it fits.
Rudy's experience and knowledge are spot on. In my experience, when you move to a CF stack with stainless washers, the materials are thinner, so that 5 stack will probably be pretty close to the original 3 stack with leather and brass, and like Rudy says I have used the original brass washers as spacers on top of the stack to help equal up the stack height to get full drag range. Important to makes sure that if your new stack is appreciably shorter, just to double check and make sure that at full drag (the star cranked all the way down) that you do not "bottom out" the star on the sideplate and end up losing max drag capability. And all of mine mirror his experience - they were equipped with the desirable steel gears. - john
When I had it apart it looked like it had a brass bushing but the gear looked to be steel. Wasn't paying close attention but will check when it pull it back apart to replace the washer under the main gear.
I thought the old 3 stack drags had asbestos washers? Compare the height of the old stack to the height of the new 5 stack and shim as necessary to maintain the original height.
Yeah, it's an Asbestos brake-type material. - john
Ran into this awhile back, without clicker means without replaceable clicker. It still has one just riveted on and cannot be easily replaced. It was in the footnotes somewhere.
ALL the 113h's with clickers had peened clicker tongues until about the 90's. After that they all had clicker tongues with a c clip.
That explains it fellas! I think they mentioned 1996 is when it changed. Thanks!
Reels of that original shape will have the steel main gear. They can rust but they last forever and don't strip out like the bronze gears.
I'm a little late to the game here, but if you need a certain thickness SS washer let me know. I have a baggie full of washers from changing out reels to 5 stacks.
Quote from: handi2 on March 22, 2021, 08:53:06 PM
Reels of that original shape will have the steel main gear. They can rust but they last forever and don't strip out like the bronze gears.
I prefer these reels when I need a donor reel for a conversion, for this reason. I grease well so no concern about corrosion without paying for SS that I don't need.
Thanks for the offer. I just got the drag kit with 5 washers in the mail today. I'll let you know if I have any issues. Thanks again!
Good Joe, when you place it back together, just make sure the eared washers fit in the grooves on the inside of the main gear, if you need anymore height use some of your old bevilled washers, good luck, cheers Don.
Rather than using bellville washers to adjust the height of the drag stack, use different thicknesses of keyed drag washers.
Thanks for all the pointers. Got the parts and will be diving into it today. Will let y'all know how it works out.