OK so I have PJ's reel in front of me and the problem we have is centering the spool. The spool needs to move towards the handle more which is simple, but! This reel has Lee Pro side plates, Tiburon P21 frame, we believe a Tiburon narrow spool, custom handle and drag star by Adam and if we adjust the bearing cup to center the spool the drag star hits the cup at about 1/3 drag. The bearing cups are bearing on the clicker side and bushing on the handle side (both the bearing and bushing are bottomed out in the cups). What next? Are all bearing cups created equal?
If the bearing cup for the handle side was 1/16" deeper we would be money.
Bt
The reel:
(http://i743.photobucket.com/albums/xx76/fresnotim/DSC01124_zpsllbrtazq.jpg) (http://s743.photobucket.com/user/fresnotim/media/DSC01124_zpsllbrtazq.jpg.html)
The bearing cups:
(http://i743.photobucket.com/albums/xx76/fresnotim/DSC01126_zps1gh2a0u7.jpg) (http://s743.photobucket.com/user/fresnotim/media/DSC01126_zps1gh2a0u7.jpg.html)
(http://i743.photobucket.com/albums/xx76/fresnotim/DSC01125_zpsjese6v4s.jpg) (http://s743.photobucket.com/user/fresnotim/media/DSC01125_zpsjese6v4s.jpg.html)
The Lee Pro Plates had two different length bushings, maybe you have the wrong one?
I'm assuming you tried a bearing in the handle side as well?
Worst case, file down the bushing a bit at a time.
Tom, yes I put a bearing in the handle side and that fixes the centering but then your'e putting pressure on the pinion, so it needs the bushing to inside the pinion...Anyone got a different Lee Pro bushing? I'm sure there a million of them out there ;D
BT
P.S. Tom you guys need to stop selling me that Grappa ;D
The easiest way is to shim under the bearing. Sal also sent me some Delrin "dots" that are punched out in different thicknesses. These you can use pushed inside the bearing down into the bearing cup. They are the same size as the inner dimension of the bearing. The spool ends will ride easily on the Delrin shims.
What is that brass insert thingy? You may have to shave that insert thingy and the spool shaft length.
Bryan that thingy goes inside the pinion and the spool shaft slides into said thingy ;D Maybe we have an incorrect spool? I do know that if I flip the thingy inside the cup the spool will center and both cups are nearly at the same depth in the side plates, but then the bushing or bearing will rub on the pinion >:( ... If only I had a mini lathe.
TIM
Tim, if you take a look at the spool shaft, there should be a shoulder where that thingy( ;D ) hits. Maybe shaving a little of the tip on the tinghy will cure it.
Sal that's where we're at now, but would you file the front or the rear of the thingy?
Tim
Quote from: Big Tim on January 05, 2017, 01:27:31 AM
Sal that's where we're at now, but would you file the front or the rear of the thingy?
Tim
Front Tim, but first pull the thingy out of the cup and place it on the spool shaft, if it's not hitting the shoulder t will be a lost cause. In case it is resting against it, it will definitely help.
By the way, your problem is the complete opposite from everyone else problem ;D
Quote from: Alto Mare on January 05, 2017, 01:45:01 AM
Quote from: Big Tim on January 05, 2017, 01:27:31 AM
Sal that's where we're at now, but would you file the front or the rear of the thingy?
Tim
Front Tim, but first pull the thingy out of the cup and place it on the spool shaft, if it's not hitting the shoulder t will be a lost cause. In case it is resting against it, it will definitely help.
By the way, your problem is the complete opposite from everyone else problem ;D
Thanks, I feel so much better now Sal ;D ... Good call on pulling the thingy and checking where it hits.
BT
Your spool appears to be an equivalent to a Penn 501, and was designed to go into a reel using bushings.
I have plastic sleeves that converts the spool to work with bearings.
OK before grinding on PJ's reel we need a bit more knowledge...As Petty Officer Griff always said "What's you clearance Clarence?" ... So I need to know what and where my clearances are? How much material can I take off and where? How does it all fit & does it do?
I need to know if the thingy rides on the spool shaft shoulder and what will that tell me? It will tell me where I can remove material and some of the effect on the reel:
OK the thingy rides on the spool shaft and I notice the the spool shaft has about 1/16" before it protrudes from the thingy...Note to self "Tom is right we have the wrong Thingy"
(http://i743.photobucket.com/albums/xx76/fresnotim/DSC01130_zpsazrvf9av.jpg) (http://s743.photobucket.com/user/fresnotim/media/DSC01130_zpsazrvf9av.jpg.html)
"Clearance Clarence" How much room do we have from the pinion to the spool pawl? This tell how much material we actually can remove and keep proper clearances:
Not a lot of room here boys and girls, too much off and we could get the pawl hitting the pinion in free spool:
(http://i743.photobucket.com/albums/xx76/fresnotim/DSC01132_zpsvafrxeje.jpg) (http://s743.photobucket.com/user/fresnotim/media/DSC01132_zpsvafrxeje.jpg.html)
Just to see what would happen if I remove material from the Thingy on the backside lowering the pinion into the cup I need to know will the pinion fit into the bearing cup and will the pinion ride smoothly on the face of the Thingy.
First I put grease on the Thingy:
(http://i743.photobucket.com/albums/xx76/fresnotim/DSC01134_zpseox6tyqp.jpg) (http://s743.photobucket.com/user/fresnotim/media/DSC01134_zpseox6tyqp.jpg.html)
Then I spin the pinion on the Thingy to check for where it makes contact. I notice that there is grease on the outside of where the pinion made contact, this is good to know, the pinion will fit into the bearing cup:
(http://i743.photobucket.com/albums/xx76/fresnotim/DSC01135_zpsirkavjza.jpg) (http://s743.photobucket.com/user/fresnotim/media/DSC01135_zpsirkavjza.jpg.html)
yup the pinionslides right in:
(http://i743.photobucket.com/albums/xx76/fresnotim/DSC01136_zpsivzdgfbo.jpg) (http://s743.photobucket.com/user/fresnotim/media/DSC01136_zpsivzdgfbo.jpg.html)
Knowing this information tells me Tom is most likely correct that we have the wrong bushing. I know would say if we can't find a different Thingy/Bushing the best place to remove material is fro'm the backside of the Thingy and possibly with the Thingy inside the bearing cup and remove equal amounts of material from both:
Now to figure out a way to keep everything square and get to grinding:
(http://i743.photobucket.com/albums/xx76/fresnotim/DSC01137_zpskou8iydz.jpg) (http://s743.photobucket.com/user/fresnotim/media/DSC01137_zpskou8iydz.jpg.html)
Thanks for laboring thru my brain ;D Peace out
BT
Quote from: reel man on January 05, 2017, 03:07:35 AM
Your spool appears to be an equivalent to a Penn 501, and was designed to go into a reel using bushings.
I have plastic sleeves that converts the spool to work with bearings.
I would like to see what you have & maybe give it a try...The reel isn't going fishing for a while.
Thanks, Tim
Try replacing the bushing with a bearing and reassemble. The pinion will not go anywhere as the joke is holding it in place.
Quote from: Bryan Young on January 05, 2017, 04:02:17 AM
Try replacing the bushing with a bearing and reassemble. The pinion will not go anywhere as the joke is holding it in place.
Bryan I did that and although the spacing was correct it started rubbing on the handle side?
Tim
Now you're getting where most everyone else is. Keep the bearing and add a shim on the right side.
where did it start rubbing? are the shoulders of the spool contacting the inner race of the bearing? What happens if you shim the bearing between the bearing and the bearing cup?
Here's what a stock set of bushings look like Tim.
(http://i1301.photobucket.com/albums/ag109/Cortez_Conversions/thumbnail_IMG_0959_zpsnqkklejn.jpg)
Quote from: Cortez_Conversions on January 05, 2017, 05:37:36 AM
Here's what a stock set of bushings look like Tim.
(http://i1301.photobucket.com/albums/ag109/Cortez_Conversions/thumbnail_IMG_0959_zpsnqkklejn.jpg)
Would a ball bearing and collar shims work here so there's better freespool?
I may be missing something here but here's my take:
You seem to indicate that it's possible to center the spool with the bearing cups. "if we adjust the bearing cup to center the spool"
But then this happens "the drag star hits the cup at about 1/3 drag"...So have you tried a longer spacing sleeve between the drag stack and the star so that the star won't hit the cup?
If this doesn't work; then I would suggest following Bryan's suggestion of trying a bearing with a collar shim or Jerry's plastic sleeve on the shaft.
Good luck
-Mike
Tim, that's enough, put that darn reel in the box and send it over...just kidding ;D.
There are many things to look at and not just the bearings, it is very hard for us to determine what's going on with that reel, unless we have it in our hands.
For me to help, and I'm sure everyone else, you need to show many pics, as how close to the right does the spool move, or left.
You have also mentioned the star, if the bearing cup is not sticking out from the housing, the problem could be related to your spacer sleeve, as Mike has mentioned.
Hang in there, you'll get it worked out, just don't toss it in the ocean ;D
Tim if your get frustrated and wanna ship the reel to any of the other reel jedi masters I'll cover the shipping and off course any new parts needed to remedy the problem
Quote from: pjstevko on January 05, 2017, 03:44:19 PM
Tim if your get frustrated and wanna ship the reel to any of the other reel jedi masters I'll cover the shipping and off course any new parts needed to remedy the problem
PJ, good morning & no frustration at all. As I stated Tom was right from the beginning about the bushing, I just like to overthink things before I break out a file ;D I would love to find another bushing so that I have a back up. I do like my theory of cutting the bushing from the backside and retaining the strength of the front side, but making the bushing look like Tom's picture is very easy to do.
Have a great day.
Tim
Quote from: Big Tim on January 05, 2017, 03:22:36 AM
OK the thingy rides on the spool shaft and I notice the the spool shaft has about 1/16" before it protrudes from the thingy...Note to self "Tom is right we have the wrong Thingy"
I love you guys and the highly technical term "thingy" :)
Quote from: mizmo67 on January 05, 2017, 06:39:53 PM
Quote from: Big Tim on January 05, 2017, 03:22:36 AM
OK the thingy rides on the spool shaft and I notice the the spool shaft has about 1/16" before it protrudes from the thingy...Note to self "Tom is right we have the wrong Thingy"
I love you guys and the highly technical term "thingy" :)
[/quote
That's just short for "thingamabob"]
I always those were called a doohickey.
Update....Tom from Cortez Conversions reached out to me and says he may have a set of Lee Pro bushings ;D Your'e the best Tom.
BT
Quote from: Big Tim on January 05, 2017, 05:05:05 AM
Quote from: Bryan Young on January 05, 2017, 04:02:17 AM
Try replacing the bushing with a bearing and reassemble. The pinion will not go anywhere as the joke is holding it in place.
Bryan I did that and although the spacing was correct it started rubbing on the handle side?
Tim
Is that the spool hitting the tips of the bridge screws ?? That can happen with Tib spools. Just shave the tips down a bit if you see the scrape marks inside the spool
Quote from: MarkT on January 05, 2017, 08:45:04 PM
I always those were called a doohickey.
In SoCal we call them "Ching-A-Deras" ;D ;D ;D
"whats-its" and if it doesn't fit we use an adjective as well.
Thingy ay, if it dont work its a bugga, when it works good, its a beauty. cheers donnyboat.
Tim,
Was this reel actually functioning with other parts?
You do have the proper bushing on the pinion side, I looked at a couple of my reels.
On both of my reels, the cups are sticking out of the plates a bit. I think you may just need a longer spacer sleeve(9-60) to get your star to load up quicker.
After re-reading your post, you said you could get the spool centered, but the star would hit the cup at 1/3 drag.
I'm going to tinker a little bit more.
Shoot me a PM with your address.
Tim, what is the OD of the smaller portion of the spool shaft? And what is the depth of the bearing cup. I could possibly send you shaft collars for the spool side of the bearing, and spacers for the bearing cap side of the bearing for fine adjustments.
Any updates Tim?
Tom from Cortez Conversions sent me some new bushings & first of all thank you, secondly his bushings were exactly what I thought... A bit shorter on the back side of the bushing. Been dealing with a family illness & haven't had a chance to get back to PJ's reel, but I am confident we will be able to fix the centering issue..PJ I will post pics and reach out to you as soon as I'm done ;D
BT
Quote from: Big Tim on January 15, 2017, 08:43:29 PM
Tom from Cortez Conversions sent me some new bushings & first of all thank you, secondly his bushings were exactly what I thought... A bit shorter on the back side of the bushing. Been dealing with a family illness & haven't had a chance to get back to PJ's reel, but I am confident we will be able to fix the centering issue..PJ I will post pics and reach out to you as soon as I'm done ;D
BT
Tim,
I sent you two sets.
The first set is a copy of the stock Lee Pro bushings.
The second set, I trimmed down the thickness so the bearing cups fit closer to flush with the side plates.
Tom
Quote from: Big Tim on January 15, 2017, 08:43:29 PM
Tom from Cortez Conversions sent me some new bushings & first of all thank you, secondly his bushings were exactly what I thought... A bit shorter on the back side of the bushing. Been dealing with a family illness & haven't had a chance to get back to PJ's reel, but I am confident we will be able to fix the centering issue..PJ I will post pics and reach out to you as soon as I'm done ;D
BT
Tim take care of your family first and foremost, family comes first before anything else!
I was just curious......
Thanks again for taking on this issue for me.... I'll pay ya back
Pj
Quote from: Cortez_Conversions on January 15, 2017, 09:17:27 PM
Quote from: Big Tim on January 15, 2017, 08:43:29 PM
Tom from Cortez Conversions sent me some new bushings & first of all thank you, secondly his bushings were exactly what I thought... A bit shorter on the back side of the bushing. Been dealing with a family illness & haven't had a chance to get back to PJ's reel, but I am confident we will be able to fix the centering issue..PJ I will post pics and reach out to you as soon as I'm done ;D
BT
Tim,
I sent you two sets.
The first set is a copy of the stock Lee Pro bushings.
The second set, I trimmed down the thickness so the bearing cups fit closer to flush with the side plates.
Tom
Tom your'e the best...I did notice the different sizes..I'm home now and will mess with fitment tonight or tomorrow ... Thanks again bud. I wish I had a working mini lathe and i would have made the bushings myself.
Tim
Quote from: pjstevko on January 15, 2017, 09:31:11 PM
Quote from: Big Tim on January 15, 2017, 08:43:29 PM
Tom from Cortez Conversions sent me some new bushings & first of all thank you, secondly his bushings were exactly what I thought... A bit shorter on the back side of the bushing. Been dealing with a family illness & haven't had a chance to get back to PJ's reel, but I am confident we will be able to fix the centering issue..PJ I will post pics and reach out to you as soon as I'm done ;D
BT
Tim take care of your family first and foremost, family comes first before anything else!
I was just curious......
Thanks again for taking on this issue for me.... I'll pay ya back
Pj
PJ, sorry for the delay..Mom is having some issues an I have the POA, I'll get the reel right ASAP bro & you owe Tom lunch not me ;D
BT
No hurry on the reel Tim, Ling season doesn't start for a couple months ;D
I guess I owe both Tom and Tim.... This could get pricy!
Quote from: pjstevko on January 15, 2017, 11:33:46 PM
No hurry on the reel Tim, Ling season doesn't start for a couple months ;D
I guess I owe both Tom and Tim.... This could get pricy!
;D
Tim,
Remember Little Bro Jeff has got us covered as far as lathe, mill, end mill ,plasma cutter etc.
Brother Jeff has about twice as many machines as anyone can cram in a 3 car garage....
Plus the capability to weld any material.
Hope Mom is OK.
Let me know what I can do.
Best,
JT
OK reel is fixed ;D Thank you Tom at Cortez Conversions...The bushings pictured are of the standard sized bushings,I used the bushings that were shorter on the back side of the bushing on the left
(http://i743.photobucket.com/albums/xx76/fresnotim/DSC01153_zpsqtlgvucg.jpg) (http://s743.photobucket.com/user/fresnotim/media/DSC01153_zpsqtlgvucg.jpg.html)
This gave me the ability to properly center the spool and enough clearance on the drag star to have full drag
(http://i743.photobucket.com/albums/xx76/fresnotim/DSC01152_zps1nnsusw7.jpg) (http://s743.photobucket.com/user/fresnotim/media/DSC01152_zps1nnsusw7.jpg.html)
Cool reel PJ
BT
(http://i743.photobucket.com/albums/xx76/fresnotim/DSC01154_zps3kry1z9q.jpg) (http://s743.photobucket.com/user/fresnotim/media/DSC01154_zps3kry1z9q.jpg.html)
That's the ticket. Way to go BT and Tom b
Very good T&T! Great job finding and solving the problem ;D
Looks great Tim! I owe you and Tom big time for all the parts and effort!
That last pic sure shows off how well that knob matches the plates.... It's prurrttyy!