I may be out in left field with this question. I know there are many vendors who make various reel parts, such as gear bridges, frames, plates. In many stiles.
What I would like to see is a place/Post here were we could reference screw sizes either in MM or IN which ever is the case. It would be convenient for the guys to reference in the event they want to change screw configuration from slot to socket head or tourx.
Like one place shopping. It's hard for some to find what they want because of the mixed bag of parts that the vendors here offer.
Just a suggestion guys..................................Joe
Great idea Joe!
Excellent idea. Also factory screw and thread sizes especially Penn's.
Ditto and ditto!
Same here!
Appreciate the good replies but it seems that no one is answering that I would have expected. :-\ ???............................Joe
Good idea Joe, but the postage to West Aussie, is huge, cheers Don.
It sounds like a great idea to me Joe. It is almost as though reel makers went out of their way to use obscure sizes.
-steve
Quote from: Reel 224 on October 21, 2018, 02:54:28 AM
Appreciate the good replies but it seems that no one is answering that I would have expected. :-\ ???............................Joe
Maybe everyone is waiting for you to make the list. If you want ideas to work you have to implament them & follow through. Rudy
Quote from: RowdyW on October 21, 2018, 09:02:32 AM
Quote from: Reel 224 on October 21, 2018, 02:54:28 AM
Appreciate the good replies but it seems that no one is answering that I would have expected. :-\ ???............................Joe
Maybe everyone is waiting for you to make the list. If you want ideas to work you have to implament them & follow through. Rudy
I don't know if it is your intention but you are coming across a little snarky.
I just managed today, to resolve one big screw screw up. I have striped three mini screws that go into end of the reel bodies, and it caused that casing end to have a gap, tiny but still...
And of course, searching for a screw that has 4 mm in length and 1 mm thickenes is mission impossible.
So I had to drill a deeper hole into existing ones and fit the much longer and a bit wider screw in, which is still tiny, found it in the old shawing aparat parts after dissasembling it.
And it worked like a charm. It was such a relief !
And YES, we all need some measures, parts and all, with those.
Quote from: Frank on October 21, 2018, 11:42:35 AM
Quote from: RowdyW on October 21, 2018, 09:02:32 AM
Quote from: Reel 224 on October 21, 2018, 02:54:28 AM
Appreciate the good replies but it seems that no one is answering that I would have expected. :-\ ???............................Joe
Maybe everyone is waiting for you to make the list. If you want ideas to work you have to implament them & follow through. Rudy
I don't know if it is your intention but you are coming across a little snarky.
Frank, no sarcasam meant. ??? ??? ???
Okay, cool. Thanks.
Rudy has a good point, and I would except I don't have the various reels to make all those screw measurements off of. I was hoping to get the guys here that make the plates,frames,and bridges to give me some guidance.
I do have work of my own as well to keep me busy. Not to find excuses but the time I spend here just posting from time to time makes it hard to do things like figuring out the many screw sizes when some could help with that end. Also I have had a UTI infection that is keeping me down these few weeks, The meds are making my concentration and ambition at less then I would like. Ruth can tell you I have slept most of the days away in the past few weeks.
Joe
Joe, I think it would be simpler for each member who wants to get into reel repair or restoration would just purchase a caliper & thread gauges. The cheap ones at HF are adequit. Charts are available on line to copy for size reference. I am sure most of the members here already have the tools needed to find the right screw for their needs. The newbes have to get the tools or ask the membership for help once in a while. If anyone has to constantly ask then they need the tools & need to learn how to use them. Don't anyone think I am being harsh but that is just my way of explaning things. ;) Rudy
I can agree with you Rudy, because I have all the tools that are necessary and because I take for granted that I do. So I'll lay out the tools that I have to show others. So they can go from there. Bear with me and I will take pictures today.
Joe
Here are the simple tools you will need for measuring screws..................Joe
I agree with Rudy and Joe —
Easy enough for any of us serious about the right screws to learn the types ourselves — or ask other regular contributors on our site.
In my opinion, this chart can be done — but it would take some time and effort, may or may not be accurate, and may be missing significant screw types — or if relied upon — may become outdated quickly as builders and suppliers change the screws used in our builds — as they will.
Type of screw, material, diameter, length, thread pitch or count, standard or metric, etc, etc...
For me, I just figure out the screws I need most of the time — then order 100 at a time from McMaster-Carr. That way I have what I need accurately within a couple of days at the latest — or in my screw bins immediately.
Another issue that comes to mind —
Like most of us active contributors on our AT site — I am willing to help those who need any knowledge or parts that I may have. This is an enjoyable hobby that sometimes pays for itself — mostly it doesn't — and that is OK, it is a hobby — not a living. A lot of what we do, is free.
Many times, folks need a part or two — do an internet search — find our information. That is all well and good — and most of us try to help. The problem I have is one-time requests for parts — then the frustration when after answering a request — I never hear a response. We are treated like we are just another Amazon retailer that doesn't rate a simple response.
It is the world we live in. And we should realize that the more information we put out for the general public — the less respect that sometimes comes our way.
Just my opinions.
Best,
Fred
Fred: I could add a little to your comments, but lets say. In my short time building reels and refurbishing them I found the only people that rely appreciate the work we go threw is our fellow creators of such equipment. The novice most of the time doesn't have a clue.
The people hear are top notch reel mechanics that put there heart it there work......................Joe Not meant to offend anyone. :)
Also needed is a thread gauge. Some of those tiny suckers are tough to count by eye with a scale.
Thank you for this post, I'm adding some of these tools to a cart on amazon, will purchase when I have extra money as I go...
So, the "screw checker" thing you're showing Joe, is that what Rudy was talkin bout - a "thread gage"? I've got a caliper, but I'd like to get that chart and screw checker. Where to? We got Ace Hardware & Home Depot left on the Island( lost K-Mart, Sears and Sports Authority since I been here). Hardest screws for me to find so far have been the little metric ones on older Abu's.
Kinda like that word: "snarky", might make a good forum name, mabey I'll take it if nobody else wants it...
Hey, Greg — and others —
McMaster-Carr has all of the thread gauges, sizing templates, charts, and other ID tools anyone needs — at very reasonable prices.
And their prices on hardware are low and swift shipping.
When you look at (1) screw on eBay for $4.95 — and you need (16) for one reel — 100 for $16 is a simple decision for me.
There are other suppliers out there also. MC is just one of the best, IMO.
Best,
Fred
https://www.mcmaster.com/
Greg, I believe this is what is being talked about here.
Of course any thread gage is a handy item to have in the shop and the one that Joe shows is great for easy reference.
I have several in this style, both metric and standard and up to 48tpi. The ONLY reason I like this type is, I still machine cut threads on a lathe and this gives me a quick reference to the amount of thread depth as I'm cutting.
Joe, I may have some charts around here that might be of interest to you. Ill dig them up and either send them or post them up if I can hunt them down. I still thread a lot but most of it is off the top of my head as I've done it so long, I never give it a second thought.
All have a great evening, .. Lou
"Kinda like that word: "snarky", might make a good forum name"
LOL, glad you got a kick out of it.
Here is one site that has it all.https://littlemachineshop.com/products/product_view.php?ProductID=2746&category=...............Joe
I was just showing the simple tools, I didn't want to get overly expensive. "Snarky" That's a good one. LoL PMP
If you look at the auction site you can find a set of fold-out thread gauges for about five bucks with shipping from China included. They are absolute junk. Do not get them and do not ask me how I know.
-steve
Hello Joe,
Thanks for trying to get this project rolling.
I've wanted to do this on my website but never have the time to do it.
I don't have a lot of experience with other reel manufactures, but here are some common Penn screw sizes in no particular order:
Most Penn side plate screws are 5-40 screws in various lengths. I believe the 6/0 and up this changes to 8-40 which is an almost unobtainable aftermarket size.
The cheap taps available on Ebay are almost always doo-doo, so buyer beware.
Penn screws, bearings, dimensions without exception(my experience) are imperial, not metric.
Quite a few clamp screws and nuts are 10-24 but I have seen 10-32 as well.
Tom
To add, bridge screws for up to 4/0 are 6-40 & screws for 6/0 & above are 10-32.
Thanks Guys those are pretty common sizes and they are easy to obtain. I will see what I can do at my end to make a list of the common Penn screws such as thread size and length.
This will be good for those guys that are just starting out..............................Joe
Lou: I appreciate you offer of charts but I have a ton of them already ;) ;D Thanks anyway..............................Joe
Quote from: Reel 224 on October 22, 2018, 03:31:49 PM
Thanks Guys those are pretty common sizes and they are easy to obtain. I will see what I can do at my end to make a list of the common Penn screws such as thread size and length.
This will be good for those guys that are just starting out..............................Joe
Thanks Joe. For those of us that just work on a
few handful couple dozen of our own reels, this would be nice information to have in one place. Especially screw lengths.
producers of the reels should state the exact code for each screw and shim, to the last digits, so that it can be found online.
There is a lot to the screw body and shape that counts a lot even if you couldnt tell the diference.
Most screws can be obtained through the manufactures and especially the old Peen reels though distributors like Mystic Penn parts.
When the real situation arises is with the alterations of reels like plates,bridges,and gears. When we choose to change those parts and alter the screw configuration, then that raise the question of what screw we want. Example: Slotted head, Socket head, Tourx. Especially when it comes to the bridge clutch screws....the require a partial thread and smooth shank, most always it has the be made by the builder(YOU).
The so called hot rod reels are like the hot rod cars. they look like the stock model but that is were it separates stock from Hot Rod. most of the time the Hot Rod is a more defined model of it's original design. Runs better,faster,smoother. And parts change.
The manufacture can not keep up with the innovators, but the innovators make the manufacture eventually make those changes because of the HOT RODERS!
Joe
I know they do, but I would like to be able finding it here localy for example. Because here in serbia things are very complicated when it comes to any exchange of goods with the rest of the world + it may cost more to ship those than the item itself.
Quote from: glos on October 24, 2018, 05:16:22 PM
I know they do, but I would like to be able finding it here localy for example. Because here in serbia things are very complicated when it comes to any exchange of goods with the rest of the world + it may cost more to ship those than the item itself.
We often take things here in the USA for granted because we have so much at our fingertips so to speak. And yes I understand what your dealing with. So I will try to give the information to those of you who are in the same situation as much as I can pass along. You just have to bear along with me as I am doing this when I have spare time. Like now. I'm answer phone calls helping my wife bring in groceries, checking deliveries. And sending out packages. :) Typical day. Oh and drinking Cold Coffee!
Joe
I'm lucky to have a specialty fasntener place right by my office. I can take the screw in and if they don't have them they'll order them for me even if it's only a few pieces. I just do penns and Newells but they have some odd screws. It's a great resource if you have a place like that nearby .
The down side is I never seem to get out of there without buy a tool or some gizmo that I "need". Haha
I was working on a small Asian lever drag reel yesterday and the screws that held the side plate on were IMO ridiculously small.
That reel is bound to suffer cross threaded screws before it gets serviced a few times.
I don't see the need for such small screws.
This is one reason why I like vintage reels. They have reasonable size screws that can be taken out and put back in many times without problems.
Basto
Alrighty then, this thread has me collecting some info. on screws, before I can get serious about meas. tools. Now I finally know that an 8-40 = decimal-diameter size 8, with 40 threads/inch. My ol' man showed me once what a 1/4-20 was, but the 1/4 just confused me when I came across single digit screw sizes.
Man, there's alota engineering stuff("pitch circle diameter"?) to learn...
Is it just me, or is the western system too complicated compared to the metric system. It's like they just randomly added things on as they went along.
Yeah Basto, that's what happened to my 80's Ambassedur, only it was me that wrecked about 3 side plate screws.
One Penn thread size that I have used is 1/4-28 left handed for the 706,700,704,710, & 712 handles. Got a set of taps and retreading die plus a half dozen nuts to save of few of the handles as they are almost unobtainium.
Sol sent me the thread size for the Smaller Penn stars 13/32-24 but I can not find a tap in that size. Same thread as Lincoln V-12 rod bolts.
I do have thread measuring tools and use them. Some of the Penn threads are not common as well as the screw head types and are available only from the factory or Mystic.
I like to clean up the threads before assembling my Penn's.