Randy just had 4.0 narrow frames and spools made. They were sold before Tiburon even started to make them. So what do you think everyone wants that can be made for us. I for one see a need for aluminum Shimano TDL side plates. I am looking for everyone's opinion here to see if it is worth having done. Or is there something else that everyone would want.
Mike
I would love an old style 114h side plate
Nick
A 114HNN would be beefed up 349. I have complete sideplates waiting.
Magnum anything. 12/0 frame.
I will put me and Daron for two 12/0 frames each. Clearly he might be working and hasn't seen this but I don't feel like I'm exactly going on a limb with that one lol. Unless he wants four which is quite possible.
Randy wanted to do a 114 wide but maybe a narrow Frame is what we really need.
Mike
These days with braid and line capacity not a big issue maybe magnum squidders and jigmasters for me.
Quote from: Swami805 on January 14, 2018, 09:25:43 PM
These days with braid and line capacity not a big issue maybe magnum squidders and jigmasters for me.
Me too!
Well squidder and jigmasters are everywhere. We all own several of them and plates and frames are everywhere. No need to make more of them. No one will buy them now. Alan C is building one already it should be here soon.
Mike
Magnum jigmaster with a spool that can handle the drag pressure of all the upgrades.
I love fishing my Tiburon 114HN.
Would love to see 114HNN.
I would really like a 112HN !
I know they have been made but I missed the bus on that one ...
Not magnums
Quote from: mikeysm on January 14, 2018, 09:49:37 PM
Well squidder and jigmasters are everywhere. We all own several of them and plates and frames are everywhere. No need to make more of them. No one will buy them now. Alan C is building one already it should be here soon.
Mike
While I love Penns, I use a lot of TLDs for light to medium trolling, I have 2 TLD 15s, 2 -20s, 2- 25s, 2 30 2 speeds and 50 with a Willfish frame. I have had the single speeds since the early 90's and they still serve me well, so why replace them. I also would like to see more innovations for these reels as there are a lot of aftermarket products for the Penns and even Newells already. There are a ton of single speed TLDs as well as the 2 speeds, out there on the water and there might be a market for a upgrade as long as it doesn't add considerable weight to the reel as one of the plusses is that they are a relatively lightweight trolling reel.
Scott
The TDL already have frames out there and plenty of parts. The side plates are the weak point of the reel. So it would benifit from aluminum plates. The 114 hnn frame would be a great choice also. I don't see making anymore smaller reel parts since Tom and Alan C have that already covered. You have to get so many people on board or it is just a waste of time. Anyway I was just throwing the idea out there anyway. You never know what people are willing to buy.
Mike
TLD20/30 2-speed side plates.... but by the time you cost it out maybe you could just buy a Talica?
Hello all,
Whatever you guys come up with, I hope you will give me a chance to put them on that beautiful new mill! ;D
Tom
349 sideplates?
Now that is Funny. ;)
I know what is on the list.
The Chairmen.
It takes years of prep.
Tom is the one that will make your wishes come true.
Master Craftsmen.
Quote from: Keta on January 15, 2018, 03:55:21 AM
349 sideplates?
Very soon, I thought I would have them last week.
Quote from: Cortez_Conversions on January 15, 2018, 03:46:07 AM
Hello all,
Whatever you guys come up with, I hope you will give me a chance to put them on that beautiful new mill! ;D
Tom
Oh boy, let the good times roll !!
349 side plates would be wonderful !!....
.....but so will anything else you decide to dream up.....I'm in !!
Thank you Tom, I could not help myself.
Build it and they will come.
Quote from: mikeysm on January 15, 2018, 02:21:21 AM
The TDL already have frames out there and plenty of parts. The side plates are the weak point of the reel. So it would benifit from aluminum plates. The 114 hnn frame would be a great choice also. I don't see making anymore smaller reel parts since Tom and Alan C have that already covered. You have to get so many people on board or it is just a waste of time. Anyway I was just throwing the idea out there anyway. You never know what people are willing to buy.
Mike
Enlighten me, please. There are TLD aftermarket frames out there? To my knowledge the weakest high stress link in this reel is the factory graphite frame, especially the base area around foot and clamp. Side plates on this well designed, light-weight, relatively inexpensive LD would be awesome, but I'd wanna start upgradin with the frame.
Gfish
Gfish
Quote from: otownjoe on January 14, 2018, 10:10:36 PM
Magnum jigmaster with a spool that can handle the drag pressure of all the upgrades.
I know that this is just a wish list, but the jigmaster magnum would be the top of my list.
Yup, Jiggy Magnum! Or a 4/0 magnum.
Ah, the wish list!
..............Lou
Quote from: Gfish on January 15, 2018, 07:01:09 PM
Quote from: mikeysm on January 15, 2018, 02:21:21 AM
The TDL already have frames out there and plenty of parts. The side plates are the weak point of the reel. So it would benifit from aluminum plates. The 114 hnn frame would be a great choice also. I don't see making anymore smaller reel parts since Tom and Alan C have that already covered. You have to get so many people on board or it is just a waste of time. Anyway I was just throwing the idea out there anyway. You never know what people are willing to buy.
Mike
Enlighten me, please. There are TLD aftermarket frames out there? To my knowledge the weakest high stress link in this reel is the factory graphite frame, especially the base area around foot and clamp. Side plates on this well designed, light-weight, relatively inexpensive LD would be awesome, but I'd wanna start upgradin with the frame.
Gfish
Gfish
Tom finished up with the most recent batch of frames for the Charter Special Tr1000, and Tr2000 Charter specials.
http://alantani.com/index.php?topic=22940.0
These are available from Alan, and make a great alternative for the old TLD 5 and 10, and compete well with some of the Avets.
Your thoughts on using the TLD series as a starting point for upgrading a lightweight, cost-effective lever drag reel have some seeious merit IMHO.
Some of these models could easily be pushed to produce higher drag numbers, if they had solid frames, side plates, SS double dogs, and possibly modified SS cams/bellevilles that could handle increased loads. An integral frame/tailplate, with an aluminum headplate designed for double dogs to be used with existing TLD internals could make for a sweet, lightweight lever drag. Some of these models come with aluminum spools, and can even accommodate larger drag discs, and steeper Belleville configurations then the stock reel. The challenge would be to make a kit or kits, that keep the reel in a price point that competes with existing models.
The top of my wish list would be a 30 sized, 2 speed reel, capable of utilizing 50 drag components, and putting out numbers similar to the Tiagra 50WLRS. It seems like this would be possible. A new 50WLRS sells for about $600. A 2 speed TLD 30II sells for about $240. That leaves some wiggle room for upgrades.
Alternatively, a 20 reel could be made with 30 drag components, and a steeper cam/Bellevilles to produce 50 size drag numbers.
Bear in mind Tiburon and others do, or have offered upgrades for these reels, but I believe They have been out of stock for some time, and they did not offer the machined head plate or double SS dogs (at least not in recent times?). Alan may have a few of these frames float around.
http://www.tiburonfishingreels.com/shimano-tld-2-speed-reels
Here is a Tiburon TLD 30 2 speed conversion for reference...
https://m.ebay.com/itm/NICE-CUSTOM-SHIMANO-TLD30-2-speed-fishing-reel-with-TIBURON-MAGNUM-CONVERSION/222790723470?_trkparms=aid%3D222007%26algo%3DSIM.MBE%26ao%3D2%26asc%3D20171010182013%26meid%3Dc8b9d392595942f1ab0d5ce1a73997a5%26pid%3D100890%26rk%3D11%26rkt%3D12%26sd%3D112719613290&_trksid=p2056116.c100890.m2460
And here is the alternative TLD 30 2-speed, Will Fish conversion...
https://m.ebay.com/itm/SHIMANO-TLD-30-2-SPEED-CUSTOM-WITH-WILL-FISH-FRAME-100-LB-SPECTRA/112719613290?hash=item1a3e9ccd6a:g:ycAAAOSwAaJaRmLA
This concept could be applied to the 20, 30, or 50 class reels. I think the 2-speed upgrades would make more sense (financially speaking) to me.
As a case in point, I have a local charter boat captain friend that has accumulated a whole box full of 'junk TLD 2 speeds that were just not cost-effective (i.e. parts costs were greater then buying a new reel) to repair. I am sure he would be willing to sell me these 'parts reels' for cheap. I am sure there are many of these nonfunctioning older TLDs 'parts reels' out there that could be had for cheap, or the new ones are actually not that expensive to begin with.
I think it is worthwhile to take a closer look at a frame/side plate/doible dog/drag/belleville upgrade kit for the TLD series of reels.
Another couple of requests would be:
-A run of replacement stands for the gen 1 Penn International 80 reels (often fail, and replacements are hard to come by)
-A batch of Penn International 130ST clicker pawl (could simply turn down the 130VSX pawl to specs). These are no longer available, and often need replacing.
-A SS handle arm that fits the 130ST, or maybe alternative arms for the Tiagra 80, and 130 reels. There are plenty if suitable handle knobs available, but the arms are tough to come by, and right now the Tiburon T-bar lite, and the reel colors handle are the only options fir the 130ST reels. A SS arm would give folks upgrade options for under $100.
-Penn clicker ratchet plates that have non-evenly spaced holes/teeth to give the clickers a louder/more custom sound. Although not needed, I think these would sell. I have heard alot of trolling customers complain that the Penn clickers should sound more like the Tiagras.
Just some ideas.
John
I'm with John on this one. The Penn 113H is the number one charter boat service reel with the TLD being their go to trolling reel. At least in the Gulf of Mexico.
I can't keep a TLD of any size in the shop and have built plenty the aforementioned Charter Special reels with the machined frames for customers.
Here the TLD is used inshore and offshore for bottom and trolling fishing. The TLD 20/25 single and two speed would be a good candidate for the frames. And the TLD 30 with a "square" frame.
One piece frame and side plate please.
Quote from: Tightlines666 on January 15, 2018, 07:40:16 PM
Your thoughts on using the TLD series as a starting point for upgrading a lightweight, cost-effective lever drag reel have some seeious merit IMHO.
I thought this too but thinking about it harder it doesn't really make economic sense.
After you throw a whole lot of $$ (frame and side plates and misc upgrades would have to be in the $200 territory, surely?) at it you basically have a single-speed Tyrnos - we'll assume the side plate is double-dogged etc.
Just going off Tackledirect, $189 for a new TLD25, so we're looking at $389 for the upgraded model. This is just over the cost of a Tyrnos 2-speed - so why wouldn't you just buy a Tyrnos? Or, an admittedly smaller reel but still all metal, 2 speed, and very good, an Okuma Metaloid 12II for $299?
Quote from: boon on January 16, 2018, 01:51:35 AM
Quote from: Tightlines666 on January 15, 2018, 07:40:16 PM
Your thoughts on using the TLD series as a starting point for upgrading a lightweight, cost-effective lever drag reel have some seeious merit IMHO.
I thought this too but thinking about it harder it doesn't really make economic sense.
After you throw a whole lot of $$ (frame and side plates and misc upgrades would have to be in the $200 territory, surely?) at it you basically have a single-speed Tyrnos - we'll assume the side plate is double-dogged etc.
Just going off Tackledirect, $189 for a new TLD25, so we're looking at $389 for the upgraded model. This is just over the cost of a Tyrnos 2-speed - so why wouldn't you just buy a Tyrnos? Or, an admittedly smaller reel but still all metal, 2 speed, and very good, an Okuma Metaloid 12II for $299?
The Tyrnos is not the same reel, I had in mind. It is smaller/less line capacity, has a cast frame, and plastic side plates, and would not have the drag capacity that A Super TLD might be able to achieve. Admittedly, the cost would likely be higher, but this going to be the case with most of the super/upgraded reels. I like the concept of finding a use for all of those older TLDs. Alot of details would need to be sorted in order for this to make sense. And you may be right, it might not. But I think it is worthy of serious consideration.
John
Just some handle side magnum plates for the CC squider and jigmaster kits. One side plate would be a great project for that shiny new machine. CC kits in regular or magnum?
Getting rid of the cheap frame and plastic side plates was the point of this discussion. Why buy the same problem I am trying to get rid of. I pay more for quality it isn't the price. You can keep shopping at Walmart or move up to better quality. There are plenty of parts around for the TDL also. So it is a good prospect for custom side plates. Their are custom frames available also.
Mike
I like the idea of a TLD frame. I think the idea behind this isn't so much about buying a new TLD and upgrading it, but giving a new life to reels that we already own. I'd go for the SS bridge and double dogs too! ;D
MIke
Quote from: otownjoe on January 14, 2018, 10:10:36 PM
Magnum jigmaster with a spool that can handle the drag pressure of all the upgrades.
+1 from me on this one.
But would also be VERY keen on the TLD frames and plates. As long as we can come up with a better arrangement for the main crank shaft support. I have found the original bush to wear out with frequent use, and thus winding can become rough at any drag setting due to the main and pinion gear becoming misaligned. There are an awful lot of TLD's out there, surely enough people would be interested breathing new life into these workhorses. I know I would.
10/0 Frame! It's long overdue, and can double as a 12/0 "narrow." ;D
Quote from: Fishy247 on January 16, 2018, 09:45:32 PM
I like the idea of a TLD frame. I think the idea behind this isn't so much about buying a new TLD and upgrading it, but giving a new life to reels that we already own. I'd go for the SS bridge and double dogs too! ;D
MIke
I love the idea of giving new life to an older reel, as do most of us here. My reservation is that it may end up being cost-prohibitive and end up with something that is likely a lesser reel than a Talica or Makaira.
If you added an instant anti-reverse, double dogs, more drag capacity and a frame and sideplates to handle it, then a proper handle, you would still have basically just a single-speed Talica. Personally I would rather get the TLD in tip-top 'Tani-fied' condition, maybe add a good handle, then sell it to someone that will use (and enjoy) it within the original design specification, then buy a Talica :)
I feel like if you're going to go to the trouble of designing, engineering and building parts like these then it should result in a new reel, like the extremely cool T4N1.
Well I guess you will miss out then. The best part about it is you have a reel that works the way you want it to. A one of a kind reel. When you get done it will be new if you want to use new parts inside.
Mike
Quote from: boon on January 17, 2018, 08:15:02 PM
My reservation is that it may end up being cost-prohibitive and end up with something that is likely a lesser reel than a Talica or Makaira.
This is a hobby and cost is not a big factor. I love taking my almost stock 40 year old plus 349H reels out for Pacific halibut and showing what the "old" gear can do, the ones with custom frames and internals are even better.
The only thing I have left that isn't worn out is my mind. The rest I slowly being replaced. I like to challange myself and dream up a new reel idea. What will it be and in a little time the light goes off and I start planning. I am driven to finish the project.
Mike
Quote from: Keta on January 17, 2018, 10:15:33 PM
Quote from: boon on January 17, 2018, 08:15:02 PM
My reservation is that it may end up being cost-prohibitive and end up with something that is likely a lesser reel than a Talica or Makaira.
This is a hobby and cost is not a big factor. I love taking my almost stock 40 year old plus 349H reels out for Pacific halibut and showing what the "old" gear can do, the ones with custom frames and internals are even better.
Different motivations I guess - I certainly enjoy modifying and repairing reels, a lot, but to me it's a means to an end: catching fish. If I can get a reel that will fish better for less money by purchasing an off-the-shelf model, that's what I'll be doing.
I prefer to catch fish with a tool I build, I built rods and rifles for the same reason.
I'm likely the least mechanically inclined person on here, but I can build a penn or a newell reel because they just don't have that many moving parts. I build all my own rods too and get a sense of satisfaction out of using gear I built. Clearly I spend more on a reel than I could buy a new one for but to me it's just a hobby like fishing. One of the beauties of this site is it has something for everyone, The guy looking to save a few bucks fixing his own gear or someone who wants a one of a kind reel.
Taste great! Less filling!
Did I mention magnum sideplates for smaller penns? oh yeah I did
Great topic,great site, Sheridan
mikey and boon.
I just want to thank you guys to agree and disagree without throwing knives.
We all have our own views, and it is nice to see you two respect each others.
Hats off to you both gentleman,
Daron ;)
So, my original question was about TLD frames. I have a 15 single speed model and consider it a "value reel"(function & bulid/price). Does someone make an aftermarket frame for this one? If so I'd vote for side plates for this little guy.
Gfish
Sheridan just finished my 349hc cradle rod for me . It cost me a small fortune to restore it to show condition. Thanks to Sheridans understanding that the rod is more than a rod. It a project of love and for me the money is well spent. Sometimes it takes a group effort to reach a goal. This is one of the only places on the internet you can do that.
Mike
Congrats on that build Mike.
I feel you, I have taken many a Senator and Morphed it into something totally different for about 5 times what the reel costs.
It is a labor of love indeed.
Put me down for the Squidder/Jigmaster Magnum sideplates.
I missed the boat/ never made the dock when they were available.
Was raising the Family in those days...
G fish, they never made a frame for a TLD 15, at least never saw one.
TLD 20,30,50 2spds
Tiburon and Willfish both made frames, Tib stopped some time ago. Willfish also stopped, but a new owner is going to build them again, the 20 and the 30. The 50 frame will come later...
I don't know if they are available yet???
I also think if someone made a TLD 10/15 frame, a lot of very good old reels would be fished again.
I have fished the Avets, Accurates, Tyrnos, Talicas, but to honest, I still like the TLDs better in the smaller sizes.
Danny :'( :'( :'(
Any narrow magnums and 114hnn would be my pick ;)
Quote from: Shark Hunter on January 18, 2018, 02:01:58 AM
mikey and boon.
I just want to thank you guys to agree and disagree without throwing knives.
We all have our own views, and it is nice to see you two respect each others.
Hats off to you both gentleman,
Daron ;)
Differences of view and opinion are what make an online place like this an interesting place to be :) As you say, nice to be able to exchange these views civilly, and the discussion here caused some introspection.
Keta, I can totally understand the satisfaction and pleasure in using something you built yourself.
My suggestion: a extra narrow frame + spool kit for the Makaira 16, single-piece frame and sideplate, thin the frame out a bit to save some weight. Ultimate super-heavy-duty jigging reel for southern hemisphere Yellowtail and Hapuka/Bass (Wreckfish).
Before Randy has a set of frames made he has to have 35 sold before hand. That's the least amount of frames before they will do it. Then there is a set up cost and 50% of the cost up front before they start. So he is putting up his own money to make it happen. He has to sell quite a few to make a profit. He does allot of work before they start. You have to give it to him for his effort so we can enjoy a new frame from tiburon.
Mike
Quote from: boon on January 18, 2018, 09:34:39 PM
Quote from: Shark Hunter on January 18, 2018, 02:01:58 AM
mikey and boon.
I just want to thank you guys to agree and disagree without throwing knives.
We all have our own views, and it is nice to see you two respect each others.
Hats off to you both gentleman,
Daron ;)
Differences of view and opinion are what make an online place like this an interesting place to be :) As you say, nice to be able to exchange these views civilly, and the discussion here caused some introspection.
Keta, I can totally understand the satisfaction and pleasure in using something you built yourself.
My suggestion: a extra narrow frame + spool kit for the Makaira 16, single-piece frame and sideplate, thin the frame out a bit to save some weight. Ultimate super-heavy-duty jigging reel for southern hemisphere Yellowtail and Hapuka/Bass (Wreckfish).
Hmm...
That would make for an interesting reel.
Quote from: mikeysm on January 18, 2018, 10:12:55 PM
Before Randy has a set of frames made he has to have 35 sold before hand. That's the least amount of frames before they will do it. Then there is a set up cost and 50% of the cost up front before they start. So he is putting up his own money to make it happen. He has to sell quite a few to make a profit. He does allot of work before they start. You have to give it to him for his effort so we can enjoy a new frame from tiburon.
Mike
When I request something I start setting aside $ and try to be one of the first to pay for it. Having inventory laying around is never good.
I just wanted everyone to understand what it takes to have frames made. That its a group effort to make side plates and frames a reality. Its not easy to get that many people to want the same thing and are willing to buy them.
Mike
Quote from: Jigtosser on January 18, 2018, 04:25:05 AM
Put me down for the Squidder/Jigmaster Magnum sideplates.
I missed the boat/ never made the dock when they were available.
Was raising the Family in those days...
Danny :'( :'( :'(
REMEMBER . . . The MAGNUM Squidder & Jigmaster will ALSO need special SPOOLS, since the Drive Mechanisms are from a larger reel and the Standard Spool WILL NOT WORK !
I would like the Magnum Squidders and Jigmasters, too.
ALSO, I would like to see a "Topless" 113HLW that uses a 114H Drive Mechanism ( increase the width from 3" to 3.5", too ) . . . a "stretched" MAGNUM 113HLW !
My plan would be to use a double-dogged 114H setup in there . . . It would be a BEAST !
PLEASE make the REEL FEET longer and wider than the Old Accurate and Tuburon frames . . . Those "stubby" little feet NEVER properly fit the hoods on larger reel seats !
Tight Lines !
Quote from: ez2cdave on January 19, 2018, 05:20:39 AM
The MAGNUM Squidder & Jigmaster will ALSO need special SPOOLS, since the Drive Mechanisms are from a larger reel .......
I don't have one to check, but the stock squidder spools should work in a magnum squidder - the 13-140 and 13-500 pinions are the same dimensions and tooth patern, the jigmaster pinion is recessed a bit at one end to accept the bushing. I'm pretty sure a 13-140 or 13-500 pinion will work with a 5-500 main gear in a magnum squidder with a stock spool. I could be wrong though :-\
Like Dave said the jigmaster magnum with 113H gear set needs a custom spool.
Mike
I own a squidder magnum. It requires a special spool to work. A 113 magnum the gear ratio wouhd be quite low because of the spool size. More of a winch reel with slow retrive .
Mike
Quote from: mikeysm on January 19, 2018, 12:22:29 PM
I own a squidder magnum. It requires a special spool to work.
I stand corrected :) and keen to learn. What is different about the magnum squidder spools Mike - is it the shaft length at either end? I'm thinking maybe the accurate magnum plates might not be as thick or wide as the stock squidder plates.
Mike
The shaft is larger and maybe longer I'm not sure. I haven't had it apart in a long time. But I do know that you can't use a stock squidder spool.
over the years I've come to own three or four TLD's, normally as parts of other deals I've done. i fished others' on their boats, but was never impressed with the overall quality vs. Penn GLS. Now, if plates and frames come available, all of a sudden you have my attention. It occurred to me that a red one with the red trim on the donor pieces might be pretty sharp, especially with matching Lou swirled knobs.
echo above sentiments...if all of us had the same vision, we'd all be fishing the same 113's on ugly sticks with no upgraded anything, now wouldn't we? Great civil discourse...something lacking in the world in general.
I would love to see 3/0 penn senator side plates or newell 220 side plates made
Quote from: mhc on January 19, 2018, 12:36:03 PM
Quote from: mikeysm on January 19, 2018, 12:22:29 PM
I own a squidder magnum. It requires a special spool to work.
I stand corrected :) and keen to learn. What is different about the magnum squidder spools Mike - is it the shaft length at either end? I'm thinking maybe the accurate magnum plates might not be as thick or wide as the stock squidder plates.
Mike
Here is why the spools have to be different:
1. On a typical classic penn conventional, the lip of the spool extends over the bridge plate. Switching to a bigger/stronger gear set means the bridge plate has to get wider, so it will no longer fit under the spool. On "magum" style conversions, the bridge plate is moved past the spool, and the spool spindle is extended still be able to reach the pinion and bearing cup. Moving the bridge out from under the spool also allows for the use of an existing bridge plate assembly from a larger reel.
2. In order to be compatible with an existing gear set from a larger reel, the spindle dimensions are increased to accomodate the new pinion.
I was playing around with the idea of a poor-man's magnum kit which would consist of a ONLY a new spool and a simple adapter plate. For example, a squidmaster kit would allow someone to join an existing fully assembled jigmaster right side plate to a squidder without touching any of the internals. Just use the one-screw disconnect and move the whole thing over. You could even go back and forth between the squidmaster and standard jigmaster without any tools. The adaptor plate is a very simple part that provides just the right amount of spacing to accommodate the magnum spool spindle, and providing the holes for the squidder frame one side, and the jigmaster sideplate ring on the other. The spool spindle dimensions should be about the same as a standard magnum spool. The spindle ends should have the right diameter to support the existing bearings.
I was going to prototype some adaptor plates if/when Alan C , Tom or another member came out with a new generation of magnum kits and spools, but then my shop closed down :(.
So, I am not not 100% positive that this will work, but it is not too hard of a garage project for several of you folks if all the details work out to allow using an existing magnum spool. An adaptor plate with a spool spindle made for the job should be pretty straightforward, but it will take a bit of luck for an existing magnum spool to work. My biggest concern was dealing with the bearing cups if the Accurate magnum spools require a larger bearing ID. Probably still doable, but then it might require some custom bushings to have enough room in the side plates. I never got my hands on a magnum spool to measure the whole thing out. Feel free to PM me if you want to attempt this and want more details.
I would encourage whover is looking into designing a new full squidder magnum kit to also look into the adaptor plate option, and also to consider making after-aftermarket spools for the Accurate kits. When I was messing around with the adaptor idea, it was basically impossible to get an Accurate magnum spool without buying the full reel. There should be at least a small demand for more spools for the Accurate kits already out there. Randy at Vintage Offshore Tackle probably has a good idea on the demand/scarcity.
The markets for franken-reel kits and new spools for magnums is probably tiny, but if somebody is already making a magnum kit, it might be possible to kill three birds with one stone.
On a completely different tack, I think that the primary purpose of aftermarket aluminum sideplates is not strength/rigidity but rather dimensional accuracy and stability. The reel works better, especially casting when everything is aligned properly, and stays aligned as the sideplates get exposed to water, sunlight, or just general aging. A stiff frame is the key. It keeps the sideplates from taking significant torsional (twisting) load, and the remaining load is mostly directional pulling on the bearing housing against the widest dimension of the sideplate. I ran some load simulation software on a jigmaster type reel, and as long as the frame was stiff enough, a properly designed sideplate out of reinforced nylon (AKA "graphite"), or even maple was doing just fine at the point where the spindle would start to permanently deform (bend). But it would be hard to make a sideplate out of these materials that would be as accurate as machined aluminum.
I'm not a mechanical engineer, so take all this with a grain of salt. The wide availability of material science information and design and simulation software means that I can try to figure this stuff out on my own. It does not mean that I am right :)
-J
Something I've noticed in reading through threads on this site... I lot of guys love Long Beaches, but no one makes a frame for them (I think). Admittedly, I'm not not a customer for this, but digging through the anecdotal marketing data says, "LONG BEACH!" :o
Too bad the shop closed down, I was always hoping you would get in the action on making us some custom parts.
Your work is amazing jurelometer ( Dave ), the best machined star I own to date is one of yours.
Sal
Quote from: boon on January 18, 2018, 12:10:30 AM
Different motivations I guess - I certainly enjoy modifying and repairing reels, a lot, but to me it's a means to an end: catching fish. If I can get a reel that will fish better for less money by purchasing an off-the-shelf model, that's what I'll be doing.
I must say that Im on the same boat than "Boon"
I really like all the upgrades and options for the 113h and many other reels but if all the cost for parts to have one a kind 113h "super tank" is going to be $450 dlls or more, well thats the reason I choose to save and get me a Makaira 15 (off-the-shelf-model) instead and Im happy with it, dont get me wrong, I actually have a T4n1 kit to build and Toms 113h sideplates on another 113hlw, I like both sides of the hobby but always with a budget on mind, if soomeone is not on a budget then its a different story.
btw, and to return to the main topic of the thread, I would like to see a Magnun 113h sideplates and spool.
Quote from: boon on January 18, 2018, 09:34:39 PM
My suggestion: a extra narrow frame + spool kit for the Makaira 16, single-piece frame and sideplate, thin the frame out a bit to save some weight. Ultimate super-heavy-duty jigging reel for southern hemisphere Yellowtail and Hapuka/Bass (Wreckfish).
just imagine if that happens someday ;D ;D ::) ::)
is someone in the market for a penn 50s and penn 16s? I need to save for two mak-16n 8)
Quote from: mikeysm on January 19, 2018, 12:22:29 PM
I own a squidder magnum. It requires a special spool to work. A 113 magnum the gear ratio wouhd be quite low because of the spool size. More of a winch reel with slow retrive .
Mike
Mike,
Yes, a 113 Magnum ( Black Senator ) would be SLOW . . . However, a "Special Senator" 113H Magnum would have the higher speed 114H gears in it . . . For even more speed, 4:1 aftermarket gears are available.
Tight Lines !
The gear set from pro challenger for a 113h is 4.0:1. The 114h is 3.25:1 . Scotts list the 113h stock gear at 3.25:1 and the 114h at 2.8:1.
Mike
Quote from: mikeysm on January 20, 2018, 02:02:07 AM
The gear set from pro challenger for a 113h is 4.0:1. The 114h is 3.25:1 . Scotts list the 113h stock gear at 3.25:1 and the 114h at 2.8:1.
Mike
I think there is/was a guy in Hawaii making 4:1 gears for the 114H, but I can't confirm that, right now.
Tight Lines !
Aluminum side plates with the quick take apart feature for spool changes would be cool.
Quote from: Alto Mare on January 19, 2018, 11:09:33 PM
Too bad the shop closed down, I was always hoping you would get in the action on making us some custom parts.
Your work is amazing jurelometer ( Dave ), the best machined star I own to date is one of yours.
Sal
That's high praise coming from the master reel builder. My designs always came out better thanks to your suggestions and feedback. At least for me, collaboration is critical for good functional design, even when making a humble drag star.
When I sent out prototype parts or lures to other folks for review, I would most often not hear anything back. I finally got tired of it. As a non-professional, it takes me too much time to make multiple parts. I am still making, just not sending out as many prototypes until I can figure out a way to separate the collaborating partners like yourself from the people looking for free stuff.
-J
Quote from: Decker on January 19, 2018, 09:32:56 PM
Something I've noticed in reading through threads on this site... I lot of guys love Long Beaches, but no one makes a frame for them (I think). Admittedly, I'm not not a customer for this, but digging through the anecdotal marketing data says, "LONG BEACH!" :o
Agree. Lotsa folks have Long Beach 60's. Didn't that guy Trond from Norway have a plan awhile back for LB 60 frames?
Gfish
I wish Trond would show back up, as well as the other missing Scandinavians.
There is not many parts for the 60, I put my project 60 together almost stock, SS gearsleve, SS AR dog and Bryans drag stack and gave it to my friends grandson. The post '90 Seaboy 185/190 project is coming along well, the 185 is finished and I'm waiting for funds to get another SS gearsleve for the 190. The 3.1:1 gear ratio is better for my needs that the 60's 2.5:1 but still not many aftermarket parts, and the reels are not that common.
Quote from: Gfish on January 22, 2018, 07:29:52 AM
Quote from: Decker on January 19, 2018, 09:32:56 PM
Something I've noticed in reading through threads on this site... I lot of guys love Long Beaches, but no one makes a frame for them (I think). Admittedly, I'm not not a customer for this, but digging through the anecdotal marketing data says, "LONG BEACH!" :o
Agree. Lotsa folks have Long Beach 60's. Didn't that guy Trond from Norway have a plan awhile back for LB 60 frames?
Gfish
Quote from: Keta on January 22, 2018, 12:30:05 PM
I wish Trond would show back up, as well as the other missing Scandinavians.
There is not many parts for the 60, I put my project 60 together almost stock, SS gearsleve, SS AR dog and Bryans drag stack and gave it to my friends grandson. The post '90 Seaboy 185/190 project is coming along well, the 185 is finished and I'm waiting for funds to get another SS gearsleve for the 190. The 3.1:1 gear ratio is better for my needs that the 60's 2.5:1 but still not many aftermarket parts, and the reels are not that common.
I've been reading through posts about the the Long Beach 60, and also the Penn Seaboy 185 & 190 (post 1990, graphite side plates). It seems to me that the the newer 185 Seaboy is a modernized Long Beach 60. The newer Seaboys are avaialble with two gear ratios, 3.1:1 and 3.5:1. The graphite Seaboy 190, with its frame and spool replaced with narrower ones, is a 185.
If someone were to produce a frame for the LB 60, it would also fit the Seaboy 185. And with that, you would have a choice of
three gear ratios: 2.5:1, 3.1:1, and 3.5:1 by using Long Beach 60, or graphite Seaboy side plates.
Years ago Tiburon made a 2/0 Senator frame, surprising, as a stock 2/0 is a pretty stout frame. Most likely this is why it disappeared, but it would be great for a hot rod LB60 project. Not sure if it was drilled for a LB60, maybe Ted knows, I think he was the one who enlightened me about the 2/0 Tib. 8)
Quote from: mo65 on February 01, 2018, 02:38:43 PM
Years ago Tiburon made a 2/0 Senator frame, surprising, as a stock 2/0 is a pretty stout frame. Most likely this is why it disappeared, but it would be great for a hot rod LB60 project. Not sure if it was drilled for a LB60, maybe Ted knows, I think he was the one who enlightened me about the 2/0 Tib. 8)
Wow, didn't think of the 2/0, Mo! The existence of that frame would put this idea one step closer to reality.
I think a frame for a 320 would be great. I'd get a few...
Quote from: Decker on February 01, 2018, 02:58:29 PM
Quote from: mo65 on February 01, 2018, 02:38:43 PM
Years ago Tiburon made a 2/0 Senator frame, surprising, as a stock 2/0 is a pretty stout frame. Most likely this is why it disappeared, but it would be great for a hot rod LB60 project. Not sure if it was drilled for a LB60, maybe Ted knows, I think he was the one who enlightened me about the 2/0 Tib. 8)
Wow, didn't think of the 2/0, Mo! The existence of that frame would put this idea one step closer to reality.
And the same frame could be used for a narrow 112H if you made a narrow spool to suit the pinion gear of the 112H. I don't know how wide they were but did the narrow 112H kits Tiburon made use the same frame as the tib 2/0 with extra side plate holes for the different screw spacing?
Mike
I've been feening for a narrow 112H for a looking time...
All you need to do is get at least 25 people to commit to purchasing 112 side plates and ask Tom to see if will make them. I don't know what amount Tom needs to start so I was just making a ball park figure.
Mike
Quote from: CooldadE on February 02, 2018, 10:00:42 AM
I've been feening for a narrow 112H for a looking time...
Tiburon produced a topless narrow (1 5/8") kit for the 112H high speed 3/0 Senator a long time ago. I have verified that they still have their engineering and set ups, so there would be no delays or tooling charges or other costs involved to have them run it again. All that they would require is a run of 35 kits, and maybe less since they already have the set up. I believe that the cost would be under $150 for the frame, spool and rod clamp kit.
I have copied this post to the Vintage Offshore Tackle forum. http://alantani.com/index.php?topic=24269.0 If you would want a Tiburon 112H kit for $149 plus $4.94 for shipping to anywhere in the USA, please post on that forum which standard Tiburon color you would like. Tiburon's standard colors are electric blue, cobalt blue, black, silver, red, purple and dark green. If and when we accumulate 20 orders, I will get a production date and exact cost from Tiburon and then check back with everyone to confirm that their orders are still firm. If there is enough interest, Tom might consider moving a 112H side plate project closer to the front of his project line up.
I do not believe that the holes pattern for the 111 2/0 and 112 3/0 are the same as the 112H high speed 3/0, and I also think that the spool shafts may be different, so the 112H kits may not fit those models. I am not home right now so I can't check, but maybe some one else can tell us.
I've never heard of the narrow 112H before, but would be interested. Sounds like a smaller yo-yo? Anyone have a pic or a link?
Quote from: Vintage Offshore Tackle on February 02, 2018, 03:49:52 PM
I do not believe that the holes pattern for the 111 2/0 and 112 3/0 are the same as the 112H high speed 3/0, and I also think that the spool shafts may be different, so the 112H kits may not fit those models. I am not home right now so I can't check, but maybe some one else can tell us.
You're correct, the hole patterns and the spool shafts are different - you could probably overcome that with extra holes in the frame and different spools but the width is wrong also. 1 5/8" is narrower than the 2/0 and LB60, they are around 1 13/16" wide. For some reason I thought the narrow 112H frames were the same width as the 2/0
Quote from: Decker on February 02, 2018, 04:40:34 PM
I've never heard of the narrow 112H before, but would be interested. Sounds like a smaller yo-yo? Anyone have a pic or a link?
Lee (keta) have an awesome 112h narrow with topless frame, but photobucket tookdown those pictures, maybe he can attach them again direct to a post so they cannot be deleted.
I was after that route, I even double dogged the stock sideplate and got one of his octagon inserts, I had plans to get the narrow frame but the extra narrow frame for the 113h appeared first. :-\ ;D
.
I have a pair of 112HN reels. Here's is the frame kit for the first one, with a 99 width 112H and the parts donor at the bottom.
(http://alantani.com/gallery/23/1583_03_02_18_6_20_46.jpeg)
Next to a 501
(http://alantani.com/gallery/23/1583_03_02_18_6_20_10.jpeg)
Very nice, Lee. Thank you.
I really need one of these for my narrow tiburon 3/0 senator...now all wi need is a stainless double dog set up
Quote from: Keta on January 22, 2018, 12:30:05 PM
I wish Trond would show back up, as well as the other missing Scandinavians.
There is not many parts for the 60, I put my project 60 together almost stock, SS gearsleve, SS AR dog and Bryans drag stack and gave it to my friends grandson. The post '90 Seaboy 185/190 project is coming along well, the 185 is finished and I'm waiting for funds to get another SS gearsleve for the 190. The 3.1:1 gear ratio is better for my needs that the 60's 2.5:1 but still not many aftermarket parts, and the reels are not that common.
I found that thread about the 2/0, 60 frame from Trond. Wish I had read it sooner: http://alantani.com/index.php?topic=12543.15
What about the TLD Star series. 15/30 and 20/40. These reels have huge stainless gears for a 3/0 size reel. Take drag washers the size of a 114h and with a carbontex upgrade will pull 20 lb of drag.
I agree the TLD sideplates would be popular. I hope it can become a reality someday.
Mike
Nice job Lee, looks great!!!!
..........Lou
Quote from: RUSTY OLD COLT on February 05, 2018, 01:45:31 PM
I really need one of these for my narrow tiburon 3/0 senator...now all wi need is a stainless double dog set up
Rusty Old Colt, I still have a few new silver Tiburon T3N narrow frame/spool/rod clamp kits left. They are 1 5/8" wide between the side plates, the same width as the 322, 501, 1/0, etc. I can deliver one to you for $153.94 including shipping by USPS first class parcel with tracking. Would you like one?
I also picked up a mint in the original box 1980's P220F if you are still looking for one.
Thanks,
Randy
What we really need are 6/0 side plates. To go with the up coming 6/0 narrow kits.
Mike
Second the 6/0 plates, but to work with older Tib and newer tip frames
All he would do is make newer style plates. Then all you would need to do is install the inner ring on the older style frames.
Mike
Quote from: ReelFishingProblems on March 19, 2018, 12:54:16 AM
Second the 6/0 plates, but to work with older Tib and newer tip frames
YES . . . The 6/0 plates in
RED !
Tight Lines !
I would like to see 112H side plates made for the 3/0 kit.
Joe
I'd love a set of plates for my 112H kit too!
112H plates, YEAH!
The stock rings often seem to split; sufficient justification to buy plates! ::)
You guys want harness lugs on the 112H plates?
No lugs. Dilly dilly!
Tom, 112H plates in purple and black, please! No lugs.
Thanks, .. Lou
Tom, could the hole pattern for the bridge be adjusted a little, or did you want a direct copy from Penn?
if the adjustment is possible, the custom double dog bridge and everything else that follows could be sweet on the 112H.
just a thought.
Sal
I'd vote no lugs, hope it happens!
I,m in for a set of blue plates and if it is possible to make the double dog bridge for the 112H that would be great also.
Joe
P.S. I received my 112H from Randy yesterday and it's a gem. I am doing up grades to the internals, as soon as there finished I'll post pictures.
No lugs on the 112h if you please ...
Cool
Tom,
You know what I'm waiting for. ;)
I quadruple vote for what Sal said!
I don't know why the 500 bridge wasn't used on the 112H, but that was a goof by Penn IMNSHO. A fully done up SS 112H would be the business.
Ron
Quote from: Cortez_Conversions on March 24, 2018, 12:37:33 AM
You guys want harness lugs on the 112H plates?
No Lugs . . . I can't imagine why Penn ever put harness lugs on that small of a reel .
Quote from: ez2cdave on March 26, 2018, 05:47:42 PM
Quote from: Cortez_Conversions on March 24, 2018, 12:37:33 AM
You guys want harness lugs on the 112H plates?
No Lugs . . . I can't imagine why Penn ever put harness lugs on that small of a reel .
Penn didn't.
What Sal said !
Cool
Quote from: Vintage Offshore Tackle on March 26, 2018, 06:01:59 PM
Quote from: ez2cdave on March 26, 2018, 05:47:42 PM
Quote from: Cortez_Conversions on March 24, 2018, 12:37:33 AM
You guys want harness lugs on the 112H plates?
No Lugs . . . I can't imagine why Penn ever put harness lugs on that small of a reel .
Penn didn't.
You're right . . . For some reason the image of the Daiwa Sealine 300H "popped" into my head, while I was typing before - LOL !
Tight Lines !
(http://www.pensacolafishingforum.com/attachments/f52/3204-daiwa-sealine-300h-reel-fs-dsc00386-jpg)
(http://www.pensacolafishingforum.com/attachments/f52/3205-daiwa-sealine-300h-reel-fs-dsc00387-jpg)
(http://www.pensacolafishingforum.com/attachments/f52/3207-daiwa-sealine-300h-reel-fs-dsc00385-jpg)
The Penn 10 Mag is classic. It's Squidder with a 4:1 retrieve and a level-wind. It could really use a frame upgrade. I suppose creating a frame with a level-wind would be a pain, but many would want to remove it anyway. There certainly seems to be a decent supply of this reel available too.
The image below is from Mike's thread on his pioneering work with with this reel: http://alantani.com/index.php?topic=22851.0 (http://alantani.com/index.php?topic=22851.0%20 )
(http://alantani.com/index.php?action=dlattach;topic=25045.0;attach=52486;image)