Hi Guys,
My definition for heavy mono is actually 40 lbs and above. Actually, i am trying to tie some 40 lb mono. I have been tying the clinch knot with 40 lb mono for some time and have been getting "pig tails" near my swivel as in my other post. According to Animated Knots, the improved clinch is not recommended for mono above 30 lbs. So, i am looking for new knots for heavy mono in the range of 40-80 lb range.
The knots i know how to tie currently are the clinch knot and uni-knot.
I just googled the centauri knot yesterday and is looking for an alternative for the centauri knot for heavy mono.Always better to have an alternative right? I was trying the palomar knot for 40 lb recently, but also had problems tying it .......
What knots do you guys use and what do you recommend?
I think by lessening the amounts of twists, the improved clinch knot can be used with heavier mono without seeing much weakening of line; granted there maybe better knots like the palomar. I regularly tie clinch knots with 60lb when attaching terminal tackle.
many long rangers use the san diego knot for their terminal tackle. How you tighten it is very important to its success. It must be lubricated. it must be tightened slowly and it must be pulled TIGHT It works on big stuff like 130 flouro 200 mono. Takes a p air of pliers to pull it tight with the bigger stuff. Many tackle boxes on long range have been fitted with an eye bolt to assist on pulling tight with pliers.
http://alantani.com/index.php?topic=21876.0
I have good success with a Trilene knot for heavier line. Just be sure to lubricate and pull tight.
http://www.animatedknots.com/trilene/index.php
I'd use a San Diego on 40lb and double Sand Diego on 60lb and up. Palomar works great on 40lb too.
40lb mono/floro is about as heavy as I get. I use a palomar or 4 turn clinch - don't forget to lube it ;)
To me "heavy" is something between 80 and 300 pound.
Try a "Springer Knot".
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DDokeGDkAt8&feature=share (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DDokeGDkAt8&feature=share)
Yeah. Any line I can't double-up before tying is heavy mono. >or= to 40lb. I use an improved clinch--- 2 loops around the hook/lure eye, then there's a 1/2 granny in the end a the line in case it still slips. Last part important, 'cause I don't tighten to the point of creasing the mono., let it tighten by itself, it ain't gonna come undone.
Also, max. of 4 twists can reduce creasing
I use a San Diego knot. It's easy and strong.
I use the SD knot also. Lite lines up to 30 lb I use 7 turns. 40-60 5 turns. It works for me, I never lose a hook and have a curly-Q at the end of my line. If you ever do see a curly-Q at the end of your line when you lose a hook that means your knot came undone.
The SD works real well.
I also like the San Diego jam knot.
This is a little OT, but when using most light (under 30 lb) copolymers, I've found it important to double the line when tying to terminal tackle. Most copolymers are soft and might not stand up well to the eyes they are tied through.
--Mike
Ive had good luck with a perfection loop in 40 lb fluoro. That knot is one of my favorites for leader to lure or terminal tackle.
I just tie unis up to maybe 150lb, especially where strength isn't absolutely paramount, i.e. I am only using that line weight for abrasion resistance rather than outright pull.
Any heavier line, or where I want to be able to pull really, really hard on a fish, I tie the AG Chain knot; it's a true 100% knot that you can't really get wrong.
EDIT: Or crimp.
if you want to check strength of knots try paulusjustfishin.com
the data there is from actual measurements, nothing has been added in years now but data is still good, and its not opinionated but factual
x2 bill - the data is still good!
Quote from: Gfish on March 24, 2018, 03:26:21 PM
Yeah. Any line I can't double-up before tying is heavy mono. >or= to 40lb. I use an improved clinch--- 2 loops around the hook/lure eye, then there's a 1/2 granny in the end a the line in case it still slips. Last part important, 'cause I don't tighten to the point of creasing the mono., let it tighten by itself, it ain't gonna come undone.
Also, max. of 4 twists can reduce creasing
x2,,,,that's how I do my 8lb and 3lb fly line 3 times stronger ;D
I don't like the Palomar. For lighter line I still like/use the improved clinch. I like the San Diego for lures and ringed hooks. It's what we were using for big tuna last week in Puerto Vallarta. The Trilene is good for heavier line and is pretty easy to tie correctly. I caught a cow using the Springer the first time I tried it, it's that easy to get right. I don't know that I'd use it for 40#. The uni is easy and good, that's why it's the UNIversal knot. Use 5 wraps for 40# and 4 for 80-130#. As always, the best knot to tie is the knot you tie best.
Quote from: bill19803 on March 25, 2018, 01:04:06 AM
if you want to check strength of knots try paulusjustfishin.com
the data there is from actual measurements, nothing has been added in years now but data is still good, and its not opinionated but factual
The knot data there is a mess, he has the FG breaking at some stupidly low number where other people who have tested it under IGFA conditions have found it a lot better.
Quote from: boon on March 25, 2018, 03:39:04 AM
Quote from: bill19803 on March 25, 2018, 01:04:06 AM
if you want to check strength of knots try paulusjustfishin.com
the data there is from actual measurements, nothing has been added in years now but data is still good, and its not opinionated but factual
The knot data there is a mess, he has the FG breaking at some stupidly low number where other people who have tested it under IGFA conditions have found it a lot better.
The FG is an easy knot to tie, but not easy to tie right. A poorly done FG wont hold hardly any weight, but a well done one will not break at the knot.
Quote from: Gfish on March 24, 2018, 03:26:21 PM
Yeah. Any line I can't double-up before tying is heavy mono. >or= to 40lb. I use an improved clinch--- 2 loops around the hook/lure eye, then there's a 1/2 granny in the end a the line in case it still slips. Last part important, 'cause I don't tighten to the point of creasing the mono., let it tighten by itself, it ain't gonna come undone.
Also, max. of 4 twists can reduce creasing
Would you consider these twp lines poorly tied? Creasing-->Pigtails?
https://imgur.com/a/KWrgN (https://imgur.com/a/KWrgN)
https://imgur.com/a/H1o6Q (https://imgur.com/a/H1o6Q)
It looka like there's a slight crease in the line. Do you think it'ed be enough to cut down on your lb. test? My guess is, if the line gets friction heated enough while being creased, it'll negitively impact it's strength. Best to test. Repeated tests witha scale might reveal the answer.
I've lost some nice keeper/eaters at, and just above the knot.
Quote from: Gfish on March 26, 2018, 12:53:11 AM
It looka like there's a slight crease in the line. Do you think it'ed be enough to cut down on your lb. test? My guess is, if the line gets friction heated enough while being creased, it'll negitively impact it's strength. Best to test. Repeated tests witha scale might reveal the answer.
I've lost some nice keeper/eaters at and just above the knot.
this fly fisherman expert at cabeles said spit on you knots before tightening ::) but it works :D
Quote from: Gfish on March 26, 2018, 12:53:11 AM
It looka like there's a slight crease in the line. Do you think it'ed be enough to cut down on your lb. test? My guess is, if the line gets friction heated enough while being creased, it'll negitively impact it's strength. Best to test. Repeated tests witha scale might reveal the answer.
I've lost some nice keeper/eaters at and just above the knot.
Unfortunately that is 30 lb line. Dont think i can get any lower than that...... It hurts when you arent good at tying knots. If practice makes perfect, a good knot is long overdue.
Gonna suggest you use just enough line to finish without havin to trim any, or even pull more than 1/4 in. or so to chinch. For me, this'ed mean 3-4 twists, then just barely get the end through the bottom(double looped around the hook/swivel/lure -eye), so the granny knot is up against the double loop, the whole clinch knot somewhat loose.
Been practicing tying more knots, snelling hooks and this is what i have concluded...
Hooks have an "ideal" line diameter to use while snelling.... once you exceed this diameter, it becomes really hard to snell the hook properly w/o getting "pigtails" and kinks. This is due to the line rubbing against the inside of the hook eye while pulling the standing line. So either you switch to a larger hook, or you use high tensile, low diameter line to tie your rigs. So forget about snelling high poundage lines to small/medium size hooks... it isnt going to work well anyway....
For tying heavy heavy mono knots, you need to snug the knot and make sure it forms properly before the final draw on the standing line. For light mono it is not a prob as the knots forms readily. For heavy mono, it becomes a large problem as there is too much friction involved and applying too much pressure on your line, stretches it, and brings it beyond its elasticity point, forming "pigtails" as we call it. When tying knots, you need to know the "point of no return" of your class/test line. Unless you have some kind of super lube, it is best to snug the knot by hand, instead of snugging it by pulling the standing/tag end. But of course you need prior knowledge of the knot, how it forms and what it should look like if you use this method.
Do you guys agree on what i said or is it back to the drawing board again?
Yeah, good points.
Nothin worse when fishin and gettin bit, than a combo. of losin an expensive rig/lure, thinkin about a fish havin to deal with a hook(s) still in it's mouth, then havin to retie another rig.
I launch my yak with 5 rigged poles and always answer the beach people's questions 'bout it: "It's too hard out there to change to a diffrent rig and tie a good knot, best for me to rig-up at home and deal with the excess rod thing out there, as best I can".
Not braggin, but I can't remember the last time I bust off a rig at the knot. Last time fishin I bent a hook ona jig gettin it back offa the reef, and pulled another one oudda a sea turtle's shell under a LOTS a strain. Then there's those 2 big 'uns that shredded my leader on the reef and probably ended up with swimbaits hangin out their mouths(ouch!) and some line... Alright I am braggin. Sounds like ya got it, or your gettin it down, though.
Seems reasonable. Alot of it is hair splitting tying knots. Pick a few knots, learn to tie them correctly and you should be fine. I've been tieing the same knots forever and know I get them right. I'm sure there's better knots out there but I'm too lazy to re-invent the wheel. That's just me.
I snell hooks too but have never done it with heavy line and normally on octopus hooks with offset eyes or those tiny trout hook with no eye. If you watch it closely as you snell it it's a thing of beauty while you cinch it as the wraps come tight. If it's not looking right cut it off and start over. Same with the San Diego jam, if it's not right you'll see it's not cinching right.
I have found the same thing regarding the FG.
The FG & RP being 2 knots where the line & not the knot breaks when testing using Ande line. Many who claim their knots test out stronger than the line they are using are unaware of the actual break strength of the used.
Tournament line will be accurate I think. As far as giving you an idea of how well you did. On the original post knot for heavy leader material, Dominick lead me to the Baja Loop. Don't know how it tests but worked for my application. Tight lines, Brendan.