Had some free time went out to do do some initial casting for distance using these two reels.
Fellas, sorry having trouble posting the video. I'm working on getting it sorted... Jeff
https://drive.google.com/file/d/14HLXAXHKLWk9STyl2FEAE_hzyckeh8t6/view?usp=sharing
And?
The way I see it, the two reels have different roles. The Baja has a bigger spool with capacity for higher test line. It also has a pinion that disconnects from the spool when out of gear. I know it casts like a dream, but it does better with heavier bates like reaaly big sardines, or better yet mackerel. The T4XN has a lighter spool and reduced capacity. I haven't used it yet but I'd bet the lighter spool has the advantage over the disconnecting pinion when it comes to lighter baits.
The T4XN may be the best star drag for bigger (25-40 pound) schoolie YT out there when running 60# braid and a 40 top shot. The Baja comes out when you are into tuna bigger than a shibi or into once in a lifetime yellowtail.
Ron
See if this works.
https://drive.google.com/file/d/199FRHPwPoiRzGEKIgQweBThHfut5w51evQ/view?usp=sharing
Hey, you flipped them around!
The Man
interesting...
Sal
Very nice cinema work.
The suspense generated is a tribute to Hitchcock.
Thanks!
Steve
Nice, now go catch some big cats bud!
Quote from: Ron Jones on October 28, 2018, 12:51:51 AM
Hey, you flipped them around!
The Man
;D No it's a different pic
https://drive.google.com/file/d/1AXwVSl5JcKo2sovYM7cp6F8jnuQEpCYM/view?usp=sharing
https://drive.google.com/file/d/1KLMR8F-cSWHc4uo81Qvz-uwwQQ5l3KRP/view?usp=sharing
Quote from: swill88 on October 28, 2018, 01:07:21 AM
Very nice cinema work.
The suspense generated is a tribute to Hitchcock.
Thanks!
Steve
Sorry about that. I was experiencing technical difficulties... Jeff
Ok it was getting dark & cold & my phone's battery was getting low..... I made two casts with the T4 where I laid into it a little harder. Both casts went 99 steps. Two casts from the Baja with both meashuring some 80 odd steps.
However the Baja has 100 yard topshot of 60 mono the T4 topshot was much shorter. So next time I expect I'll be a better caster with both reels & will have the same length topshot on both.
This was fun... Jeff
So,
Here's a loaded question. When comparing rigs like this, is it appropriate to load both of them with the exact same line or should they be compared as they'd be fished?
Same for rods?
Just food for thought.
The Man
Quote from: Ron Jones on October 28, 2018, 05:05:31 AM
So,
Here's a loaded question. When comparing rigs like this, is it appropriate to load both of them with the exact same line or should they be compared as they'd be fished?
Same for rods?
Just food for thought.
The Man
Ron, this is how I plan to fish them. Both with100 braid & 60 - 80 mono topshots. I dont need that much capacity.
The objective was to see if one cast noticeably better than the other regardless of the supposed pluses one reel might have over the other. I was not attempting to find the ultimate distance either of these reels could cast.
The type of casts made were the same used if one where tossing a live bait. I was in no way swinging for the fences on any of my casts made during this time.
But if some one tested as you suggest spooling them with differeing weight line, using different rods there would of course be a noticable difference. With them both seemingly at this point close in their respective casting performance using the same weight line.
Ron, I hope I'm understanding & not giving a meaningless explanation of what I was attempting here. Which was nothing more than trying to establish an answer to satisfy my curiosity... Jeff
Either way, that's some impressive distance with 4/0 class reels, and I know you are using shorter rods than what might be done with, say a 12'-13' ulua rod. Good work.
You know I'm very happy with the distance. They cast as far as a person would realisticly want toss a live bait haveing it stay lively on hook... Jeff,
That's exactly what I was asking, Jeff. I've sen some people try to compare apples to apples with rigs that were so different that they were really comparing apples to giraffes! Of course one would cast further.
The way I see it, if your looking for best distance between two similar class reels, say a Mak and an Avet 2 speed of similar capacity and drag range then you should load them with the same line and use the EXACT same rod. Otherwise, other differences in the whole rig might mask any advantage one reel as over the other.
Ron
Quote from: Ron Jones on October 29, 2018, 01:16:52 AM
That's exactly what I was asking, Jeff. I've sen some people try to compare apples to apples with rigs that were so different that they were really comparing apples to giraffes! Of course one would cast further.
The way I see it, if your looking for best distance between two similar class reels, say a Mak and an Avet 2 speed of similar capacity and drag range then you should load them with the same line and use the EXACT same rod. Otherwise, other differences in the whole rig might mask any advantage one reel as over the other.
Ron
X2 on this. Though I think the Okuma Makaira and Avet 2 speeds are not in the same class. The Raptors are closer in a match to the Makaira's for the smaller reels under the 30 Avet and 20 Okuma
These reels are of course different. Both seeing some refinement in different areas of their build over a regular stock 4/0.
Mainly I was just curious if the lighter spool of the T4 would overcome the Bajas disconnecting pinion, with spool being fully supported by bearings.
For my use with heavy line it appears both are capable casters for their size. In fact they both compare well with other reels of recent design.
The fishing I do I don't feel like I'm fishing a lesser reel with the T4 with its 3.25:1 gears. Same goes for my
Baja / US113 reels.
However I say this knowing my three 2 speed reels will always have a solid place in my arsenal... Jeff
I'm still waiting the day where I'm into a fish that makes a full 4/0 hotrod a "lesser" reel...Dominick has caught marlin on the Tank with 100lb braid....
Quote from: Rivverrat on October 28, 2018, 01:44:19 AM
Quote from: swill88 on October 28, 2018, 01:07:21 AM
Very nice cinema work.
The suspense generated is a tribute to Hitchcock.
Thanks!
Steve
Sorry about that. I was experiencing technical difficulties... Jeff
Getting compared to Hitchcock is nothing but a complement. I enjoyed your video Jeff.
Steve
Steve, its all good you made me laugh... Jeff
Quote from: thorhammer on October 29, 2018, 03:10:38 AM
I'm still waiting the day where I'm into a fish that makes a full 4/0 hotrod a "lesser" reel...Dominick has caught marlin on the Tank with 100lb braid....
My comment came based on my on going surprise of people, some whom I respect & turn to for their thoughts & advice on gear & fishing in general. But am amazed when I hear what they think of reels such as the Baja / US113.
Don't bother bringing up a hot rodded 4/0.... Jeff
Your videos won't load here in my end of the woods. Judging by the "reviews" they are a must see!
Ill try again later.
The Tank seems to be one of those magically symbiotic specimens assembled by a master that performs beyond reason when played like a Stradivarius by a wizard of his craft!
All BS aside, I am also a little tired of hearing how things that were world class a brief moment in time ago are now worthless. I've caught fish on a YTS that most fishermen dream about maybe once in their lives having the opportunity to catch (I realize that anything I've caught isn't all that special for many on here.)
After these last 2 trips to Mexico, I do see where there is a place for 2 speed lever drag wonder reels, but my heart will always go back to what worked for my grandfather.
The Man
Agree...you don't have to search hard to find grander fish decades back on Senators, which were VERY likely to be bone stock with three piece spools, leather / asbestos drags, and dacron. Sure, modern two-speed and braid with a 21st century composite rod makes a smaller-lighter combo...but there were some really large BFT, billfish, tigers, GWS, mako's and the world record hammerhead (1200 lbs or so) caught on Senators...
Hot-rodded by Daron, yes, but our own Mike beasted a tiger over 12ft from a pier last year on a 16/0 and a massive boat rod that was made for anything BUT stand-up fishing...yet, he did....
Sal got 75lbs of drag on a 9/0. Try holding on to that standing up in pitching boat...
you know, for me, the thing that has always made the biggest difference in my casting? yup, it's the rod....... ;D
Quote from: Rivverrat on October 28, 2018, 05:19:00 AM
............ I hope I'm understanding & not giving a meaningless explanation of what I was attempting here. Which was nothing more than trying to establish an answer to satisfy my curiosity... Jeff
for me thats enough LOL, I like to made tons of "what if.." test on my rigs, with different weights, rods, lines most of them are against "the fishing rules" so, they are mostly to satisfy my curiosity and self teaching.
Quote from: Rivverrat on October 29, 2018, 01:18:53 PM
My comment came based on my on going surprise of people, some whom I respect & turn to for their thoughts & advice on gear & fishing in general but am amazed when I hear what they think of reels such as the Baja / US113.
Don't bother bringing up a hot rodded 4/0.... Jeff
since I saw Randy coming with this idea of the XN kit of the 113h I saw it as a "MUST HAVE" toys for my arnseal with its light and narrow spool with with the tons of current upgrades it for tons of power on a small package.
glad to see you taking the time for this tests that make me feel that I wasnt wrong on my expectations, somehow the overal and simplicity construction of the 113h will outlast the many moving parts and bearings of the Baja.
I have two YTS reels with alloy sideplates and Tib frame but never were goto reels (being a tackle ho didnt help also), in other side the T4nx its a smaller and lighter fun reel to fish with and since built with have gone fishing with me and all my trips, along with the Baja and Mak15.
A Tanked out T4XN still costs more than an Avet HXJ Raptor. Me? I'd rather fish the HXJ Raptor! You could still be driving a 40 Ford like your granddaddy but I bet you don't.
A smaller 2 speed reel is a must have for me and Baja. The only real I bring down with me as an Avet JX 2 speed. Of course I have other reels down in Baja but I always bring the JX with me. It is a fine 40 lb test reel and l have caught Monsters with it including Marlin and sailfish
A JX Raptor is what I used last month at Cedros.
Quote from: MarkT on October 29, 2018, 06:19:45 PM
A Tanked out T4XN still costs more than an Avet HXJ Raptor. Me? I'd rather fish the HXJ Raptor! You could still be driving a 40 Ford like your granddaddy but I bet you don't.
I am currently picking a 70s Mopar to turn into a restomod. It will be as nice as any OEM today, or as nice as I decide to make it. Really similar to a T4XN?
The Man
Ron, thats funny.
Like Ive said before 2 speeds will always have a place for me. In most cases though for my fishing their high is to fast & the low to slow... Jeff
Hey Jeff, new to this site and poking around the forums I noticed this topic and can relate on many levels. Firstly I found out about the T4N1 Kits from Randy Pauly, I contacted him and found out he had one still available and ordered it. Since then I found a nice late style 113H 4/0 on eBay and ordered it for a donor reel. This will be my fifth designated Flathead cat reel.
I currently have stock standard 113H, 2-4/0 narrowed YTS Tiburon reels and a Tiburonized 112H 3/0 that I use exclusively for Flathead fishin'. I use 80# and/or 60# Big Game mono on these reels and have a few custom Flathead rods based on Calstar glass blanks. I figure the T4N1 will be perfect for a 50# class line cat setup. I have long considered spending $250 on a Baja Special but see no real advantage over what I already have. Unless you fish from the bank in some circumstances you may desire more casting distance, but in a boat, for Flatheads you just need to cast 40 feet or so behind the boat with a live bluegill and a 2 or 3oz sinker. Something you can do on these Penn's is fine tune and modify the clickers (bending the ring in the side plate with pliers) a bit for less resistance when the fish makes a run, tight enough to keep a 6" bluegill in place while waiting for a bite but loose enough that the bait can pull clicker when it gets nervous or gets bit. Also tight enough that if a big 'un takes off on a run that the reel won't backlash while the rod is in the rod holder, heaven forbid! If in doubt, leave the clicker alone and as they say, don't try this at home! To justify the new Kit and reel I figure that I'll end up with more drag capacity than the 3/0 that uses 500 size drag washers, even though I've landed big fish on it with no problems. I also have a T3N kitted 3/0 but it really doesn't have the line capacity I think I need? Do I need a trick ultra narrow 4/0 to catch catfish? No. Do I want one anyway? Of course!
Hey Yellowcat, it is good to have you here.
The 4/0 for me while bigger with more line capacity than I need allows for some things that smaller lighter reels dont. It allows me to toss out my bait walk back a ways to get get back under the trees with the rod & enjoy the shade when its hot. Still having enough line to fight any fish I may hook on the river.
Using braid, with shorter mono leader, fill them to half their capacity. this acheives some positive things for me. It lowers the gear ratio, ups the drag to a level that would grenade a lot of reels in its weight class in short order. Making this reel capable of skull dragging most any Flathead or Blue from it's home. Spooling line only half way also gives me a lot of real estate for my thumb when casting. Keeping my thumb off the line.
Only other conventional reel in this weight class I'm aware of that will give years of trouble free use fished in the same manner is the Avet HX Raptor. Had one I sold. Wish I had it back.
While the 4/0 isn't the blingiest or the best, in most cases it's good enough. It works & keeps doing so after years of hard use. Parts are cheap & readily available.
The Penn 4/0 is the Chevy 350 of fishing reels... Jeff
Quote from: Ron Jones on October 30, 2018, 05:17:34 AM
Quote from: MarkT on October 29, 2018, 06:19:45 PM
A Tanked out T4XN still costs more than an Avet HXJ Raptor. Me? I'd rather fish the HXJ Raptor! You could still be driving a 40 Ford like your granddaddy but I bet you don't.
I am currently picking a 70s Mopar to turn into a restomod. It will be as nice as any OEM today, or as nice as I decide to make it. Really similar to a T4XN?
The Man
You probably know this Ron, but stock Mopars post '73 were dogs compared their predecessors. They had lowered compression ratios, poor ingnition systems(both primary & secondary), and several other bad systems used so Chrysler could comply with Fed. smog emission standards.
Ron, having a better understanding of the point you were making....
Both rods are exactly the same just different reel seats. I built them myself. The line while different brand is of the same diameter. I dont know that my casting is perfect enough that I would see a diff between the two. The biggest difference was the TN4 had a shorter topshot of mono than the Baja. Which leads me to believe the Baja might be noticeably better when going for max distance.
Plan on finding out for sure & posting results... Jeff