I got 113hn baja special reel new without box from a guy who bought it from a garage sale with other stuff and since he dont have any idea about reels and doesnt like fishing he told me he will give it to me for (30$), i was so happy with this purchase even though when i first hold the reel i noticed it was not working properly, but i thought there is nothing cant be repaired and that was the issue.
I found out that the spool is rubbing the frame i took it apart checked every thing and i didnt notice anything wrong, checked again while reading Mr. Alan post here in the forum and still no noticeable problem appeared, i dont know if the problem is with the spool or the frame is twisted because the bearings are fine.
I dont know anyone who have the same reel here to identify the fault by putting another spool and try if its the spool.
I have been wanting this reel for quite a while and i really want to use it, any help or advice is much appreciated.
Is the spool rub constant or intermittent? I would suggest first attempting to center or adjust the spool right and left. I haven't been inside my own Baja Special in a while but there may be some shims under the bearings in the bearing caps.
Keep us posted.
Mike
Maybe it's the angle of the picture but that spool doesn't look right. Looks much closer at the cross bar than it does at the top. Also looks like there's a line were the finish has rubbed off on the spool, could be a reflection though. Could just be the picture
it might be that the bearings are damaged and the spool shaft is not maintaining proper alignment. :-\
I'm with Sheridan - that spool looks crazy out of alignment (unless there is something funny about the photo). First thoughts torqued frame - second thoughts bent spool shaft. If it's bearings surely you could feel that :-\
Quote from: alantani on December 23, 2017, 04:59:08 PM
it might be that the bearings are damaged and the spool shaft is not maintaining proper alignment. :-\
Yes, Alan is right --
Bearings first --
Then you can look at the spool or the frame -- but these are less likely culprits.
Just a suggestion --
If it were mine, I would get it working properly with help from on this site -- then drop in one of Tom's bridge assemblies for $65.
It is a solid, very well made reel worth $200 stock. So for just a set of bearings, and a bridge assembly -- it will last a lifetime.
Best,
Fred
Now that's odd. I doubt that the frame got tweaked. It's a mighty strong frame. If it was tweaked, you would also see an issue with the reel seat. And the spool shafts are so short, that it would also be difficult to tweak the spool shaft...but not saying that it couldn't happen, but also unlikely. The only other thing I can think of would be the bearings. Possibly wrong size bearings in the reel.
Have you read http://alantani.com/index.php?topic=14.0? Maybe this will help give you a clue what could be wrong.
From the looks of it I think that the frame is way out of alignment. Looks like the frame took am extreme force to it.
Quote from: Tile on December 23, 2017, 11:49:52 PM
From the looks of it I think that the frame is way out of alignment. Looks like the frame took am extreme force to it.
Same here! I didn't think it could happen, but as I see it, anything is possible.
your gears are probably shot as well.
In this case, looks like you got what you paid for.
Sal
As Fred recommended, bearing and the Cortez bridge. When I rebuilt mine from a coffee can of parts i had the rubbing also, but careful adjustment of the bearings cured that for me. I did replace a couple bearing too. Bill
I agree that the frame appears twisted in the photos but a camera lens can do really strange things to perspective...but the spool definitely appears to be skewed in relation to the frame. There are a lot of very wise reel-smiths here who will give you really good advice. You could make a diagnosis more accurate by posting some less distorted photos. Try to keep the focal plane and camera as parallel as possible and make certain the reel frame and spool are centered in the photo frame. Any little bit of tilt will distort the image. Also, photos of the innards would be a big help.
-Mike
If you suspect that the spool's tweaked, try a flange to flange caliper measurement all the way around the circumference. A Compression force that damaged the spool would probably have deformed the frame too.
Quote from: Tiddlerbasher on December 23, 2017, 05:09:57 PM
I'm with Sheridan - that spool looks crazy out of alignment (unless there is something funny about the photo). First thoughts torqued frame - second thoughts bent spool shaft. If it's bearings surely you could feel that :-\
Yes its out of alignment threre is no line in the gap and the friction is continous checked the bearings they are ok
Quote from: Bryan Young on December 23, 2017, 05:22:59 PM
Now that's odd. I doubt that the frame got tweaked. It's a mighty strong frame. If it was tweaked, you would also see an issue with the reel seat. And the spool shafts are so short, that it would also be difficult to tweak the spool shaft...but not saying that it couldn't happen, but also unlikely. The only other thing I can think of would be the bearings. Possibly wrong size bearings in the reel.
Have you read http://alantani.com/index.php?topic=14.0? Maybe this will help give you a clue what could be wrong.
Yes i mentioned that it was the first thing i did, the frame post on the secound picture look twisted the the other post is straight and nothing wrong with the reel seat it looks ok and i removed it and but it back with no issue the place where it sets is flat and clean also checked the frame several times the is no dent or even a scratch only one of the frame bars not straight, can this be fixed
Quote from: PacRat on December 24, 2017, 02:21:30 AM
I agree that the frame appears twisted in the photos but a camera lens can do really strange things to perspective...but the spool definitely appears to be skewed in relation to the frame. There are a lot of very wise reel-smiths here who will give you really good advice. You could make a diagnosis more accurate by posting some less distorted photos. Try to keep the focal plane and camera as parallel as possible and make certain the reel frame and spool are centered in the photo frame. Any little bit of tilt will distort the image. Also, photos of the innards would be a big help.
-Mike
Its not the camera lense one of the frame bars is straight the other is not ill tacke couple pictures when i get back home im left to my parents house to spend Christmas evening with them, merry Christmas to everyone
I want to mention that I've done many personal tests using 2-3 times the force that the reel was intended to be fished at, I have a couple of Tiboron kits with the same issue, as rub mark on the spool lip.
Mine still work fine afterwards, under normal conditions.
Sal
I would think trueing up the frame would be very difficult. Would need to be about perfect for it to work right. Might be able to buy a frame on ebay or something but if there was enough force to bend the frame with the reel together likely some other stuff is tweaked too. At least you only have $30 in it. Bummer
My thinking is that your not out anything by trying to rotate the frame back to what seems to be true. By careful trial and testing the forces that bent the frame could be reversed in rotation possibly? If its indeed twisted? You,ll learn something! Post us some more pictures when you can possibly. Just about anything is possible nowa days! Best of Luck.
Do you have a set of calipers to check the frame to see of it is still true? I would start there and work backwards.
i dunno, guys. it's hard for me to imagine the frame being torqued..... :-\
Just take it apart and roll the spool on a flat table watching it closely. Do the same with the frame. Then you can start measuring. A new or used frame and or spool is available. Its too good of a reel to go to waist.
I have a new Makaira Sea 50II with a bent spool so it does happen. Its on the way back now.
It has been mentioned that the bearings are in good shape, there is a good chance the tip of the spool shaft is bent on one or both sides.
Put the spool back in without the clutch assembly, just the spool, spool shaft and the two bearings. Give it a spin and keep an eye on the edge of the frame where it meets the lip of the spool. if the gap gets larger and tighter, it would be your spool shaft.
if the lip of the spool goes in and out of the frame, it would be your spool...just a thought.
Sal
Spool looks to be aluminium. I've had one tweaked old penn metal spool. Looked and rolled ona flat surface perfectly. Differing flange to flange caliper measurements was the only way to see the problem.
Gfish
yeah, i know the bearings are supposed to be good, but i keep on thinking that it's usually a burnt plug before it's a burnt piston. :-\
Any dings on the frame that might show it was dropped? There's probably a reason it was sold cheap. Worse case you can probably part it out and get your money out of it.
Could be someone had it apart and dropped part of it. Very strange, the mystery deepens
Alan look down the plug hole can you see the piston pin through the hole. I see the picture and the mark were it's been rubbing. Something is bent for sure.
Mike
Here is more pics
I figured out where the spool rubs the frame its below the what i think a twisted frame bar
Quote from: MarkT on December 25, 2017, 11:21:13 PM
Any dings on the frame that might show it was dropped? There's probably a reason it was sold cheap. Worse case you can probably part it out and get your money out of it.
Not even a tiny scratch except one which was my fault when i tried to put together
On the side plate does it the look like the bearing cap has been cross threaded or not threaded strait from the factory? Or if the through hole in the side plate is not strait? If so this could tilt the spool enough to rub against the frame.
To me it looks like the spool and frame are out of line and if the frame is strait and you would most likely see damage to the frame if it got tweeked, then it must be the spool.
Frames are near impossible to find for the baja special. Looks like if you could find one you would have a nice reel.
Mike
Quote from: SoCalAngler on December 26, 2017, 05:31:42 PM
On the side plate does it the look like the bearing cap has been cross threaded or not threaded strait from the factory? If so this could tilt the spool enough to rub against the frame.
To me it looks like the spool and frame are out of line and if the frame is strait then it must be the spool.
No the threads are clean.
Is there any after market frame for this reel. I guess i should be looking for a frame now thinking of used one or after market
I'm not sure but maybe a Penn USA Senator 113N would work? Those are silver frames. Maybe a call to Scoots Bait and Tackle and they would know?
Quote from: SoCalAngler on December 26, 2017, 05:50:25 PM
I'm not sure but maybe a Penn USA Senator 113N would work? Those are silver frames. Maybe a call to Scoots Bait and Tackle and they would know?
I live in middle east it hard to call them ill try to email them any chance the internals will fit another reel if i cant find a frame maybe a 4/0?
It's 124 dollars for a new frame half of what a new old stock reel costs.
Mike
In this picture you can see the side plate is not fully seated. Is this before you took it apart?
Keith
It sure looks like that cross bar is twisted a degree or two. If the reel seat is ok and not torqued it's hard to imagine how that much force was applied so as to rotate the sides of the frame in opposite directions.😯
While I lack the depth of knowledge among some of you regarding Senator reels the Baja / US113 is one I love & am a little bit familiar with.
For what it's worth I've noticed large variations in the width of the crossbar between the Baja & US113. Some I've seen are to thin for my liking. But still should stand up well to any pressure from drag & a fleeing fish. 1st pic Baja 2nd US113 ... Jeff
without the reel in our hands is very hard to give a proper diagnistic
I have 2 Baja Special reels and another in the works (missing few parts to complete it)
so it wont be difficult to check if the spool is twisted or if the frame is the culprit.
but what I can see (it might not be part of the problem) is the spool sits too deep in one site of the frame and too far from the other side, I will post a picture of your reel with lines to try to make myself clear
on the picture of my Baja Special you will see the spool "shoulders" are equal in both sides on how it sits on the frame.
so, I would check both bearings on the sideplates and shim as needed.
is the bearing cap on the left sideplate tightened all the way ?
Maybe the frame should have been a reject at the factory - but managed to slip through Q/C :-\ It does happen.
Hi Guys...
Sorry for my poor English. I had the same problem on a 113HN from a client. The shaft detached from the spool. Does anyone know how to fix it again?
(https://scontent.fcpq2-1.fna.fbcdn.net/v/t1.15752-9/41283100_253490558833400_1482342206265098240_n.jpg?_nc_cat=0&oh=f46a50b21c8c768411e11b850d937c8d&oe=5BF74D25)
(https://scontent.fcpq2-1.fna.fbcdn.net/v/t1.15752-9/40802744_325761331327119_6057220982030991360_n.jpg?_nc_cat=0&oh=e3e280f24d6e5e485384b1a056d1df43&oe=5C32BACE)