More input needed from you big game fishing people.
I'm thinking about how to best rig my lures when I go fishing for some giant halibut. The plan is to have a 10' rubbing leader (wind on) of 150lb mono, then a 3-4' 150-200lb mono trace, with a swivel in between them. Sounds ok so far? I'll be using 10-15" softbaits mostly.
But then comes the part I can't really decide on. I don't want to have a snap close to the lure as I know they can break open while fighting a fish, especially if it comes into a position where the lure acts as a lever on the snap. I've had it happen myself. So that leaves split rings. But they can be pretty big and the eye on the lures are quite small. I'll be attaching assist hooks threw the eye as well. Another option I'm thinking about is to crimp the trace to the lure and have them pre-rigged. Then have a snap between the leader and the trace for quick lure changing. I'm thinking that if you move the snap away from the fish and the lure it will be fine and not risk snapping open.
Are snaps safe in this position? And what kind of snap should I be looking for? I've heard good things about pigtail swivels but haven't found any supplier that ships to Europe.
How would you setup your leader-trace-lure for safety but also quick interchangeability between lures?
Thankful for some input!
Karl
Are you using a snap with a rolling swivel or just the snap.
No snaps or split ring use knots and welded (silver brazed) butt rings.
Karl: I am not sure if I understand your set-up. How heavy is the line on the reel? Assuming heavy Spectra finish it off with a 150lb clip. Put a barrel swivel on your rubbing leader and attach the lure directly to the lure with a crimp. You will want to keep the lure lively so make a Flemish loop in front of the crimp. Dominick
Quote from: Dominick on March 28, 2014, 03:49:55 AM
Karl: I am not sure if I understand your set-up. How heavy is the line on the reel? Assuming heavy Spectra finish it off with a 150lb clip. Put a barrel swivel on your rubbing leader and attach the lure directly to the lure with a crimp. You will want to keep the lure lively so make a Flemish loop in front of the crimp. Dominick
Or crimps.
Quote from: Keta on March 28, 2014, 03:51:28 AM
Or crimps.
Lee, thank you for your concurrence. 8) Dominick
;D
Hi Karl,
I would rig up straight from the big game 'play book'. Wind-on leader rigged at the end with a big power swivel and 'tournament snap', crimped to the leader – a 'tournament snap' rather than any other type, as they are stronger and very reliable. Sampo or Rosco.
The lures are all then rigged individually on their own leaders, crimped loop at the lure end, with either a Flemish Loop or even just a stainless steel thimble. The issue here has always been that during a long fight the mono will rub on the steel of the hook or lure, and may weaken during a long fight – so either double up the mono (Flemish Loop), or use a thimble. At the other end either just a power swivel or a thimble loop – again crimped.
Personally, I prefer stainless steel thimbles for really heavy duty mono, or in lighter cases nylon thimbles are just as good. You are looking for a little flexibility, so the lure can move accordingly – so look at the size of the eye on your lures.
With all your lures rigged this way, then you can change as they get damaged, or change colours. Have always found that you need to keep it simple and reliable – fish aren't impressed with seriously fancy rigs. If you are using Assist hooks alongside the main lure, then stainless steel thimbles will probably offer the best solution.
Lastly, crimps should be double barrel type, copper or aluminium, crimped with a proper double crimp tool. Avoid single barrel crimps like the plague, they fail frequently.
Hope that helps
Cheers from sunny Africa
Jeri
Quote from: Jeri on March 28, 2014, 05:30:17 AM
Hi Karl,
I would rig up straight from the big game 'play book'. Wind-on leader rigged at the end with a big power swivel and 'tournament snap', crimped to the leader – a 'tournament snap' rather than any other type, as they are stronger and very reliable. Sampo or Rosco.
The lures are all then rigged individually on their own leaders, crimped loop at the lure end, with either a Flemish Loop or even just a stainless steel thimble. The issue here has always been that during a long fight the mono will rub on the steel of the hook or lure, and may weaken during a long fight – so either double up the mono (Flemish Loop), or use a thimble. At the other end either just a power swivel or a thimble loop – again crimped.
Personally, I prefer stainless steel thimbles for really heavy duty mono, or in lighter cases nylon thimbles are just as good. You are looking for a little flexibility, so the lure can move accordingly – so look at the size of the eye on your lures.
With all your lures rigged this way, then you can change as they get damaged, or change colours. Have always found that you need to keep it simple and reliable – fish aren't impressed with seriously fancy rigs. If you are using Assist hooks alongside the main lure, then stainless steel thimbles will probably offer the best solution.
Lastly, crimps should be double barrel type, copper or aluminium, crimped with a proper double crimp tool. Avoid single barrel crimps like the plague, they fail frequently.
Hope that helps
Cheers from sunny Africa
Jeri
It was something like that I was thinking about! Thanks for breaking it down for me Jeri!
Karl
Halibut are not that powerful, even large ones. I've always used 50#-65# main line, 5' 50# topshots and 100#-150# leader. No snaps or split rings. My topshots atachement is L2L and my leader is attached to my topshot with a heavy ball bearing swivel.
Most people I've seen fish for butts in Norway just use maybe a 6' 150lb leader connected to their mainline and a split ring for attaching lures. And I guess that's fine, works for them anyway. I just wanted some extra rubbing safety. Your setup sounds nice Lee, maybe I'll scale down the topshot/rubbing leader to 50-60lb. Actually it sounds like a wise decision. Less water resistance as well.
But how do you attach your lures? Knots?
Karl
Most of the time I use dead bait with circle hooks. I'll get a photo today.
Quote from: Keta on March 28, 2014, 11:44:42 AM
Most of the time I use dead bait with circle hooks. I'll get a photo today.
;D ;D
I love pictures!
Here is a 100lb twisted leader of about 15ft, the loop end is joined via catspaw to bimini twist to the mainline with 250lb swivel crimped with 250lb split ring. Highly abrasive resistant, we use them for the big stuff that wants to pull you into around the reef and acts as a great shock leader for the big takes and allows you to wind right up to the reel with the leader.
(http://i1034.photobucket.com/albums/a424/Snapplizard/IMG_2186_zps8dd1643c.jpg)
Quote from: OldSchool on March 28, 2014, 12:33:59 PM
Here is a 100lb twisted leader of about 15ft, the loop end is joined via catspaw to bimini twist to the mainline with 250lb swivel crimped with 250lb split ring. Highly abrasive resistant, we use them for the big stuff that wants to pull you into around the reef and acts as a great shock leader for the big takes and allows you to wind right up to the reel with the leader.
I like it! Simplicity!
Thanks for the pic!
Swivel and loop connections, make sure the loop ones are set like in the photo. These are 16/0 Mustad circle hooks rigged with 150# mono.
(http://i54.photobucket.com/albums/g104/IGFA19Keta/Fish/DSCN1420_zpscf4fd651.jpg) (http://s54.photobucket.com/user/IGFA19Keta/media/Fish/DSCN1420_zpscf4fd651.jpg.html)
The other end.
(http://i54.photobucket.com/albums/g104/IGFA19Keta/Fish/DSCN1422_zps43e0804e.jpg) (http://s54.photobucket.com/user/IGFA19Keta/media/Fish/DSCN1422_zps43e0804e.jpg.html)
My go to butt rig.
(http://i54.photobucket.com/albums/g104/IGFA19Keta/Fish/DSCN1421_zps071473ed.jpg) (http://s54.photobucket.com/user/IGFA19Keta/media/Fish/DSCN1421_zps071473ed.jpg.html)
Large iron waiting to be contoured, see the butt ring and my small torch.
(http://i54.photobucket.com/albums/g104/IGFA19Keta/Fish/DSCN1417_zps857f84d7.jpg) (http://s54.photobucket.com/user/IGFA19Keta/media/Fish/DSCN1417_zps857f84d7.jpg.html)
Thanks for the pics Lee! That is some serious iron you got there!
How do you fish the giant hoochie? Trolling? Drifting? With bait?
Quote from: Mandelstam on March 28, 2014, 09:03:04 PM
Thanks for the pics Lee! That is some serious iron you got there!
How do you fish the giant hoochie? Trolling? Drifting? With bait?
Drifting with bait 500'-700' deep (152m-213m). I put a slider on my topshot above the swivel with a 36" (1m) dropper and 36-48 oz. (1.2-1.36 KG) lead.
BTW, I have some real "giant" shell squid (hoochies)24" (609mm) too.
Quote from: Keta on March 28, 2014, 09:13:31 PM
BTW, I have some real "giant" shell squid (hoochies)24" (609mm) too.
Oh.. That really is Giant. :) Would love to see your giant hoochie sometime Lee! ;)
BTW, how do the halibut usually take a dead bait? Stop and swallow, or does it run off with it? When do you start to put pressure on it to set the circle hook?
I'll try to get a photo of the large shell squid and post it this evening.
USUALY, a butt will inhale the bait and you feel a tap or a tap, tap, tap. Give it slack and let it make a run, usually 10'-20' (3m-6m). When it stops put your reel in gear, point rod toward the fish, wait until the drift takes up the slack, then crank until hook is "set". Then raise rod up for the fight.
:) I can't wait!
They pound iron, keep your drag fairly loose and hang on.
I couldn't find my 24" ones but these 21" ones are big.
(http://i54.photobucket.com/albums/g104/IGFA19Keta/Fish/DSCN1424_zps4140b323.jpg) (http://s54.photobucket.com/user/IGFA19Keta/media/Fish/DSCN1424_zps4140b323.jpg.html)
Jeez, they are big.. :P
You use them for halibut as well or tuna trolling?
They were donated for swordfish and sharks.
Quote from: Keta on March 28, 2014, 08:05:04 PM
Swivel and loop connections, make sure the loop ones are set like in the photo. These are 16/0 Mustad circle hooks rigged with 150# mono.
(http://i54.photobucket.com/albums/g104/IGFA19Keta/Fish/DSCN1420_zpscf4fd651.jpg) (http://s54.photobucket.com/user/IGFA19Keta/media/Fish/DSCN1420_zpscf4fd651.jpg.html)
Did you pry open the eye of the hook to insert the swivel?
Yes, I did. I put the hook in my vice and twist the eye open with a punch inserted into the eye then close it with my vice. I also file down and recontour the point to make the gap wider.
What are the two different ways of mounting the hook good for? I mean are they used for different kind of fishing or bait?
Quote from: Mandelstam on March 29, 2014, 03:45:57 PM
What are the two different ways of mounting the hook good for? I mean are they used for different kind of fishing or bait?
Circle hook works with snell, hence the method photo w/o swivel work better. Shark tend to roll hence the swivel works better.
I use them both for halibut but the loop connection is what I have decided is best, with help from a friend that works for the IPHC.
http://www.iphc.int/ (http://www.iphc.int/)
But sometimes you see ringed circle hooks as well but without a swivel. They have both much more freedom to move than when you snell it or rig it like above with a loop around the shank and through the eye. Are there situations when you should choose one over the other?
Karl
Not with dead bait, my friend that works for the IPHC has many hours of research on halibut hookups and the loop gets them more often. for live bait a ring or swivel is a plus. The swivel on the upper end takes care of most twisting, a rare thing with butts. My swiveled circle hooks are mostly used for fishing for YFY with chunk bait now.
Thanks Lee! I'm a wiser man now!
Karl