I'm starting to get gear together for a short multi day trip in late summer early fall and need help with bait hooks.....
Generally I prefer to use lures/jigs etc but if I'm gonna travel all that way and spend decent $$ than I don't want to hinder my chance at success but limiting myself to lures only.
So what brand and size hooks should I have for fly lining sardines/mackerel to SD tuna (yft/bft)?
Thanks
Pj
Hard to beat Owners,flyliner,mutu,super-mutu. Ringed or not ringed. A lot will depend on the size of the bait to figure out the size of the hook. Might wait until you get to the landing and buy them then when you'll know the bait size. Also most boats sell that stuff on board too. It's hard not to obsess a little I know
I am pretty much sold on Super-mutu ringed circle hooks. Worked for me everywhere all last year. I'm ready to buy stock.
The Man
I use ringed Owner, Mustad and Gamakatsu hooks. I ring the low price Mustad hooks and use them when the pest fish are thick so the more $ hooks last the trip. I'll look up the Mustad hook # and post it and a few other hook numbers later today. Mustad Ultra Point hooks will also work well.
Owner Super Mutu, Flyliner and Guerrilla
Gamakatsu Live Bait
For cheap hooks for schoolie Tuna and Dorado I like the Mustad 94151. That's your standard bronze colored bait hook with a slightly turned in point.
For bigger fish I like the Owner Gorilla. In circle hooks I use the Mustad 3x or 4x perfect circles or Owner Super Mutu.
You size the hook to the bait, not the size of the fish you're trying to catch. Usually a 2/0 for Sardines and a 4/0 for Mac's.
Quote from: MarkT on February 05, 2019, 03:26:32 PM
For cheap hooks for schoolie Tuna and Dorado I like the Mustad 94151. That's your standard bronze colored bait hook with a slightly turned in point.
Thanks Mark, the bronze Mustad 94151 hooks are the ones I ring and use when the rats are eating the paint off the bottom of the boat and I don't want my big $ hooks going in the slush tank.
For most fishing I use the Mustad short shank hooks for fly line, I don't remember the model number it may be the same as above but I know them when I see them.
I am often given hooks to try out or get freebies when fishing tourney's so I have tried a lot. Gamakatsu, Owner, Eagle Claw and others are in my hook box right now and all seem to work about the same.
Now you will need to decide if you want to go J, circle, ringed or not in your hook selection. I now only use circles when hunting big game for everything else I use J's for bait but I set the J hooks just like a circle hook when fly lining.
Quote from: SoCalAngler on February 05, 2019, 04:32:20 PM
.....I set the J hooks just like a circle hook when fly lining.
Me too and get a lot of J hooks in the corner of the jaw. I use C hooks for tuna but not YT. For Pacific halibut I use 16/0 Mustad C hooks.
Also if you don't want to buy the whole range of hooks from say #2 thru 4/0 you may want to wait until your trip is a couple of weeks away to see whats working or just grab some at the landing before your trip. I have been on trips where a #2 even with deans are the only thing that will get bit. I also tend to go a size or two smaller than what the deckhands recommend in hopes of keeping my bait fresher longer.
My semi local Turners was having a sale on Gamakatsu hooks so I picked up a few different sizes. I hate trying to buy hooks at the landing right before a trip.... Here's what I got, what do you guys think?
Looks good! Might want a few bigger ones if you're using bigger mackeral. Takes a little practice to use those small circle hooks on a live bait if you've never done it.
Quote from: Swami805 on February 05, 2019, 11:49:05 PM
Looks good! Might want a few bigger ones if you're using bigger mackeral. Takes a little practice to use those small circle hooks on a live bait if you've never done it.
Especially if you butt hook your bait.
I don't know how long of a trip you plan on going on but if your thinking about trying to catch the larger BFT here in So Cal you may want to wait to buy the larger hooks. Who knows if the big fish will show again this year or be around when your trip leaves.
4/0 circles were what most boats were recommending for bait on the larger BFT. If you have another use for hooks that size then buy them, if not you may want to wait.
If the BFT is your target remember the limit is 2 fish per day. So one small pack like the ones you have shown should be fine. You should not go thru a lot of hooks, if you are something is very wrong in your approach.
Any updates on your circle hook choice for bft?
I'm thinking of trying out the ringed Charlie Brown circle hooks.....
Last week I was using owner 2/0 mutu, we had nice big sardines. For smaller 'dines I like the Mustad demon offset ringed 2/0 which are pretty small. The quick rig 2/0 Charlie browns are very strong, fairly thin wire and smaller than the 2/0 mutu. I use a bigger hook for a night sinker rig since it isn't visible. Go as small as you can during the day for stealth!
The Cadillac of hooks, can't go wrong with those.
Get some non ringed small J hooks too in case the bait is weak they're not towing around all that hardware. Sometimes a small fiesty bait will out fish a big beat up one. Doesn't cost much for those
For small stuff, I use either Mustad and Blacktail hooks, for the bigger stuff I stick to Owner (ringed, non-ringed, mutu, super mutu).
I like the Mustad 94140 and ring them myself.
Peter
For bft w/live sardine, I like Mutu circles #1,2 & 4 (5163-xxx). Make sure to bring a few lighter wire circles in smaller sizes (#1 Gama, mutu hybrid) for weak bait/finicky fish. Handful of bigger (2/0-6/0) circles & owner gorillas for bigger baits. 6-10 oz torpedoes & 1-4 oz eggs. Good luck!
I see nobody mentioned the classic Mustad 9174 O'shaugnessy
The black nickel finish of the 9174NP-BN
is hard to beat in terms of sharpness, strength, and value :o
Quote from: Zazzara on June 28, 2021, 03:40:16 AM
I see nobody mentioned the classic Mustad 9174 O'shaugnessy
The black nickel finish of the 9174NP-BN
is hard to beat in terms of sharpness, strength, and value :o
With that out turned point they tend to stick in places of a BFT that you don't want... and then they chew you off. A circle hook in the corner is best... and safest. I quite using 9174's years ago.
I'm gonna order some 1/0 - 4/0 ringed Charlie Brown hooks and double the order for the 2/0 size
9174!!!!!! Oh, the days of pinhead anchovies!!!!
Peter
The last time I fished Isla Guadalupe, I pulled out a Mustad 7691 (that I had ringed myself) on the last afternoon, about a 7/0. It was a slow pick afternoon. I impaled a poor live sardine with it. So much for matching the hook to the bait. The deckhands laughed when they saw what I was doing.
I cast my poor live bait out, flylined. And 'lo and behold', I got bit. I didn't have to worry about breaking that hook!
My last Guadalupe YFT boated was about a 70 pounder, on a slow pick afternoon bite, on a NOS (it had the Mustad name on the shank of the hook) Mustad 7691.
7691 might be good for a bridled mackerel.
My Charlie Brown hook order came the other day while I was at Yosemite on a fire assignment so I was excited to get home and check them out....
Here's what a $150 worth of Charlie Brown made in Japan tuna hooks looks like...
Listen to Mark T.
He's got more LR experience than pretty much anyone on this board.
;D
They're bigger than I thought they'd be....and bigger than the Gamakatsu ringed live bait hooks I like....So i now i'm not sure which ones to use.....
Can a mod please rotate the pic? Thanks
I think they measure the distance from the point to the shaft to determine size so circle hooks are usually bigger overall than regular live bait hooks. At least that holds up most of the time
They look about right. Measure from the point of the hook to the shank. Circle hooks will be overall larger than the equivalent J hook even from the same mfg.
Leave the j-hooks, imo. Once you get the hang of circles your hook up ratio goes way up AND you land more fish that you hook.
place the hooks on the graph paper, so that:
the top straight part of shank is on vertical line
and point touches horizontal line, then measure
I'm sure all the premium Japanese stuff is fairly uniform
All good tips and advice above. And my point is coming from a guy that has a small fortune invested in ringed hooks (but small change compared to many of my friends). But I throw this out for consideration. One of my friends (and old stick with waaay more experience than me) on my trip in June pulled me aside during a finicky BF day bite when I was struggling, and like all good friends, said (Foghorn Leghorn impersonation here) "You're doing it all wrong Son! Let me show you how it's done!" Basically he nipped off my ringed hook, and tied a slick loop knot with a standard fine wire circle hook. Now I know there are folks here that have tested all manner of knots for breaking strength, and that's "Knot" ;D where I'm going with this. His point was that those rings contribute to the weight that the bait has to haul around, regardless of whether you are talking "Gorilla Mutu" or "Live Flyliner" that getting rid of the ring, but still having that loose loop allowed the bait freedom to swim naturally but with less weight to drag around. And I did hook up shortly after (and am practicing that knot now) :D. Again, I don't know if it's a panacea silver bullet solution, BUT his experienced, combined with the reasoning (and the fact that I like to learn by watching "hot sticks" to see what I could do better/improve on) certainly is something to be considered. Especially since we are a spoiled with great sardine bait but what happens if in a few years its back to the anchovies of my youth? - john
Quote from: Brewcrafter on July 05, 2021, 08:27:27 PM
You're doing it all wrong Son! Let me show you how it's done!" Basically he nipped off my ringed hook, and tied a slick loop knot"
I can attest to the no-slip mono loop knot being an excellent choice.
I've used it in locked drag scenarios with 125 lb. leader and an 8/0 hook with excellent results.
It's more commonly used with artificials,
but is certainly a proper substitute for a ringed hook
when more "free-swing" is desired for live bait fishing.