I've got a 130lb class rod straight butt 6' , 12/0 penn, 130lb mono, 300lb mono leader material, some hooks and heavy duty swivels and I'm going to make some SS wire leaders for shark. Now, I have to get a fighting harness and belt. I don't have a big enough boat, so we're probably going out on a lobster boat, so unlikely to have the luxury of a fighting chair. We're going to try sharks first (porbeagle, shortfin mako, blues etc) and maybe even tuna if we're lucky enough to stumble upon some feeding. What I'd like to know is how I should properly set myself up to fight a large fish standing up safely and how to make proper leaders for both large shark and tuna and all connections. Also, I know a little bit of how to set up for chumming, but what are some tricks to be more effective at quickly bringing sharks around the boat and is it as easy as throwing a hook out with some mackerel and float, then hang on, or are these sharks more intelligent than I think?
As far as tuna go, all I have are the largest size magnum rapalas, some arbogast squid plugs, large soft plastic shad bodies and some 4-6oz kandlefish jigs, but I'm assuming that live mackerel or daisy chained mackerel are best? I've also got some lighter tackle 60-80lb class stuff that I plan on putting 100lb power pro on so I can use for casting live or artificial baits with. Both setups will hold 400-450yds of 100lb braid, but is that enough capacity if you get a 500lb fish on or am I just going to be donating some expensive line on the first run? So , I need some help with these questions and some general do's and don'ts so I can increase our chances of hooking into something on our first outing, without getting pulled out of the boat! Thanks in advance
wow! big stuff like this is really beyond my pay grade. the big fish for me is only 150 pounds. i saw a guy reel in a 250 pounder. ain't interested! ;D
The average tuna that the commercial/sport fishermen catch in the region is well over 500pounds. I'm hoping for smaller to start out and maybe hook a few on my 12weight, but you never know what you might get. A 10foot great white was found last week in a weir not far from my area. Porbeagles seem to be most common and from what I've seen, but some other monsters have been hooked and lost. There was also a swordfish harpoon fishery many years ago, but I've never heard of anyone ever fishing tuna or swordfish with rod and reel in the bay, just a couple people fishing sharks. I've also seen pictures of halibut that filled the whole bed of a Ford Ranger and hung over the tailgate. There is very little saltwater sportfishing done in my area, mostly mackerel, flounder, a bit of striped bass surf fishing and cod/pollock jigging.
i don't think i would want to tackle something three times as big as me. basic principals would be the same. curious though. do you know how much drag you need to land one of these?
NBStriper: Here is the key. The gear you are using is sufficient to catch those monster fish that might take the bait. The idea is to set the drag to the point that you can safely hold the fish while letting it pull on the drag. I weigh about 180lbs and can hold 25lbs of drag but not for long. The longest I had to fight a fish was 35-40 minutes. You should let the fish run and get tired. In theory you could get a 250lb fish to the boat quickly with the drag buttoned down but the fish will be too fresh to handle safely. The way to do it is to set your drag at 1/3 of the breaking strength of the line and play the fish. Also you do not want the drag to be so tight that the fish could pull you off the boat. If you are in a fighting belt and harness have someone hold on to your belt until you feel you can hold the fish. On some boats they attach a rope to the fisherman to keep him in the boat should a monster fish pull hard. The other thing is you need a good captain. There are ways to tire the fish. A good captain will keep the boat in gear while you hold the fish (this tires the fish), however if the fish is taking too much line the captain will either back the boat or orientate the boat to the fish to allow you to get line back. It is a team effort. A good book to read regarding how to fight large fish is Fishing for Tuna and Marlin by Captain Pete Barrett also The Best and Worst of Tred Barta by Captain Tred Barta. There are a load of good books out there for catching and fighting big game fish. Regarding the lures, live or fresh dead bait always out fishes lures. I don't know where you will be fishing to comment on the lures. Dominick
NB, you got yourself some good info from pesca, he has some good experience with big fish. Everything he said is right on , not sure about his weight though :-\
Great advice, Dominick.
I had an hour-long battle late last year which clearly demonstrated some of your points.
Due to the proximity of structure, I had to fully button down the drag on what I estimate was (very approximately) a 200lb fish.
It was back-breaking and nearly took the rig over the side of the boat several times (had a gimbal, but no harness).
Only really made ground on it by the skipper backing up.
Ended up breaking off after a brief touch of Spectra against hull.
Took about a week to recover from the neck/back/shoulder/arm etc strain.
Good luck NB - looking forward to your reports!
All the best, Justin
PS x2 on Dominick's comment re: bait vs lures.
Sal: I hedged the weight a bit I did say "about 180." ;D
Justin: I experienced that soreness on a couple of occasions, now I do weight training 3 days a week. I am in condition for the November Tuna Tournament in Cabo. It does take reasonable upper body strength to hold a heavy drag but lighter drags mean longer fights and the possibility of spooling. Hey that's a good idea maybe we can get Alan to change the name of this site to "Fear of Spooling." ;) Dominick
Alan, I have no idea how much drag pressure I'll need, but going by the suggestions, max 40lb drag pressure with 130lb mono, does that sound about right? From what I've read about the tuna fleet off PEI, they land giant bluefins relatively quickly, but I believe they use bent butts rods in stern mounted rod holders mostly and don't mess around.
Pesca, I'll be fishing off the coast of New Brunswick, Canada. I'm sure it will be a few years of fishing until I figure things out for tuna, but I'm hoping the sharks cooperate on the first outing. I was out scouting all day yesterday and couldn't find any schools of mackerel anywhere, nor much else for that matter, so it may prove difficult if the mackerel schools have moved farther offshore or up the coast because of Irene. My wife had a seal hit her rapala while trolling for stripers or blues, but that was the only good bite of the day!
G'day NB,
The 40lb drag/130lb mono combo is fine (hefty, though).
On an associated topic, this is an excellent post on balancing your rig, which may be of interest: http://alantani.com/index.php?topic=733.0 (http://alantani.com/index.php?topic=733.0)
QuoteOnce you have determined the drag, multiply that by four to get the rod rating middle point. Once you have matched the drag to the rod characteristics, you have a balanced rig, one that will flex enough to handle the shock loads, but is strong enough to fight the fish you expect to catch.
All the best, Justin
Yes, Irene did cause some problems. I would not have gone out with the water in such turmoil. We haven't heard from Sal (Altomare) in Connecticut, I hope everything is ok with him. Since he hasn't weighed in I expect it is a power problem. Sal, check in and let us know how you got through the Hurricane. My friend Joe lives in Bradley Beach NJ, a half a block off the beach. He tells me that the coast did ok but they got it rougher inland. NB Striper, set your drag at 40lbs and tie it to the bumper of a car and have someone slowly drive the car away from you. See how tough it is to hold 40lbs of drag. Then figure out how long you can hold that. Report in. Dominick
For the shark leaders single strand stainless leader would be good, haywire twist to the hook and swivel.About 170lb single strand should be fine, when you catch a fish you can cut the leader next to the hook for release and haywire another on.I use mostly 275lb stainless cable crimped for shark but also use some heavy mono and single strand s.s wire it will all catch fish ;) . Make sure if you use 40lbs of drag to be secured to the boat..or that you can hold your breath for a long time :o
Quote from: Squirmypug on September 01, 2011, 03:22:12 AM
Make sure if you use 40lbs of drag to be secured to the boat..or that you can hold your breath for a long time :o
Good one Squirmy. Gave me a chuckle. Seriously NBStriper check out holding 40lbs of drag and let us know how it feels. Dominick
I thought of tying up to the back of the car before, but by the sounds of things, 40lbs of drag is too much so I'll still try tying it to the bumper and setting the drag until I feel it's right for me. I haven't got my proper belt and harness yet, but found a new gimbal belt (although somewhat small for the job) in a box of stuff and some heavy duty military shoulder straps and tried everything on. If I just make a softener for going around my lower back and stitch the straps on, I think it would do the trick. It may not last forever like the highquality purpose made belts, but I think it may do the trick. By the time I get a good deal on ebay, ship it and pick it up across the border, the snow will be flying and I'll never get out.
I had 2-3 nice shark/tuna hooks, but I was looking at an old VMC hook display board I picked up years ago and since all the labels fell off, it isn't much of a collectable now so I'm going to use some of the hooks off it... it's got every size commercial long line hook they made on it at the time. I've got a line on someone with a big boat, so now it's just a matter of setting a date to go out and buying chum/bait.
Good luck mate - looking forward to the 'man vs fish' stories!
Hey NBStriper: Report back on the final drag setting from the bumper of the car. Also once the fish tires you can advance the drag. Sometimes the fish will sound and you will need the extra drag to bring it up. When we were talking about holding 40 lbs of drag, that was with a lively fish. Dominick
NBStriper 40lbs drag may not be too much for you, but is more than most people want to try to use.When you set up the reel for fishing you may want to put a wind-on leader so that you can handle the fish boatside better.And for the belt, a small one may not spread the load enough for you but you can try it.For the harness I have seen alot of guys make their own from 3-strand twisted nylon rope and some kind of strap to spread the load on the back.If you have any questions post them, if I'm able to help I will respond.Good luck on the fishing. ;D
Hello NB, there is some information here that might be helpful to you.
http://alantani.com/index.php?topic=1792.msg8660#msg8660
I fish a 12/0 for sharks and all I can say is get a really good harness and belt,if you try to skimp on the cheaper ones it could break the strap and there goes said rod or you.Get one rated for unlimited class only.Set your drag to around 20 pounds with a scale and adjust from there,I have been drug from stem to stern with a bad drag setting so it's better to start easy then once you settle into the fight put the hammer down.Oh and since fishing from a boat it is always good to use a safety line attached to your outfit,it may not be pretty but if you loose your grip or your step someone can pull you or your rod in.The truck will let you know if you can handle the pressure though.I made my own harness out of two inch tow strap and sewing with 200 pound braid,I also have a really large belt with an extra 2 inches of padding added on cause when that drag is heavy it can dig into your thighs pretty good.
Hey NB Striper-- how did you make out last season? I saw this post a little late, but thought I'd offer my 2 cents anyway. I'm just down the coast from you in Maine. We catch mostly blue sharks here, some of which can get into the jumbo size category. Even so, I would say that you can take them without too much trouble on much lighter tackle, say a 6/0 or 9/0 set up with 50-80 lb line. Much safer that way, with less drag and you won't have to wave that big rod and reel around. I've caught a few porbeagles, mostly small pups, but a couple 250-300+ pounders-- I've also caught mako and threshers here too. No doubt the sharks in the Gulf of Maine get big, but extra heavy tackle isn't needed. My shark rigs consist of Penn 114s, 115s and Daiwa 900s and are paired to BWSU 1150130 56 and BWSU 113080 60 Ugly Sticks. The BWSU 1150130 56/Daiwa 900 combo is all I care to handle standing up with a large fish on the other end. All my reels get the "full Tani" treatment of course, with my 900s having the drag and handle upgrade.
Giant tuna are another story altogether.As you said, most guys are using bent butt with 130s in the swivel holders. Too much money at stake. I don't have any advise for you here, the only giants I've ever caught were on handlines years ago.
Anyway, post up a report, and let us know how things went, and stay safe.
Hi Striper i dont think your going to get the 130lbs rod into a fighting kerve so that you can get the maximum out of it i use a Braid power play harness & butt pad and fish for common skate & porbeagle shark using IGFA 50lbs class rods & tiagra 50w reels and after 20/30 minutes your arms start to burn thats hard enough the 130 outfit is going to be very heavy to hold for any length of time your best bet would be to sell it and buy a 50 IGFA outfit and a good quality harness and butt pad the wind-on`s are easy enough to make yourself i use 200lbs dacron 480lbs nylon as the rubbing leader onto 480lbs s/steel 49 strand wire & 10/0 to 12/0 3406 mustad or sea demon hooks
(http://i992.photobucket.com/albums/af48/willybendit/windonwinderjig003.jpg)
(http://i992.photobucket.com/albums/af48/willybendit/skatefishinglochcrinannovember005.jpg)
tight lines Alain
Quote from: willybendit on November 14, 2012, 07:08:07 PM
Hi Striper i dont think your going to get the 130lbs rod into a fighting kerve so that you can get the maximum out of it
I'm not so sure about that, I can load a 130lb rod and I'm not that big. My 2 really heavy rods hurt after 30 to 45 minutes.
Here's my heaviest rod at the time, 6-1/3' and 150lb, not completely loaded up but the large YFT is running and I'm on break.
The reel was set up for 32lbs at strike and around 35-38 at full. I really can't handle drag settings over 35lbs for long, the higher drag is for the last 20' or so. At the time I was a heavy 155lbs at the most...and I don't miss the lard.
(http://i54.photobucket.com/albums/g104/IGFA19Keta/bth_FightingAFish-1.jpg)
A photo of a failed plate, it hurt when I got pinched.
(http://i54.photobucket.com/albums/g104/IGFA19Keta/bth_BentPlate-1.jpg?t=1352924993)
Hi Keta so how long can you hold a 130lbs in full fighting curve with 38/40 lbs of drag the picture is not a 130lbs in full curve in my mind hears a mate with a 50 lbs IGFA rod in full fighting curve and the fish took over a hour to bring boatside
The rod in the photo is a 150 class and not nearly fully loaded, I'm on break and relaxing as the fish takes line with the lever on strike. The longest I've had to deal with 38lbs of drag has been the last 10 minutes or so of the fight and it is about all I can take. The longest fight I've suffered was around 50 min and that fish was only around 160lbs, my 258lb YFT was a "wimp" and only took around 40 min.
Wow you guys must be big in size ::)
The heaviest rod I can handle is just 80lb and 30 min fight with that setup was tiring.
During one of my previous assignment in Aussie water, I was jigging with my 50lb setup for arm length tuna.
I landed 6 tuna head with the rest of the body taken away by shark. Being piss off, I steal some spring wire(single core steel wire) and aim for shark instead. I manage to pull one bugger almost 2 meters long all the way to the side of my ship, but landing it on my ship with more than 3 meters free board is impossible.
My setup at that time was:-
Rated 30-50lb rod
50lb braided main lines
80lb nylon topshot
2m single core wire
5/0 live bait hook with solid ring(far under size)
Shark is not much of fight, they shake their head, to the roll trick and will try to swim forward to chew your topshot nylon.
So if you are using a dual speed reel, I recommend that you stay on high speed.
Yup, I'm a giant at 5-1/2' and 145 pounds.
At one time I was 160 pounds of solid muscle but cancer and being crushed has caused me to get a bit flabby but I still have to move 140-160 pound hay bales. It has more to do with proper equipment and technique (the rail is your friend). All of my cow YFT were caught a few years after almost loosing my legs in an industrial accident and I have limited use of them. I'm not that bright though, I went elk hunting 2 weeks after getting out of the hospital for the removal of 1/3 of my colon and a large tumor...no brain no pain.
Depending on bait size I've used circle hooks as small as 3/0 for large YFT and I try to avod sharks.
Well i am pretty big at 6'3" and 185lbs. I can bend a big rod pretty easy, and sharks round here fight pretty good, so................ ;D
I"m 6' and 270 and I will tell you a couple hours on a big Tiger or hammer will give you a run for your money,some come in easy and then you have the bulldoggers that no matter how hard you push them they push back.A 12' Tiger or hammer will test you to your limits especially if they have an attitude.After my cancer and other issues the last few years I have given up the big stuff and moved towards lighter stronger tackle.A 114H has the same line capacity of 80# braid as a 12/0 Penn has in mono,1100 yards and with the right modifacations,7+1 drag stack a ss gear sleeve,ss gears,and a one piece frame with aluminum spool you now have a much more manageable sharking outfit with almost the same drag capabilities.I don't push the drag much more than 20-25# anymore and that is plenty for any of the fish you will probably see,and you will enjoy the fight much more.And one thing to remember about LBSF is that the longer drops don't always mean fish,just watch for the bait.Most of the time it is right up to the beach,so why put your bait where the bait isn't.Most of my drop are right over the first bar and they produce 10x as many fish as the longer drops,and most of the bigger sharks I've caught too.Hope it helps.
Yeah up here in NC you definateley dont need long drops, i fish the pier most of the time though. I run a 9/0 and 6/0, soon to be hot rodded
Please remember that there is a difference between a chair rod and a stand-up rod, and these two built for the same strength line will vary in length and stiffness as well as the shape of the fighting curve under load.
I've never caught a big bluefin -they are something else. But I have had some nice sharks - nothing huge - and some nice blue marlin both from the chair and stand-up. My largest fish took three hours and some serious drag towards the end to gain inches of line at a time in low gear - locking knees to avoid being frogged was important! Never measured the max setting - scales only went to 56lb! And I'm only 150lb - the credit goes to the skipper and crew for their skill and advice.
On another occasion, using a chair rod stand-up style (a mere 80lb rod) was a pain and I knew I could not apply sufficient pressure to control the fish. I could not get that rod to bend too much and yet the strain on my arms was excessive in the several minutes it took to restore sanity in the cockpit and get me a harness. I only had the 'opportunity' because the chair was occupied by the other angler on a double-header of big blue marlin. When his fish was released, I took over the chair and then I had the right tools for the job. That's when I found the 80lb chair rod rod too soft and floppy (!) to raise the fish which by now had decided to sulk way down deep but that is another story.
Yet, when fitted with a proper 80-100lb stand-up rod the complete opposite was true. I was (relatively) comfortable even when lifting a 600lb fish because the rod was shorter and bent into a suitable fighting curve and the butt was not way too long. However, that same rod was used by this other guy later and he could not take the strain (well he was 70!) and wanted to sit in the chair - but the butt was too short for him to reel when the rod was in the seat gimbal, and the rod too short to keep the line away from the transom corners.
What I'm saying is don't try to use a chair rod stand-up or vice versa - horses for courses - but get the gear that suits the style you are going to have to use, and have fun!
What Happened to NBStriper?
Sort of forget about this topic....
I did manage to get into a shark, the first time out at that. At the end of the day, we dumped out chum and were reeling in the rods...when just as I was reaching for the last rod (30lb class with a fin nor offshore 65) I noticed the balloon moving. I set the hook and the shark turned and swam on the surface towards our boat and under. We had it to the boat in 15-20mins, but it took off again and finally after 50 mins and a seized drag we got it boatside and cut it free. No pictures as my gopro and our cell phones were all dead by the end of the fight/day. We figured it was around 7 feet 200+lbs.
No luck on tuna fishing... turns out you aren't allowed to target them without a commercial licence here.
Thanks for all the advice guys.