How's this look, doing the black and white on the grip? I'm second guessing myself. I'm trying do something a bit different, but not too wild. I may add some gold and blue banding
no valid opinions on decoration from me, but design seems more than "a bit different"
why is the up-locking seat reversified -- why not just use down-locking ???
that's a pretty long handful of thread, for a cork-lover :-\
Sometimes simplicity is the best approach to dealing with the edges of components. In this case a simple small section of black edged in a very thin band of a metallic to match whatever is used on the rest of the thread work.
Quote from: philaroman on August 17, 2021, 11:17:07 AM
no valid opinions on decoration, from me
why is the up-locking seat reversified -- why not just use down-locking ???
that's a pretty long handful of thread, for a cork-lover :-\
All opinions are equally valid. They're opinions.
Am I supposed to be using a different reel seat for threads-up install? If so that's news to me. I've always preferred threads up, if I were building a tuna stick I'd probably prefer to reel against a fixed point, but this is a bass rod so I'm building for comfort.
And there may be an optical illusion at play. Its a size 16 seat, twisted all the way down. With reel installed there's less than a half inch of exposed thread with my short foot SS1300. Slightly more with my shortER foot SS700.
Now, the rod I built for a friend using an old FPS sz 20 seat, that looked goofy with reel installed. Didn't realize until guides were already wrapped. So i solved that with cork tape. I think it came out ok. Had I planned ahead I definitely woulda sawed off an inch or so. That's what made me measure how much I could trim on this one. I decided the quarter inch that i could actually do without wasnt worth the risk of error.
I simply don't understand the purpose/desirability of that design, on a light spinner
why do you want ANY exposed threads on top ???
up-locking (threads on bottom) if the foregrip is stationary
down-locking (threads on top) if the foregrip is attached to collar nut & moves down to cover threads
Quote from: philaroman on August 17, 2021, 01:51:12 PM
I simply don't understand the purpose/desirability of that design, on a light spinner
why do you want ANY exposed threads on top ???
up-locking (threads on bottom) if the foregrip is stationary
down-locking (threads on top) if the foregrip is attached to collar nut & moves down to cover threads
My answer, and it may be mine alone, is that I'm holding cork while fishing, not plastic threads.
And in my limited experience none of the varieties of reel seat that have the foregrip attached to the nut, or any of the other non standard seats I've played with (fuji VSS, etc.) seem to work with these small footed reels.
My 2cents......the reel seat doesn't bother me, however the black and whit threads seem too "busy". Maybe a simple metallic thread like Jeri suggested......Bill
got it: I hold mostly fore+seat... you hold mostly rear+seat
side-note: Daiwa always had a strictly L/UL rod model
whatever was concurrent w/ your reels,
should have seat/collars custom-fitted to tiny foot
keep an eye out for an old glass Spinmatic, or similar
Beauty is in the eyes of the beholder, so unless you're building rods to sell, if it looks good to you go with it and if you don't like the looks change it.
Now with regards to the reel seat, there is no way I could stand having that stuff in front of my reel. I always have my index, and most of the time, my bird finger, too, in front of the reel. I guess that's one of the reasons I prefer Tennessee style slip rings. If I did a lot of casting with that thing I'd soon wear a blister on my fingers, plus it reduces feel/sensitivity, and would be just plain annoying.
Those Fuji seats come extra long in order to accommodate any conceivable reel foot. Once you know what type of rod you are building, you can cut down the threaded end to be long enough plus a little extra for the reels that might be used. Note how the threaded portion is shorter on your buddy's built rod. The "graphite" cuts easily and can be sanded flat with little effort. If you are sanding with power tools, low RPMs are your friend. Nylon gets gummy at fairly low temps.
In terms of the cork edge to blank: Functionally, you need to protect the end of the cork from getting chipped/torn. A generous filet or taper on the cork is important. Also consider an epoxy filled winding check if the face is large. Some folks load up the grip to blank transition with a ton of epoxy, and some folks like this look, but I try to avoid it.
On switching colors and patterns: It is harder to pull off a professional looking rod when going "rodeo clown". As tempting as it is to try a bunch of different things on the same rod, the odds are more in your favor if you pick a color/pattern scheme and stick with it. And grip diameters and shapes/edges should be consistent when there is not a functional need to diverge. Grip diameter, shape, and location have a huge effect on casting performance, but often does not get enough attention.
Black wraps on a flat black blank with straight/gradual taper grips is highly functional, gives a nice tactical look, and is used on some of the highest end rods. Some simple edge banding as Jeri mentioned is a reasonable next step, and metallic thread can be used for the banding for some subtle bling. Three and four colors, marbling, etc is a bit trickier to pull off, and the farther you go, the more likely it will look like overkill on smaller/lighter rods. If you look at the work of Jon Vadney on this board, you can see some examples of well executed highly decorative (but still highly functional) builds. He pulls out all the stops, but there is still a consistent pattern/scheme/color combo that makes it all work. It helps that he builds a lot of large saltwater sticks that can "withstand" :) a more complex decorative payload.
If you are just building for yourself, it is still worthwhile to pay attention to grip diameter, shape and length, but you can ignore the rest, and as Tommy noted, build whatever floats your boat. It will still fish the same if you don't get too heavily handed with the epoxy finish.
My $0.02,
-J
I'm gonna skip the black and white. Thank you everyone for talking some sense into me. They're a reason inwas hesitant.
With regard to the ends of the cork I've had good luck epoxying the ends and sprinkling (and pushing in) cork dust. That's usually my first choice.
Will post updates as it comes together.
Maybe a piece of cork tape over the exposed threads. That's is, of course, if you are committed to the reel. That's all part of the reason I hate reel seats.
I often get the opportunity to help budding rod builders, especially when they come to show their latest 'creation' for comment. The most frequent issue is that they are trying to run before they can walk, meaning that they are trying to build a masterpiece showing just about every technique they can find on 'Utube', and fail to observe and learn the basics. The fundamental issue is always the transition between components, whether it is a cork handle, reel seat or something else, and the lack of planning towards what they plan to do at all the junctions when viewed as a whole job.
The 'KISS' principle is sometimes the most effective and striking, simple colour sections with fine 3 or 4 turn metallic thread edging can be absolutely stunning when used as the core theme, and avoid outlandish decorations - for a simple well finished rod can equally appear professional, as one with multiples of fine and technical thread work.
Just an opinion that seems to work for us.
Quote from: JasonGotaPenn on August 17, 2021, 12:42:45 PM
Quote from: philaroman on August 17, 2021, 11:17:07 AM
no valid opinions on decoration, from me
why is the up-locking seat reversified -- why not just use down-locking ???
that's a pretty long handful of thread, for a cork-lover :-\
All opinions are equally valid. They're opinions.
Am I supposed to be using a different reel seat for threads-up install? If so that's news to me. I've always preferred threads up, if I were building a tuna stick I'd probably prefer to reel against a fixed point, but this is a bass rod so I'm building for comfort.
And there may be an optical illusion at play. Its a size 16 seat, twisted all the way down. With reel installed there's less than a half inch of exposed thread with my short foot SS1300. Slightly more with my shortER foot SS700.
Now, the rod I built for a friend using an old FPS sz 20 seat, that looked goofy with reel installed. Didn't realize until guides were already wrapped. So i solved that with cork tape. I think it came out ok. Had I planned ahead I definitely woulda sawed off an inch or so. That's what made me measure how much I could trim on this one. I decided the quarter inch that i could actually do without wasnt worth the risk of error.
This is the way I have always attached my reel seats, reason because I want my reel to always sit on precisely ( very near) the same spot. This is because I control my cast with the hand behind the conventional reel during the cast and I also want my reel the same distance from my body when retrieving a lure on most of my rods.
Took some thinking why that would not apply to a spinner. I think you place your hand in front of the reel when casting or perhaps around the reel foot is that right?
yup, depending on angler's choice & rod/reel clearance limitations, could be just the index above the stem, or every finger above pinky, or anything in-between... plus, some guys reposition their hand completely to the rear grip for retrieve/battle
I'm w/ Tom: place my hand mostly above stem & keep it there to feather line & touch exposed blank for sensitivity, AND ROD REMAINS BALANCED through every phase... I hold the rear grip w/ my armpit more often than w/ my hand -- exposed threads behind reel are no big deal
I find I like to have the reel stem between middle and ring finger for casting one handed (which is most of my FW casting) but reel stem goes back between middle and index finger before I start retrieval (both fighting a fish or jigging a lure). But this is a new development. The stem used to stay between middle and ring full time, but the bail wire of some large saltwater reels rubs on my fat index finger, and that gets old after about 3 seconds. As a result my whole approach has changed.
I'm pretty happy with how the cork-dust end treatment came out. Ive been sacrificing a syringe (I have nurses in the family) to inject the mixed 5min epoxy into the gap, without getting it on the blank, then i just use the "sprinkle cork press it in sprinkle more press again repeat until time runs out or you can't pack any more in. As I near the end of the time limit i use a business card for the last push to also level it out. Then 2 hours later I give that newly created surface a blast of compressed air and a pass with some 600 grit sandpaper while spinning the rod, then another air blast and call it a day. If you zoom in you can see slight scratching on the blank from the sandpaper but thread will cover that.
Sounds like an awful lot of work to me. Personally, I like taking the easy way out by fitting the grip tight so epoxy will fill the gap, adding a vinyl winding check and adding a matching wrap. Fitting the grip tight is easy and slipping on a cheap winding check is even easier. I'm not a of metal winding check, though.
for learning purposes seems like nice way to do it, but for practical purposes a vinil/plastic or alum winding check would be easier and faster.
I dont know how bad the cork was in that zone, but sometimes making a trim ring with metallic thread and applying epoxy will make the ugly crack disappear or hard to find.
with that said, I must admit I not fan of the easy ways or shorcuts LOL, few years ago I was just starting to repair my own rods and felt like rebuilding my favorite rod, when I took the thread near to the cork out near the handle it came out with small pieces of cork, so it looked ugly (maybe as it was in your rod), so, in order to cover that area I put some crazy glue with a tooth pick and poured some "glow in the dark" dust, then added more crazy glue and poured some more of the same dust, then made my decorative wrap and epoxied the whole area, after some coats of epoxy I had a nice ramp there.
https://alantani.com/index.php?topic=22222.0
I know long decorative wraps and heavy epoxy is not your thing but its another way to skin the cat.
(https://alantani.com/gallery/19/3592_14_07_17_1_08_18_190201218.jpeg)
(https://alantani.com/gallery/19/3592_14_07_17_1_09_30_19023728.jpeg)
and the good thing is that now it glows in the dark pretty cool, well so far it havent served me to any practical or useful purpose
other than showing it off to friends LOL
(https://alantani.com/gallery/19/3592_14_07_17_1_07_35_190181299.jpeg)
my idea was to make a winding check with the Glow in the dark dust and epoxy
That looks pretty cool, and unique, Alex!
I like the glow in "the dark" bit bit just the edges need some practice ;D :D :D
So this is what I ended up doing. I tried to give some thought to what Jeri was saying about focusing on transitions, and that kind of guided my approach. I did a single layer of the pro-wrap metallic twist thread (blue + gold) wrapped next to some pro wrap "sky blue." That's the color I'll be using for the guide wraps, it's quite a light blue pre-epoxy but I love the color wet. Just the twist thread by itself looked mostly gold, so adding the blue really got it where I want it visually.
it's 2.25" long to the top of the gold collar. I'm really happy with how it came out. It added a bit of bling but it's still small and fairly subtle.
Also re: the work of doing the cork end the way I did, to each their own but it's 5 minute epoxy. It can't take long.
I also tried my hand at doing a thread ramp below the grip. I don't love it, but it was a first attempt. Honestly the thread cone was fairly smooth by the third try, but my epoxy is less good. But I suspect I can clean that up with some sandpaper and a thin second coat.
Thank you everyone for tolerating and guiding me as I stumble through this. I really do appreciate it.