I've been using Reel Butter on some reels and Penn Blue on others.
Is there anything new out there for gears that has given better results?
-Steve
Ive been using the blue yamaha marine grease with great results. The quantum hot sauce grease I used before is horrible unless you clean and regrease every 6 months. It separates and hardens in around a year.
Quote from: sandbar on August 25, 2023, 10:22:37 PMI've been using Reel Butter on some reels and Penn Blue on others.
Is there anything new out there for gears that has given better results?
-Steve
define "better results"?
Reel Butter is a very light grease that is typically used on the gears of light freshwater reels to keep them free spinning and "smooth". But they don't require much in the way of corrosion protection not being exposed to salt. It works fine for it's intended purpose. Its more durable than oil and is not as heavy as stiffer greases but not as durable as it might be for most saltwater gear applications. We also generally prefer something with anti-salt additives for that application.
What are your goals for your gear lubrication?
Almost every spinning reel I have opened that had made use of Reel Butter was smooth, worked just fine and had been pretty well protected. Personally, I think it's a little thin for my liking, but it seems to have done its job efficiently.
I'm a SuperLube fan. It has a little more substance than Reel Butter and is rated as saltwater protective, too, so that's my go to grease.
Been using 301, corrosionX lube and grease and Cals. Was getting too confusing before. I have limited brain cells left.
it might be less a matter of what you use and more a matter of just using something.
Quote from: alantani on August 26, 2023, 09:08:05 PMit might be less a matter of what you use and more a matter of just using something.
I am not a pro reel fixer, but I have been doing all of my reel repairs and maint. for around 30 years. I also worked on many reels for friends and family. I agree with the above post. Most reels that had issues had either old dry grease or nearly no grease.
I will say just make sure you pick a quality grease with a good reputation such as Cal's, Yamaha, Shimano grease, etc. There are a few reel greases that just plain suck, but they are still likely better than no grease. I am only familiar with freshwater reels and their maint. Dealing with saltwater is a very rare thing for me.
Quote from: Hytekrednek on August 26, 2023, 10:05:41 PMQuote from: alantani on August 26, 2023, 09:08:05 PMit might be less a matter of what you use and more a matter of just using something.
I am not a pro reel fixer, but I have been doing all of my reel repairs and maint. for around 30 years. I also worked on many reels for friends and family. I agree with the above post. Most reels that had issues had either old dry grease or nearly no grease. Replaced regularly and not a complaint heard.
I will say just make sure you pick a quality grease with a good reputation such as Cal's, Yamaha, Shimano grease, etc. There are a few reel greases that just plain suck, but they are still likely better than no grease. I am only familiar with freshwater reels and their maint. Dealing with saltwater is a very rare thing for me.
Precisely right my friend. Anything is better than nothing. Vasoline was used for years to pack 704Z spinners so that people could swim with them and crank underwater (not a seal to be found on those old work horses). Pretty sure that's an off label use! :P
Replaced in a timely fashion anything will do.
However:
The consensus list of can't go wrong oils and greases (as long as they are replaced when needed):
Anything with Diawa, Penn or Shimano on it is perfectly fine for general saltwater use.
Marine Bearing Grease (Yamaha has stood the test of time but any will do). Corrosion-X grease is also a good heavy duty grease.
Cal's. (Tan = Thick, Purple = light or cold weather)'
Super Lube for a little lighter and non-toxic grease.
TSI321 for a "super speed oil". Cut with 100% Isopropyl alcohol as it suits you. There is nothing out there faster and as durable for speed.
CorrosionX/ReelX/GunX (it's all the same) for a "workhorse oil" and rust remover. Many a bad part rehabbed with it.
Anything outside of that list and you are just making work for yourself re-inventing the wheel. Which might be fine, its a hobbty, enjoy experimenting! :d
Sal gave me a recipe for his grease. I've been using it with good success.
Valvoline marine grease cut with automatic transmission fluid to the consistency required. Kind of a PITA to mix but have had no separation with stuff I mixed 1 year ago. Bill
Has anyone experimented with Fluid Film as a lubricate in reels. It is a lanolin based lubricate used for for automotive lifts and as an undercoating vehicles because it stays in place.
I know it stinks for a week or more, as I use it for my car lift but is a solid lubricate, stays put and is much better than white grease with respect to longevity.
I haven't tried it myself on reels. I am just wondering if someone had experience and if so, what were their thoughts.
Quote from: jtwill98 on August 28, 2023, 06:19:51 PMHas anyone experimented with Fluid Film as a lubricate in reels. It is a lanolin based lubricate used for for automotive lifts and as an undercoating vehicles because it stays in place.
I know it stinks for a week or more, as I use it for my car lift but is a solid lubricate, stays put and is much better than white grease with respect to longevity.
I haven't tried it myself on reels. I am just wondering if someone had experience and if so, what were their thoughts.
Be the Guinea Pig & let us know how things end up. ;D
Haven't tried it. As old as I am, it's hard to get me to change anymore.
Quote from: alantani on September 02, 2023, 02:57:17 PMHaven't tried it. As old as I am, it's hard to get me to change anymore.
I agree
There are a few really good lubricants that will do the job most of us expect out of them. I think that, for most of us anyway, if we find something that is doing a really good job without any weak points we generally hesitate to switch, mainly because "why try to reinvent a wheel" that is working as it should and up to our expectations. If we switch to some sort of other application or need, that might be a different story or reason to try something different.
Fluid Film smokes at 212F, so unless you want your reel to smell like burning mutton, you might want to keep it off of the drag stack. Dropping point is also low ~100F.
Otherwise looks like an interesting choice if corrosion protection is your main concern.
Let us know how it works out.
-J
I just serviced my Shimano AX-UL reel with fluid film a few nights ago. The reel was dry.
Fluid film being so light and oily, I thought to myself, why not. It's smooth as silk now.
I might do the other AX-UL backup reel, if so I'll take pictures.
Being so light, I wouldn't use if for heavier reels or gears. As a coating for corrosion on bail springs and other exposed parts, I might.
Wasn't a lanolin based lubricant the go to back when these really vintage direct drive reels were cutting edge?
I use penn blue grease and beige cals on clutches.
Lately i have been using ACF Corrosion block which like the penn grease is blue.
Compared to penn and calls, its very cheap and not much more expensive than conventional
multipurpose automotive grease
It is available in little 2oz tubes as well as 14ox grease gun tubes and 1lb tubs
As yet i have not been brave enough to try it on drag washers but if anyone has tried it on
drag washers i would like to know how they got on
Should just be a re-packaged generic silicon marine grease (nothing wrong with that). Might even be repackaged Super Lube.
And small tubes are convenient.
I wouldn't worry about on drags, although some marine greases dry out more easily than others. If you're on top of maintenance then no worries.
Try ACF50 Corrosion block. it is a waterproof silicone grease and the price is very good.
There is also a spray to protect chrome etc.
The grease comes in 3 sizes from a little 2oz tube to a 1lb tub.
Like penn grease it is blue in colour.
The tube has a pic of a reel on the tube meaning it is suitable for a reel.
It can also be used for many uses such as bearings on your car.
Here in the UK it is used by the RNLI (royal national lifeboat institute) in their boat trailers
Re ACF50 grease:
Here is the product data sheet:
http://www.learchem.com/files/brochures/cb-grease-eng-web.pdf (http://www.learchem.com/files/brochures/cb-grease-eng-web.pdf)
And the Saftey Data Sheet:
http://www.learchem.com/files/msds/corrosionblockgrease-whmis2015-english-v6.pdf (http://www.learchem.com/files/msds/corrosionblockgrease-whmis2015-english-v6.pdf)
I like to take a look at the SDS before deciding to purchase a chemical product, and play close attention to the sections on toxicity and safe handling. They recommend no skin contact for this product, so that means gloves when working on reels.
Some observations:
Bonus points for listing some of the properties in the data sheet. Better than the magic reel grease products that have no data at all. A couple useful items includes the thickness (NLGI 2), and a very high dropping point temperature (536 F).
The base oil is not listed (big deduction). I don't think it is silicone oil, as the SDS lists the base oil as biodegradable, which silicone is not. Silicone is resistant to solvents, so if the stuff is silicone base you will have to clean it out with something like dish soap and hot water. If you could find a reference to the base oil in the grease product, it would be useful.
For drag grease, you want a high dropping point, which this product has. The popular drag greases usually also have a PFFE (AKA Teflon) additive, but I don't know if this is necessary.
ACF 50 spray is a well regarded thin film corrosion remover/protective coating, competing with products like Boeshield. My guess is that they are using the same strategy as WD-40, Corrosion-X, and others to leverage a successful brand name in different lubricant products. This is most likely just a typical grease, as it can't be a thick grease and a thin film at the same time.
Sounds like a decent product. As John noted, resisting oxidation while the reel is sitting around waiting for the next trip is usually the most important attribute. Reels are not too demanding a piece of machinery when it comes to lubricants.
-J
I dont know about the superzilla grease, but if it is like a lot of these types of products, it is probably just a good plain bearing grease in a fancy labeled tube and sold with lots of hype and marketing. I suspect if it was that much better than normal grease, most would have heard about it and probably be using it.
The fact that you maintain your reels at all, even with a generic bearing grease, still puts you way ahead of most users. I tend to just use what a professional reel fixer uses and recommends.
There are some new and awesome lubricants out there based on very new chemistry, I just dont know enough about them to trust them in my $300-$700 reels. Were I to try a new grease, it would probably just be on one reel at first, likely an older mid-tier reel.
Quote from: Hytekrednek on October 06, 2023, 06:40:34 PMI dont know about the superzilla grease, but if it is like a lot of these types of products, it is probably just a good plain bearing grease in a fancy labeled tube and sold with lots of hype and marketing. I suspect if it was that much better than normal grease, most would have heard about it and probably be using it.
The fact that you maintain your reels at all, even with a generic bearing grease, still puts you way ahead of most users. I tend to just use what a professional reel fixer uses and recommends.
There are some new and awesome lubricants out there based on very new chemistry, I just dont know enough about them to trust them in my $300-$700 reels. Were I to try a new grease, it would probably just be on one reel at first, likely an older mid-tier reel.
I'm with you, brother. And I have been bitten by curiosity to experiment with the latest synthetic miracles.
But it's far less a case of which grease you use. It's the amount of "elbow grease" you use in maintaining your gear that really matters. Factory prep has come a long way to gain durability advantages for most guys. Because most guys do nothing to maintain their gear other than a freshwater spritz now and again.
You could go a long way with the cheapest marine bearing grease at the local auto parts store and 3 in 1 oil found at a supermarket if you regularly used them both.
My Yamaha mechanic turned me onto his favorite grease which is Mercury / Quicksilver 2-4-C Marine Grease with Teflon. He said it is the only grease that he has found that doesn't harden in the saltwater environment. What I like about it is it is a little thinner consistency than Yamaha Marine Grease but yet still lubricates reel gears quite well. I also use it on my Yamaha motors and surprisingly when I repowered with new Yamaha F250's in 2018 and uncrated the new motors they appeared to be lubricated from the factory with 2-4-C. I know for certain they were not lubricated with Yamaha blue grease. In any event 2-4-C, Corrosion X and live bait is all I need.
I use all Super Lube products. NLGI1 and NLGI2, ISO 220 gear oil, plus the ISO 10 and ISO 22 light oils. They all work very well.
Quote from: johndtuttle on October 11, 2023, 08:40:00 PMYou could go a long way with the cheapest marine bearing grease at the local auto parts store and 3 in 1 oil found at a supermarket if you regularly used them both.
Amen! I'm not against innovation and I respect the fine-tuning that some seek to gain enhanced performance. I do believe reliance on "super lubes" to keep you out of your reel for extended periods is a risk. IMO, you have to go in and see if this or that lube is really saving your reel or masking symptoms.
I don't know the specs of this stuff, but my Abu's love it. it was fitty cents at a garage sale.
Shellbelly - Firstly, I REALLY hope you're joking us - I have to think that to a camara geek that box and bottle would be worth at least $1 as a shelfie and you could double your money as opposed to wasting it on reels....And since I happen to know somebody like that (a camara geek)...if you are really using that for reel maintenance, how about I trade you a couple of 4 oz. bottles of TSI321 that I am sure your Abu's will also love???? - john
Quote from: Brewcrafter on October 20, 2023, 04:26:02 AMShellbelly - Firstly, I REALLY hope you're joking us
Sort of. I had to try it, though. A few drops went into 4 reels and the results were notable. It has a metal applicator that helps to apply a drop (or less) exactly where you want it to go. Reel oils should be so equipped to cut down on waste. I believe this lube is for certain areas within motorized filmmaking equipment.
I understand the collector's POV. The top flap and ears of the box are missing. I was kind of hoping someone would know what else this oil would have been marketed and labeled for. I doubt it was made and used exclusively by Kodak.
Send me a PM. I'm always willing to help the shelf of a fellow collector.
Returning to the topic...I was agreeing that any frequent maintenance is better than neglect.
It's worthwhile experimenting with what's out there; like most areas of science/engineering things constantly move forward whether it's incrementally or massive advancements. I'm yet to find a "light" lubricant I like more than TSI321 but in greases there are definitely alternatives out there that outperform the extremely tacky marine greases we've been using for a while, in my opinion.
Quote from: boon on October 23, 2023, 10:42:55 PMIt's worthwhile experimenting with what's out there; like most areas of science/engineering things constantly move forward whether it's incrementally or massive advancements. I'm yet to find a "light" lubricant I like more than TSI321 but in greases there are definitely alternatives out there that outperform the extremely tacky marine greases we've been using for a while, in my opinion.
I think for spinners this is certainly worth exploring as much as one cares to. Free tuning of the handle is very useful for tossing artificials or dropping jigs all day as spinners notoriously have poor cranking power.
With most conventionals I'm personally not too worried other than wanting solid and reliable corrosion protection (which TSI321 seems to be good for too).
Yours, John