Hi lads,
Just got back from a week at sea, chasing monster kings and bass off the top of New Zealand, out wide past the Three Kings Islands.
It was a sensational week with a cracker bunch of guys (none of whom I'd met before the trip).
One guy flew all the way from Nagasaki, Japan, another from Shanghai, China, and a third from Adelaide, Australia, just for the trip.
There were also three of us Kiwis aboard (me included), so six anglers in total.
While I love to speed jig primarily - usually at around 100m (330ft) deep, with jigs between 500-1000g (17-35oz) - there was so much squid around that the jigs weren't generating much interest.
We caught ~150 squid each night and burned through the lot each following day, with nearly all producing fish.
That meant we caught around 100 kings between 25-35kg (55-77lb) on the first day, before mixing things up a bit more with some time on kings and some chasing bass and hapuku on the following days.
Though I try not to have any 'expectations' on trips like these, I inevitably find myself hoping to get - or at least equal - a PB.
That wasn't the case on this trip, unfortunately, but I still caught more fish than I could count and some that would've been 'fish of a lifetime' size, if my current PB wasn't 40kg (~90lb).
While I didn't really get any photos, I thought you might get a kick out of this - one of the many bass we caught on the trip - @65kg+ (~145lb).
How's that tail?! So much power...
(https://alantani.com/gallery/38/3590-111223224410.jpeg)
Righto - hope yer all keeping well, Justin
PS Rick (Roosterfish) - sorry you weren't able to make it. Would've been an even better trip with ya there. Deepest gratitude for the favour you did - I'm in your debt...
very nice! there was some discussion about flying out. i just wouldn't want to get yelled at for laying the rod down on the rail!!!! >:D
Getting yelled at by the skipper is mandatory ;D
Wow!!! Sounds like a fun and amazing trip.
That Bass was only 145 pounds???!!!!
Looks WAY BIGGER than 145.
Maybe the camera angle?
Kings are the same as our Yellowtail aren't they?
Steve
That is a great report and those are some incredible fish, thanks for sharing! What do those 1000g jigs look like? That a lot of metal! - john
Hi Steve, yep - they're the same species (just the XL versions ;) )...
Hi John, here's one:
(https://alantani.com/gallery/38/3590-121223203810.jpeg)
I don't know how pressure, density and weight work down deep, but they sure seem to feel pretty heavy when jigging 100m+ (330ft+)!
Cheers lads, Justin
Quote from: redsetta on December 12, 2023, 08:47:26 PMHi Steve, yep - they're the same species (just the XL versions ;) )...
Hi John, here's one:
I know how pressure, density and weight work down deep, but they sure seem to feel pretty heavy when jigging 100m+ (330ft+)!
Cheers lads, Justin
That's one long jig!
Water is a tiny bit denser under pressure and at lower temperatures, but not significant enough to make it harder to work a jig on a deep drop. It is pretty much all friction across and along the line. The amount of friction is a function of line size and current vs boat position. Jig weight, shape and action will also affect resistance, but won't change with depth. Bouncing the rod tip isn't moving the jig at those depths, and jig-winding a kilo of lead is going to give you some serious Popeye arms! Curious how you guys work those big jigs.
My PB Eastern Pacific yellowtail (AKA king) barely cracked 20 kilos. Can't imagine a 40 kilo beast, or even a 30. I'm putting on the earplugs and railing the rod for one of those. The captain can say whatever he wants :)
-J
Wow. Just wow..... - john
I need to book a trip up there.....
That Bass is a monster. Wow. Surely you initially think you've just got hung up on the bottom? Any idea what rod/reel combo it was caught on?
Justin,
I thought Kings were the larger version of our Yellowtail.
That Bass was really only 145 pounds?
Steve
Quote from: Crab Pot on December 13, 2023, 02:30:40 AMI thought Kings were the larger version of our Yellowtail.
Pretty much. Same species the last time that I heard -Seriola lalandi. For some reason, they get much larger ones more frequently off New Zealand.
Haven't fished for them in New Zealand, but have caught them in Australia and Mexico. Didn't notice any difference in behavior or appearance.
Update: But there is talk among the scientists of splitting into three sub-species:
https://www.researchgate.net/profile/Larry-Allen-3/publication/277928176_A_Tale_of_Three_Tails_Cryptic_Speciation_in_a_Globally_Distributed_Marine_Fish_of_the_Genus_Seriola/links/5579f18508aeacff2003ce47/A-Tale-of-Three-Tails-Cryptic-Speciation-in-a-Globally-Distributed-Marine-Fish-of-the-Genus-Seriola.pdf (https://www.researchgate.net/profile/Larry-Allen-3/publication/277928176_A_Tale_of_Three_Tails_Cryptic_Speciation_in_a_Globally_Distributed_Marine_Fish_of_the_Genus_Seriola/links/5579f18508aeacff2003ce47/A-Tale-of-Three-Tails-Cryptic-Speciation-in-a-Globally-Distributed-Marine-Fish-of-the-Genus-Seriola.pdf)
-J
Hi Logan, I run two Accurate Obsidian BX600NNs - one on a Jig Star Twisted Sista for livies and one on an MC Works Southern Blue 548SS for jigging.
All the boat gear is the same - Maxel Transformers on Jig Star Twisted Sistas.
It's definitely like you've hooked the bottom, until it runs... :o
By 20-odd metres deep, the swim bladder comes in to play and the fish becomes buoyant.
They're wildly strong...
Hope you're keeping well mate.
Cheers, Justin
Hi lads,
If of interest, the chap who flew over from Nagasaki sent me a pic of one of the kings that typifies the size taken over the trip...
Around the time this pic was taken, sister-ship Radar Blue (in the background) boated and released a 52kg (115lb) king.
(https://alantani.com/gallery/38/3590-050324201227.jpeg)
All the best, Justin
if i kill one of these in 60 seconds, can i lay the rod on the rail? it works great for yellowfin tuna!
wow, a fantastic trip or should I say, fantasy trip
Quote from: alantani on March 05, 2024, 10:43:41 PMif i kill one of these in 60 seconds, can i lay the rod on the rail? it works great for yellowfin tuna!
Haha, nope!
Unless you want the skipper and deckie swearing at ya ;) ;D
They pretty much all go back over the side anyway.
ok, then pass. need to protect my shoulders. two bad rotator cuffs take priority over a skipper and deckhand!!!! :d
Quote from: alantani on March 06, 2024, 01:03:06 AMok, then pass. need to protect my shoulders. two bad rotator cuffs take priority over a skipper and deckhand!!!! :d
They might give you a bit of grief but at the end of the day they're there to provide a top quality experience and if that's how you want to fish they can shut up and accommodate it :-X . I'd love to see how the rail technique works down this part of the world. I've never heard of people doing it because of the "tough macho" thing.
Charter crews outside the U.S. won't give an American angler serious grief (ie. beyond a bit of banter) about the way s/he fishes, because they all know how well U.S. clients tip!
Leaving that aside, I think in some parts of the world there is that perception that placing your rod on the rail is somehow unsporting, but who cares. That style of large NZ vessel is not dissimilar to a CA party boat and should be a good situation for rail rodding (high rail, large unmanoeuverable vessel where a longer rod can keep line away from the boat, etc).
Yeah, the sporting thing is a bit arbitrary about where the line is drawn. Fishing for sport is a bit of an oddball activity, so it doesn't make sense to me to tell someone else how they are supposed to have fun. Fly fishing can get to be ridiculous when it comes to what is "sporting".
But I was also thinking that our southern hemisphere members must be cringing a little watching our San Diego long range trip videos. Lots of rod-railing and handing off rods to deckhands to complete the fight. I think that the SD long range trips originated with harvesting as a goal, and while it is changing slowly, harvest counts are still how a trip's success is measured. Nothing wrong with harvesting, BTW.
If I went on one of these NZ yellowtail trips, I would probably go with the flow, figuring to learn a thing or two, but have to be honest about not being enthused about staying off the rail on a 70 lb fish :)
Been awhile since I have been to NZ, but remember that in that part of the world, the exporting of American tipping culture was not looked upon favorably. I am on their side on this.
The problem with tipping is that rather than coming to an agreement on what a fair price for service is, the customer gets to decide how profitable the service will be. And then there is always that guy who thinks that he will get a premium service by overtipping, which drives up the average tip, which just increases the portion of payment that is arbitrary. All this creates an imbalance of power.
One customer tactic I see a lot in Baja is negotiating down to a very low price and then tipping very well (30% or more) if happy with the trip, which is usually more about how good the fishing is rather than if the guide puts in a honest day's effort. In the end, it seems to both sides are usually less happy, and price transparency is hard to come by. Not a healthy marketplace. This is a direct result of having a large portion of customers coming from an area where being a big tipper is considered high status.
If tipping is customary, I think that it is only fair to pay the customary tip. Being a "big tipper" is not helping in the long run, and introducing tipping where it is not present is not so great either.
Just my opinion...
-J
Re: the tendency to avoid railing here - it's probably a combination of factors.
It's a lot more common in NZ to use big spinners (eg Saltiga, Dog Fight, Stella etc) on monster kings, whether casting or jigging.
For obvious reasons, railing isn't an option when using an eggbeater, so there's definitely a bit of an attitude that if they can land a 90lb king without using the rail, why should anyone need to?
Also worth bearing in mind that the average size of kings on these trips (in my experience) has been 75-90lb (115lb at the top end), which is a terrific fight that really doesn't require rail assistance.
If our kings got to cow tuna size (eg 200lb+), however, that'd be a different story...
"Only" 75-90 lbs? I will rail a 30 lber off the rocks without shame :)
-J
A friend just came back from a 3 Kings trip, I was invited but work got in the way.
Best Kingfish (Yellowtail for our northern friends) was just shy of 100lb, many fish over 60lb. All released.
Filled the freezer with Bass (Wreckfish), 2 fish over 90lb and several other very solid ones.
Weather was apparently terrible the entire time but they fished through it. No billfish this trip.
wow a 100# kingfish !! :al
My back is sore just thinking of a 100 YT and not being able to use the rail... :o
(https://scontent.fakl1-4.fna.fbcdn.net/v/t39.30808-6/500651878_691785683457574_1729082416710186422_n.jpg?stp=cp6_dst-jpegr_tt6&_nc_cat=102&ccb=1-7&_nc_sid=833d8c&_nc_ohc=GC-c3eKDaaIQ7kNvwEpQlyo&_nc_oc=AdnzXDjItZ67jLQ6uxlG1Bhn6_DeDYO3OuCTpdD60f_PxA-vzS-R-RMWy2HgCdB2-_Y&_nc_zt=23&se=-1&_nc_ht=scontent.fakl1-4.fna&_nc_gid=Qaotmr-4TeIsGAwWm07yqQ&oh=00_AfLGPyWfTk9bsJYvNgBHRnX8gvVqZlxnFZbxKDzsRuceqQ&oe=684328B1)
Good times!