Shimano was always great at parts availability and delivery. Even during covid. Now, you look at their sight and for popular reels like the Tranx 400 and 500 parts availability has become questionable.
I went over the parts list for the Tranx400 and 500 and this is what it states:
Tranx 400
Discontinued - 55 parts
out of stock eta or no eta listed - 14
Tranx 500
Discontinued - 63 parts
out of stock eta/no eta - 47
ETA's have not been reliable. Just received a A/R pawl ordered in October. Had a number of eta's during that time.
This doesn't look promising. Have these reels reached the end of their support life? Both are pretty much the most sought after reel in the muskie world and continue to be sold everywhere.
I quit Shimano years ago due to parts and poor customer service.
I also gave up on working on these Shimano's, like Lee, a few years ago. Wasted too much time trying to track down parts from multiple sources that were fast becoming extinct.
Part of the issue, as I understand it, is that they changed their part numbering system. And with the tens of thousands of parts, assigning new numbers took some time. That was last year.
So a part may show discontinued —- but actually be in stock.
However, in many cases (generally the part I need!) —- they are truly out of those parts and have used up the inventory —- and will not make any more.
It is a mystery to me why a solid Japanese long time company like Shimano would not support their products longer?
I guess it must be new management, or the company was sold, or??
Sad...
Best, Fred
The TranX 400 and 500 are still current production reels. You can't get parts? It's not like these are original Curado's that haven't been made for years!
The coat of losing the small handful of customers who actually fish hard and often enough to wear out parts is apparently less than the cost of maintaining warehouses full of parts.
Most just buy the pretty reel, and leave it on the shelf most the time.
It will cost them my business too if the parts I need are never available. I spend around 2k a year on their reels. I expect commonly worn parts to be available. If not, I will go to a brand that will support their product and customer rather than abuse them.
Per Fred's post, Shimano re-numbered all of their parts in the last 6 months. Everything on the old numbering system will show as "discontinued" even if the same part with a new number is totally available. It is a huge pain in the rear if you're going off the original schematic and associated part numbers.
EDIT: I know it's very cool to hate on Shimano around here but thinking they would not make parts available for a relatively high end, current model reel is, erm, novel.
EDIT Again: Assuming you were on the Shimano CA site, all those discontinued parts literally list the replacement part number underneath?
Quote from: boon on August 02, 2024, 05:14:38 AMPer Fred's post, Shimano re-numbered all of their parts in the last 6 months. Everything on the old numbering system will show as "discontinued" even if the same part with a new number is totally available. It is a huge pain in the rear if you're going off the original schematic and associated part numbers.
EDIT: I know it's very cool to hate on Shimano around here but thinking they would not make parts available for a relatively high end, current model reel is, erm, novel.
EDIT Again: Assuming you were on the Shimano CA site, all those discontinued parts literally list the replacement part number underneath?
if you go to the Shimano USA site and go to the parts section (to order parts online) many/most of the Tranx 500 parts are listed as discontinued by number- no alternate part number identified by name (for example no main gear).
Take a look at the high speed model:
https://fishshop.shimano.com/collections/trx500hg (https://fishshop.shimano.com/collections/trx500hg)
Agree that this is most likely just a screw-up. But it is still not a good look.
Curious as to what anyone has heard who called them live.
-J
The new part numbers are there, not really clearly stated!
»=INDICATES A PART SUBSTITUTION
BNT4429 <—- old part number
>> 10KX2 <—- new part number
Every "discontinued" part has the new part number listed underneath it?
Ok it's not by name but if you're deep enough into reel repair to be ordering parts direct then surely you can figure this out.
Quote from: boon on August 02, 2024, 05:14:38 AMI know it's very cool to hate on Shimano around here but thinking they would not make parts available for a relatively high end, current model reel is, erm, novel.
I love my Shimano reels but not being able to find parts for a 15 year old and $400 at the time reel does not make me thrilled with their corprete policies.
Quote from: MarkT on August 02, 2024, 06:40:59 AMThe new part numbers are there, not really clearly stated!
»=INDICATES A PART SUBSTITUTION
BNT4429 <—- old part number
>> 10KX2 <—- new part number
Quote from: boon on August 02, 2024, 06:43:43 AMEvery "discontinued" part has the new part number listed underneath it?
Ok it's not by name but if you're deep enough into reel repair to be ordering parts direct then surely you can figure this out.
Nope. You cannot order these parts, at least online.
The old and new part number are just description fields for the same item. If it is listed as discontinued, you can't add it to the cart. There are not separate items for the new part numbers.
I didn't try this on a bunch of browsers, so maybe it is a presentation issue, but I sort of doubt it.
-J
Dealing with Mystic and Mo is far easier.
Quote from: jurelometer on August 02, 2024, 06:12:44 AMif you go to the Shimano USA site and go to the parts section (to order parts online) many/most of the Tranx 500 parts are listed as discontinued by number- no alternate part number identified by name (for example no main gear).
Canadian site is the same. Some only have the new number, others still show both. For example:
BNT4874
>> 10FJB PAWL CAP $1.99 $1.99 Out Of Stock ETA : 2024/08/25
BNT5611
>> 10QW4 Discontinued
10SWF HANDLE ASSEMBLY $54.99 $54.99 Out Of Stock ETA : 2024/08/06 Notify Me
I cannot come up with a reason they would change part numbers that probably range into the millions. Are they clearing their books of old part numbers they no longer stock. That would make sense as it must be extensive but of no use now. What schematics will be reissued with the new numbers?
Anyway, just me griping a bit. You know what they say about us old farts and change. >:( :D
Quote from: jurelometer on August 02, 2024, 07:26:36 PMQuote from: MarkT on August 02, 2024, 06:40:59 AMThe new part numbers are there, not really clearly stated!
»=INDICATES A PART SUBSTITUTION
BNT4429 <—- old part number
>> 10KX2 <—- new part number
Quote from: boon on August 02, 2024, 06:43:43 AMEvery "discontinued" part has the new part number listed underneath it?
Ok it's not by name but if you're deep enough into reel repair to be ordering parts direct then surely you can figure this out.
Nope. You cannot order these parts, at least online.
The old and new part number are just description fields for the same item. If it is listed as discontinued, you can't add it to the cart. There are not separate items for the new part numbers.
I didn't try this on a bunch of browsers, so maybe it is a presentation issue, but I sort of doubt it.
-J
Quote from: jurelometer on August 02, 2024, 07:26:36 PMQuote from: MarkT on August 02, 2024, 06:40:59 AMThe new part numbers are there, not really clearly stated!
»=INDICATES A PART SUBSTITUTION
BNT4429 <—- old part number
>> 10KX2 <—- new part number
Quote from: boon on August 02, 2024, 06:43:43 AMEvery "discontinued" part has the new part number listed underneath it?
Ok it's not by name but if you're deep enough into reel repair to be ordering parts direct then surely you can figure this out.
Nope. You cannot order these parts, at least online.
The old and new part number are just description fields for the same item. If it is listed as discontinued, you can't add it to the cart. There are not separate items for the new part numbers.
I didn't try this on a bunch of browsers, so maybe it is a presentation issue, but I sort of doubt it.
-J
They're sold out but it's there... https://fishshop.shimano.com/products/10kx2
Ooh,
I tried that for the main gear, and there it is!
https://fishshop.shimano.com/products/10CP3 (https://fishshop.shimano.com/products/10CP3)
So if you look at the schematic, find the old part number, search through the Tranx 500 part ordering pages for the old part number and find the corresponding new part number, ignore that it is listed as "Discontinued", cut and paste the new part number into the URL, you are rewarded with a page with the part that can be added to your cart. 'Cause if you don't want the part bad enough to dig for it...
Oh, and to make it as inconvenient as possible- once they tag the part as "Discontinued" the description is wiped out, so you can't search for the part by name.
Now that is what I call stellar customer service! /s
Tried this on two different browsers now, same result.
Let's see how long this takes for Shimano to clean up.
-J
Quote from: jurelometer on August 02, 2024, 10:46:09 PMOoh,
I tried that for the main gear, and there it is!
https://fishshop.shimano.com/products/10CP3 (https://fishshop.shimano.com/products/10CP3)
So if you look at the schematic, find the old part number, search through the Tranx 500 part ordering pages for the old part number and find the corresponding new part number, ignore that it is listed as "Discontinued", cut and paste the new part number into the URL, you are rewarded with a page with the part that can be added to your cart. 'Cause if you don't want the part bad enough to dig for it...
Oh, and to make it as inconvenient as possible- once they tag the part as "Discontinued" the description is wiped out, so you can't search for the part by name.
Now that is what I call stellar customer service! /s
Tried this on two different browsers now, same result.
Let's see how long this takes for Shimano to clean up.
-J
Their website also often has bad info, making the more expensive reel have better specs than the cheaper version. They blame it on bad data entry. The true specs are on the box!
Quote from: jurelometer on August 02, 2024, 10:46:09 PMOoh,
I tried that for the main gear, and there it is!
https://fishshop.shimano.com/products/10CP3 (https://fishshop.shimano.com/products/10CP3)
So if you look at the schematic, find the old part number, search through the Tranx 500 part ordering pages for the old part number and find the corresponding new part number, ignore that it is listed as "Discontinued", cut and paste the new part number into the URL, you are rewarded with a page with the part that can be added to your cart. 'Cause if you don't want the part bad enough to dig for it...
So... one more step than before? You can also just type the new part number in the search box at the top.
I mean, we could title this thread "The internet is hard and I don't like change and I also don't really like Shimano, generally speaking" and it would serve the same purpose.
Not every part shows up as being available when you search that way. I've been doing that since the change after talking to Shimano.
What about the abundance of back ordered parts. It's never been at the level it is now.
"I really don't like Shimano 'cause I have much more enjoyable things to do than go on an exploratory expedition just to find a part for their overpriced fishing equipment" would be an appropriate title if I were writing it. ;) 😂
But they do make realy nice reels.
Seems to me
Quote from: boon on August 03, 2024, 10:07:48 AMQuote from: jurelometer on August 02, 2024, 10:46:09 PMOoh,
I tried that for the main gear, and there it is!
https://fishshop.shimano.com/products/10CP3 (https://fishshop.shimano.com/products/10CP3)
So if you look at the schematic, find the old part number, search through the Tranx 500 part ordering pages for the old part number and find the corresponding new part number, ignore that it is listed as "Discontinued", cut and paste the new part number into the URL, you are rewarded with a page with the part that can be added to your cart. 'Cause if you don't want the part bad enough to dig for it...
So... one more step than before? You can also just type the new part number in the search box at the top.
I mean, we could title this thread "The internet is hard and I don't like change and I also don't really like Shimano, generally speaking" and it would serve the same purpose.
More accurately "The internet is hard for some of the folk at Shimano."
You skipped over the part where the customer has to deduce that interspersed with parts that are directly orderable, some or all are of those parts listed as unorderable ("Discontinued") are actually mislabeled and are orderable if you add a secondary step to search for them. Don't know if you have actually gone to the page linked earlier, but it is worth a look.
Shimano has earned a lump or two here.
-J
Japan is going broke. The yen is collapsing and they are basically in a recession.
They finally stopped their long battle with deflation. Japanese tourists in Hawaii used to be everywhere; like our ants. Since the pandemic they're nowhere to be seen.
God this thread got good fast
Quote from: mikeysm on August 03, 2024, 11:02:46 PMJapan is going broke. The yen is collapsing and they are basically in a recession.
Unfortunatly we are not far behind.
It's unfortunate that Shimano didn't handle their transition to the new part numbers more professionally.
On the other hand, they more than any other manufacturer in recent history, have been the leader in the development of innovative mid-priced and high end saltwater reels.
As much as I love my Penns, I have to admit that no other reel manufacturer has come close to matching Shimano when it comes to the depth and breadth of quality saltwater reel series introduced over the past two decades. Trinidad, TLD, Talica, Tiagra, Tranx, Calcutta, Stella, Baitrunner and probably many others are trendsetters that have withstood the test of time.
As to service, while it is upsetting to find that parts or service are no longer provided for a discontinued series, I have had nothing but great experiences every time that I have called Shimano. From top to bottom, they have always done their best to take care of my parts and service needs, often going above and beyond the call of duty.
Considering all of the above, I am willing to cut Shimano some slack with their parts number transition. They will hopefully get it straightened out in the not too distant future.
Thanks Randy,
That is a fair take from the pro-Shimano side of the house.
I think as an industry leader, Shimano is also bearing the brunt of the ire for changes in the industry that are less popular here. The constant churn of new models with ever shortening support lifespans, the decreasing availability and increasing prices of parts, expensive "premium" models with little technological improvement from reels made 30 years ago, and marketing content that is so over-the-top as to be entirely laughable.
Shimano is not the only manufacturer doing this. Just the most visible.
As for me: Shimano did make some excellent reels - some of the classics are still good reels today. I can't comment on more recent models, as they are usually the most expensive reel in the category that I am looking at, so I buy something else.
Back on topic- I picked another current model- Trinidad, and found the same issues with parts that Larry noted for the Tranx - the mislabeled "discontinued" parts plus plenty on back order.
Hopefully Shimano straightens this out.
-J
Shimano has been a gripe since the moment they added the BB1 and fishing reels to their repertoire. I wonder if people that use Shimano bike parts feel the same way. They're very good at design and manufacture but also very good at marketing. Selling you a reel that you will keep and fish with for the rest of your life is not a goal or part of their business plan. If you want the design then you have to stomach the marketing ploys too.
Planned obsolescence wasn't invented by Shimano!
Quote from: MarkT on August 05, 2024, 08:17:32 AMPlanned obsolescence wasn't invented by Shimano!
Yup.
Too bad they didn't stay conservative. At least not enough for me. Japanese companies such as vehicle makers Honda and Toyota are far from perfect, but have done so successfully. New fangled untested electronic oriented design-engineering? "Ah, let's hold off on some of that and continue to use what's been working".
Some of those older reel models were real winners. Though it's heavily graphite oriented, the original Triton Sea Spin Baitrunner is superior to the latter iterations, IMO. Same with the Stratic spinners. The Charter Special and TLD's were real winners. Do they even still make them? I have an original Bantam 100, simple-quality construction.
Years ago they were easy to deal with over the phone, even did the "no charge" thing for minor parts.
Quote from: MarkT on August 05, 2024, 08:17:32 AMPlanned obsolescence wasn't invented by Shimano!
Maybe not but they sure did jump on the band wagon big time. I find it interesting how long it has taken some to realize their game plans.
Quote from: MarkT on August 05, 2024, 08:17:32 AMPlanned obsolescence wasn't invented by Shimano!
I'm going to go out on a limb here and say it was Bic...
Several years ago I worked for a person that was former Shimano USA upper management. He told me that fishing in many parts of Asia is a rich person sport. He said Shimao catered to them by comming out with "new" models often and their customers bought them to have the latest and greatest. The customers tossed the old reels rather than repaired them.
Ski companies used to change the graphics every year to make it obvious that you're skiing on last years model. Some places people are very aware of this and don't want be skiing on last years models. Me? I still have my K2 VO Slaloms from 1984!
Quote from: MarkT on August 05, 2024, 07:49:54 PMSki companies used to change the graphics every year to make it obvious that you're skiing on last years model. Some places people are very aware of this and don't want be skiing on last years models. Me? I still have my K2 VO Slaloms from 1984!
K2 VO Slaloms? Eek! I doubt that even Phil Mahre is using his VOs any more...
Hopefully these are not your daily drivers.
-J