Hi guys
Well I managed to get my hands on a Albacore Special 280. Wow. What a nice piece of machinery.
As per the usual I pulled the reel down and lubed up the bearings, exposed surfaces and gave it a good looking over.
I did discover (much to my disappointment) that it does not have Carbon Fibre drags. It had a some sort of material with what appears to be metal flakes in it. From my understand they were supposed to com out standard with Carbon Fibre. The previous owner assures me that the drags have not been changed from new. The reel is actually unused from new. Lucky me.
Upon testing the drag I am also disappointed to say that I cannot get more than about 18 lbs of drag, let alone the 30+ lbs that the reels are supposed to have. I have checked the belleville washers and they are in () sequence. Could the drag material be limiting the drag capabilities? Would Carbontex give more power?
I had a look on Smoothdrag and they dont have a listing for this reel. Can anyone help out with what Carbontex washers I need?
Cheers
Brad
Brad,
Take a picture of it next to a ruler so I can get a rough idea of the size of the washer. I may have them.
Bryan
Thanks Bryan
Could the lack of Carbon Fibre drags washers be the reason for not getting as much drag as it should?
Cheers
Brad
G'day Brad,
I've got a 282 Albie special with the same fibre washers - they're original.
If you decide to upgrade to CF, be aware of the drag stack height as the CF will be significantly thinner.
I'm yet to upgrade for this reason (also, the original drag - with a little Cal's - has been flawless to date).
CF won't generally add to drag capacity (not significantly anyway), but it will make it smoother (especially on start up) and it'll basically last forever.
While I haven't tested max drag on mine, 30lbs sounds too much.
It's definitely more than I'd fish a 282 with - probably a little over 15lbs max.
Hope that's of some assistance.
Cheers, Justin
PS Re: drag washers, here's a post about the 540 which may be of interest: http://alantani.com/index.php?topic=3419.msg23456#msg23456 (http://alantani.com/index.php?topic=3419.msg23456#msg23456)
Hi Justin
Thanks for the reply.
One of the reasons I wanted the 280 was because they are supposed to have 30lbs of drag. Now, I would only fish 20lbs at most but at the moment I have to completely tighten up the star to get anywhere near that, and that cant be a good thing.
Brad, I'm sure Dawn has them. They are the ones that are 1 mm thick. I have a few original, unused CF drag washers that I got for the Wahoo Special. I believe they were the same washers as what is in your reel.
I will get some photos tonight so that you can have a look at them.
It still doesnt address why the reel doesnt get as much drag as it should though.
If the Carbontex are only 1mm (0.040 inch) thick, what effect will this have on drag performance if the originals are 1.4mm (0.064 inch) thick?
Cheers
Brad
You could no doubt shim the drag stack (ie with another bellevile) to get the full height.
I'd be keen to hear how it all works out as I'll do the same with mine if the parts are available.
Good luck, Justin
PS I'll do a drag test on mine tonight and let you know what I get...
If you could take photos of the drag stack. Something seem a miss.
I will take a picture tonight and post for you guys to have a look at.
Cheers for all of the input so far.
brad, just did my albie 282, dawn at smooth drags have the cf drag washer that you need, they are thinner than the stock washer so i doubled up on a drag washer. it was recommended to place the doubled up washer on the bottom to minimize the potential for water getting in between the washers. you can also add another metal washer on the top to get you close to the stack height that you need, it is cheaper than buying another cf washer. when you place your order be sure to mention that you need the replacement washer under the main gear, dawn will fix you right up. the washers are not readily apparent on the website, just tell dawn what you need and she will get back to you. you may want to look at bryan's article :TUTORIAL: Pro Gear Wahoo Specials, Model PG461, it show the two stock and cf washers, it wasn't apparent but if you read the thread someone questions the doubling up of a washer to make up the stack height difference. hope this helps, you've got a great reel rodney.
Hi Rodney
Thanks for the info. I will have a chat to Dawn as well.
the early albacore specials did not have greased carbon fiber. that was added later, about the same time that the classic series reels were introduced.
Hi Alan
So, straight from the manufacturer, do you think the carbon fibre in the late model Albacore Specials is carbontex or something else? If it is thicker than the standard 1mm Carbontex then it is either HT100 (possibly) or something else.
I have seen your post about servicing the 280 and the drag stack has 4 fibre washers. I realise that Randy from Progear no longer makes the reels, but, would it be worthwhile contacting him about the washers or just deal with Dawn at Smoothdrag?
Cheers
Brad
Hi guys
In my haste I forgot to look under the main gear. What did I find? One of those dodgy plasticky type washers. It is 1 inch (25.4mm) diameter and about 1mm thick. Am I correct in assuming that this washer will significantly reduce my drag capacity?
The rest of the drag washers are 1.25 inches (32mm) diameter and 1/16 inch (1.6mm) thick. You can see in the image that they are not carbon fibre. They have quite a smooth surface and look almost rubbery.
I also measured the metal washers. They are all 1.25inches (32mm) diameter. The top 2 are 1.3mm thick whereas the bottom one is 2mm thick.
I look forward to hearing what you think I should do next.
Hi Brad,
Those are not CF washers. The are like brake material found in your car, and was a common washers back in those days. Order up some Carbontex washers and Cal's grease to grease the washers. Then you will have the ultimate star drag reel.
Bryan
Thanks Bryan.
As someone else mentioned,should I just order an extra cf washer to make up for the fact that they are thinner?
Also, should I put a cf under the main gear in place of the "plastic" one?
Thanks again
Brad
Hi Brad, do you ever sleep?
That is correct. Order up a CF washer for under the main gear. Calculate the stack of the washers you currently have, minus the metal washers, and order enough CF washer to at least what you currently have.
Bryan
try matching them up against something on this list. http://alantani.com/index.php?topic=21.0
Hi Bryan
Yep, I do sleep, but when you guys respond, my phone beeps and I feel obliged to respond. Plus I have a baby that keeps getting me up.
Alan, is ht-100 as good as carbontex? That is, am I better off getting the exact thickness washers in ht-100, or building up the thickness with carbontex?
I'm back off to sleep now.
Cheers
Brad
the material and performance will be the same. the advantage of carbontex that they will fit for sure. penn ht-100's often have to be ground down or filed out.
bradz, while reading a post TUTORIAL: progear 545/541 (slides 25-27) by mark mayo, he mentions that if the eared washer is bent you may lose drag pressure. his recommendation is to place it with the bent ears up or replace the washer with a new washer. aloha rodney.
Thanks everyone.
I will be giving Dawn at Smoothrag a call later.
Alan, the #6-116 in HT-100 are the right OD but far to big on the ID, so i will be going Carbontex.
I will let you know how I go in the next week or so.
Cheers
Brad
that is probably the one that i used in the past. it would work just fine.
The HT-100 works fine for the 2 washers in the gear, but the last one on the top should be a Carbontex due to the ID size.
a smaller penn washer still works. it is not an exact fit, but a full set of penn washers can be mcgiver'd to fit. if dawn has a carbontex set to fit, that would obviously be better.
That's true. I was only looking at the larger ones.
I have sent off a request to Dawn at Smoothdrag for the required washers. They are 32mm OD and 9.7mm ID.
Because the originals are 1.63mm thick and there are 3 of them, they total 4.9mm. The carbontex are only 1mm thick which means I will need 5 washers instead of the original 3 in order to keep the drag stack the same height.
Is my rationale correct? If so, do I simply put some of the carbontex back-to-back in between the metal washers? Will this reduce the drag capacity if some of the carbontex are back to back?
I have also ordered one for under the main gear to replace the plastic looking one.
Stacking of the carbontex will not have any negative effects. Just be sure to grease all drag washers. You are gonna love that reel.
Thanks Bryan. That is what I wanted to hear.
After having pulled the reel apart a few times in the last couple of days I have come to realise how easy this reel will be to maintain. Having said that however, there does appear to be a little bit of play in the spool, forwards and backwards. It is not the anti-reverse (that is perfect) it is just the spool on the spool shaft. I didn't notice it before so I will pull it down again tonight to see if I can figure out why.
Cheers
Brad
I am trying to work out if this reel should have some forward and backward play in the spool.
It is as if the spool shaft is not sitting far enough into the back of the Pinion. I have checked that the yoke and its screws are in the right place; I have made sure the bearing is sitting nicely.
Holding the handle still the spool can be moved forward and backwards about 1/4 inch. Is this meant to happen? If not, what could it be?
I cant recall if it had this play when I first received it and now I am paranoid.
I think I have noticed what you are talking about on many reels including the Saltiga 20 and 30, it disappears when there is any amount of tension on the spool and is only apparent when playing with the reel with the spool in your hand, could be wrong though ???
I am new to pro gear reels but I noticed that little bit of play in the handle on the three reels I have dealt with.
Tight lines, Brendan.
This is common in all of my PG reels. Not to worry.
Fantastic. I thought for a while there that I may have busted something.
I will give an update on the drag situation in a few weeks time.
Cheers everyone.
OK.
Well, Randy got me the new drag washers. They were a little too large so I had to file them down to size.
Greased them up with Cals and have installed. The drag is smoother but I am still not getting past about 18lbs of drag. Do the washers need to bed in or something before they are up to full power?
Would changing the bellevue washers increase the drag?
As mentioned previously, I only really want to run about 18lbs of drag but the reels are supposed to put out 30lbs of drag.
Any more suggestions that I may be missing?
Cheers
Brad
i'm not sure where the 30 pound number came from. you have to figure 5 pounds of drag per drag washer. you have a three drag system, so 15 pounds would be about right for a little reel like that. besides, at 15 pounds of drag, i damaged the main and pinion gears of my progear classic series reels. the gears your reel are very similar to the gear in mine.
Hi Alan
The promotional spiels from ProGear say that the Albacore Special is good for 30+lbs of drag.
Quote
Albacore Special® Series (Gunmetal is the Standard Color)
** Click on image at left for larger view **
Introducing the all-new Albacore Special® Series. These models deliver and then some. These reels are unbeatable in their class. They feature a new precision-machined and hard-anodized aluminum bridge plate, four ball bearings and one anti-reverse roller bearing, combined with a dog system to create a strong and positive anti-reverse. They have a large manganese bronze alloy main, gear and a heat-treated stainless steel pinion gear.
The smooth oversized drag system of the Albacore Special® Series delivers 30+ lbs of drag pressure, which provides more than enough stopping power needed for almost any saltwater gamefish and yet still remain smooth.
Whether you're fishing for amberjack, albacore, yellowtail or offshore tuna, the Albacore Special® reels are definitely the reels for you and a must on any trip.
Specs
ABS280S-7 - 6:1 Ratio | Wt. 22oz | Capacity 300 yrds/20lb mono - $349.00
ABS282S-7 - 6:1 Ratio | Wt. 24oz | Capacity 425 yrds/20lb mono - $362.00
ABS540S-7 - 5:1 Ratio | Wt. 24oz | Capacity 350 yrds/30lb mono - $349.00
ABS542S-7 - 5:1 Ratio | Wt. 26oz | Capacity 450 yrds/30lb mono - $362.00
The NEW Classic Series has the features which have made the original series so popular with serious anglers, along with the added benefit of engineering enhancements that result from eight years of production experience.
• True one piece machined aluminum frame
• Three screw take down end cap
• Oversized Lubri-drag wet drag system
• Manganese bronze-alloy main gear
• Heat-treated stainless pinion gear
• Heat-treated spool shaft
• Three S/S ball bearings
• One anti-reverse roller bearing
• Hard-anodized corrosion resistant bridge plate
• Limited lifetime warranty on the frame
These reels are "Simply the Best."
Specs
CS501-6 - 6:1 Ratio | Wt. 18oz | Capacity 350 yrds/15lb mono - $199.00
CS5551-6 - 6:1 Ratio | Wt. 20oz | Capacity 400 yrds/20lb mono - $199.00
CS600-6 - 5:1 Ratio | Wt. 22oz | Capacity 275 yrds/25lb mono - $229.00
CS625-6 - 5:1 Ratio | Wt. 23oz | Capacity 300 yrds/30lb mono - $239.00
CS650-6 - 3.6:1 Ratio | Wt. 24oz | Capacity 380 yrds/40lb mono - $249.00
CS700-6 - 3.6:1 Ratio | Wt. 30oz | Capacity 300 yrds/40lb mono - $249.00
CS750-6 - 3.6:1 Ratio | Wt. 36oz | Capacity 300 yrds/50lb mono - $249.00
sorry, that didn't come out right. i did not doubt that it said that. it's just that we commonly see inflated numbers. remember the claims from ambassaduer that the revo would deliver 24 pounds of drag? that was all over, and it was definitely not true. not even the penn baja special can deliver 30 pounds of drag without sustaining damage.
That OK Alan.
I will just need to use my thumb to put the brakes on.
The funny thing is that the CS600 (which has the same drag stack) puts out more drag than the 280. What makes this quite strange is that the CS600 is significantly taller and as such the drag should be less effective.
Cheers
Brad
well, 15 pounds on the rail is about as much as these old shoulders of mine can handle anymore. i had a guy holding a 15 pound downrigger weight and he was having a tough time.
Alan
Fishing the rail is unheard of in Australia.
Jigging for Samson fish (similar to Amberjack) it is no unusual to fish 20lb drag and over. Some guys even believe (wrongly) that because their Stella or Saltiga can put out 50lbs of drag that this is what they are actually fishing.
I am the only guy in my state that I am aware of with one of these reels and it will be cool when people start asking "what reel is that?"
PS: Fantastic site.
Well I emailed Randy and he seems to think that you will push 30lbs of drag if you fish them dry.
Now, I didnt think that you would lose any drag capacity by greasing the drags. My drags are very lightly greased and any excess grease is always wiped away.
Does this sound right to you Alan?
yeah, that's sort of the same thing that newell did. they would lock up the reels until they shredded the gears and called that their maximum drag. it is not a reasonable working load at all and you would never fish a reel in this manner. well, you could, but only for the first fish..... :-\
Check Ebay. I've seen them for $13.99. Upgrades from a 3 stack to a 4 stack carbon fiber.