Recently, I found a Penn Defiance 25LW off ebay from a guy that apparently bulk purchases these returned reels. When he lists one he includes the reason for return and this one was "will not churn in" so no one really knew what the problem was with this reel. He did say it turned and the level wind mechanism went back and forth.
Here's a link that should be alive for another couple weeks: http://www.ebay.com/itm/251094520453#ht_500wt_1361
So as luck would have it I won the auction and the reel is tight and very smooth but has a very faint to non existent clicking from the dog and sometimes it is able to turn backward. Sometimes it would turn backward almost a full revolution- not every time but often enough to realize the issue wasn't going to get any better. So I am thinking the dog spring came off and an easy fix.
So I decided to go into the reel realized this chinese built reel doesn't have much documentation and I can't seem to find any online schematics. How tough can it be- right?
Once I get the reel open it appears there is no dog spring in there but there is a post real close to the dog. I tried to figure out what type of spring would be needed to get the dog to engage but I had nothing.
(http://i189.photobucket.com/albums/z242/slowdriftn/071412133000.jpg)
So out come the Dremel and a quick run to Ace Hardware for their smallest spring. I put a small groove at the base of the ear on the dog itself. Sorry for the crappy pics but my phone is old and I lost my camera in Key West fishing a few weeks back.
(http://i189.photobucket.com/albums/z242/slowdriftn/071412135935.jpg)
The dog is now engaging and loud when reeling. The reel has ball bearings and is really smooth and I can actually feel the dog racket mechanism when you reel it. I am now quite pleased with the repair BUT is this what every body else would have done to fix this? Maybe drilling a hole through the dog would have been better but the springs stays put.
The best method is to drill a small hole in the tale end of the dog. This will ensure that the spring won't come loose. On a new reel I would spread open the dog spring where the teeth of the ratchet engage the dog and do the secondary dog spring modification.
On the SBT site you will find the schematics for the Defiance series as well as photos of their parts.
Scottbt- talk about right under my nose!
From the schematic it looks like the thin metal strips around the dog are the springs that keep the dog engaged. I'm definitely not a fan of that design and agree with drilling a hole for secure engagement.
Thanks
Bob
in the 1st photo that dog looks damaged
Actually the dog is in good shape. The dog has a thin pieces of metal on each side which i assume is the actual dog spring and appears that the ends ride in the recessed area on the gear. The thin metal strips were most likely damaged when the reel was able to turn backward judging by the direction of the wrinkle.
This is what Tile was referring to as well. I actually went back in and did as Tile suggested.
QuoteOn a new reel I would spread open the dog spring where the teeth of the ratchet engage the dog and do the secondary dog spring modification.
Regards
Bob
Apart from the Ambassadeur-style dog spring design the Defiance is a well-made reel because it has good metal in the right places.
Another modification to the reel that I would do is to put a pair of brass liners cut from an old radio antenna on the yoke posts (similar to the ones that come standard on the Fathom series) to prevent wear on them. This modification will require the yoke holes to be enlarged a bit.
That's a great idea..........
I really can't understand why Penn put an Ambassadeur-style dog system on this reel. More than a few people will fish a reel this size with 80# spectra, button down the over-built drag, and end up with a knuckle buster. The modifications done here will help considerably, but few people are going to do this on an $80 reel...
The modifications cost next to nothing but they make a huge difference on the reliability of the reel.
The mods are cheap and effective but very, very few people buying that reel will do it. And if they take it to a shop to have it done, they're looking at least $20 or so -- enough to have gotten a different reel, say a Penn 320 -- in the first place. I'm curious: How much more would it have cost to put in a good dog in the first place? Couldn't be much.
I realize that I'm harping a bit, but believe me, I'm going to see lots of these reels come in for repairs. And if they are still under warranty, we'll have a problem: Is fishing 80# line on these reels considered abuse? If so, the warranty is void. If not, then it gets fixed, only to happen again...
The Defiance series of reels are best used for light saltwater applications and medium to heavy freshwater ones. These reels are not intended to be fished with 80lb(38kg) line on them. The maximum line test for graphite bodied stardrag reels shouldn't be above 40lb(18kg).
I know that, but many people don't. I'll see lots in the shop that have been used for halibut. Really.
Looks like you see a fair share of busted reels due to abuse.
Yep. Unfortunately, too few shops tell customers that the reel they are preparing to buy won't work for the fish they are targeting. One problem came directly from Penn a few years ago: They had an advertisement touting the 220 as a reel for halibut. Many charters bought them. Unfortunately, I think the ads were meant to suggest the 220 would work for California halibut not barn door Alaskan halibut.
For alaskan halibut a metal bodied 50 class leverdrag reel is just fine and there are a lot of options.
You don't need that much. A Baja Special is just about perfect; a 16VSX is almost overkill. And I got a Fathom 25LW for my girlfriend; she's caught fish up to 100 pounds. I've been fishing an HX Raptor this year; the standard HX is OK too. But the Defiance series just won't cut it. If reel makers would specify what sort of fish could reasonably be targeted with their reels, it would make my job a lot easier.
Did a search for my problem and found this. Often the handle could be turned backwards a half turn to several turns before the dog would catch. I bent the springs on the dog to the point they were touching each other and it still slipped. Seems to be working good for now. I drilled an 1/8" hole in the dog and coated a spring I had with Cal's grease hoping it won't rust. The spring has a gold colored plating on it. What kind of spring do I really want?
those springs mods are really nice idea.
well I will use this same thread to post more issues on this reel.
guys since you have this same reel, by chance your reels make a grinding noise if you turn the handle when the eccentric lever is in free spool?
I mean, in the reel I have if you put it in free spool and spin the spool by hand it can spin easily by 30 seconds and completely silence but if you turn the handle (the reel is still on free spool mode) the reel will make a grinding noise, if you turn the lever to engage the pinion with the spool then the noise is gone
everything else is good, dog is acting like it should, spool spins freely and nicely, and drag is nice too.. it just that grinding noise that happens only on that moment.
good thing is that you normally dont turn the handle and having the reel in free spool at the same time.
It looks like the pinion is still touching (barely) the spool "tooth" on the axle when the free spool mechanism is activated, but maybe is the way this reel works.
Quote from: wallacewt on July 15, 2012, 12:49:31 AM
in the 1st photo that dog looks damaged
Yup, the ear is bent. The spring made the reel much better.