Does anyone know if it will work if I swap out the main gear and pinion out of a 500, and replace it with the main and pinion from a 99? making it into a slower jigmaster?
nope, you have to switch out the entire side plate. it's a very cool conversion.
but the side plates match up?
Yes, they do.
Quote from: Keta on September 05, 2012, 02:46:28 AM
Yes, they do.
No Lee, they don't, you must be thinking of another reel.
The 99 has gears same as a squidder, you need to switch the entire plate, as Alan mentioned.
In my experience, sometimes the 99 sideplates fit on a Jigmaster, sometimes they don't. For example, I have five Jigmasters and my 99 sideplate will fit only two of them. On the other three reels the 99 plate just wouldn't rotate far enough to allow the locking screw to line up with the hole. I suppose it is due to manufacturing tolerances over a period of decades. Maybe some careful filing would make things fit better.
George
in southern california during the 60's and 70's, the jigmaster 99 conversion was a favorite among the old japanese guys that fished the day boats out of southern california. they would pull a side plate off a jigmaster and slap it on a 99 frame and spool. it made a great 25 to 30 pound reel. at least that's what hank told me. he was one of those old japanese guys. taught me alot about reel repair!
Alan,
You made me get get my reels out and play with them, again. ;) I've checked this out before, but interestingly, all five of my Jigmaster sideplates fit the 99 frame. I can see how this was a favorite conversion before Accurate, Newell, and Tiburon made their "99" width frames. Apparently many others also think it is the ideal width "jigmaster".
In fact, I bought my 99 because I wanted to use the spool in my first narrowed jigmaster frankenreel. It was cheaper than buying the aforementioned manufacturers narrow kits.
Quote from: alantani on September 05, 2012, 06:26:06 AM
in southern california during the 60's and 70's, the jigmaster 99 conversion was a favorite among the old japanese guys that fished the day boats out of southern california. they would pull a side plate off a jigmaster and slap it on a 99 frame and spool. it made a great 25 to 30 pound reel. at least that's what hank told me. he was one of those old japanese guys. taught me alot about reel repair!
Those guys were clever Alan, I was amazed the first time you mentioned it. I just can't figure out why the Jigmaster stand has four screws and the 99 being a smaller reel, with Squidder gears has six :-\
i would love to see penn bring these reels back.
Washers are too small. There might be a way for us to customize it with a set of jigmaster gears, using the same 99 plate, but i don't have one to play with :-\....George?
Quote from: alantani on September 05, 2012, 11:01:52 PM
i would love to see penn bring these reels back.
Alan, are you referring to the Silver Beach 99 or another reel? I wish Penn made the jigmaster in the "99" width. As the old school guys said about their modified 99's, it is a great 25-30# reel. It is so easy to assemble with a 99 spool, 30-66 reel foot, and longbeach 66 spacer bars. Of course, finding a 99 spool is difficult these days. :(
Quote from: Alto Mare on September 06, 2012, 01:09:17 AM
Washers are too small. There might be a way for us to customize it with a set of jigmaster gears, using the same 99 plate, but i don't have one to play with :-\....George?
Sal, I'm giving your suggestion some thought and I'll get back soon.
BTW a 99 is 2-1/8" wide between the sideplates and a 500 jigmaster is 2-3/8".
yup, it's the old silver beach 99!
OK, here's what we've got.
(http://i1162.photobucket.com/albums/q523/rumbum01/P1010395.jpg)
A 99 on the left, and a jigmaster narrowed the "old school" way with a 99 spool, 30-66 stand and four 37-65 frame posts. Now the reels are the same size, just different retrieve ratios.
(http://i1162.photobucket.com/albums/q523/rumbum01/P1010399.jpg)
A view of the left side of the 99, showing the extra screws for the reel stand and the chrome beauty ring.
(http://i1162.photobucket.com/albums/q523/rumbum01/P1010400.jpg)
Notice the pen pointing to the cutout for the much larger gear on the 500. Modifying a 99 plate for 500 gears is unfeasable. Sal, is this what you were curious about?
Luckily I"m able to swap both sideplates between these reels to make each a slow or fast retrieve reel. The only advantage the 99 gears offer is a slower 1:3 retrieve (advantage??) and this is at the expense of having smaller drag washers. Accurate, Newell, and Tiburon have pretty much made this old school mod obsolete with their 99 width jigmaster kits. Their spools also fit in the 99 Silverbeach.
So, Twopatch, I hope we answered your question, and I'll bet you didn't think it would get this technical. But it was fun and I obviously have too much free time on my hands. ;D ;D
George
And to give CooldadE and others their due credit, see the following link. We've discussed some of this before.
http://alantani.com/index.php?topic=2984.0
George,
Very interesting. Thanks for taking the time for the review.
John
Thanks for the pictures George, you alays step up to the plate ;).
I still don't get it though why Penn would add a ring on the left plate and a stand with six screws on that reel , compared to the jigmaster :-\.
BTW, nice shot of the hand, I can't keep mine that clean from working on reels ;D ;D. Later buddy.
Sal
Twopatch,
The reel you want has been there all along. :o It is the Surfmaster 250 and you can usually find one on ebay. Assembled on a full size jigmaster frame and a 250 sideplate with 1:3 gears and squidder drags. Just be aware many of them have a plastic spool. Plastic not good, aluminum good. Of course, you can always replace it with an aluminum spool from a jigmaster. John (john2244) has one in his fine collection and can tell us all about it. Thank you John. ;)
Quote from: Alto Mare on September 06, 2012, 09:30:14 AM
Thanks for the pictures George, you alays step up to the plate ;).
I still don't get it though why Penn would add a ring on the left plate and a stand with six screws on that reel , compared to the jigmaster :-\.
BTW, nice shot of the hand, I can't keep mine that clean from working on reels ;D ;D. Later buddy.
Sal
OK, the secret is out and my name is really Georgia. ;) ;D But to answer your question as to why Penn would make the 99 Silver Beach a little differently, look at all of the other reels they've made that are similar but different. Such as the black 111 and 112 Senators with the 6-screw stands and the same diameter 112H with a 4-screw stand. Or putting a beauty ring on the 505 and 506 jigmasters. The bean counters must have went crazy over so much of this. We'll never know.... ::)
Sal,
Nice call on Georgia's hand. Your guys are just too funny sometimes.
John
Quote from: George4741 on September 06, 2012, 02:43:48 PM
Twopatch,
The reel you want has been there all along. :o It is the Surfmaster 250 and you can usually find one on ebay. Assembled on a full size jigmaster frame and a 250 sideplate with 1:3 gears and squidder drags. Just be aware many of them have a plastic spool. Plastic not good, aluminum good. Of course, you can always replace it with an aluminum spool from a jigmaster. John (john2244) has one in his fine collection and can tell us all about it. Thank you John. ;)
I like the smaller Surfmaster 150 and 100 reels for when I don't need high speed, like live bait albacore fishing.
Quote from: Keta on September 06, 2012, 07:50:36 PM
I like the smaller Surfmaster 150 and 100 reels for when I don't need high speed, like live bait albacore fishing.
Lee, it's good to know there are still folks out there who don't feel they're at a disadvantage when using "old School" equipment. What weight line are you using?
40lb hollow spectra with short 15lb, 20lb and 25lb Fluro topshots on the 100s. 40 hollow Spectra and 100' 50lb mono topshots on the 150s.
Thank You All. I really appriciate all of the help. Once the fishing slows down, I will post a report on what I ended up putting the real deal on, and how she preforms. ;)
Yesterday evening I had a few minutes to take apart a 99 and a 500, 99 gears will not work in a Jigmaster bridge, 99 bridge will not work in a Jigmaster side plate. A larger pinion gear might work but metal would have to be removed from the bridge and the gear ratio will change.
I need to pick up a Surfmaster 250 for reference.
Lee, anything is possible, but I don't think it is worth the effort on that particular reel. So, you're going to need to step away and get back on my parts ;D.
The 99 has the same main gear as the surfmaster 100-150-200 and 250, also all of the squidders and a few more reels.
I realized why Alan's friends were just swapping the right side plate from a jigmaster to the 99...smart guys ;)
Yeah, I wouldn't bother, Lee. The only difference between the 250 and 99 sideplates is the "250" and "99" molded in them. Gears and all other parts of the mechanism are identical.
Quote from: George4741 on September 10, 2012, 11:23:54 PM
Yeah, I wouldn't bother, Lee. The only difference between the 250 and 99 sideplates is the "250" and "99" molded in them. Gears and all other parts of the mechanism are identical.
George,you are almost correct. The 99 has a coil spring and 15-99 dog,and the 250 has a flat spring and 15 -60 dog.
I ended up putting that "reel deal" on a surfmaster 100. The only real use that I have found for the reeldeal is deep water rockfish. I can crank it in fast when its time to move. I would not put it on a reel that didn't have a quick change side plate. I narrowed my 250 to 501 size and fish it with braid. I have to say it is a great salmon/halibut troller. I liked it so much a have 2 now.
WOuldn't a 501 width 250 be a 246? Great little reel in it's own right. I like the idea of a slow jigmaster for dragging skampis on the bottom.
Ron
I am not sure of a 246? It is a poor mans' 1/0. It dosen't look as cool as a 110. But if you put an aluminum spool on it,it fishes better.
Ah !@#$,
I ment 146, and I guess it would be a little different, more like a 100. Cool any way you look at it, especially if you like slow torquey reels.
Ron