Wanting to know if anyone has seen or run into this problem before? I have a set of brass gears for the 114H in the center the bushing(I really don't know what to call it) is slightly higher than the bottom of the main gear. The steel gear next to it you may be able to see the bushing is slightly recessed.
(http://i1278.photobucket.com/albums/y502/MITSERVCS/null_zpsd716f7dd.jpg)
(http://i1278.photobucket.com/albums/y502/MITSERVCS/null_zps55d58316.jpg)
(http://i1278.photobucket.com/albums/y502/MITSERVCS/null_zpsc5b853b8.jpg)
It's only about 0.15mm higher than the main gear but I was wondering if this could cause the cf washer to deform when put under pressure? Is there a way to reduce the height of this inner bushing?
Bob
It will deform the bottom CF washer and cause problems. Is it recessed on the bottom or is the bushing too long? If it's too long you can drive it back into place and using a flat surface and sand paper remove the excess material. If it's just moved put a dab of super glue on the gear, bottom side, and push back into place.
I have seen this and have not seen any issues. The CF washer will eventually wear away at that area or the CF washer will grinding down the plastic bushing, or both.
Bryan, that center bushing is plastic??
I think it's made from a material similar to delrin...so yes, it's plastic.
Many plastics are used as bearing materials. They are slippery enough and cheap and effective enough. I have only worked on 3 reels where that bushing was either broken or just slipped out...and they were well used reels.
For the life of me, I can't figure how are they holding the bushing in there. I see the contact points where it was piened. Is there a grove that is cut out and the bushing has a tab of some sort? Or is it purely squeezed in there?
Its a press fit.
I"ve seen a few and they never gave me any problems. The easiest solution would be for you to open up the Id on the first Carbon Fiber washer, the rest would be fine.
I've never seen a plastic sleeve on the 4/0 and up, but I have seen them on the Jigmaster and smaller.
Man I hope Alan at BP gets hex gears to happen! ;D ;D
Quote from: Alto Mare on July 24, 2013, 10:04:33 PM
I've never seen a plastic sleeve on the 4/0 and up, but I have seen them on the Jigmaster and smaller.
I've got a fiber sleeve in my 116L main gear Rudy
How old is that gear Rudy?
Quote from: Alto Mare on July 25, 2013, 12:16:17 AM
How old is that gear Rudy?
I don't know, it was the gear in the 12/0 that I got from Cypress. I had to pry the gear off the sleeve & when I did the bushing stayed on the sleeve. I pried it off the sleeve & pressed it back in with the back of a socket & a mallet. By the way it was a steel gear. Rudy
You're right Rudy, I would have never thought that it was plastic. I took a shot of a couple of gears, the ones with the black rings are plastic:
(http://i1318.photobucket.com/albums/t646/pescatore2/002_zps6ac2509e.jpg) (http://s1318.photobucket.com/user/pescatore2/media/002_zps6ac2509e.jpg.html)
I'm not crazy about them, I wish they kept them in metal. Not really a problem though, I have made my own in the past for some 4/0's, it doesn't take much.
Mine wasn't black, it was the same brown color as the fiber under gear washer. It looked like it was made out of the same material. Its really tough material, tougher then plastic.
As tough as it might be, it can't be as tough as a brass ring. I've replaced that brass ring a couple of times on 113H's, the wall on some was as thin as 1/16, there is stress there. I don't see why there is a need for that ring, from what I've learned, it's there just to make the gears quieter. I don't mind the clicking of dogs and gears, I actually enjoy it.
Sal
No rings on the BP gears right Sal?? They are super quiet! So maybe punching out the plastic/delrin bushing then replace say with copper pipe would be the ticket? Don't know maybe I'll give it a go when I find some time.
Copper is to soft, better to use oil impregnated bronze. Even brass is tougher. Rudy
With respect, the internal ring is for the purpose of providing a sliding/wear surface upon which the gear ride upon the sleeve, without which, the gear would be in direct contact on the sleeve, and one of those would wear. The very slight thickness of the internal ring also provides the correct pinion to main gear clearance. Without this added thickness, there would be too much "slop" between the gears (teeth would not mesh correctly) and premature failure would occur.
My recollection is that the early reels did not have this wear ring, but the gear and sleeve were in direct contact with each other (but my recall isn't too good on this issue). The sleeves, being brass, provided the wear surface, so there would be lots of very worn sleeves on those reels. Consequently, and subsequently, the gears would also wear so the sleeve, pinion and main gears would all need to be replaced after heavy use.
It is interesting to note that the Everol Cairns big game reels originally came with a ball-bearing that held the sleeve in place with the side plate. This was done so that the sleeve would not get worn on the shaft (as much). In having to repair one of them recently, the company advised me not to replace the ball bearing, but to use a brass/bronze/delrin bushing instead. They advised that the BB was prone to failure from exposure to sand, grit, etc. Anyway, without that bushing/guide, there would be lots of wobble when cranking the handle. Not quite the same, but similar with the Senator when that main gear bushing gets worn.
Quote from: Makule on July 25, 2013, 06:06:22 PM
Consequently, and subsequently, the gears would also wear so the sleeve, pinion and main gears would all need to be replaced after heavy use.
If Penn didn't use the bushing they would make the ID of the gear to the correct size to fit the sleeve & there would be no wobble. Some of the main gears do not have a bushing & they don't wobble on the Senators or any other reel.