I decided to double dog a LB 66 as a back-up "grouper special".
My first thought was to use the same procedure I copied from Sal for the 113 side plate http://alantani.com/index.php?topic=9979.0 (http://alantani.com/index.php?topic=9979.0)
Milling out part of the side plate to make room for the second dog to sit on one of the bridge screws.
(https://lh3.googleusercontent.com/-y8wTZXdw9Bg/Vi3GTyzM_RI/AAAAAAAAAkI/tSd4tQOEjYA/s800-Ic42/DSCF2525.JPG)
The dogs on the bridge screws can be fiddly to install for amateurs like me, particularly if there are two - so I thought I would try mounting the dogs on the bridge similar to the jigmasters. I've used 1/8" rod for the dog posts and 3/64" for the spring posts. You need to workout where the posts go and drill 1/8" hole for the dogs and 3/64" for the spring posts. Insert the rods and peen the back over and file the posts a tad higher than than the dogs (I'll try to take photos next time)
(https://lh3.googleusercontent.com/-lqUsIeQUw2c/VoJ1HawHryI/AAAAAAAAAng/Ahj-UiszSsI/s800-Ic42/DSCF2546.JPG)
As you can see, I have set them up as alternating. Normally it is just a case of adjusting the length of one or both dogs for simultaneous engagement but there isn't much room under the 5-66 gear, you might have to file more material off the underside of the dog to clear the ratchet teeth if you make them longer.
(https://lh3.googleusercontent.com/-EH8Wn3DE5qY/VoKAg3CSilI/AAAAAAAAAn0/T4vLhjW6Bz4/s800-Ic42/DSCF2547.JPG)
With the under gear washer
(https://lh3.googleusercontent.com/-BIYDgMH14gs/VoKCmjBserI/AAAAAAAAAn8/nF4LZ_55mF8/s800-Ic42/DSCF2549.JPG)
and gear
(https://lh3.googleusercontent.com/-QSsovUTxDeA/VoKDAuv5GmI/AAAAAAAAAoE/Isw6JzzVVdY/s800-Ic42/DSCF2551.JPG)
ready for assembly
(https://lh3.googleusercontent.com/-SmY2UD3-rRo/VoKNg8mOBuI/AAAAAAAAApA/xnom_J2N3_Q/s800-Ic42/DSCF2553.JPG)
The drags are a 3 stack of carbon fibre I took out of the 113 gear when I made my grouper special - I now have to decide whether to go the full hog and put a stainless sleeve, stainless dogs, 5 stack drags or 7 stack drag kit from Bryan and a bigger handle.
I have assembled it as is with a pitted bronze spool until I decide what I want to do with it.
(https://lh3.googleusercontent.com/-jvm-_t0cSoM/VoKIdFI3YeI/AAAAAAAAAoo/1QuWWrsofdY/s800-Ic42/DSCF2554.JPG)
Great Job on that Bridge. That is a deep steel gear you have there and a five stack should fit with 6-60 drags. I think the only three upgrades I would do are stainless sleeve and spool with a handle upgrade.
Nice job. Did you change spools when you put the reel together? I like the other spool better. Less prone to splitting.
Good eye Bry. ;D Yes the shiny spool is a stainless one. That is the one you want to fish. The three piece will warp under load.
Thanks guys, I kept the stainless spool out to clean up a bit of pitting in the arbor, I'll put it back in when I do the drags. I think you're right Daron, a five stack of 6-60 drags will be enough drag for this reel.
If you do build this with a five stack and a SS sleeve, the next weak spot would be the stand. I believe Sal bent one at 22#s drag and a five stack could possibly do that. Using a good clamp helps significantly, but if you want to go whole hog, a Newell 112H base will fit.
Ron
Just got back from a 3 day music festival to see you've posted this Mike. Nice job.
I've seen this a couple of days ago, I thought I commented on it already ::).
Very nice job Michael!
From looking at it when done, it looks as something very easy to do, but as we both know, it's not that easy to get it there and make it functional.
Thanks for sharing Michael, you've been doing some nice work around here.
Sal
Quote from: noyb72 on December 30, 2015, 06:51:10 PM
If you do build this with a five stack and a SS sleeve, the next weak spot would be the stand. I believe Sal bent one at 22#s drag and a five stack could possibly do that. Using a good clamp helps significantly, but if you want to go whole hog, a Newell 112H base will fit.
Ron
Thanks Ron, I didn't realise the 112H had the same screw spacing - I have used a 66 stand on a 99 width jigmaster so I guess the newell 112H and newell 99 jigmaster stands are the same?
Thanks for the kind words Chris and Sal, I know the 66 isn't the most glamorous of the Penn line up, but I like the idea of improving a reel that has been overlooked by the professional after market upgrade team. Your right about it being a challenge Sal, the first attempt didn't quite clear the eccentric jack when it was engaged - I had to shave a bit off in a couple of places. I'll put that one in a long beach 60 I have. Available area for dogs under a 5-349H main gear is like a ballroom compared to under the 5-66.
Mike
Mike,
The 66 stand works on a bunch of reels. As you state the 99 has a different stand but it is the same width as a 66 so yes, the 112H and 500 series have the same spacing. I'd bet that one of the wide 112Hs, like the Tuna or Bluefin specials actually use a 500 stand. I haven't put a Newell base on a 66, but I always thought it would be a better idea that the original grouper special because of the open top. In reality you can't get a lightweight 66 spool unless you mill down a YTS spool to fit but if you were willing to do that (I think Sal has once) then ou could get into an open topped, slow, easily castable reel for way less than a Tib kit.
Enough rambling, I hope you enjoy the reel.
Ron
The Newell 99 stand works good
Its the first one I've seen. Do you know if the cross bars will fit? This is really cool.
Ron
Quote from: noyb72 on January 02, 2016, 03:50:33 AM
Its the first one I've seen. Do you know if the cross bars will fit? This is really cool.
Ron
The post spacing is different to the jigmasters on both the 60 and 66 size long beach. The 66 posts are a bit more than a screw width further apart so you could probably put an adapter in similar to the ones Irish Jigger made for a silver beach 99. The 66 has six posts so you could replace the top 2 or the bottom 2 or make the adaptor long enough for two bars on each side of the stand.
Link to Tom's post http://alantani.com/index.php?topic=6437.msg54778#msg54778 (http://alantani.com/index.php?topic=6437.msg54778#msg54778)
and the photos;
(https://lh3.googleusercontent.com/-6naGFamM2HY/Vod3KBFfeVI/AAAAAAAAApU/k9Ew2d4B5Bs/s800-Ic42/99%252520spacer%252520bar%252520adaptor.jpg)
(https://lh3.googleusercontent.com/-IwamTHLKiJo/Vod9JT7hT0I/AAAAAAAAApo/IYICP9owrZc/s800-Ic42/99%252520spacer%252520bar%252520adaptor%2525202.jpg)
Unfortunately the long beach 60 and 65 posts are less than a screw width further apart than the jigmaster so the adaptor plates won't work - the second 'side plate to adaptor' screw and the 'spacer bar to adaptor' screw would overlap. Hope that makes sense.
Mike
I gave it a go with the 99 bars so close.
mine is the 65 I'm becoming a huge fan of the little reel.
The 60s and 65s we have on the party boat with greased CFs have no problem catching AJs and Cobias using 40 lb mono. The low gearing helps the tourist.
I love that low gearing. Works for slow jigging and live bait, and when you have a sea monster on the other end. My dream reel is a 3/0 sized reel with 66 gears, an open and that is 501 width. There are several ways to get there on the 1/0 size, but not the 3/0 that I know of, basically because reel capacity has changed with braid.
Ron
I have decided to do another two dog 3-66 bridge, with a stainless sleeve and dogs, for my 66 and put the brass set into a 60. This time I have taken a couple of photos of the process for anyone that wants to give it a go.
To locate the posts, I place the dogs roughly where I think they will fit, making sure the dog clears the plate and eccentric jack (it helps to use a used plate that has contact marks) then mark the bridge for the first dog with a centre punch
(https://lh3.googleusercontent.com/-gn3XfT7C0Gs/Vr3Q0rmYbLI/AAAAAAAAAv8/COUGTgEIgEI/s800-Ic42/DSCF2604.JPG)
(https://lh3.googleusercontent.com/-k7dHy8mXcjo/Vr3RJzSvikI/AAAAAAAAAwA/vxmjj3s2MX4/s800-Ic42/DSCF2605.JPG)
In this case, I want alternating engagement, so I rotated the gear sleeve half the distance between the teeth then positioned the second dog where it will also clear the side plate and eccentric jack
(https://lh3.googleusercontent.com/-xXiy0icYt0E/Vr3ThT0V17I/AAAAAAAAAwQ/oZZ-bJ1F6sQ/s800-Ic42/DSCF2606.JPG)
With the dogs roughly in place, mark the spring post locations, again checking clearence
(https://lh3.googleusercontent.com/-oYyywFVrLAY/Vr3VUsQ1MjI/AAAAAAAAAwg/QNmTIRPblBE/s800-Ic42/DSCF2607.JPG)
I have used 1/8 and 3/64 brass rod for the dog and spring posts and drill the holes to match - I use a piece of wood with a recess drilled to sit the raised peened back of the gear sleeve post in so the bridge sits flat while drilling the post holes
(https://lh3.googleusercontent.com/-vMBeejg6tIM/Vr3XbCJSjZI/AAAAAAAAAww/6RA-ozqZ3JI/s800-Ic42/DSCF2608.JPG)
(https://lh3.googleusercontent.com/-b9vIpVMqCfA/Vr3YKw1vQrI/AAAAAAAAAw8/IKqshdrwwKs/s800-Ic42/DSCF2609.JPG)
(https://lh3.googleusercontent.com/-XpwjD81Ed30/Vr3XzX6EvaI/AAAAAAAAAw0/eMzQg7QUE2s/s800-Ic42/DSCF2610.JPG)
Mark the rod for the post allowing approx 1/16" to peen the back and slightly longer than needed for the dog.
(https://lh3.googleusercontent.com/-wHnNFCoxA_Y/Vr3ZGHqjQdI/AAAAAAAAAxQ/Ky_z8YqpjCw/s640-Ic42/DSCF2611.JPG)
To peen the back of the post I have drilled a 1/8" to the depth of the post in the corner of a steel plate - this supports the post while it is being peened
(https://lh3.googleusercontent.com/-4wVCcferoto/Vr3aJuJpj_I/AAAAAAAAAxY/J41BVHVeMPc/s800-Ic42/DSCF2613.JPG)
Insert the post and peen the back over - I have started marking the back of the hole with an old phillips head screw driver to give the post a better grip. The post can become tight in the plate hole and need twisting to remove it - the marks help secure it in place.
(https://lh3.googleusercontent.com/-d9uZrYQmyn0/Vr3cBEFR3JI/AAAAAAAAAxo/D4QsZPD4jig/s800-Ic42/DSCF2616.JPG)
(https://lh3.googleusercontent.com/-5SkQ9-dO7YU/Vr3cVflFw-I/AAAAAAAAAxs/LY6E93riyOw/s800-Ic42/DSCF2614.JPG)
(https://lh3.googleusercontent.com/-5pNS7FRxKfA/Vr3cofrmauI/AAAAAAAAAxw/90wOCbXqvjU/s800-Ic42/DSCF2617.JPG)
mark and trim the dogs to size, leave a bit of extra length to allow fine tuning - the dog on the left needs material removed from the 'under side' to clear the the sleeve teeth when engaged
(https://lh3.googleusercontent.com/-kDddw6anNMw/Vr3eFgsBeVI/AAAAAAAAAyE/0nISzq7ntEQ/s800-Ic42/DSCF2620.JPG)
(https://lh3.googleusercontent.com/-PnBrMmLmN1I/Vr3ewoJnasI/AAAAAAAAAyM/xOkXyD-hg48/s800-Ic42/DSCF2622.JPG)
(https://lh3.googleusercontent.com/-SwGQHcyKklE/Vr3fFSDu9YI/AAAAAAAAAyQ/ZdLucMSjNms/s800-Ic42/DSCF2623.JPG)
In this case I fine tuned the dogs until they were both too short :( - I like the point of contact with the tooth and the direction of the tooth to be as close as possible in line with the post - to eliminate loss of effectiveness due to all those applied mechanics moment and vector things that I have forgotten.
(https://lh3.googleusercontent.com/-EVUD-Txt710/Vr3i5mL9olI/AAAAAAAAAyk/Z971WfmyRNM/s800-Ic42/DSCF2625.JPG)
Luckily I had two sets of Lee's (Keta) SS 15-99 dogs from some time ago and trimmed another pair a tad longer.
File the posts to height and clean up the plate with a bit of vinegar
(https://lh3.googleusercontent.com/-QKH2--Hqm6c/Vr3kz6ooEeI/AAAAAAAAAyw/_lIBlE9Ttmo/s800-Ic42/DSCF2626.JPG)
(https://lh3.googleusercontent.com/-kov0zm2SGtM/Vr3lisAP08I/AAAAAAAAAy8/3v7Ko4HrlLU/s800-Ic42/DSCF2628.JPG)
(https://lh3.googleusercontent.com/-tRXUIGqAyGY/Vr3lNEHJDQI/AAAAAAAAAy0/o4gw0iA-zg8/s800-Ic42/DSCF2629.JPG)
I wasn't happy with the pitted stainless 66 spool so I have sent it 'offshore' to be corrected and will post the assembled reel when I get it back from Chris (Rothmar II) In the meantime I am toying with some frame spacers for the 60 to fit a 501 stand, something Ron (noyb72) suggested ages ago.
Mike
Mike,
Thanks for sharing this. I've got more than a few bridges laying around so I think I'll give this a try.
Mike
Great post Mike. I'm going to be doing this to one my Jigmaster bridges at some stage, and will be able to follow this for reference. Thanks for posting.
Great Write up Mike.
Excellent work.
8)
I've done a quick 'dry run' assembly of the Long Beach 66 using the stainless dogs, gear sleeve, star and handle with the cleaned up spool. It still needs a few final touches, I couldn't quite fit a 5 stack HT 100 drag stack using stock stainless washers, I've got some 0.7 mm carbon sheet I will use for thinner drag washers. Here's a couple of photos of the assembled reel.
(https://lh3.googleusercontent.com/-IHW7CX4Jxqw/Vt_u0HN5p2I/AAAAAAAAA0U/0YYw_0SauK4/s800-Ic42/DSCF2673.JPG)
(https://lh3.googleusercontent.com/-sA9Tp3MBoWk/Vt_yE1KAf-I/AAAAAAAAA0g/EShPI63lRvs/s800-Ic42/DSCF2672.JPG)
Mike
cool looking reel. love the star. mad max looking :)
Quote from: mhc on March 09, 2016, 09:55:48 AM
I've done a quick 'dry run' assembly of the Long Beach 66 using the stainless dogs, gear sleeve, star and handle with the cleaned up spool. It still needs a few final touches, I couldn't quite fit a 5 stack HT 100 drag stack using stock stainless washers, I've got some 0.7 mm carbon sheet I will use for thinner drag washers. Here's a couple of photos of the assembled reel.
(https://lh3.googleusercontent.com/-IHW7CX4Jxqw/Vt_u0HN5p2I/AAAAAAAAA0U/0YYw_0SauK4/s800-Ic42/DSCF2673.JPG)
(https://lh3.googleusercontent.com/-sA9Tp3MBoWk/Vt_yE1KAf-I/AAAAAAAAA0g/EShPI63lRvs/s800-Ic42/DSCF2672.JPG)
Mike
Mike, use the 6-60 CF washers with the SS metals. You also might have to shorten the spacer sleeve a little.
Quote from: RowdyW on March 09, 2016, 02:20:29 PM
Mike, use the 6-60 CF washers with the SS metals. You also might have to shorten the spacer sleeve a little.
Thanks Rudy, I'll get some 6-60 CF with my next order from Scott's or Dawn for the other 66 I've got, and cut a set from the 0.7mm CF sheet I've got here to see how it fits on this one.
Broschro - that's one of Adam's (Three se7ens) Newell style drags.
Mike
A few photos of the finished reel with the double dog bridge, a newell 501 stand and 5 stack drag.
(https://lh3.googleusercontent.com/-cggI5GvE014/VuesxWm_kDI/AAAAAAAAA1M/Vi4H2BoRjp0Yix_bzOer8CU1GeMH_4RygCCo/s800-Ic42/DSCF2679.JPG)
(https://lh3.googleusercontent.com/-l9Z9slLju2I/VuetxDcOsxI/AAAAAAAAA1U/shFQuf2bxG0COolKuXlPsvDf6kkwHwz3ACCo/s800-Ic42/DSCF2682.JPG)
(https://lh3.googleusercontent.com/-dgi7ZRXoRo8/VueuJ_SoZgI/AAAAAAAAA1Y/IymrXTghoRkL1q7xI8e_g6tLDrqd1AtgQCCo/s800-Ic42/DSCF2683.JPG)
Look out reef-fish on the GBR.
Looks great with the custom handle and star......
That reel says, "No nonsense."
Mattman's post on narrowing squidder and 500 spools has reminded me I've neglected to give Chris (Rothmar2) credit for narrowing the 29M-66 spool to 501 width for me - the standard 66 spool is '99' width. To make the short long beach spool, we sourced a 1/2-28 UEFN die for the 'lock nut' and Chris turned the clicker end to length and hand filed the recesses for the clicker. Hopefully he has photos of the process he used.
Mike
That's a pretty cool looking reel. Looks kinda like a 349 with the narrow spool.
And that is the size of Alan's future 113HNN! I am chomping at the bit.
Ron
Quote from: mhc on April 10, 2016, 11:55:32 AM
Mattman's post on narrowing squidder and 500 spools has reminded me I've neglected to give Chris (Rothmar2) credit for narrowing the 29M-66 spool to 501 width for me - the standard 66 spool is '99' width. To make the short long beach spool, we sourced a 1/2-28 UEFN die for the 'lock nut' and Chris turned the clicker end to length and hand filed the recesses for the clicker. Hopefully he has photos of the process he used.
Mike
Yep, I have a few photos of the process, but as I said on Mattman's Squidder post, I won't be able to post pix until next week. Thanks for the reco Mike.
As mentioned, here is a brief rundown of modifying the spool arbor for the 66N....
Remove the cheeks and set the arbor up in the 3 jaw. Check for trueness with the dial gauge. If I was going to do more of this, I would set up a proper between centres rig. Something I would have to make.
(http://alantani.com/gallery/22/10783_16_10_17_9_51_28_22097966.jpeg)
Machine back the shoulder for the cheeks to butt up against. For memory, I think it was about 12-13mm to be cut to get the arbor suitable for 501 width.
(http://alantani.com/gallery/22/10783_20_10_17_3_31_23_221821634.jpeg)
Check with micrometer to get correct diametre for the cheeks to push over
(http://alantani.com/gallery/22/10783_20_10_17_3_30_31_221802169.jpeg)
Prepare the next section to be threaded. Note groove cut for thread against the end of the cheek shoulder.
(http://alantani.com/gallery/22/10783_17_10_17_3_14_47_22101141.jpeg)
Using the tail stock to keep the 1/2-28 UEFN die square to the shaft to make first cuts with lathe out of gear, then run the die right up
(http://alantani.com/gallery/22/10783_20_10_17_3_29_53_221791714.jpeg)
Once thread cut, quick check with the cheek and the clamping nut, all good.
(http://alantani.com/gallery/22/10783_16_10_17_9_52_38_220992422.jpeg)
Measure the rounded diametre of the ratchet seat, and continue this into the shaft. The flats will be carefully filed in later. No choice on this, no mill.
(http://alantani.com/gallery/22/10783_20_10_17_3_26_56_221762440.jpeg)
Then machine the shaft end diametre (which spins in the bushings), checking diametre with micrometer
(http://alantani.com/gallery/22/10783_17_10_17_3_12_58_221002053.jpeg)
Measure for length and make a slight groove with the point of the tool
(http://alantani.com/gallery/22/10783_16_10_17_9_50_12_22095476.jpeg)
And cut away the excess length with the hand-saw. The new end was rounded over with a fine file and emery paper.
(http://alantani.com/gallery/22/10783_16_10_17_9_49_46_22094195.jpeg)
Do a final check by spinning the left end plate on the end of the arbour to check the size.
Removed arbour from the lathe
(http://alantani.com/gallery/22/10783_16_10_17_9_51_58_220982330.jpeg)
The flats filed and ratchet cog installed. I made the flats so the cog had to be tapped on, and then it was secured with a centre pop across the rounded end of the key. Obviously this last step done after all the cheeks and securing nuts fitted.
(http://alantani.com/gallery/22/10783_20_10_17_3_31_18_22181124.jpeg)
And the assembled reel (prior to Mike adding additional upgrades).
(http://alantani.com/gallery/22/10783_16_10_17_9_49_12_220811541.jpeg)
(http://alantani.com/gallery/22/10783_16_10_17_9_50_40_22096548.jpeg)
Thanks again Chris - obviously I have seen the finished spool, but it is always fascinating to see the photos of how you made it happen.
Mike
No problem Mike, I hope this helps and inspires others to give it a shot.
Damn that was impressive stuff!