Reel Repair by Alan Tani

Fishing Rods => Fishing Rods => Topic started by: steelfish on May 04, 2016, 01:50:28 AM

Title: need help to fix a broken running guide on a trevala rod
Post by: steelfish on May 04, 2016, 01:50:28 AM
so, guys, I dont know if rod building is full of secrets and special recepies so excuse me if Im asking for something that is not permited on the rod building world.


I have a trevala rod with a broken guide, the last running guide and the tip top are done.

tip tops are easy to repair, I have repair a lot of tiptops for my rods and my friend rods but never a running guide.
and I would like to know how difficult and how much I would spend on materials to install just one guide.

first let me tell you that locally there is no fishing store or fishing shop that offer repair/building rods, the closest fishing shop with that service is 4 hrs from me, I have only needed that service two times inmany years and always waited until a friend goes to that place to send my rods with him but I have to wait 6-8 weeks to have it back.

this time is only one guide what is broken as I previously said, I really dont want to buy a power wrapper or any expensive tool, if you think it can be done as an amateur job with decent skills and home tools I will try it, but I will need a lot of assistance I dont know if someone can guide me step by step how to remove a broken guide, how to wrap the thread, epoxic, in short all steps to make it look as factory made as possible.


I alredy have:
the new guide
flexcoat 5 minute
nylon wrap thread (for rod building)
jig bobbin (if needed)


if you need a pic of the rod to give a better assistance I will upload it later when I get home, maybe if I found comfortable with this small job, I might end up building a rod from the scratch.

Title: Re: need help to fix a broken running guide on a trevala rod
Post by: Marcq on May 04, 2016, 01:57:09 AM
Not that hard, you will find tons of video on youtube. You could do an easy job with five minute epoxy, do you have the color tread needed? Or you don't mind what it will end up looking like

Marc..
Title: Re: need help to fix a broken running guide on a trevala rod
Post by: cbar45 on May 04, 2016, 03:53:53 AM
Hi Alex,

What you propose can certainly be done without a power-wrapper or expensive tools:

1. A simple cardboard box with V-cutouts at the top of each end will work to support the rod.

2. Thread tension can be accomplished by placing the loose spool in a jar and running the thread between the pages of a heavy book.
   (Or you can use the bobbin you already have)--you want the tension to be just tight enough that it takes a little effort to pull out some
    thread, pinching it with just your thumb and index finger.

3. Old braided line of about 20 lb. test makes great pull-through loops for completing your guide wrap.

4. Any clean cylindrical object--like a metal pen barrel--will work to "burnish" your wraps; that is the closing up of any gaps and minor    
   inconsistencies by lightly rolling the tool over the thread--in a direction parallel to the rod blank.

5. Masking tape, isopropyl alcohol, scissors/razor, small brush, and paper towels are items you probably already have.

6. The rod must be turned for approx. 3 hours after finish is applied. This is probably one of the more tedious tasks--especially if you don't
   have a motor to do the job--but still can be done by hand. A comfortable chair and something to snack on helps pass the time. The rod
   must be turned continuously for the first hour or so, then intermittently in 90-degree arcs after that.

The broken guide can be removed by gently heating the wraps with a blow-dryer, then slicing the thread and softened epoxy with a razor held almost flat and directly above the guide foot. Doing so protects the blade from nicking the blank as you cut. You'll find that the wrap can literally be peeled off once a section of thread starts to uncoil. Any residual epoxy is removed by scraping with something like a plastic picnic knife or angular piece of bamboo. A little riskier--but faster--method is to scrape using the blade of your razor held at a 90-degree angle in relation to the blank.

Don't worry about the remaining ridges of epoxy at each end of where the guide was; you will start your new wrap just inboard of these ridges, and once finish is put on they will blend in as to be unnoticeable. The ridges also serve as a guide to help you locate where to start the new wrap, such that its completed length will match all the other guides on the rod.

The actual wrapping of the new guide is pretty straightforward if you've watched a tutorial or two--5-6 locking turns to start, up and over the foot, then the pull-through loop inserted 5-6 turns before you reach the end. Many first-timers find it somewhat challenging to transition the thread from the blank onto the guide foot, especially if the foot's taper isn't all that shallow. One way around this is to prep the top of the foot by grinding it down a little to ease the thread's transition--but then you need to touch-up the areas of bare metal with suitable paint--otherwise it will show through your wraps if no color preserver is used. Another method is to wrap a few turns straight onto the foot a little higher than normal, then gently push that band of thread down and into place over the tip of the foot. Luckily most guides today come pre-ground making for an easier time of just wrapping straight up and onto the guide.

Likewise, achieving a crisp, straight, finish edge is something that takes a little doing for a first-timer. If you have some broken blanks or pool cues it might be a good idea to mix up a practice batch of finish and get to know its traits. You only have about a 30-minute working time window, but for one guide that is more than enough. Pay attention to what happens if finish is applied too thick, too thin, etc. Generally an initial flood coat evenly wetting out the thread is all you need, then an additional coat over that. For a straight edge, load the brush, place it on the wrap, then spin the blank with your other hand a half rotation or so. Lift the brush and repeat the process accordingly.

P.S.
I noticed you listed Flexcoat 5-Min in your materials list, sounds like that is their epoxy adhesive used for gluing reel seats and such. For guide wraps you need to use what is called an epoxy finish--it will say either "high build" or "light" on the bottles and has a longer working time. Hope this helps.

Chad
Title: Re: need help to fix a broken running guide on a trevala rod
Post by: steelfish on May 04, 2016, 04:49:09 PM
Quote from: cbar45 on May 04, 2016, 03:53:53 AM
Hi Alex,

6. The rod must be turned for approx. 3 hours after finish is applied. This is probably one of the more tedious tasks--especially if you don't
   have a motor to do the job--but still can be done by hand. A comfortable chair and something to snack on helps pass the time. The rod
   must be turned continuously for the first hour or so, then intermittently in 90-degree arcs after that.


P.S.
I noticed you listed Flexcoat 5-Min in your materials list, sounds like that is their epoxy adhesive used for gluing reel seats and such. For guide wraps you need to use what is called an epoxy finish--it will say either "high build" or "light" on the bottles and has a longer working time. Hope this helps.

Chad

thanks Chad, that was pretty informative, can I ask why the rod must be turned by 3 hrs after the finish is applied? (by finish do you mean the epoxy on the guide wraps, right?)
actually, I need to check the materials I bought few months ago, I think its not the 5-min epoxic but something about light epoxic, Im pretty sure its not simple glue epoxic but the one for the guides, I bought a kit on mudhole late fall it was gonna be a winter project to change all the guides on my muskie rod for better ones and make it acid-wrapped but it never happened  :-[, I just bought the epoxic, thread and guides, but the guides ended up being too small, I ordered the wrong size by mistake and never took the project again  :-\

building my own rod is something that attracts me since some time ago, but havent had the time and space needed to get into

Title: Re: need help to fix a broken running guide on a trevala rod
Post by: Keta on May 04, 2016, 05:08:19 PM
Quote from: steelfish on May 04, 2016, 04:49:09 PMthanks Chad, that was pretty informative, can I ask why the rod must be turned by 3 hrs after the finish is applied? (by finish do you mean the epoxy on the guide wraps, right?)

Turn for 3 hours not after 3 hours so the epoxy does not sag.
Title: Re: need help to fix a broken running guide on a trevala rod
Post by: Newell Nut on May 05, 2016, 01:46:55 PM
A cheap drying motor set up is well worth the money. Constantly turning by hand for a long time gets kind of painfully boring and still may not come out smooth. It will no doubt be strong and effective doing it by hand but nicer with a drying motor.
Title: Re: need help to fix a broken running guide on a trevala rod
Post by: Keta on May 05, 2016, 02:20:52 PM
Quote from: Reel 224 on May 05, 2016, 02:18:27 PM
I have an extra dryer setup. If you want it N/C. PM me.

Joe

Jump on this Alex, it will make the job much easier.
Title: Re: need help to fix a broken running guide on a trevala rod
Post by: steelfish on May 05, 2016, 04:36:34 PM
Quote from: steelfish on May 04, 2016, 04:49:09 PM
can I ask why the rod must be turned by 3 hrs after the finish is applied? (by finish do you mean the epoxy on the guide wraps, right?)

sorry, Lee your right, I was lost in traslation, I was meaning, it have to be turned by 3hrs just after the epoxic have been applied



Quote from: Reel 224 on May 05, 2016, 02:18:27 PM
I have an extra dryer setup. If you want it N/C. PM me.

Joe

PM Joe

Title: Re: need help to fix a broken running guide on a trevala rod
Post by: steelfish on September 07, 2016, 12:46:36 AM
ok, just to continue with the end of this thread


I got the Dryer from Joe (thanks a lot buddy) and after training with some cheap rods I finally decided to fix the trevala rod.
it was a lot easier that I though it would be.
this is the dryier Joe sent me, I installed also the last running guide on a Terez rod from a friend of mine in this pic
(http://i202.photobucket.com/albums/aa198/alextellofotos/2%20Rod%20repair/IMAG7508%20ss_zpsb6g25qey.jpg) (http://s202.photobucket.com/user/alextellofotos/media/2%20Rod%20repair/IMAG7508%20ss_zpsb6g25qey.jpg.html)




not a professional job with is really a lot better than all the local guys that made urgent repairs with 5-min epoxic and fishing braid line as winding thread, anyway, this is the ending job.



tip top out as well as the last running guide
(http://i202.photobucket.com/albums/aa198/alextellofotos/2%20Rod%20repair/IMAG7570%20ss_zpss34zwvbj.jpg) (http://s202.photobucket.com/user/alextellofotos/media/2%20Rod%20repair/IMAG7570%20ss_zpss34zwvbj.jpg.html)


this is the result
(http://i202.photobucket.com/albums/aa198/alextellofotos/2%20Rod%20repair/IMAG7776%20ss_zpsgj9y21ys.jpg)

(http://i202.photobucket.com/albums/aa198/alextellofotos/2%20Rod%20repair/IMAG7774%20%20ss_zpsrenqdava.jpg)


(http://i202.photobucket.com/albums/aa198/alextellofotos/2%20Rod%20repair/IMAG7762%20ss_zpsfhxcedn4.jpg)

(http://i202.photobucket.com/albums/aa198/alextellofotos/2%20Rod%20repair/IMAG7772%20%20ss_zpszrj84hxs.jpg)


please dont mind the football style epoxic finish, I kind of like it LOL, hopefully on my next repairs I will get better finish job


thanks guys for your tips and help.
Title: Re: need help to fix a broken running guide on a trevala rod
Post by: steelfish on June 08, 2022, 05:27:25 PM
Quote from: steelfish on May 04, 2016, 04:49:09 PM...........

building my own rod is something that attracts me since some time ago, but havent had the time and space needed to get into

Quote from: steelfish on May 04, 2016, 01:50:28 AM..... if I found comfortable with this small job, I might end up building a rod from the scratch.


,,and that my amigos was 6 years ago  :d


that Trevala fishing rod was the reason of this rabbit hole

Title: Re: need help to fix a broken running guide on a trevala rod
Post by: JasonGotaProblem on June 08, 2022, 05:47:35 PM
Blast from the past! It feels weird doesnt it?
Title: Re: need help to fix a broken running guide on a trevala rod
Post by: steelfish on June 08, 2022, 06:28:25 PM
Quote from: JasonGotaProblem on June 08, 2022, 05:47:35 PMBlast from the past! It feels weird doesnt it?

weird and comfortable at the same time.


talking about Trash Junk rods and sentimental value on them, I have a short story which is related to my beginnings on Rod building, there are few rods I restored at that time that I would made completely different with the things I know by now, one of those rods is the cheap solid tip Glass rod I rebuilt for my daughter
https://alantani.com/index.php?topic=20515.0

she was 7 yo (5 years ago) when I rebuilt that rod for her, as I said on that thread I choose a cheap solid tip rod I have thinking that she wont have any care for it so, a Eglass blank with solid tip with no ceramic guides will be better for a 7 yo kiddo, she helped me to pour the sprinkle fairy dust on the blank and to she choose the colors for the guides and let me tell you she's proud of have participated on restoring that rod, recently I proposed to her to rebuild it again with different guides, a better reelseat and different colors combination on the guides and she said (now with 12yo) that she loved the idea but she loved more the way his fishing rod looks as is now so, she even told me that she prefer a new custom rod from the blank dont change anything on that old rod and leave it as is and she will continue to use it in any chance she has.

:fish



Title: Re: need help to fix a broken running guide on a trevala rod
Post by: Cor on June 08, 2022, 06:53:36 PM
Nice to have a daughter who has an interest in Dads hobby. :D
Title: Re: need help to fix a broken running guide on a trevala rod
Post by: steelfish on June 08, 2022, 07:07:30 PM
Quote from: Cor on June 08, 2022, 06:53:36 PMNice to have a daughter who has an interest in Dads hobby. :D

oh yes, maybe she will build his own rod some day, for now she wants to help on any given rod I building.

Title: Re: need help to fix a broken running guide on a trevala rod
Post by: Gfish on June 08, 2022, 07:41:42 PM
Yup. A pretty daughter at that. I foresee a line a custom rods for the ladies. I have 2- Trevala rods that I really like. However I noticed that the guides tended to rust pretty quickly for such an expensive(to me anyway) model.
Title: Re: need help to fix a broken running guide on a trevala rod
Post by: steelfish on June 08, 2022, 08:09:56 PM
Quote from: Gfish on June 08, 2022, 07:41:42 PMI have 2- Trevala rods that I really like. However I noticed that the guides tended to rust pretty quickly for such an expensive(to me anyway) model.

I think thats something on the Shimano factory, almost all Trevalas and Terez rods which are some of the high end fishing rods from SHimano have problems with corrosion on the foot of the guides, maybe the epoxy job is too thin that lets the water to get in the foot of the guides causing corrosion.

Title: Re: need help to fix a broken running guide on a trevala rod
Post by: oldmanjoe on June 08, 2022, 09:47:24 PM
Quote from: steelfish on June 08, 2022, 07:07:30 PM
Quote from: Cor on June 08, 2022, 06:53:36 PMNice to have a daughter who has an interest in Dads hobby. :D

oh yes, maybe she will build his own rod some day, for now she wants to help on any given rod I building.


Now it all makes sense , Your daughter is the quality control inspector .  Looks like she is packing the threads