Reel Repair by Alan Tani

Conventional and Bait Casting Reel Rebuild Tutorials and Questions => Avet Tutorials and Questions => Topic started by: ez2cdave on July 16, 2018, 08:03:20 PM

Title: Avet STAR DRAG Reels
Post by: ez2cdave on July 16, 2018, 08:03:20 PM
It looks like Avet might be coming out with some Star Drag reels . . .

https://www.instagram.com/p/BlLci9Mlxtm/ (https://www.instagram.com/p/BlLci9Mlxtm/)


https://www.instagram.com/p/BlEkMPclY71/ (https://www.instagram.com/p/BlEkMPclY71/)


(http://www.stripersonline.com/surftalk/uploads/monthly_2018_07/9636898A-4EAB-4661-8F37-1BF453E5F090.jpeg.82011def254d555cf15995e9e4830f82.jpeg)



Tight Lines !





Title: Re: Avet STAR DRAG Reels
Post by: David Hall on July 16, 2018, 10:58:25 PM
I sent them an email asking about it.  No prices, no release date, not on their website?  I saw it on Facebook?
Cmon we all know they can do better than that.  It is a sweet looking reel and I'm looking forward to learning more about them.
Title: Re: Avet STAR DRAG Reels
Post by: xjchad on July 16, 2018, 11:00:38 PM
No clicker?
Title: Re: Avet STAR DRAG Reels
Post by: akfish on July 17, 2018, 12:52:34 AM
I can't believe they'd make it without a clicker -- but they did offer only optional clickers on their fist reels...
Title: Re: Avet STAR DRAG Reels
Post by: mike1010 on July 17, 2018, 03:11:50 PM
It will be interesting to see whether they stick with a single dog for anti-reverse, or maybe go full monty with an ARB.
Title: Re: Avet STAR DRAG Reels
Post by: mikeysm on July 17, 2018, 07:11:13 PM
It better be trick or it won't do well.

Mike
Title: Re: Avet STAR DRAG Reels
Post by: ez2cdave on July 17, 2018, 08:02:32 PM
Quote from: mikeysm on July 17, 2018, 07:11:13 PM
It better be trick or it won't do well.

Mike

In that case, if you really want one, grab it quick, before they go out of production !

Tight Lines !
Title: Re: Avet STAR DRAG Reels
Post by: basto on July 17, 2018, 09:29:40 PM
Looks good on the outside. I like the allen head screws.
Title: Re: Avet STAR DRAG Reels
Post by: ez2cdave on September 01, 2018, 10:17:28 PM
https://www.bdoutdoors.com/forums/threads/new-star-drag.693483/ (https://www.bdoutdoors.com/forums/threads/new-star-drag.693483/)

https://www.stripersonline.com/surftalk/topic/734890-accurate-and-avet-star-drags/ (https://www.stripersonline.com/surftalk/topic/734890-accurate-and-avet-star-drags/)


Tight Lines !

(https://www.stripersonline.com/surftalk/uploads/monthly_2018_07/9636898A-4EAB-4661-8F37-1BF453E5F090.jpeg.82011def254d555cf15995e9e4830f82.jpeg)
Title: Re: Avet STAR DRAG Reels
Post by: sabaman1 on September 02, 2018, 12:30:26 AM
Hmm thats interesting, I'd like to think that this site has resurrected the recent comeback of the narrow star drag reels as of late! Afterall Newell, Tiburon, and Accurate made these possible for us many years ago.
Title: Re: Avet STAR DRAG Reels
Post by: Rivverrat on September 02, 2018, 07:17:59 AM
This place has most likely had some effect. But with Penn being the only US maker of benchmark quality  & pretty much having that market to themselves in this regard it's easy to see some may think there is room to test the market.

Also it doesnt take to long for an avid lever drag user to be fishing next to a star drag fisherman & in certain scenarios not notice a difference in favor of the star drag. Until someone finds a way to disconnect the drag from the spool of the lever drag during a cast the star will always be better tossing lite stuff.

I came into lever drags late. Never turning down a chance to use all the older models I could get my hands on to gain a better understanding of where they are at today. It's really a pretty amazing thing how far they've come.   While so many are fond of saying, the margin between the two has narrowed  I still believe the star drag rules in certain fishing situations also regarding durability & dependability.

People who catch fish regularly dont accomplish this by running dumb. So I suspect a lot of them have noticed or agree with something I've brought up here... Jeff
Title: Re: Avet STAR DRAG Reels
Post by: mike1010 on September 02, 2018, 04:35:30 PM
I had sent them a letter a few years ago suggesting that there was probably a business opportunity for them to build a good, US-made star drag reel at a reasonable price point.  Never had a reply, and always thought that meant they didn't want to dilute their lever drag marketing message.  I don't for a minute think I persuaded them, but it's good to see them entering this market.
Title: Re: Avet STAR DRAG Reels
Post by: David Hall on September 02, 2018, 06:17:41 PM
I can't wait to hold one and check it out for myself.
Title: Re: Avet STAR DRAG Reels
Post by: ez2cdave on October 07, 2018, 01:23:34 AM
Has anyone heard any recent updates ?

Tight Lines !
Title: Re: Avet STAR DRAG Reels
Post by: Swami805 on October 07, 2018, 01:52:55 AM
I think they've started delivering to some outlets,just the 300 & 400 models. Haven't seen a schematic anywhere yet. Interested to see the drag set-up.
Title: Re: Avet STAR DRAG Reels
Post by: SoCalAngler on October 07, 2018, 02:13:14 AM
Charkbait who put Avet on the map does not have them yet. Not to say others don't but I know Avet would release to them before many others. Charkbait was the largest seller of A et reels for many years and is one of the top resellers to be his day
Title: Re: Avet STAR DRAG Reels
Post by: ez2cdave on October 08, 2018, 03:46:43 PM
Quote from: Swami805 on October 07, 2018, 01:52:55 AM
I think they've started delivering to some outlets,just the 300 & 400 models. Haven't seen a schematic anywhere yet. Interested to see the drag set-up.

Thanks for the update . . .

The "300" and "400" reels must refer to Accurate's new reels, not Avet's ?

I haven't seen any specs for the Avet reels.

Tight Lines !
Title: Re: Avet STAR DRAG Reels
Post by: ez2cdave on November 18, 2018, 11:19:51 PM
Still no information on a release data . . . Anyone got any info ?

Tight Lines !
Title: Re: Avet STAR DRAG Reels
Post by: MarkT on November 18, 2018, 11:23:31 PM
Maybe they're having second thoughts after Accurate got to the market first.
Title: Re: Avet STAR DRAG Reels
Post by: SoCalAngler on November 20, 2018, 05:49:45 PM
Naw, with Avet just like Accurate, reels is just a small part of their business. Avet in the past has slow rolled out reels before, the release of the HX when it first came out comes to mind. I feel other bigger things may come up in their business and the reels kind of take a back seat.

They will be out when their ready and for people that know Avet the slow release should really not come as a big surprise.
Title: Re: Avet STAR DRAG Reels
Post by: akfish on November 20, 2018, 06:09:27 PM
Hmm. Reels are a small part of Avet's business? What is the big part?
Title: Re: Avet STAR DRAG Reels
Post by: SoCalAngler on November 20, 2018, 06:29:45 PM
Quote from: akfish on November 20, 2018, 06:09:27 PM
Hmm. Reels are a small part of Avet's business? What is the big part?

Google Avet Industries Corp. Their main business is a job machine shop.
Title: Re: Avet STAR DRAG Reels
Post by: ez2cdave on August 27, 2019, 08:27:10 PM
There have been ZERO updates from Avet, on their new Star Drag reels . . . Disappointing !

Tight Lines !
Title: Re: Avet STAR DRAG Reels
Post by: ez2cdave on October 12, 2019, 02:25:22 PM
There is ZERO new info about the star drag Avet reels.

I wonder if they decided not to produce them, since they have always promoted their reels by claiming how superior a lever drag is, compared to a star drag.

If that were true, why would they produce an "inferior" reel and bring it to the market . . . I hope I am wrong !

Tight Lines !

Dave F.
Title: Re: Avet STAR DRAG Reels
Post by: steelfish on February 28, 2020, 09:18:18 PM
they are finally here..

Title: Re: Avet STAR DRAG Reels
Post by: xjchad on February 28, 2020, 09:22:06 PM
Looks nice!
Interesting that the left side plate now bolts on instead of being part of the frame.
Title: Re: Avet STAR DRAG Reels
Post by: Donnyboat on February 29, 2020, 01:15:44 AM
I see a clicker knob there to, cheers Don.
Title: Re: Avet STAR DRAG Reels
Post by: Rivverrat on February 29, 2020, 01:20:58 AM
Gears housing looks to hold gears of a decent size. I'm not ready just yet to get rid of my Torques. These would need to be something very special for that... Jeff
Title: Re: Avet STAR DRAG Reels
Post by: Pier Rat on March 24, 2020, 07:29:34 PM
Casted one at Fred Hall, was wondering about the left plate being screwed on instead of a one piece frame with side plate being part of the frame, casted well, I may get one however I have the older Saltigas and too many reels, if that is a thing.
Title: Re: Avet STAR DRAG Reels
Post by: mike1010 on May 23, 2020, 05:04:23 PM
Has anyone got hold of one of these yet?
Title: Re: Avet STAR DRAG Reels
Post by: ez2cdave on May 30, 2020, 12:56:29 PM
Quote from: mike1010 on May 23, 2020, 05:04:23 PM
Has anyone got hold of one of these yet?

Not yet . . . I haven't seen them in stores yet, either.

Tight Lines !
Title: Re: Avet STAR DRAG Reels
Post by: Rivverrat on June 29, 2020, 05:07:09 PM
As of this Sat. Mark at Charkbait told me they haven't seen them yet. Looking into this further I dont believe that while this may be a good reel it is at cheaper selling point & I dont believe my Torque star drags are in any danger of being replaced by them... Jeff
Title: Avet MXL Star Internals
Post by: mike1010 on July 07, 2020, 05:10:51 PM
They actually exist, or at least this one does.  A buddy took delivery of this last week, and I talked him into letting me do a pre-fishing service on it.  This writeup concentrates on the construction of the reel, and skips lube instructions and reassembly.

Highlights:  Sturdy construction, interesting, wet (!) drag stack and novel AR dog.  "Infinite" AR with dog backup.  There is not yet a schematic or owners' manual.

(https://www.dropbox.com/s/59m6jujgezf4hmr/00.jpg?dl=1)

(https://www.dropbox.com/s/9hzw406smjxn1sk/01.jpg?dl=1)

See the clicker button?  First, the clicker itself is nice and loud, like a small Penn reel, a departure for Avet.  Second, the button doesn't move radially, like all earlier Avets.  It travels about five degrees off the radius.  Scott at Avet says the new clicker will be introduced to all their reels over time.

(https://www.dropbox.com/s/es9uhcgzqyho0eq/02.jpg?dl=1)

I was kind of surprised to see the vertical logo, but how else would you fit it on the plate?
(https://www.dropbox.com/s/zuodwrx6xknoyso/03.jpg?dl=1)

Avet was not stingy greasing the rod clamp screw holes.

(https://www.dropbox.com/s/0gd2fkpbzxoap03/04.jpg?dl=1)

Gearbox drain holes just like the lever drag MX series.

(https://www.dropbox.com/s/61xtxw5vtg8c0t6/05.jpg?dl=1)

The drag star has a clicker.  See the button at 3:30.

(https://www.dropbox.com/s/rnfd4nyobwe268f/06.jpg?dl=1)

Here is the wheel for the drag star clicker.

(https://www.dropbox.com/s/gxu5epmcjsf2p46/07.jpg?dl=1)

Under that are two Bellville washers, installed in this () orientation.

(https://www.dropbox.com/s/pd9c6cst7u817wr/08.jpg?dl=1)

The spool tensioner is different from anything I've seen in other reels.  It passes through the pinion gear to contact the end of the spool spindle.  Scott at Avet says it can safely be used to control overruns, baitcaster-style.

(https://www.dropbox.com/s/mu3tkld6oshs6ah/09.jpg?dl=1)

The headplate with externals remove.  The six screws holding each plate to the frame are the usual Avet 6-32 thread, but socket head instead of Philips head.  I've not going to remove the free spool lever.  BTW, the lever action has a "crunchy" feeling with the reel assembled.  Maybe break-in will change that.

(https://www.dropbox.com/s/aa280o19wjnbp97/10.jpg?dl=1)

Now we are getting somewhere.  There are no plastics or stampings here.  Everything is beefy, machined aluminum or stainless.  Scott says that internal pieces are Teflon-coated, where applicable.

It's not obvious from the picture, but one of the bridge springs was dry.  Greasing it did not cure the crunchy free spool lever, though.

The IAR collar engages with the top drag washer.  Under the washer, see the top carbon fiber washer engaging the nice, big main gear to get both surfaces working.

The IAR bearing was heavily greased, which is not what I have learned to expect.  Scott didn't seem to think it was a problem.

(https://www.dropbox.com/s/syubptay3vddw3e/11.jpg?dl=1)

Here are the drag stack components under the top washer.  The CF washers have been wiped dry, but there is grease, yes, grease evident on the metal washers and inside the gear.

The small, non-Raptor LD Avets are widely criticized for marginal drag capability.  I wonder why Avet chose to make only one of the carbon fiber washers engage the gear.  Vice-Versa drag?  Even so, with roughly three times the drag washer surface of the LD reels, this setup should comfortably generate plenty of drag, say around 25 lbs.

(https://www.dropbox.com/s/rq5w5pzgm0it1f6/12.jpg?dl=1)

Under the main gear is a carbon fiber washer, and under that, a fat and sturdy AR ratchet.  At five and six o'clock are two screws holding the AR dog retainer plate.  See the AR dog just peeking out.

(https://www.dropbox.com/s/adwyo8bc6k3zzfd/13.jpg?dl=1)

More detail on the AR dog.  Like an Ambassadeur-style dog, it does not touch the ratchet except when activated (as in the picture).  That whisker spring alone provides pressure to make the dog engage.  Well, then, what keeps the dog "floating" above the gear, and then gets out of the way when the dog needs to work?  See the circled thing between the dog and the gear, and read on.

(https://www.dropbox.com/s/ri0wnsrbq2ihpg3/14.jpg?dl=1)

With the AR ratchet removed from the gear post, we see a new variation on the friction washer and ring mechanism familiar from the LD reels.  The washer is keyed to the gear post.  Operation  is the inverse of the LD reels.  Here, backplay in the gear post causes the friction ring to get out of the way of the AR dog, allowing the whisker spring to push the dog into engagement.  In the LD reels, backplay causes the friction ring to pull the dog into engagement.

Look at the whisker spring in the previous picture.  Does it seem up to the job?  I wonder, especially since the dog was swimming in oil, as if someone was hoping to ward off a problem.  The hole drilled in the dog is not used in this reel, but the part is shared with the G2 SX (and MX, I guess), where it is used.

(https://www.dropbox.com/s/q8gs1gk8tk4z1es/15.jpg?dl=1)

Under the friction washer is a carrier for the washer, also keyed to the gear post.  Under the carrier see screws holing the gear post retainer, Avet's answer to Penn's gear post pin.

(https://www.dropbox.com/s/jz2fmwycfsxf39a/16.jpg?dl=1)

The gear post retainer and post.

(https://www.dropbox.com/s/omimmcfxjjibsh5/17.jpg?dl=1)

The head plate empty except for bearings and the free spool lever assembly.

(https://www.dropbox.com/s/bfrsoulxsg4fcm8/18.jpg?dl=1)

Remove six screws to take off the tail plate.  This is it, in full, including the nice, loud clicker.

(https://www.dropbox.com/s/lhvlmvwi1rddl3t/19.jpg?dl=1)

The spool, including the clicker ring, which is held in place with a spring.

(https://www.dropbox.com/s/14v0wz2vxi6pjph/20.jpg?dl=1)

When I first saw a picture of one of these reels, I wondered why Avet departed from the one-piece frame and tail plate used in the LD reels.  In retrospect it seems obvious that they wanted to make spool access through the simple tail plate, rather than through the more complicated head plate.

This is a nice reel, sturdy and very easy to work on.  The only tools needed are a small Philips-head screwdriver and a 3/32 inch hex key

It will be interesting to see how the AR dog and whisker spring work out, and the greased IAR.

Title: Re: Avet MXL Star Internals
Post by: alantani on July 07, 2020, 05:38:26 PM
Quote from: mike1010 on July 07, 2020, 05:10:51 PM

Highlights:  Sturdy construction, interesting, wet (!) drag stack and novel AR dog.  "Infinite" AR with dog backup.  There is not yet a schematic or owners' manual.


seriously???  greased drag washers???   >:(
Title: Re: Avet STAR DRAG Reels
Post by: Rivverrat on July 07, 2020, 09:22:22 PM
Thanx for doing this. I'd been wanting to see the inside from the first I heard of this reel... Jeff
Title: Re: Avet STAR DRAG Reels
Post by: mo65 on July 07, 2020, 10:07:24 PM
Looks solid! 8)
Title: Re: Avet STAR DRAG Reels
Post by: CooldadE on July 07, 2020, 10:41:32 PM
Hmm, I see the text  but no pictures...

Cool
Title: Re: Avet STAR DRAG Reels
Post by: jurelometer on July 07, 2020, 11:10:17 PM
Quote from: Rivverrat on July 07, 2020, 09:22:22 PM
Thanx for doing this. I'd been wanting to see the inside from the first I heard of this reel... Jeff
x2!!!

Thanks for doing this.   This is a great breakdown review!

First some comments:

1.  The one-way bearing looks like the standard-off the shelf  variety.  If Avet is greasing the one-way bearing, I think they are basically giving up on it  working full strength over time and relying on the dog to take the load.  But if the dog is silent and the pawl has lots of teeth (thanks to the large diameter), the one-way bearing only has to work a little bit before slipping (or maybe not at all) and most folks will never notice :)  Greasing will help keep the  bearing from being as much of a rust/corrosion headache, but it begs the question of why bothering to put one in in the first place.  Market demand?


2. To risk sounding like a broken record, the surface area of a disc drag does not directly affect the stopping power, which is strictly a function of clamping force * the coefficient of friction (how slippery the surfaces are).   However, a larger circumference  means more braking work per revolution (longer distance traveled).   But the inside is still traveling a shorter distance.  To get the most braking work per revolution, you would want a large outer diameter AND a large inside diameter (less surface area).  Increasing surface area does have the potential to help make the drag smoother and provide a larger reservoir for absorbing heat and greater heat dissipation.

3. 
QuoteI wonder why Avet chose to make only one of the carbon fiber washers engage the gear.

I think that  since the bottom drag washer is sandwiched between the gear and a keyed washer,  it can only slide against one surface, and it doesn't matter which.  This design might be a bit less expensive to manufacture, and makes the drag washer order a bit more obvious.

4.  I am assuming that the yoke pins are press fit.  It might have been nice to have them threaded with some wrench flats ground into the top. but maybe I am nitpicking here.

5.  The jack and yoke look like forged (or cast?) stainless.   Nice and beefy.  These designs without a bridge plate are a bit of a mixed blessing, as the jack is stainless sliding against aluminum.  not the greatest sliding surface combo for a saltwater reel.  The Shimano TLD star is a very similar design, but since the frame is made of plastic, sliding wear/corrosion is not a problem for the TLD star.   IMHO for this type of reel,  the bridge assembly built into the side of the frame is the best way to go in terms of rigidity and protection from the elements.

6. So it looks to me like four drag surfaces in action.   Not as many as they could have put in, but if you put in more, you are just encouraging folks to crank down the drag more and break something :)

7.  Only six screws to hold down the reel foot?  What?  They couldn't fit  eight?  ::)


Now onto my questions.   


1.  The undergear drag washer has a much wider ID that the shaft.  It needs to be kept in place in order to avoid getting chewed up by the dog.  Is there another part or something on the bottom of the main gear to keep the washer centered?  If not, my vote is another last minute hack to increase the drag after they decided to grease the washers.

2.  Not clear to me from the photos on how the dog is kept silent.  If you have a chance to explain or post another photo, it would be appreciated.

3.  So there is a post affixed to the dog, and it rotates in a hole in the aluminum sideplate?  If so, this is an area where wear could become a problem.  I don't know why reel makers always have a tough time designing a strong dog shaft/alignment setup. 

4.  Does the main shaft go all the way to the sideplate on the handle side?, if not how is the pinion supported?

-J
Title: Re: Avet STAR DRAG Reels
Post by: Brendan on July 08, 2020, 01:55:41 PM
Thanks for the peek. I was able to see pictures the first time I viewed this but not now.
Tight lines, Brendan.
Title: Re: Avet STAR DRAG Reels
Post by: MarkT on July 08, 2020, 02:11:38 PM
Greased drags and a loud clicker... are you sure it's an Avet?
Title: Re: Avet STAR DRAG Reels
Post by: alantani on July 08, 2020, 04:26:05 PM
yeah, seriously!  aren't these the guys that are adamant about using dry drags?  and now they have greased drags?  first, corona virus, now this?  what's the world coming to???
Title: Re: Avet STAR DRAG Reels
Post by: mike1010 on July 08, 2020, 06:14:26 PM
Quote from: CooldadE on July 07, 2020, 10:41:32 PM
Hmm, I see the text  but no pictures...

Cool

Who provides your network service?  I suspect that the images are dropped out because they are big, and your provider is throttling your bandwidth.  Try off-peak hours.
Title: Re: Avet STAR DRAG Reels
Post by: mike1010 on July 08, 2020, 06:46:28 PM
Quote from: jurelometer on July 07, 2020, 11:10:17 PM
Quote from: Rivverrat on July 07, 2020, 09:22:22 PM
Thanx for doing this. I'd been wanting to see the inside from the first I heard of this reel... Jeff
x2!!!

Thanks for doing this.   This is a great breakdown review!

First some comments:

1.  The one-way bearing looks like the standard-off the shelf  variety.  If Avet is greasing the one-way bearing, I think they are basically giving up on it  working full strength over time and relying on the dog to take the load.  But if the dog is silent and the pawl has lots of teeth (thanks to the large diameter), the one-way bearing only has to work a little bit before slipping (or maybe not at all) and most folks will never notice :)  Greasing will help keep the  bearing from being as much of a rust/corrosion headache, but it begs the question of why bothering to put one in in the first place.  Market demand?


2. To risk sounding like a broken record, the surface area of a disc drag does not directly affect the stopping power, which is strictly a function of clamping force * the coefficient of friction (how slippery the surfaces are).   However, a larger circumference  means more braking work per revolution (longer distance traveled).   But the inside is still traveling a shorter distance.  To get the most braking work per revolution, you would want a large outer diameter AND a large inside diameter (less surface area).  Increasing surface area does have the potential to help make the drag smoother and provide a larger reservoir for absorbing heat and greater heat dissipation.

3. 
QuoteI wonder why Avet chose to make only one of the carbon fiber washers engage the gear.

I think that  since the bottom drag washer is sandwiched between the gear and a keyed washer,  it can only slide against one surface, and it doesn't matter which.  This design might be a bit less expensive to manufacture, and makes the drag washer order a bit more obvious.

4.  I am assuming that the yoke pins are press fit.  It might have been nice to have them threaded with some wrench flats ground into the top. but maybe I am nitpicking here.

5.  The jack and yoke look like forged (or cast?) stainless.   Nice and beefy.  These designs without a bridge plate are a bit of a mixed blessing, as the jack is stainless sliding against aluminum.  not the greatest sliding surface combo for a saltwater reel.  The Shimano TLD star is a very similar design, but since the frame is made of plastic, sliding wear/corrosion is not a problem for the TLD star.   IMHO for this type of reel,  the bridge assembly built into the side of the frame is the best way to go in terms of rigidity and protection from the elements.

6. So it looks to me like four drag surfaces in action.   Not as many as they could have put in, but if you put in more, you are just encouraging folks to crank down the drag more and break something :)

7.  Only six screws to hold down the reel foot?  What?  They couldn't fit  eight?  ::)


Now onto my questions.   


1.  The undergear drag washer has a much wider ID that the shaft.  It needs to be kept in place in order to avoid getting chewed up by the dog.  Is there another part or something on the bottom of the main gear to keep the washer centered?  If not, my vote is another last minute hack to increase the drag after they decided to grease the washers.

2.  Not clear to me from the photos on how the dog is kept silent.  If you have a chance to explain or post another photo, it would be appreciated.

3.  So there is a post affixed to the dog, and it rotates in a hole in the aluminum sideplate?  If so, this is an area where wear could become a problem.  I don't know why reel makers always have a tough time designing a strong dog shaft/alignment setup. 

4.  Does the main shaft go all the way to the sideplate on the handle side?, if not how is the pinion supported?

-J


First, everybody, you are welcome.

Comments 2 and 3:  Got it.  Thanks.

Comment 7:  Standard for all of the SX and MX LD reels, except the SXJ, which is very narrow.  Funny thing, I've heard or read it claimed that Avet reel seats are weak.  No way.  Maybe some of their earliest reels?

Question 1:  Busted.  You've got good eyes.  I neglected to take a picture of the main gear underside, which has a raised area fitting the washer inside diameter, which centers it.

Question 2:  The "friction ring" is a circular spring that sits on the circumference of the rubber friction washer.  In normal operation, the washer just rotates inside the ring, and the end of the ring exerts pressure on the inside of the dog, holding it off the ratchet.  When back-play happens, the washer forces the end of the ring into a concave portion on the inside of the dog, allowing the whisker spring to push the dog into the ratchet.  In the picture below, see the circle drawn around the end of the friction ring sitting in the dog concavity, allowing the dog to engage.  Clear as mud?  The friction setup is used in all Avet reels, AFAIK.  I think they hold a patent.

Question 3:  No post at all.  There is a recess machined into the plate.  It holds the dog in such a way that it can rotate, but there is a retainer plate screwed over it that keeps it from escaping.  See the picture below.  Again, this is similar to how the LD dogs are set up.

(https://www.dropbox.com/s/ri0wnsrbq2ihpg3/14.jpg?dl=1)

Let me know if I've been unclear, and I will try to get more pictures, or find some in the Ave LD tutorials on alantani.com.

Question 4:  The spool main shaft extends to within, but not through, the pinion bearing.  The unusual spool tensioner shaft extends into the pinion from the plate side.  So the support for the pinion is these two, the yoke, and, when engaged, the main gear.

Thanks for the comments and questions; they increase my understanding of the reel.

--Mike

Title: Re: Avet STAR DRAG Reels
Post by: steelfish on July 08, 2020, 08:31:54 PM
thanks for the pics Mike

I dont know, I was expecting something "innovative" on this reel, since avet reels were a big hit when they arrived to the gear market
Title: Re: Avet STAR DRAG Reels
Post by: CooldadE on July 08, 2020, 10:08:55 PM
Still looking for pics... I'll keep checking.

Cool
Title: Re: Avet STAR DRAG Reels
Post by: RUSTY OLD COLT on July 09, 2020, 01:33:12 PM
  My local shop has the MXL Avet in stock looks and feels nicely made ,  I am going to wait for the narrow version MXJ to come in and purchase one and give it a workout .
Title: Re: Avet STAR DRAG Reels
Post by: Donnyboat on July 10, 2020, 12:06:34 PM
Hi Mike thank you for that, It took some time for the pics to come through, by the time I read the text, they were there, nice & clear, thanks again, cheers Don.
Title: Re: Avet STAR DRAG Reels
Post by: Rivverrat on July 12, 2020, 02:37:51 AM
The anti reverse appears to be of a stronger design than with my favored Penn Torques. The anti reverse on the Torque star drags is their weak link.  All my Torques are in need of AR bearing replacement... Jeff  
Title: Re: Avet STAR DRAG Reels
Post by: jurelometer on July 12, 2020, 04:14:12 AM
Quote from: Rivverrat on July 12, 2020, 02:37:51 AM
The anti reverse appears to be of a stronger design with my favored Penn Torques. The anti reverse on the Torque star drags is their weak link.  All my Torques are in need of AR bearing replacement... Jeff   


I like the design too from a strength perspective.  It looks like the outer diameter of the dog acts as the radial load surface and the recess into the frame acts as a bushing.   This design creates an opportunity to have a strong dog that will not get pushed out of place, but from a wear perspective, it is kind of sketchy.   In  Avet's defense, with a silent dog, it does not get much of a rotational workout.

If I had to make a wager on the area that would fail first (besides the one-way bearing), it would be somewhere around the pinion.  That floating pinion shaft design  (like all of them) does not look that robust.  The reel might perform plenty well, but my bet would be this is the area that would go if the reel was pushed too hard. Something has to give eventually if there is enough drag.

Overall though, just by looking at photos and reviews of the internals,  I would plunk down my cash for for an Avet Star before an Accurate Tern.   But I would still prefer a TLD star.

Curious as to what you are seeing on the Torques, since they have backup dogs.  What is is the behavior when the one-way bearing fails?  Is it just slipping until the dogs engage, or worse?

-J
Title: Re: Avet STAR DRAG Reels
Post by: Rivverrat on July 12, 2020, 03:41:12 PM
  J, I have always appreciated your thoughts.

   I can say from my experience my thoughts agree with yours. I would purchase this reel before I would the Tern.

On my Torques now understand I have pushed these reels.  Drag levels above 15 lbs. are common. So whats happening is  with reel engaged & now with only 10 lbs. of drag, when you pull line the the spool rotates backwards until the dogs are engaged. I have also thought the stub shaft that disconnect the pinion would be problematic in some cases but have never experienced this my self.

The Torque star drag models are not designed to rely on the dogs. They cant, long term because the studs for the dogs are mounted in reverse on a thin plate.  This design is said to be stronger. Until some one can explain how this is. I dont believe at this time it is stronger than mounting all internal lock work directly to the side plate.

EDIT: Forgot to add, there is peening of some metal on this new plate design used on the Torques. I'll start another thread when I have time & show wear & tear on my Torques

 I originally thought Penn may have made use of an AR bearing as a designed failure point. But this doesn't  makes sense. With the dogs, studs & rachet being of a weak design there was no choice but to make use of an AR bearing.

The Torques do fine with 40 line & 50. But if you fish your 50 heavy you will destroy the AR bearing.

As I learn more I have come to look away from any reel with an AR bearing that will be used with more than 40 line. Which makes up a large majority of the reels I use. However the Avet here is a bit different.

 As of now all my reels needing performance levels above that using 40 line will be lever drags. Which is where the market pushes us... Jeff
Title: Re: Avet STAR DRAG Reels
Post by: Rivverrat on July 14, 2020, 04:25:10 PM
  I have become intrigued with this reel. I will get one as soon as able. I'll wait just a bit prior to purchase for some real use feedback.

The internals, price make this reel worthy of giving it a go.
Title: Re: Avet STAR DRAG Reels
Post by: mike1010 on February 14, 2021, 08:57:20 PM
When reassembling the head plate of one of these reels, beware the IAR roller clutch.  It is not the kind with the roller springs molded in plastic.  Instead, there are small steel springs carried in a plastic insert.  It is surprisingly easy to dislodge this insert when fitting the IAR collar into the clutch, at which point all the tiny clutch parts fly around the room and laugh at you.  There is no reassembling the pieces, at least for the hack hobbyist.  I've been through this grief twice.  The safe thing I have found is to insert the IAR collar from the outside after screwing the head plate to the frame.  Finesse the collar into the clutch and then the collar ears into the top drag washer slots.

Also, a correction to my original breakdown of the reel:  The unused hole in the AR dog is not an engineering change.  The dog is shared with the G2 SX and, I assume the G2 MX.  There the hole is used.  I will make the change in place as well as note it here.

Mike
Title: Re: Avet STAR DRAG Reels
Post by: ez2cdave on February 28, 2021, 10:13:43 PM
Quote from: mike1010 on February 14, 2021, 08:57:20 PM
When reassembling the head plate of one of these reels, beware the IAR roller clutch.  It is not the kind with the roller springs molded in plastic.  Instead, there are small steel springs carried in a plastic insert.  It is surprisingly easy to dislodge this insert when fitting the IAR collar into the clutch, at which point all the tiny clutch parts fly around the room and laugh at you.  There is no reassembling the pieces, at least for the hack hobbyist.  I've been through this grief twice.  The safe thing I have found is to insert the IAR collar from the outside after screwing the head plate to the frame.  Finesse the collar into the clutch and then the collar ears into the top drag washer slots.

Also, a correction to my original breakdown of the reel:  The unused hole in the AR dog is not an engineering change.  The dog is shared with the G2 SX and, I assume the G2 MX.  There the hole is used.  I will make the change in place as well as note it here.

Mike

Mike,

It would be great if you could do a thread and post photo's of the disassembly / re-assembly process !

Dave
Title: Re: Avet STAR DRAG Reels
Post by: ez2cdave on May 18, 2021, 04:59:51 PM
Well, I'm STILL HERE . . . BORED, but STILL HERE !

https://charkbait.com/product/avet-mxl-star-drag-reels/ (https://charkbait.com/product/avet-mxl-star-drag-reels/)

Tight Lines !