I was given a gift the other day and found this old fishing pole interesting. The lathe turned butt and metal ferrule might date it in history. Butt the guides are over and under and there is only one pair, the top guide seems to be universal in how the rod is strung.
The split bamboo is very well made. What are your thoughts. Just wondering.🎣
The closer look
I have one just like it somewhere...shot in the dark is 1930's or so, but really maybe older....
When the rod starts take a "set", you rotate it 180 degrees in the ferrule to bend it back the other way. Hence the in-line tip (for want of a better word).
The length is about 5 1/2 feet. Quite stiff action.
Montague rod I think,,,,, :D I was very surprised of how strong bamboo rods are,,,,, ;) take it fishing my friend,,,,,, ;D
again, shot in the dark because I really don't know much about vintage, butt that tip may be German silver (and mebbe guides too). Would look great on your wall! Love your place up there, from Wayne's pics.
Speaking of vintage, about to finish the last Fenwick clean-up with some assistance from the Aftco rollers you sent me a ways back.
Quote from: Benni3 on August 27, 2019, 05:25:14 PM
take it fishing my friend,,,,,, ;D
Are you nuts Benny. Gary has never caught a fish small enough to land on split bamboo :) :)
But, kidding aside, if you plan to ever use it you should start oiling the bamboo now to give it time to soak in. Something like Tru-oil or linseed. They get brittle when they dry out. Using it is probably a death sentence though.
-steve
Quote from: oc1 on August 27, 2019, 06:22:46 PM
Quote from: Benni3 on August 27, 2019, 05:25:14 PM
take it fishing my friend,,,,,, ;D
Are you nuts Benny. Gary has never caught a fish small enough to land on split bamboo :) :)
But, kidding aside, if you plan to ever use it you should start oiling the bamboo now to give it time to soak in. Something like Tru-oil or linseed. They get brittle when they dry out. Using it is probably a death sentence though.
-steve
Yep, I would find an old Ocean City or an old Pflueger conventional Salt reel in about 4/0 to 6/0 size with original line — and make a Great Wall hanger for your den.
If you would like a cool 80 or 90 year old reel — I would send you some choices — then after you decide, would send it North at N/C.
I have tried to use old bamboo rods — and even after oil conditioning — either the thread wraps start to come apart under pressure — or the rod just cracks.
It has successfully completed its mission — it's duty shift is over.
Just my opinion, Gary....
Best,
Fred
:) :) That is a trolling pole 1950 ish Montague .
It is very stiff . I have a few that i added more guides to and fish them.
I was out on a charter yesterday and took the old boys with me . I showed up with 3 of them in a soft gun case .
A 5 1/2 , a 6 foot and a 8 1/2 foot . I really enjoy fishing with them
The kind of rod that was very popular with the Tunny fishers, in the North Sea out of Scarborough, back in the 30/40/50 ish - until the trawlers decimated the herring stocks. Then the the Tunny (tuna) moved to other feeding grounds. As has been said, when the rod got a 'set' in it - turn the top section 180° and carry on. Lovely old stick - I'd clean it up and hang it on the wall :)
Thanks for sharing your information and thoughts. I am planning on making a wall art with it. It's original and still straight. The ferrule and guides did appear to be silver plated.
It's older than me. Boy Howdy.🧜♂️
That type of tip is called a stirrup tip, the handle is quite similar to a Montigue, the company sold tons of rods under its own name and also manufactured them for others. Being blessed with the position of consort to the "Queen of Catfish" I have restored several that are her arsenal. If you decide to strip it and rewrap, Formsby's Tung oil finish is a good choice, the natural Tung oil is excellent for older grass and wood rods.
Huh? Did I read this right? What is a grass rod? Dominick
According to Hoyle, Bamboo / Calcutta are of the grass family.
Oops,
My bad in the fly fishing world bamboo is often referred to as grass. If your interested in bamboo rods something to look for is obvious glue lines that appear to be dark purple/purple-brown. This color indicates the use of Penocolite glue and was considered a much more waterproof adhesive. Phillipson rods were made using this product and are one of the best American made grass rods. I don't know if they made deep sea rods, I know they manufactured some split cane conventional rods.
Phillipson made fly and spinning rods in tobacco fiberglass too. I don't fly fish but have striped a couple of Phillipson fiberglass fly rods to make ultralight baitcasting rods. I don't know where they found all that extra loading without increasing the overall weight, but they did and it's dramatic. Very nice rods and everything they say about them is true.
-steve
Cool. "Grass rods".
I've got maybe the same rod Gary. A Montague. If you wanna completely restore yours, there's a rubber end piece cap that goes on the bottom of the handle. Mine has a partial sticker above the handle that proclaims it as "tonkin bamboo"( Gulf of Tonkin, SE Asia ?) something they seemed to be proud of.
Quote from: Gfish on October 01, 2019, 02:22:14 PM
"tonkin bamboo"( Gulf of Tonkin, SE Asia ?) something they seemed to be proud of.
Yeah, it's from northern Viet Nam into southern China. There was a period when international relations were so bad that western rod builders couldn't get Tonkin cane. Things are much better now, but there is no longer much demand for bamboo so it still takes some effort to get good culms. Last time I looked there was only one or two places selling it and the costs plus shipping is really really high.
-steve
Quote from: thorhammer on September 30, 2019, 11:10:55 PM
According to Hoyle, Bamboo / Calcutta are of the grass family.
Thanks foe that... Calcutta reels are made of grass ??? ??? ??? Dominick
Rods marked Calcutta are generally older, the Calcutta cane from India was the transition from wood to cane, then Tonkin was found to be a superior type. The finest Tonkin cane cane from a very small area in Guangdong province, but this was generally used for flyrods, after the post war embargo, suppliers switched to Vietnam as a source. The scarcity of quality bamboo played a large part in the advancement in fiberglass rod technology.
Today a quality culm of Tonkin seems pricey untill you count up the hours to turn the raw material into a finished fly rod.
WOW!!! you guys are hittin' a major point of interest & major "sore spot"
can old cane be restored to "fishable" ??? ...mine's unused, zero set
grabbed a "bargain" old Japanese 3-pc. SPINNING!!! ...9-10'(3m?) ...light Surf?, Steelhead?
allegedly brought over by a post-Korea GI... still had the steel seat wrapped in that age-appropriate greasy wax paper
definitely unused, 'cause the darn ferules don't fit :'(
what can I do,
with this pretty, straight boo?
:o
Sadly the quality in those rods was at best questionable, glue, cane, guides, and reel seats are all prone to failure. I spent about 30 hours restoring one, looked outstanding, snapped on a bluegill. You can get lucky, some of them will fish okay, but the majority are best used as wall hangers. If you want to fish an old bamboo there are basically two types expensive and needs work.
Sometimes one will slip by at auction, last month I bought an Orvis spinning rod for $118.00, old Montigue rods are still very reasonable, but they usually need guides. The best source of fishable split cane spinning/boat rods I've found is rods from the UK on the big auction site. The drawback is a $25.00 rod may cost $50 or more in shipping, but the same rod if commissioned from a current rod maker will go north of $500.00 and a 1k price is not uncommon.
A friend used to make light spinning rods from broken fly rods, they were very good rods, I believe he favored domestic brands such as Granger, Montigue and South Bend. I think he said he had approx 10 to 25 hours in each rod, depending if the goal was for show or go.
If you decide to pursue "grass" rods let me know I can point you in the right direction for anything you might need. It used to be a mildly serious addiction, then realizing I had a problem I switched to greenheart wooden rods, lately I've been eying combination rods made of whole cane, Greenheart, Lancewood and or split cane.
Tom
Tom
Tom, where-the-heck did you find greenheart? I looked once but came up empty and had to go with ipe (bethabara)
-steve
Steve
I purchased Greenheart dowls and unfinished turned sections in England (my daughter lives there) and brought them back as luggage. I have bought most of my rods from England via the big auction site UK version. The draw back is shipping!!, I have bought numerous rods where the shipping was double the cost of the rod. I have been offered various large 14 to 20 foot single piece Greenheart rods, just never wanted to pay the shipping.
If your interested in greenheart let me know what format and I'll try to find you a source, your best bet may be to repurpose an existing rod. One of my favorites for conventional fishing is Hardy's Everyman model greenheart pike rod.
Tom
Gulp! I doubt that I'll be buying many Hardy rods. Do you know anyone over there who would ship three to five foot dowels or a 3' to 5' piece of half to one inch thick lumber? Long lumber and long one-piece rods are nice, but there are financial limits you know.
I read somewhere that if you had a good long hardwood rod (back in their day) it would be too long to bring into the house, yet you wouldn't want to leave it outside after the fishing season. Instead, you would have a two or three piece rod held together by lashings that were tied for the season. After the season it was untied and the pieces brought indoors away from the weather.
-steve
edit: I mean shipped by a commercial lumber establishment, not your daughter. She probably thinks your weird already. :)
Steve,
Don't fear the Hardy, other than unbranded, they have been my cheapest Greenhearts I have never payed more than $100 for a Hardy pike rod. Most of them were less than $50, Hardy in the US has always been a high end company, in the UK they produced a full range of tackle, much of it for what is referred to as coarse fishing in the UK. Spliced joints are interesting and we're used by most of the high quality big rod builders, I've passed on several, due to size, and unfamiliarity with the use of spliced joints.
Orvis offered Greenheart fly rods in thier 1978 and 1979 catalog's, I believe there were smaller one piece trout rods
I will look for a source of wood for you, when I got mine they were scarce, and much higher than common rods in need of restoration.
Tom
Is this the type of lumber you guys are discussing ?
https://www.westwindhardwood.com/product/hardwoods/greenheart/
Crow,
That's the right species, thanks for the link. I never looked for raw wood, having no lathe, dowls and turned sections were my interest. Hopefully they might have something for Steve.
Tom
there's grandpa's old bamboo rod hanging up in my mom's garage. i'll pull it down next time and share some pics...
While doing some "surfing" on greenheart, I found this:
https://www.woodmagazine.com/materials-guide/lumber/wood-species-2/greenheart
Quote from: Crow on October 03, 2019, 12:52:31 PM
Is this the type of lumber you guys are discussing ?
https://www.westwindhardwood.com/product/hardwoods/greenheart/
Yeah, thank you very much Arlyn. Your googling skills are much better than mine. That is the first time I've seen a species name for green heart,
Ocotea rodiei. I ordered a three to four foot stick from West Wind Hardwood. The estimated shipping is forty bucks. We'll see what happens. Oh, and thank you for the heads-up about the exploding lumber too.
-steve
As to that "exploding" lumber.....I'll share a story: I , for quite a few years, had a sawmill, and cut a lot of local, hardwood logs, into lumber, and turning squares ....did lots of 'wood working", in those days, and made woodwork, cabinets, doors, etc., for 3 different houses. A "farmer friend" said he had a black cherry tree that I could have, if I wanted it. It was the "tallest tree", in his small stand of timber, and was continually being struck by lightning, and, the "last strike" had peeled the bark, all the way to the ground, and he figured it was either dying, or, already dead. Anyway, I cut the tree (probably 18", at the butt), cut it into "manageable " lengths, hauled it home, and when fall came, I started sawing it. each board...starting with the "wane" (bark side), and continuing all the way trough the log, came off in "long splinters"! From looking at the cut end of the logs, everything appeared "normal", and the "cant" (the , as yet un sawed chunk of log) appeared normal as well....but as the saw passed down it...all splinters !! Stopped trying for boards, and just made firewood from it ! It burned well :P. When talking to an "old time sawyer" (who happened to be an uncle of mine) later, about it, he said that "lightning blasted" trees usually did that, and, often, the whole log would "shiver" (his term for falling into a pile of slivers !) when the saw first touched it.
Quote from: Crow on October 03, 2019, 08:53:58 PM
As to that "exploding" lumber.....I'll share a story:
That's a wild story. Reminds me of those pictures you see of graphite rods struck by lightening. They turn into a ball of fuzz when the heat burns away the resin and leaves the carbon fibers. I guess trees have their resin too.
-steve
Great stuff on this site. Dominick
wonder if "lightning blasted" trees would make better/quicker charcoal
since all the resins(sap), oils and alcohols are already burned/evaporated out