The "Mitchell Garcia 302 Saltwater" came to the spinning reel scene in '51 as a 1/2 bail model and lasted as such 'till '53. The '51 & '52 sold an estimated 4 - 5,000 units. The full bail reels went from '53 to '77. Production of the full bail reels was 2,100,000+(this is pretty good data which is based on serial # records. These records were absent from the earlier 1/2 bail style). Source: "The Mitchell Reel Muesum".
What I'd call "small changes" occurred along the way. For example, a '54 schematic shows 51 part #'s, while a '69 shows 68 diffrent part #'s. These "small changes" over a 24 yr. production peroid, may speak to the overall design, tolerances, and material quality of the 302. Big changes could be indicative of major problems, or a desire to cheapen a popular model. A good example of this would be the latest iteration of the 300. A plastic lookin Mitchell(no Garcia) 300 for $29.70 at Walmart.
I was able to guesstimate that mine is a '63-'66 version. The seller advertised it as a '55, but the presence of a removable rotor counterweight with 2 screws(part#'s 66 & 11) and the absence of part#5: 2-drag stack "shims", tells me different.
Warning, soapbox statement: sellers need to make an effort to confirm statements like: "it's a vintage 1955". Or, at the very least, maybe they should tell you that their selling info. is a guess. Some, IMO, seem to want to say anything that sounds good, probably trying for a quick, over-priced sale. The drag screw was boggered and frozen in place, so it probably hasn't been removed in a long time, which is what is what you would need to do, to see any of the parts I described that might help identify it. Also, this important problem info. was not provided by the seller. I know, I know, buyer beware...
This is a rather complicated reel for a 50's---70's spinner, so I'll start with what I call "systems" and over a course of days disassemble the whole thing. Also I don't do ultrasonic cleaning, so I won't take it apart all at one time. What this actually really means, is that I'm afraid of having left-over parts and getting stuck, because I can't remember how to reassemble parts/systems that are new to me.
Please post comments, advice, correct my inaccuracies, etc. as I go. Note: I mixed terminology up at times, using generic nouns for spinner parts that I'm familier with and nouns from way back when, that Mitchell uses in the schematic. I'll try'n correct that in future posts.
Reel's in the middle, with a Fin Nor LT-100(left) and Zebco Cardinal 4(right) for size comparison.
Nice catch! I got to dig my 302 out of storage and give it a look. Garcia Mitchel was the go to reel in the 1970's.
eBay is loaded with miss numbered reel parts and reels that need more "love" than the description.
I got one cheap in a bunch of assorted reels on ebay a while back. Somebody on this forum told me it was probably made about 1956. It's a Mitchell, not a Garcia Mitchell.
(https://alantani.com/gallery/28/17863_28_05_19_2_41_50.jpeg)
A previous owner had filed around on the reel foot. I imagine because the reel foot on these are so long they won't fit a modern Ugly Stik, Eagle Claw, Whuppin Stick, or Berkley Big Game. However it fits my old 9' Roddy fiberglass surf rod.
(https://alantani.com/gallery/28/17863_28_05_19_2_41_06.jpeg)
Was definitely different than any other Mitchell I've worked on. First reel I'd ever seen with two c-clips on the axle. These reels have the most complicated set of drag washers I've encountered.
(https://alantani.com/gallery/28/17863_28_05_19_2_38_20.jpeg)
Yeah Chester. No "Garcia" and no "302" on the tail-plate. Also the counter-weight in the rotor looks like it don't screw in. A '56 it could be. If your interested, the drag stack should have 2-part # 5 shims, one up underneath the copper spring washer in the drag knob and one between the collared washer and the coil spring. Also, the clicker right below the coil spring, on the '56 is called a "coaster assembly"---2 washers; a big fat lookin click pawl and a skinny click washer. The '57 on, has a thinner click pawl wavy washer with a gap in it. Works pretty well on mine.
That's too bad with the filing. The external parts on that'n otherwise look real nice.
1) The handle assembly. A little Inox penetrating oil, a brass wire brush on the exposed friction surfaces and threads. A cotton swab with Inox to clean the inside of the knob. Some marine grease on all threads and knob screw.
A larger knob, like on the 402 would be nice.
Leave the handle out of the reel, so that latter you can pull the main gear shaft out.
Next, the spool, spindle and drag stack.
2) Spool, drag stack, drag stack with modification and the spindle.
I like the big heavy spindle: it screws off/on to the shaft with a 9mm open-end. It seems to provide good stability for the relatively wide aluminum spool. There are 2 flat sides on the spindle, like on a Penn gear sleeve. Note that the bottom-of-the-spool fiber washer was replaced with delrin in the 4-155 Penn size and is sitting on top of the spindle.
I managed to put 2 - 6-155 c-tex, slightly modified, in the bottom of the stack. The stack barely fits into the spool recess now and I only removed 1 "spacer washer". The spacer washer is what we call a keyed washer when working on Penn conventionals(2 sides are flat on the i.d.) Conversely, Mitchell refers to what we call "eared washers" as "keyed washers" in the schematic.
Lapped the brass washers with 1000 grit wet/dry, scraped the other drag parts with a wire brush and everything was painted with Cal's tan drag grease.
A big THANK YOU to Fred for replacement parts: drag screw, drag knob, bail wire and roller assembly. I damaged the old ones gettin 'em out by cutting too deep a groove in both parts. I was attempting to get a good bite with a screwdriver as the the screw was frozen and the slot damaged.
Pictures: 1) original stack; 2) c-tex added in, 1 "keyed" washer removed; 3) close-up of spool, spindle and new c-tex.
Next, the rotor cup and the bail.
Great post G! The 302 is one Mitchell absent from my stable...hopefully that changes soon. I'm sure this thread will be helpful when I tear into one. 8)
Mo, I might also suggest a 488 for you. You will see why when you lay hands on it :)
I LOVE my 489. Its drag isn't as strong as the 302s, at least not as upgradable, but skirted spools make so much sence, and it retrieves a bunch of line for every rotation. There are a TON of things you can do with a 302. Cross-wind, drag upgrade, put a 303 side plate on and support the main on both sides. Lots of clear side plates floating around.
The Man
Just got my Mitchell 302 out of storage. Opened it up checked on the gears. Found everything in order. Took drag apart & cleaned the metal washers. Maybe one day I will fish with it.
Thanks Gfish for the for the reminder of a long forgotten tool.
Nice post and a lot of thoughtful research.
-steve
Ron, you have a 499 remember
Great look(s) at a classic reel & the comments are pertinent & help expand the discussion. Way to go folks!
Frank
System 3) the rotor & bail system.
Note: The spool and spindle has been removed and serviced already.
1st; take off the 14mm rotor nut and remove rotor. 3 things to keep track of: the tiny "key" attached to the pinion shaft, and remember: a copper shim first, on top the ball bearing, then a chrome bushing on top of the shim. Possibly the chrome bushing will be stuck to the bottom of the rotor. Put 'em back on the pinion shaft for now.
When I first got the reel, it wasn't turning easy. I thought " bad ball bearing". When I opened it up, I found someone had reversed the bushing and shim order. The schematic cleared it up for me. Much better now.
2nd; remove 2 bail screws and bail, then the line roller nut & lockwasher. 3rd; remove 1 screw holding the 2-part bail release mechanism located inside the rotor. Remvoe the unit, carefull! don't let the bail release pin fall out, and as you slide this pin out of the rotor from the inside out, keep your finger on the pin spring. Also, note which side of the pin contacts the bail arm and reinstall the same way, later on. 4th; remove the counterweight if it's the type with screws insteda rivets.
Quote from: thorhammer on September 03, 2019, 06:15:03 PM
Ron, you have a 499 remember
What's one digit among friends?
The 488/9/98/9 are basically the same except for the rotor. At least that's the way I understand it.
Thanks for the back up.
The Man
Rotor/Bail system, continued.
Cleaned all moving parts with wire brush and penetrating oil, and cleaned black aluminium rotor with p. oil, rag and Q-tip.
Marine grease mixed with oil for bail arm, trip lever piviot area and bail release pin. Oil on the line roller. Plain marine grease painted on all inner rotor surfaces.
Reassembly: pretty much the reverse of assembly, starting with the line roller lock nut assembly. Next, on the rotor, slide the pin in from the outside and through the pin spring. Place the trip lever back in with the extended part fitting into the notch in the pin, line it up and screw in. Note that in the picture, the pin spring is behind where the trip lever contacts the pin.
Fun part now: install bail spring into the rotor. CLEAN GREASE OFFA FINGERS. To install bail arm, first use your finger inside the rotor to hold the pin in, so it doesn't push on the bail arm. Push on a certain part of the bail trip lever mechanism to do this, you'll find it...Put bail arm onto spring, center it. Are you still holding the pin in!?, now twist the bail arm slowly, keeping it centered and with some pressure, twist it up and around that square shaped rotor projection( bail bumper rests against this when it's back together and bail is closed), you got it? Are the spring ends still in their respective holes? Good. Now quick, put the bail screw in, torque it! Hurry-up!
Only took me 3 tries!
IMO, the bail system on this reel is pretty flimsy compared to all the other 302 systems. The wire is thin, and the line roller only has 3 parts. The locknut for the roller is small and attaches to a pretty thin threaded bail end-piece. There is no real support for for the bail wire on the opposite side, it just fits loosely in a hole in the rotor with a cover screw to keep it from popping out.
And no, the roller on my 56yr. old reel isn't gonna roll, even with the nut locked in a pretty loose position. Best to snug it up so the bail doesn't wiggle around when actuated, that could tweak something.
That's probably why Mitchell came up with the PUM. A bail-less manual pick-up. The PUM looks like a tough unit in the schematic's picture. These are offered in the '63 schematic as an extra part to order. Probably check out da bay and see about gettin one.
Next, the gear box, AR and ball bearing.
The Gear Box, Anti-Reverse System and The Ball Bearing
1st) Unscrew the non-gear side plate which has a red plastic Lube Access Port (for the main & pinion gears). This side-plate has shorter, flat-top screws and the opposite(gear side)plate uses tapered-head screws, probably to better align the gears. 2nd) remove the skinny screw at bottom of the shaft(sometimes called the"reel axel") which attaches to the "axel guide". This unit seems to provide strength and stability to the shaft, by kinda stabilizing it against side to side movement at the bottom. 3rd) push the 2-"C" clips off of the axel shaft, located on top and on the bottom of the oscillation unit(called the "pivot slide")and pull the shaft out.
In the second picture you may be able to see, bottom C-clip is all the way off and the top one is 1/2 way off.
Continued...
4th) Remove the gear side-plate and pull the main gear out.
5th) If you haven't already done it, remove the chrome rotor bushing and the copper shim from the top of the ball bearing. 6th) Pull the key from the pinion shaft and hold-on to it! Push the pinion down into the gear box and out, then reinstall the key with a dab of grease. 7th) unscrew the 2 set screws on either side of the gear box "neck" and push the ball bearing up and out.
Continued...
The planamatic gear system consists of a main("drive") gear (left side in picture) ring gear("planamatic cam ring")far right, and an oscillating gear("planamatic gear") middle. Note in the 2nd picture I push/pulled out what I'll call the "lubricant absorbtion pad" from the main gear shaft, it's sitting on the reel seat in picture #2. This is common in the older Mitchell reels. I press cleaned it between paper towels. Looks kinda delicate---hey, it's almost my age!
At this point I'm gonna return the screws, clips and a few other small items to where they go, after clean and lube, so I don't lose 'em or forget where they go.
These gears shine like steel, but feel like they're aluminium in weight. Probably some kinda alloy. Tolerances at the various friction points seem to nice and tight.
Continued...
The anti-reverse assembly.
8th) remove the "E"-clip from the from on top of the "antireverse cam spring"(black color). Carefully, with your finger on the silver dog spring, pull the AR cam spring and then the dog and dog spring.
This looks like a nice sturdy system. In the first picture, it's in the off position.
Cleaned and lubed all of the above parts, as well as these AR parts as described before. Exceptions would be the lube pad that I pulled out of the main gear shaft. I dumped some clean oil down there and stuffed the pad back in. The ball bearing got soaked in inox mx3, lubed with oil and covered in marine grease. Most other friction parts on the reel got a mix of oil and marine grease.
Reassembly of gear box next.
Reassembly:
1st) the AR system. Very simple: the reverse of disassembly.
2nd) the shaft, with the axel guide, pivot slide and pinion must be done in the right sequence. The pinion goes in, in only one direction, from the inside of the gear box, up. First, install the pivot slide on the shaft WITHOUT the C-clips. Install the pinion gear also on the shaft above the pivot slide.
Remember, the pivot slide and shaft have corresponding groves and they must face the planamatic gear on the proper side. The planamatic gear's knob, needs to fit into the pivot slide/shaft grove.
Second, attach the bottom of the shaft to the shaft guide, but don't screw it in yet. Next, push the pinion up through the top of the gear box and put the ball bearing in on the pinion shaft and install the set screws. Are the groves on the pivot slide & shaft going to line up with the planamatic gear(i.e. face the gear side-plate)? Install the shaft guide screw, now. Push the C-clips onto the shaft groves, on the top and the bottom of pivot slide.
3rd) The 3 planamatic gears are straight forward with one exception: the planamatic cam ring(middle gear) does not move. There are 2 knobs on the ring that must be inserted into corresponding holes inside the gear box. Easy to see. However, there's also a knob on the planamatic gear(innermost gear) that 1) has to be lined up with one of the knobs on the cam ring gear and 2) at the same time, fit into the pivot slide. Once you think you have it right, tighten down the shaft guide screw.
Screw in the handle assembly.
Place the gear side-plate on the correct side of the gear box, without the plate screws. Hold it close to centered and get the ring gear knobs into the corresponding holes. Then manipulate the planamatic gear to 1) have the knob fit into the grove of the pivot slide and 2) be lined up, side to side, with one of the ring gear knobs.
Test it by holding the gear side-plate and gear box (with alota pressure) centered and steady and turn the handle. May take several adjustments to get a proper & consistent oscillation of the shaft. Screw the plate on when it works right.
4th) you've already installed the ball bearing and the 2 set screws. Now put the copper shim down against the top of the ball bearing and the chrome bushing on top of the shim. Make sure the tiny key is still in the pinion shaft and adjusted longest side top to bottom.
Time to button her up. Non-gear side-plate, rotor, spindle, spool and drag stack. 1st) install the rotor by positioning it so that the keyway slot slides down over the key. Screw on the 14mm nut. 2nd) screw the spindle onto the axel. 3rd) add the spool onto spindle and put drag washers in, proper order is important for best performance. Drag washer order is on page 1, post #5. Screw down drag knob making sure the spacer washers with the 2 flat sides on the inside hole are down properly on the spindle. Twist in the screw on top of the drag knob.
Test, and screw on the side plate. Done!
Oh boy! A "new to me" reel. Kinda like a new relationship, and the honeymoon phase is a goin' on!
Gonna get some good line on her and take her for a nice long test drive.
I'm bettin' she shows you a good time !
Excellent tutorial, Gregg!
Like many of us on here, having worked on plenty of these over the years — at least (2) things are worth noting, in my opinion.
1) These 302/303's are strong salt water reels. Good, tough frames — metal spools, good construction and
materials, attractive in appearance.
2) They also seem like they have too many parts for a HD Salt-Water reel — overly complicated and prone
to salt/sand damage and corrosion.
I have 2 or 3 large crates of these — and it seems like if they were ever used — they need major restorations to bring them back to where we would fish them confidently.
You have done a fantastic job on yours. It will catch a lot of fish!
Best,
Fred
Great job, Greg! You are right, the bail is puny on these reels. The smaller heavy freshwater/light saltwater 306 has a more robust bail wire.
The 302 engineering is nothing like the Mitchell 300. Similar to the smaller 308 and 306, but more complicated. One weak point is the plastic anti-reverse lever. Mine arrived with a stripped a/r lever, but l found the parts cheap on ebay. Also Fred Oakes sent me some missing drag components at n/c.
These reels can probably handle anything in my neck-of-the-woods, big cats, stripers, carp, drum, buffalo, paddlefish, and lake sturgeon which have been stocked in the past 20 years or so.
I cut my teeth working on these reels. Its all we had back in the day when I fished with my father on the Pensacola Beach Pier. Hundreds of King and Spanish Mackerel. They are still used today.
You can fit 5 Penn 6-155 HT-100 drag washers if you remove the spool clicker. The spool clicker puts a lot of tension on the line. Not so good for free lining a tiny bait.
Great walk through, Greg! Thanks! I've got a tote with about 20 various Mitchell models to service, if I live long enough :D, one of these winter months. These types of tutorials will sure come in handy when that time comes. ;)
A note about this odd color metal inside the housing. A while back in the Mitchell Reel Museum forum I read that this is either a coating or plating to prevent salt water damage. Can't remember exactly what the plating is made from.
Special Note: George6308, whom posted replies #1 & #9 on page 1, passed away a few days latter. Sounds like before he left us though, he got another reel(his old 302) out, serviced and up to par. Maybe his kids or grandkids will use it someday. In honor of his memory, I'm gonna unofficially name mine George(hope that's ok buddy!) and will remember him whenever I use it.
Great tutorial Gregg. I have an 302 from 1960's Hawaii. I damaged the drag knob screw while trying to service the drag. Is that screw often difficult to take off? Any tricks?
Quote from: festus on September 05, 2019, 07:59:56 PM
A note about this odd color metal inside the housing. A while back in the Mitchell Reel Museum forum I read that this is either a coating or plating to prevent salt water damage. Can't remember exactly what the plating is made from.
Thanks for adding that Chester. I was wondering what that was...hadn't seen it on the museum site yet.
Quote from: Gfish on September 13, 2019, 07:04:49 AM
Special Note: George6308, whom posted replies #1 & #9 on page 1, passed away a few days latter. Sounds like before he left us though, he got another reel(his old 302) out, serviced and up to par. Maybe his kids or grandkids will use it someday. In honor of his memory, I'm gonna unofficially name mine George(hope that's ok buddy!) and will remember him whenever I use it.
That's a nice gesture G...I'm sure George would be pleased. 8)
Quote from: smnaguwa on September 13, 2019, 12:19:38 PM
Great tutorial Gregg. I have an 302 from 1960's Hawaii. I damaged the drag knob screw while trying to service the drag. Is that screw often difficult to take off? Any tricks?
Thanks, Mo & smnaguwa! I tried to provide enough detail for a rookie at reel service/repair to get through it, but readin/editing back through it, it seems like there's probably a confusing excess of detail. Tutorials are hard for me to do... Hope I will learn and get better.
There's a thread I started on exactly that same screw problem, located in the "mitchell section" of "spinning reel rebuild tutorials and questions". The bottom line there was: penetrating oil, heat and a dremel cutting wheel(to deepen the screw slot).
Check-out the thread, I got a-lot of good help on that issue. Anyone that services reels for themselves or especially a business, is gonna need somea this knowledge.
Quote from: smnaguwa on September 13, 2019, 12:19:38 PM
Great tutorial Gregg. I have an 302 from 1960's Hawaii. I damaged the drag knob screw while trying to service the drag. Is that screw often difficult to take off? Any tricks?
Nice tutorial, Gregg!
Hi smnaguwa --
On those drag screws -- most are salt-fused, or easily damaged if the right driver is not used the very first time the screw is ever removed -- which was likely long before you owned it.
If you post a pic of the top of the spool -- I can send you one at no charge. There are a couple of different versions of these spool screws -- depending on vintage.
We are in SoCal for the weekend -- and not back until late Sunday -- so could send on Monday.
Best,
Fred
Thanks for the tutorial, I recently got another 302 at auction, was able to semi disassemble and get back together due to your tutorial.
This was a surprise reel, only bid 5 bucks because shipping was kinda high $10.50, but I won. My intention was just to save it for parts, when it showed up it was better looking than the one I fish with. The drag was auctully all there and had blue grease, when I opened the reel no signs of corrosion, was adequately greased, no dark hard gunk. The only issue the reel had was the bail was slightly tweaked, causing a rub.
Think I'm going to start watching for upgrade part, like a PUM kit, crosswind and another side plate to double dog the reel. Is anyone aware of any other 302 more???
Thanks again for that great tutorial
Hi Fred, sorry for the late reply. Just read your post. I eventually got the screw off and greased the threads well for the next servicing. Thanks for your generosity.We need more people in this world like you.
Great, glad it worked out!
Best,
Fred
Quote from: Ron Jones on September 03, 2019, 04:19:14 PM
Put a 303 side plate on and support the main on both sides.
How does this work? The main only has a post on
one side. Is there a different gear around?
I was also wondering about the crosswind modification...has anyone tried it? It is supposed to make braid wind on better. On my reel the standard planamatic set up laid the braid on very nice...nicer than most reels I have. :-\
Reading this tutorial before diving into my 302 was a wise decision...for a reel so large it sure has it's share of tiny parts. Here are a few observations. That pinion key circled in yellow can disappear easily, use caution. The 302 bearing(on the left) in the second photo is dwarfed by the South Bend 960's bearing, although it is a very good quality bearing. The bearing retainer on the 302 is a small affair too, and those c-locks on the axle can fly better than a Squidder's dog spring!
I modified the drag stack on my 302 as well, and it is sort of a cross between Keith and Greg's set ups. I managed to squeeze a 3-stack of carbon fiber in there while keeping the drag clicker. The first pic shows the original stack...with red arrows indicating the two discarded pieces. The next photo has blue arrows indicating where to add the carbon fiber washers. My reel came with a box, not the best box, but a box none the less. It will probably live on the shelf...unless I blow up that 306! 8)
The Mitchell reels are all we had available when I fished the Pensacola Gulf fishing pier. I cut my teeth working on Mitchell reels. I was 14 at that time. They are still used today on the piers for King Mackerel. The 300's were the bait reel and Spanish Mackerel reel.
I used them on the piers until I got a boat in my 30's.
I use 5 6-155's in the spool after removing the clicker washers.
Keith
Greta tutorial brother.....question...I'm working on a 402. It was a basket case that came in a lot I just picked up. Those this spinal shaft come apart? If so how did you get yours apart? Also do I need to take it apart to reassemble? The reel basically fell apart during disassembly, and the rotor nut was already loose.....Bill
Please disregard my previous post, but have a new question.....where does this part go? Found it in the bottom of the degreasing pan......Bill
Ok, Bill, did you get that spindle to unscrew off the spool-shaft, then maybe back on?
That mystery part is a shim for the silver colored, "H" shaped unit that supports the bottom of the spool shaft. As
I recall, it goes on one side, or the other, with the short-bent ends facing inward.
On post reply #18, you can see it next to the H part("axel guide").
Odd these Mitchell's, coming from the factory with shims already installed. Maybe a way the increase tolerances and smooth-out things...
So it would go between the wing and the rail it slides on?
Yes.
Kinda like Fred said ; "too many small parts for a HD Saltwater reel".
'