farmer 56 here ... does anybody have or use an abu-garcia suveran reel ? thanks farmer out
Hi farmer 56, I've got a S1000M suveran - I haven't fished it so I don't have first hand experience as far as performance goes.
Mike
Never heard of them. A quick look at prices suggests I'll never have one either. This was interesting:
http://www.alanhawk.com/reviews/suv4.html (http://www.alanhawk.com/reviews/suv4.html)
-steve
Wow! Cool reel. 8)
The Suveran has been scarce on ebay until the last few weeks. They're bringing around 200 bucks apiece.
I have no idea if true, but, they have always looked unbalanced and ungainly to me. What are the two serrated knobs doing?
Great engineering apparently.
Quote from: Rancanfish on March 21, 2020, 04:23:12 PMI have no idea if true, but, they have always looked unbalanced and ungainly to me.
Ha-ha, I remember thinking that when they were available in stores. They looked too plasticky and yes, "unbalanced" with those funky wheels. Boy, now I wish I'd snatched up a couple!
Quote from: Rancanfish on March 21, 2020, 04:23:12 PM
What are the two serrated knobs doing?
Great engineering apparently.
I assume, which I never like to do, that you are referring to the two plastic wheels. The one on the spool is for drag adjustment. That design is way less awkward and clumsy than a front of the spool adjustment. The one behind the rotor is for easy on and off anti-reverse.
Yes, great engineering! Many consider them to be the best, and highest quality, open face spinning reel ever made.
farmer 56 back ... reason i asked , maybe too much time on hand waiting for spring planting season ... and a few days ago i read that article by Alan Hawk .. so lo and behold saw a abu-garcia suveran s1000m on the evil-bay so i bought it ... will report back after first fish caught this may .. farmer out
These reels are for some the Holy Grail of spinners. I dont share this sentiment. Though I think they are great reels... Jeff
In the past 3-4 weeks there have been 15 or 16 Suverans sold on ebay. Someone got a "bargain" on one of those for $93.77, an S2000M. :o They usually go for double or more. Today there are about half a dozen on ebay. They're asking $375 :o plus shipping buy it now for one mint S4000M with the box and accessories, spare spool, manual, and tube of grease.
I don't recall seeing one of these reels. And I agree, they are awkward looking, but never really heard anything negative about their engineering. The drag and anti-reverse adjustment knobs remind me of the the focus adjustment on my old Nikon D8 camera.
Quote from: festus on March 21, 2020, 06:35:06 PM
In the past 3-4 weeks there have been 15 or 16 Suverans sold on ebay. Someone got a "bargain" on one of those for $93.77, an S2000M. :o They usually go for double or more. Today there are about half a dozen on ebay. They're asking $375 :o plus shipping buy it now for one mint S4000M with the box and accessories, spare spool, manual, and tube of grease.
I don't recall seeing one of these reels. And I agree, they are awkward looking, but never really heard anything negative about their engineering. The drag and anti-reverse adjustment knobs remind me of the the focus adjustment on my old Nikon D8 camera.
In the eBay "reel" world, when the stock market tanks the desirable specimens start coming out of the woodwork. 2008 & 09 were prime examples, so be prepared. ::)
Interesting reel -- and the engineering is exceptional, Dennis --
I have always thought that the concept of 4 different line capacity spools for the same reel was clever.
I know Alan Hawk through the years and also emails -- and have the utmost respect for his evaluations.
But another interesting thing, based on "reel" world experience -- why do manufacturers make key parts out of plastic?
Price and ease of manufacturing, I guess...
Case in point --
Restoring an old DAM Quick 440 reel for a client today.
While there are at least 18 or 20 parts on this reel that could have had plastic substituted for metals -- DQ chose to only make (3) parts out of plastic -- the spool, the crank knob, and a tiny black bail cover cap.
And...of these three parts made out of plastic -- after 50+ years, the plastic spool and cover cap did not survive. Just the crank knob.
Any shortcut manufactured out of plastic on a reel -- will always fail sooner than the metal parts of the same reel.
???
Best,
Fred
Fred ... farmer here .. you are spot on ... the vintage older engineering was and is remarkable ... both my two sons share the same views as you .. i see them eye-balling all the reels you made for me ... so Fred just look what your legacy will be in my family alone .. the boys each have their favorites picked out .. thanks again Dennis
Quote from: farmer56 on March 22, 2020, 04:07:55 PM
Fred ... farmer here .. you are spot on ... the vintage older engineering was and is remarkable ... both my two sons share the same views as you .. i see them eye-balling all the reels you made for me ... so Fred just look what your legacy will be in my family alone .. the boys each have their favorites picked out .. thanks again Dennis
Right, Dennis --
But make them boys wait a long time for your reels.
Or make them get their own in the meantime.
We don't want you leaving any time soon!
Best,
Fred
Quote from: farmer56 on March 22, 2020, 04:07:55 PM
Fred ... farmer here .. you are spot on ... the vintage older engineering was and is remarkable ... both my two sons share the same views as you .. i see them eye-balling all the reels you made for me ... so Fred just look what your legacy will be in my family alone .. the boys each have their favorites picked out .. thanks again Dennis
This is awesome...the boys love Fred's reels...they have great taste. I know my brother sure loves his 110 that Fred put together. Fred's Quick builds are like the president of DAM Quick requested a reel and they made him one that was tweaked in every possible way.
Good to see you on here Dennis...hope you're doing well. 8)
thanks mo all is well
Ok, farmer and others, I posted on Fred's "Old Unusual and Historical Reels" thread, that if I could lose my fear of wrecking a Suveran I got offa eBay, I'd disassemble mine. This one will prolly be a shelf queen. Got it for $230 after shipping and Tax. Advertised as a "Salesman's Sample" from Bobber Down Tackle store in Ruthven, IA. Pretty close to the old Spirit Lake, IA, headquarters for Abu Garcia.
After reading Allen Hawk's review years ago, I bid on prolly 5 or 6 of these that had low starting prices. Too many had that automatic "raise it by a dollar above the highest bid" thing set-up. Won't play that game. Recently, I finally won one. I agree with his assessment on the design/engineering quality. There's some very high quality parts and unique design stuff goin on here. But he wrote: " It's basically a small sized ALL METAL freshwater reel". AS Fred and Nelz noted on page one here, there are some plastic assemblies, mostly in the center drag system and to a lesser extent in the AR unit. Also, there's a plastic cap and push button on top of the beautiful aluminum spool. This cap is threaded into the spool—plastic threads—a cardinal sin in construction for me.
Indeed it has no signs of fishing use, but there is some slight fading of the lettering "MORE" at the center drag adjustment wheel. That drag wheel might be one of the first things I myself would play with in the store, given the advertising: "Revolutionary New Center Drag Technology"(on the box). The bottom of what I'll call the spool assembly has "Pro Command Magnum Drag" written on it—sounds pretty cool, but real hyped.
I wanted to show some of the "plasticky" parts that the Allen Hawk review left out. Please, if interested in this reel, read his review. Oc1 Steve has the reference on page 1. Several comments from members about the looks: "unbalanced, ungainly, awkward. Yeah, a giant rotor and spool relative to the gearbox. Even the stem/seat and handle make the gearbox look small. But, it is well balanced when you crank it.
I couldn't find anything on the history of these reels. The manual I have says 1998.
The spool assembly, note the plastic screw-on cap and push-button;
The spool hub(my noun for it). There are 3-main parts, all of them plastic composites. There are some metal components integrated with the hub sections: hub 1(top); a hub nut(screws onto the spool shaft) and ball bearing at the very top. A metal click spring for the drag when spinning. Note that hub part 1 is splined to a corresponding female section on the bottom of the spool. So, it's a ball bearing drag reel.
In these pictures, hub 1 is larger than hub 2, and hub 3 is of course, the largest. The last picture shows the external view of the AR system.
Inbetween the 1st and 2nd hub sections is where the rather complicated drag washer arrangement resides. Washers: 3-carbon, 2-eared metal, 2-keyed metal and 2-metal spring type on the bottom. Hub 2 has a metal click spring for drag adjustment. It is also splined for the drag washers and is threaded on the inside so it can be screwed upwards by turning hub 3.
Hub 3 has a hard rubber knurled outer section for drag adjustment, an aluminum insert with external threads and a nice anodized aluminium ring at the bottom, where the lettering is. Twisting it, screws hub 2 upwards into a stable hub 1, squeezing the drag washers(not showen).
Wow, godda get better at picture taking. Picture 2 & 3 are not complete, showing bad angles of hubs 1 & 2 and part of 3. Picture 4 shows the spool and all of the 3 hub parts. Picture 2 might give you an idea; from right to left: hub parts 1, 2 & 3. The drag washers I left up in hub 1, except for the spring washers which are still on hub 2.
It is a Purdy Thang .
Too bad for all the plastic holding otherwise well endowed drag system together .
👀The ARB and oscillating systems below the rotor. Didn't disassemble them, but you can see some small plastic parts and a plastic composite housing😫for the oscillation pawl(uppermost part, with the end of the pawl sticking out)IMO, a great way to do this on a spinning reel—It's a bait casting type of worm gear grove, machined into the spool shaft. The ARB on/off is the lower wheel on the reel. This one is plastic(as opposed to hard rubber like on the the upper drag adjustment wheel) and only moves about 15 degrees. The ARB is nylon(?) with plastic springs for the steel rollers. Yet more plastic supports these systems at the bottom(on top of the gearbox).
The handle assembly is really sturdy and innovative. Allen Hawk raves about it in his review and I agree with him.
BTW, this is a worm gear reel and another really cool design aspect is the worm is machined into 1 of the 3 parts that make up what I suppose you could call an elongated pinion gear. The whole spool shaft/pinion/ ARB/Oscillation complex is pretty darn unique and seems to be sturdy in-spite of of the plastic components.
I would really like to get a relatively inexpensive, used Suveran, just to see how it fishes. Might be hard to get one that's kinda beat-up enough to get a good price...
Externally, it's mostly a metal reel. Exposed plastic composites would be the spool cap, hub 3 and the AR on/off wheel. Everything else that isn't metal is covered/protected.
I just got a S1000M a couple of weeks back, found it on Facebook Marketplace 3 hours away near my brother's house. I got it for a price I couldn't refuse, also came with a spare 1000 size spool, a spare 2000 size spool, spare drag module, spare handle, and a spare complete rotor with the bail arm and line roller. I do really like it, but man is it heavy for a 1000 sized reel, considerably heavier than my Cardinal 3. I'm on the fence whether to service it and use or or pass it along to somebody else. I really like to hold on to these rare birds but I also like to fish them, and for me mostly fishing light and ultralight tackle, I fear it won't fit the way I fish. Fantastic reel way ahead of its time, even now, and it makes me wonder what it would be like now if the design continued to be improved upon.
Here's a pic of the haul, almost forgot to post it up.
(https://i.imgur.com/KJH4i8mh.jpg)
thanks Greg for the detailed pics of the Sueveran reel which I had no idea it existed until read about it
@Farmer, did you used your Suveran reel or its a shelf queen?