Benora is a swiss made reel from 50's. I cleaned it up to turn. But can't figure out if this is a two speed. Internals have two gears. Am i missing external part on handle like a button? How does this two speed engage on reel? Is it a handle trick
I think it WAS a two-speed. There was a button through the hole in the crank shaft, apparently now missing.
Too bad. That would be a cool reel. I would be interested to see the innards. It can't be impossible to make a new part, but i can well imagine it would be difficult to locate an original one, unless Fred just happens to have one of course.
Here is an instruction sheet I just stole from Ebay. See paragraph 1 and diagram at right.
.
Yes, the switching device (button) on the crank is missing.
(https://i.ibb.co/p0pvH4z/buch15-077.png) (https://imgbb.com/)
(https://i.ibb.co/nD2ykZL/P4150013.jpg) (https://imgbb.com/)
greeting Walter
Yeah, I have 3 or 4 of them in my totes but haven't taken the time to dig into them and see how they're designed. Maybe one of these days. They're a cool and interesting little reel.
If they're anything like the French Sup-Matic that two speed button shaft can be pretty delicate. The Sup-Matic's shaft is about the size if a #4 pencil lead.
Interesting...
Here is a photo that I found of the insides.
Since the double pinion is one piece, it looks to me like the shift button must pull the low main gear away from the pinion for high speed, but it still stays locked to the main shaft to drive the oscillation. Low speed must push the low main gear back in to engage with the pinion, and either pull the high main back, or more likely disengage it.
I think that this means that the line lay would vary depending on the gear ratio used, but with such a narrow spool, no harm, no foul.
As to why a 2.7:1 low gear is useful on such a small reel.... ???
(https://i.ibb.co/jgrVkwM/P1160902.jpg)
Source: https://ibb.co/ZWMHzg8 (https://ibb.co/ZWMHzg8)
One for sale at the big auction site right now.
-J
My guess is that it is a sliding key in the handle . :cf
The button on the handle is basically a spring loaded detent scenario. Push the button and pull the handle out and it pulls the small gear back into a recess in the large gear so that it doesn't hit the inner pinion gear, i.e. high speed. Push the button and push the handle in and it moves the small gear in to contact the back pinion gear, i.e. low speed. The button in front of the handle is the A/R/clicker. It's spring loaded with divots in the back of the large gear and works similar to the Dam Quick style.
FWIW, I took one of mine apart to see how it works, and BTW, the shaft inside the push button is really tiny.
So the push button is just a handle lock for up and down. The outer gear is free wheeling when the handle is down . When the handle is up , the little gear moves up with the handle ,it dogs itself to the outer gear making it the driver ?
I am willing to take reel apart at the gears to show everybody the mechanism. What do I have to lose! Think of it as a tuition reel to learn about a reel design from 50's
Does your handle move up and down now with out the button ? Or is it locked in low gear.
The handle is locked in low gear. When i pull handle it moves but the reel will not lock
I see a tiny hole in the handle when you unscrew the handle. There is no pencil lead shaft showing. When i get gear disassembled...
I didn't go any farther than to remove the side plate, push the button and pull and the handle in and out to see how the two speed mechanisms work. It looked pretty complicated to me to remove the push button and turn knob on the end of the handle shaft. I didn't want to dig that deep and get that far into it right now. I did notice that both the button and turn knob have small holes in them. I'm not sure of their purpose at this point since they were both full of dirty black grease.
Maybe that helps a little. Here are the two Benoras I have and a few more pictures.
(https://i.ibb.co/Lr5jjzL/P1180633.jpg) (https://ibb.co/PMQXXZ7)
Unfortunately I only have the role drawing of the big role, but the small one should be similar.
(https://i.ibb.co/4twz21J/P1180634.jpg) (https://ibb.co/wgZV7cY)
(https://i.ibb.co/CQ4Chbr/P1180635.jpg) (https://ibb.co/TtJjm4C)
1:2,7
(https://i.ibb.co/B4s71gc/P1180636.jpg) (https://ibb.co/z8fLkSQ)
1:4,4
greeting Walter
This is rapidly escalating into a really good thread
Thanks, Walter! As far as I can tell at this point is that the only purposes of the turn knob on the handle shaft is to house the push button and secure the crank handle in place. That collapsible handle design is similar to that of the later Dam Quick Juniors. I haven't figured out yet how to remove that knob.
:D Well Y`all got my interest peaked enough that I have one on the way to the house . It be couple 3 days before i get it and will pull it apart !
Quote from: oldmanjoe on March 14, 2023, 05:45:45 PM:D Well Y`all got my interest peaked enough that I have one on the way to the house . It be couple 3 days before i get it and will pull it apart !
Good! You get to be, and also work on, the guinea pig. :d That way hopefully I won't break mine. ;D
Save you all time! Decided to take a break from grant reviews!
Don't know why pics aren't in order!
Highlights:the handle has a sleeve set screw that holds gear set in. In center of gear set is set screw that holds a spring. The spring engages two ball that go up and down with spring in shaft. The small gear locks into four holes in main gear to spin on rotation. The handle spring pushes out small gear. The reel outer gear is now engaged in reel. Note case has anti reverse that is simple lever. I can't seem to activate the small gear externally as spring locked in to two balls on shaft.
The anti-reverse system is similar or the same as the DAM Quick / DAM Quick 250 Standard, the crank is, as Tommy already wrote, similar to the DAM Junior (heart-form).
In Germany, the Coast was introduced in 1956 and the Standard in 1954
In your example yours is missing the push button on the end of the shaft. My question is if the push button is still in place and in tact how does one remove the handle tightening knob? On my reels that knob won't just unscrew off the end, it stops at the end of the threaded shaft.
My knob comes off. Perhaps thats why the button was lost. The knob turns clockwise to come off. There is a set screw hole in my knob, i think ? Dont know if pictures
The knurled nut must turn so that the crank can be applied.
But your lost button, it had a locking screw.
I am attaching a macro image.
(https://i.ibb.co/5hqLksy/P1180642.jpg) (https://ibb.co/ZzyxScP)
Best, Walter
The coastreel (the left reel in the picture) also has this screw in the button. But you can't put the crank there.
(https://i.ibb.co/gW0c3rz/P1180638.jpg) (https://ibb.co/dpNHrfG)
On the right you can see the crank applied to the Standard.
Quote from: Walter61 on March 15, 2023, 07:14:10 PMThe knurled nut must turn so that the crank can be applied.
But your lost button, it had a locking screw.
I am attaching a macro image.
(https://i.ibb.co/5hqLksy/P1180642.jpg) (https://ibb.co/ZzyxScP)
Best, Walter
That is starting to make seance , the set screw in the button is locked to the trip rod # 52 . The trip rod must come out from the other side ? What is a little puzzling is that hole in the knurling of the nut .
It`s to close to the button channel and too far back from the threads ? Oil port ?
Makes perfect sense now that i have removed gear and taken apart reel. The reel is missing part 52 and button with set screw!!there is an oil port cover on stem as well. I agree that hole in knurl knob is for oiling. Benora 2speed is an interesting reel. I have locked this in as a one speed for now!! But i do like to tinker! I definitely need to get a working 2sp to fish in saltwater as I don't collect but have a nice parts reel available.
When I get the reel apart i will measure the parts and will try and make the parts that you need . Rite now it looks to be a week before i get it .
Wow. Many thANKS
Thanks for that photo, Walter. It's starting to make a little more sense now. That set screw in the button in my reel that I first looked at was covered in black grease so I couldn't tell there was a screw in there. I agree about the hole in the knob probably being an oil port. Mine was originally plugged with grease, too, but when cleaned it out with a pick I could see through it to the tiny button shaft. I'm wondering if if there's some type of flare, etc., that prevents the knob from being turned to far out over the button and being lost?
I took another picture with the knurled screw fully open. It cannot be lost and hits the button.
I also think that the hole in the knurled screw is an oil hole.
But there is still such a strange screw (arrow).
This screw has two holes, I think that should also be an oil hole. Tried opening the thing with a cut off paper clip. It doesn't work properly, I think I'll have to build an extra tool.
(https://i.ibb.co/xMpqyZV/P1180649.jpg) (https://ibb.co/0fgyk5P)
One though that i had is if you unscrew the handle all the way , you do and can break the # 52 rod at the thinnest part were ball bearing release is . That`s provided that the set screw is tight in the button . Like Tommy said it`s lead pencil fragile .
I tried to upload the enlarge photo of part number 52 .
I find thoes bits in kit like this .
https://www.amazon.com/Security-Tamper-Proof-Screwdriver-LIQUIDATION/dp/B00BTKFFAU/ref=asc_df_B00BTKFFAU/?tag=hyprod-20&linkCode=df0&hvadid=309832851244&hvpos=&hvnetw=g&hvrand=1179
That's a neat little set, Joe. Thanks for the link! I usually have to end up making mine out of an old cheap #### screwdriver or flattened nail.
:) OK the reel showed up today and i was able to tear into it . There is some steps that need to be done in order to get this reel apart and to make it easier to reassembly..
The button has a set screw , straight blade screw driver , micro small !! It will not come all the way out , it hits the handle nut . Yes the nut is locked down and still no room . That hole in the knurling part of the nut is not a oil hole . It`s meant to be lined up with the button screw , so when the screw is backed out of the button it also passes through the handle nut . You may be able to loosen the screw enough to get past the flat that is on the # 52 trip rod . the button is threaded to the rod .
(https://alantani.com/gallery/37/17471-180323041824-378241814.jpeg)
(https://alantani.com/gallery/37/17471-180323041841-378252269.jpeg)
(https://alantani.com/gallery/37/17471-180323041349-378111289.jpeg)
I learned as i went on . you can wait on removal of button and get it later .
The easiest way to tear down the handle and gear assembly is to remove the 3 screws and remove the gear assembly.
(https://alantani.com/gallery/37/17471-180323054025-3782761.jpeg)
(https://alantani.com/gallery/37/17471-180323054000-378261882.jpeg)
Clean the center of the gear , there is screw in there and a spring that put pressure on the trip rod .
The trip rod has a small slot on the bottom of it , that you can hold it or help unscrew it from the button if necessary.
(https://alantani.com/gallery/37/17471-180323061105-37835318.jpeg)
(https:%5Bimg%5Dhttps://alantani.com/gallery/37/17471-180323061020-37832245.jpeg)//alantani.com
This is the flat on the side that the button set screw locks in to .
(https://alantani.com/gallery/37/17471-180323061020-37832245.jpeg)
The drive nut that the handle locks to is next to be removed " left hand thread " The low speed shaft can be removed from the high speed gear . The ball detents should fall into there holes making it easier to remove the shaft .
The high speed shaft is held in with a spanner head screw and has a pin tail to lock into a sliding bearing
(https://alantani.com/gallery/37/17471-180323041639-37818807.jpeg)
(https://alantani.com/gallery/37/17471-180323041709-378191228.jpeg)
(https://alantani.com/gallery/37/17471-180323041614-3781780.jpeg)
(https://alantani.com/gallery/37/17471-180323041551-37816962.jpeg)
Super Joe, excellent work
This is really good stuff. Gotta get myself one of these. So far, it seems like no parts impossible to replicate.
.
Bet everyone selling one of these on the bay is thrilled that this thread took off
Quote from: oldmanjoe on March 16, 2023, 12:52:53 PMI find thoes bits in kit like this .
Here's a minimalist tool pouch version of what Joe has. We called those screws "snake eyes".
Quote from: Robert Janssen on March 18, 2023, 09:26:13 AMThis is really good stuff. Gotta get myself one of these. So far, it seems like no parts impossible to replicate.
.
:) I know that this is right up your ally . Working on this reel ,is like working on a pocket watch . I have done # 4 screws , but this is down to # 1 size . Or to be correct 2 mm thread .
I am not sure if i can cut this on a lath or set up a grinder ?
(https://alantani.com/gallery/37/17471-180323061047-37834223.jpeg)
(https://alantani.com/gallery/37/17471-180323174743-378362260.jpeg)
I don`t see the need to thread the button to the shaft , i think it can be done with a smooth shaft and set screw . But the Swiss do it because they can .
The top numbers are the lengths and the bottom numbers are the diameters
Nice work Joe!
So the mechanism works as I suggested earlier.
The basic mechanism that fixes the small main gear to to the shaft and uses the outside face of the small main to drive the large main eliminates one of the main problem areas in many two speeds - having the shaft switch drive load from one main to the other. This is such a simple clean design, albeit with some tradeoffs.
Not sure how the small main meshes when re-engaging with the pinion. It also seems there could be a point where the pinion could spin backward under load during a shift, unless the anti-reverse acts on the pinion.
.040 inch is pretty skinny. Assume that in order to make this cut, the part has to be supported on both sides. Might need to be tempered afterward, too.
-J
Well done, Joe! I'm starting to wonder how my stiff clubby old hands and fingers are going to manipulate those minute little parts. :o ;D Does one need to completely remove that button set screw through the hole in the knurled knob before removing the knob?
I'm starting to wish I had a video setup for this disassembly rather than just a camera. ::)
Quote from: Midway Tommy on March 18, 2023, 06:30:39 PMWell done, Joe! I'm starting to wonder how my stiff clubby old hands and fingers are going to manipulate those minute little parts. :o ;D Does one need to completely remove that button set screw through the hole in the knurled knob before removing the knob?
I'm starting to wish I had a video setup for this disassembly rather than just a camera. ::)
I will tell you that i am using a big magnifier glass and tweezers and forceps . that button screw is a little bigger than the eye glasses screws
I think that you could back the screw out just enough to clear the locking flat . I pulled it out because i did not know what to expect . I was surprised that it was threaded , i was expecting a smooth shaft with a pocket detent for the set screw .
Ok looking at it again and playing with it , if you can see all of the screw hole , than you can loosing the set screw with a driver and unscrew the button . The one i have was half buried . One turn of the button out and the screw is wide open . I can see why you can`t lock it up here , i don`t see a critical travel requirement . The ball detent slot is long enough , that it does not affect the shifting of gears.
The screw can stay in the button ,Just back it flush with the button side and it will clear the flat lande on the shaft . One less thing to fool with fat fingers ..
Quote from: jurelometer on March 18, 2023, 06:09:12 PMNice work Joe!
So the mechanism works as I suggested earlier.
The basic mechanism that fixes the small main gear to to the shaft and uses the outside face of the small main to drive the large main eliminates one of the main problem areas in many two speeds - having the shaft switch drive load from one main to the other. This is such a simple clean design, albeit with some tradeoffs.
Not sure how the small main meshes when re-engaging with the pinion. It also seems there could be a point where the pinion could spin backward under load during a shift, unless the anti-reverse acts on the pinion.
.040 inch is pretty skinny. Assume that in order to make this cut, the part has to be supported on both sides. Might need to be tempered afterward, too.
-J
(https://alantani.com/gallery/37/17471-180323202427-378371204.jpeg)
This picture shows the pins and sockets between the 2 gears " drive dogs " The outer gear "high gear " is always in mesh with pinion , it is free wheeling , and the anti reverse works with this gear alone .
Low gear , when in low gear is in direct contact with the pinion . "I should note that the 2 pinions are tied together 2 difference gear counts " Low gear is the driver " tied to the handle " When you shift into high gear , low gear pulls away from the pinion and now locks up 'Pins and socket " to the high gear , now making it the driver and no longer a free wheeling gear .
The spring that pushes on the trip rod makes the gear change snappy . You can go slow a get the two gears in a neutral state and spin the handle and the spool oscillation will be the only thing working .
As long as the anti reverse is engaged and you do get this in between gears , the rotor will not back up on you .
The 1 X 7mm section is some delicate work.
I do believe a piece of the trip rod is still in fishgolfman reel , when i see the ball detent sticking up on the shaft , other wise they would fall into the shaft .
You are probably right on a piece still in. The spring came out easily when I unscrewed the recessed set screw and the ball bearings were inside of shaft. When i played with spring and re inserted did ball bearings pop out. Upon assembly in frame, the re assembly has reel locked in the big gear vs the small gear. Challenge will be to dissemble when i get parts.
Quote from: oldmanjoeI am not sure if i can cut this on a lath or set up a grinder ?
[
I don`t see the need to thread the button to the shaft , i think it can be done with a smooth shaft and set screw
Yeah, that's going to be a bit finicky, but not impossible. The thread is probably a normal M2. There are dies for that, and it can be done before the finicky bits. Or like you said, just skip it. Make a little notch for a set screw instead.
The skinny 1 mm bit, hmm well maybe sharp carbide tools, or a toolpost grinder would do that nicely. Or just put a Dremel in the toolpost.
Maybe start with a decently hardened shaft to begin with, like a 1/8" allen wrench for example. That way you don't have to worry so much about bendy parts or hardening & annealing. Or a decent quality small screwdriver shaft. Those are super strong.
I'm sure you'll figure it out. Easy does it, and make a few test cuts, try it a few different ways... you'll get there.
.
This thread makes me want to bid on the big auction board for a functional 2sp benora reel!! As far as functional two speed spinners got a dam quick 275, zangi 3v three speed and sup- matic 707!! Going to partially disassemble the 3v to show the board the gearing and reel itself in a new thread when i am back from fishing in florida.
Quote from: Fishgolfman on March 18, 2023, 11:41:11 PMAs far as functional two speed spinners got a dam quick 275, zangi 3v three speed and sup- matic 707!! Going to partially disassemble the 3v to show the board the gearing and reel itself in a new thread when i am back from fishing in florida.
Be very careful if you decide to delve into that 707! Their handle button shaft is very small, brittle and breaks easily. (Don't ask me how I know :-[ ) I've also seen quite a few of those Sup-Matic two speeds missing that button. I read somewhere that heat is needed to remove it but after I had one break I haven't had the wherewithal to jump back into them. I've got a half dozen or so that need to be restoed.
If you can't find a Benora reasonably priced on daBay let me know. I have one that everything works on except the bail spring that needs a good cleaning & adjustment and the reel needs a good servicing that I would consider parting with.
When i get back from fla. May take you up on benora opportunity.
I had made one trip rod from welding wire , and didn`t like feel of it , was not hard enough material .
Than i tried Robert`s idea of the Allen key , That was much better . I did not grind along slot for the ball bearing detent . I felt that is was not necessary to be so long and create a weak point . (https://alantani.com/gallery/37/17471-190323145033-37839737.jpeg)
I have it in test mode now and it does work , i will most likely make another so i can refine and polish it .
(https://alantani.com/gallery/37/17471-190323145022-37838406.jpeg)
I will make a button later on today .
Amazing, Joe! 8)
8) I made another one from a Allen wrench stock . Sparks a flying .
(https://alantani.com/gallery/37/17471-190323194732-378421227.jpeg)
I ruffed out a button , just need to see what the ace hardware has for small set screws, than i can trim down the length !
(https://alantani.com/gallery/37/17471-190323194721-378411460.jpeg)
(https://alantani.com/gallery/37/17471-190323194707-37840133.jpeg)
Joe. As usual. Great work. I've been enjoying this thread immensely.
Absolutely amazing!!
Quote from: JasonGotaProblem on March 18, 2023, 01:35:40 PMBet everyone selling one of these on the bay is thrilled that this thread took off
:) I see some one picked up one yesterday !!!
Quote from: oldmanjoe on March 20, 2023, 03:02:45 PMQuote from: JasonGotaProblem on March 18, 2023, 01:35:40 PMBet everyone selling one of these on the bay is thrilled that this thread took off
:) I see some one picked up one yesterday !!!
The ones I saw I thought were way over priced, especially considering their condition.
Yes this thread has reel collectors interested!! Was not my intention just curious on functional oddity of my scrap heap reel!!
I moved on to the knob today . It was frozen and cracked , finally got it free .
I decided to spin a couple . Made 2 that are a little more in diameter than the stock size .
Seems to be a problem on these reels according to pictures that i have seen .
My knob is such a disaster! If I remove my black knob...it will disintegrate!! Nice job!!
Quote from: Fishgolfman on March 21, 2023, 11:11:44 PMMy knob is such a disaster! If I remove my black knob...it will disintegrate!! Nice job!!
;D That`s why I made a few , looks like you need one real bad !
I've noticed that on a lot of the examples, too. Interestingly enough, all three of the reels I've got have pretty nice knobs on them.
Ok I wasn`t sure if you needed any .
Dug out my three & took a quick photo of the handle sides. One shows some wear on the crank and the knob is a little dull but overall the knobs are in nice condition on all three. None have been serviced yet. The reel on the left has seen a quite a bit of use but works as it should. The other two don't show much use at all. :D
;D I made one more trip rod and button . The smallest set screw that i can find local was a stainless steel 6/32 Allen socket . It was a little bigger than i wanted , but it works and it is a lot easier to handle !!!
A 1/16 Allen wrench for the setscrew , and it helps to remove a trip rod . It fits in the center shaft . I found that you do not have to tear down the shafts to replace the rod . All that is need is the set screw and spring remove from the center gear . The ball bearing will stay in there pockets.
I believe you have a broken piece in your reel ,the Allen wrench inserted from the handle side will push it out . Insert the new shaft ,spring and set screw ,than the button .
Two pictures . First one is your trip rod and button and you can see that the set screw is just exposed . Second picture. is what i am sending you . and there is a piece of broke trip rod that i think is in yours .
They do look in good shape . I think the knob screw rusts and breaks the knobs on the i have seen .
I started to put 8 pound momo line on the spool today . After a couple yards i checked the drag.
It was jerky , it was like compression strokes on a small gas engine .
I popped off the serrated cup and found 3 belleville washers and 1 keyed washer .
After looking at the schematics #18 is two belleville and I don`t know what # 19 is.
When i blow up the picture , it is thick with a knurled look to it . Any guesses what it is .
Took all 3 of mine apart today, Joe, and they're all the same as yours, and in the same configuration as you have laid out. Bottom is dome down to the spool, second is big diameter down to bottom washer big diameter with dome up and top washer is dome down to second washer dome and the keyed washer goes against top washer big diameter. I'm wondering if the bottom washer dome digs into the bottom of the spool cavity?
I have tried all the combinations < > < , > < > ,<<< , >>> . I don`t think there is any digging going on . I even played with a resitex washer from 330 quick spool , front and back .
The best so far is spool < > < resitex keyed washer .
I also checked little Benora's panes. Also the same arrangement.
(https://i.ibb.co/PFj1MBK/P1180769.jpg) (https://ibb.co/6rwD86z)
The reelshematic is from the larger Benora Coast.
(https://i.ibb.co/zPSWySM/P1180772.jpg) (https://ibb.co/44jw6jq)
So I checked the discs right away and they fit, as the reel shematic shows.
The thick disk is made of rubber.
(https://i.ibb.co/M7FRh5T/P1180771.jpg) (https://ibb.co/m4fHBFs)
Any chance a carbon disk in a well chosen spot would help?
Thank You Walter . That makes perfect sense now , looking at the wrong schematic ...
Quote from: JasonGotaProblem on April 01, 2023, 01:54:47 PMAny chance a carbon disk in a well chosen spot would help?
Yes i was thinking spool , carbon ,> < > keyed washer .
I've never cared much for the cone shaped or wavy metal washers in drag configurations.
If there's no eared washers I'd think spool, carbon, keyed washer, then the wavy ones.
Quote from: JasonGotaProblem on April 01, 2023, 03:10:33 PMIf there's no eared washers I'd think spool, carbon, keyed washer, then the wavy ones.
The flat keyed washer needs to be on top directly under the drag knob.
Quote from: JasonGotaProblem on April 01, 2023, 03:10:33 PMIf there's no eared washers I'd think spool, carbon, keyed washer, then the wavy ones.
:) That can work too , i will give that a try..
Quote from: Midway Tommy on April 01, 2023, 03:22:10 PMQuote from: JasonGotaProblem on April 01, 2023, 03:10:33 PMIf there's no eared washers I'd think spool, carbon, keyed washer, then the wavy ones.
The flat keyed washer needs to be on top directly under the drag knob.
At first i though that also ,but the springs are on top of the key . The only movement the spring will see is when you tighten or loosen the nut .
OK, I guess. :-\
The "moment of truth" which started this thread.I have time to tackle after St Augustine, Fla and Barcelona. Tommy supplied me with a functional Benora, as a comparator. Joe supplied me with three important parts. The rod, button and new knob!! Many thanks. Reel on top to be repaired! Have to re read all the threads to tackle restoration.
Surprised myself on an ebay find, thinking it was same size as my original Benora. Its bigger and functional as a two speed. Chipped reel foot but fits most rods seats.
Documenting the repair! Removed the interlocked gear set from body. Removed the set screw from small gear. Using a pick i was able to get spring out. Note on small gear shaft, two ball locks. Using a small allen wrench as suggested by Joe, pushed out small broken piece. Note that the joe supplied shaft next to broken piece. Broken head has a slot for small screw driver? Hopefully slot not needed in repair. The handle screw is rusted frozen but soak overnight will loosen with heat. Spool crusted with salt which soak overnight will rid of!
Yes the original shaft has a slot . I believe it is for back up ,in case the button was stuck to the shaft threads . The .040 midsection would most likely break if it was really stuck . That`s one of the reasons to try a straight shaft into the button . The spring seams to put enough pressure on the shaft to screw and unscrew the button from the shaft on the original setup .
Good for you, Stephen, on picking up the larger saltwater size, even if it does have a chip foot! You don't seen them in that size often. Keep documenting and showing us the process until you've completed your total dis- and re- assemblies.
Thought I would add to this thread a bit... Yeah, I bought one of these a while back too. It has been on my list for a long time; just hadn't gotten to it yet.
But now I did. Opportunity came up to buy one cheaply. Granted, in poor condition, but that doesn't really bother me.
So, it arrived, and hoooeee, what a rough life it had lived. A real train wreck.
Paint flaked off, corroded all over, knobs and dials with tool rash, the skirt behind the rotor had corroded right through in places. Strangely, no salt or grime anywhere, so somebody must have run it through the dishwasher or something.
Well, okay... this can't be too hard. Just going to need some doing, that's all.
So, after some disassembly, and about that rotor skirt thing, that is a two-step process:
1) throw old one away
2) make new one
And for some more disassembly help on the pinion... that rotor was torqued on TIGHT, so I milled a couple of flats into the pinion. That will come in handy later in life.
Managed to get the shift assembly and rod apart in one piece, that is good.
Aaaand then, when i tried to get the second, handle support knob unscrewed from the main gear, it was seized up pretty tight. Twist, twist, creeeak... click.
Click. Dammit, twisted the threaded portion right off. Sigh.
Okay, that is not good, but not that big of a deal. Just go back to the lathe and make a new one. The thread is an M5 Lefty. Zipzipzip, done. Turned down a little neck on it and counterbored the main gear shaft to fit, then brazed it into place. All done, it turned out rather well.
To be continued
While I was over at the lathe, I also made a new cylindrical handle part. Stainless this time. Much better.
The body itself was actually in pretty good condition. It just needed a skin peel spa treatment in the sand blaster along with a foundation of grey primer.
This will turn out fine with some green paint. And so it did.
All the other chrome and silver parts needed a lot of buffing and polishing, but turned out rather well in the end.
And then I also made a new conical handle screw knob, also in stainless steel.
Generally, i am very reluctant to make any changes on a reel, especially a collector's item. In this case however, the reel was in such poor condition that it was necessary, and the rest of the world should be happy that it is still alive.
All told, it came out rather nicely. And when paired with this Hardy's of England split-cane bamboo rod, will be a fine item for those opportunities when one goes fine fishing in a tweed suit.
Nice, Dr. Rob! Lucky you to have the mechanical capabilities and appropriate tools at your disposal to accomplish such a great save & restoration. Well done! :al
Simply amazing. I aspire to learn how to do this!!
Not all things are easy as it seems. Joe made me a wooden knob among other things for the small Benora. The handle is a probelm. I can't unscrew the knob shaft from handle. I used soaked in 50% vinegar, penetrating oil. I was able to get knob shaft to spin but nut won't cone off. Afraid i might break something. Tommy or Joe any suggestions
Stephen,
The only suggestion I have is to use the correct size screw driver on the bolt and a slotted (spanner) screwdriver or bit to hold the nut. That's what I used on mine and they came apart just fine. The threads are standard right-tight, left-loose.
Will have to fabricate a a slotted spanner screwdriver or buy a set.
Quote from: Midway Tommy on April 22, 2023, 06:00:58 PMNice, Dr. Rob! Lucky you to have the mechanical capabilities and appropriate tools at your disposal to accomplish such a great save & restoration. Well done! :al
I just got back from vacation and playing catch up . You have done a wonderful job machining all those parts , i especial like the way you handled the new threads on the gear shaft .
Quote from: Fishgolfman on April 24, 2023, 07:55:47 PMWill have to fabricate a a slotted spanner screwdriver or buy a set.
I cheated and used a small vice grip pliers to loosen the nut while using a screwdriver also .
One unaddressed question. What's the drag like on this fella? Is it set up to utilize this 2 speed?
Quote from: oldmanjoe on April 28, 2023, 12:18:07 PMI cheated and used a small vice grip pliers to loosen...
I tried that on the line roller on mine, with the result that the line roller cracked and crumbled into pieces. So, i had to make a new one of those too.
Quote from: JasonGotaProblem on April 28, 2023, 12:25:54 PMWhat's the drag like on this fella?
Mine was pretty lousy. In fact, the whole spool was lousy. Initially I was seriously considering making a new spool with substantially improved drag components. In the end, I just didn't bother, but instead poked a small CF drag washer under the spool.
There's a part of me wondering if there's any DAM reels with a similar diameter spool shaft. If so I'd want to steal the spool and rotor (especially if it's a skirted spool but that's 100% personal prejudice) and make one heck of a fish-ready frankenreel.
Quote from: oldmanjoe on April 28, 2023, 12:18:07 PMQuote from: Fishgolfman on April 24, 2023, 07:55:47 PMWill have to fabricate a a slotted spanner screwdriver or buy a set.
I cheated and used a small vice grip pliers to loosen the nut while using a screwdriver also .
I would be afraid of pinching the nut just enough to make even more difficult to loosen, which is usually my luck. :D Fabricating a slotted spanner type screwdriver only takes around 15 minutes if you have some sort of anvil surface, a grinder or a couple of good files. I generally use a cheapie old screwdriver to fabricate specialty tools like this that aren't used frequently.
Quote from: JasonGotaProblem on April 28, 2023, 12:25:54 PMOne unaddressed question. What's the drag like on this fella? Is it set up to utilize this 2 speed?
About like most spinning reel drags from that era, leaving something to be desired, especially when tightened down past their design capabilities. :D
I ordered slotted screwdriver set.. Unfortunately the sizes are not right. Harbor freight i go to get a few cheap screwdrivers to make a special slotted screw drivers for future projects too! Dremel time!!!
I was looking at your photo`s of the handle . You have a hot mess there with all the rust .
Keep soaking it . Also keep in mind there are 2 nuts on that screw . I will show in pictures .
You can use pliers on the screw down low close to the wood handle nut side , the nut it self and the back side nut . Just grab litely and rock back and forth a little at a time to break it loose .
when you grab the split nut , grab it slit to slit ,this way you are not closing tighter on the nut
You have more intestinal fortitude than me, Joe! :D
The rusted handle part is soaking in liquid wrench! Also need to fabricate the slotted screw drivers!! Want to finish this project on the bench with Joe's parts!!! I have two project reels also on bench a zangi delphino whose rotor nut won't come off and a penn mag 970 with salted on screws! I want to jump on the Big Benora to clean up! I have rule of three, only three project reels at a time!!
It only takes about 15 minutes to make a spanner/slotted tip out of a screwdriver. Good luck working on 3 at a time, Stephen. With my crusty old memory I need to finish one before I start on another. :) Sometimes I even forget where I was at on just one. ;D Thank God for cameras! ;)
Finally. Took a couple west coast trips,barcelona, st augustine and north carolina. Soaked for months in liquid wrench. Challenge 1: remembering how I disassembled. Challenge2: having all the old parts and joe's fabrication. Challenge 3:dry fitting. The spring loaded shaft and ball bearing stopping insertion. Challenge 4: the handle knob. Had to resort to liquid wrench for months, butane heat and vise grips. The fabricated split screwdriver didn't work not enough torque. Sixty years of crud. Finally the assembled reel sans knob!!! Works. Put together joes knob and a working reel!!!!Note that the spool has old linen? Line. Opinions in removing? I am going to put 6-10 lb monofilament to fish this restored treasure. Many thanks to old man joe and midway tommy for advice and parts
My reel graduated to functional status!!! While not close to perfect, it works to reel at two speeds. Sharing the final pictures. Note Joe's button and wooden knob. Quite a journey.
That was quite an ordeal! Glad you got it put back together and it works. 8)
8 pages later we got to a working reel. This Is great!
Seriously though this was a very entertaining thread.
Glad to see you have the reel put back together and it works ..
This thread peek my interest to get one , because of the difference in the way a two speed can work .
Time to start a new thread on DQ 275. Two speed. I have one almost resurrected from a franken reel! Still need a couple of parts from Fred!!