Useful Life of Rods

[Bill Karr]

I'm very curious as to the opinions of the experts as to the useful life of rods. Do they lose their strength/ durability over time? Is there a difference between, S Glass, E Glass, the newer graphite composites? I have some older rods that are not used much like a self made 20-30 (guess) 6 1/2 ft. built on a Contender blank, A 1971 vintage Fenwick 8'3'' 12-15 on it's 3d set of guides, and a couple of Calstars pushing 20 years.
I appreciate your opinions.
Thanks,
Bill

[alantani]

as long as you get the right amount of flex you need, the blank is fine.  then is just a question of the condition of the guides and reel seat.  

[Jon Vadney]

Alan nailed it.  It's not the blank you need to worry about, it's the components. 
The difference between the variety of materials blanks are made of:
E-glass = fiberglass that is bonded with a polyester resin
S-glass = fiberglass that is bonded with an epoxy
Graphite composite = a combination of fiberglass and graphite that helps to reduce weight, increase lifting power, while still being more durable than solid graphite blanks. 
Calstar grafighters, seeker black steel, Phenix axis, and some others are graphite/Eglass composites. Super seekers are graphite/Sglass composites (the best imo).  The one drawback of Sglass is that it's heavier, but if I'm throwin a big 2speed on a rod I'm not sweatin a couple of ounces on a rod.

[Bill B]

jon thanks for the simple explanation.....would have taken me weeks to figure the S glass, E glass, graphite composites out, but then I never knew that much to ask the right questions...Alan's website has to be the best place for reel/rod info anywhere...except for Sal's new book....Bill

[Jeri]

Hi Bill,

I would disagree slightly with some of the answers offered, though with the more 'boat' orientated rods you have mentioned, there replies are probably spot on.

On a lot of high flex rods, like Bass, fly, spinning and surf, especially rods where the angler puts a lot of casting use into the rod, there will be deterioration over time, or more specifically 'use'.

An example might be a semi-pro Bass angler that does upwards of 1000 casts per day, over the course of a year, would see a deterioration in a specific rod, especially should he then buy a brand new rod of exactly the same model – the used rod would appear 'softer'. The same with a fly rod that is used extensively – then when compared to a brand new version of the same model – it would appear to lack 'crispness'.

We see this a lot in the competition level surf anglers, having a favoured model of blank – that after 5 years suffers an accident and needs replacing with exactly the same model. They complain that the new rod is a lot stiffer.

What they aren't seeing in all these cases is that in these high flex situations, the microscopic bond between resins and core material is weakening or even breaking down to the point where there is a certain amount of internal delamination of the bonded layers of glass or carbon. They are not recognising that the rod is getting softer in action, through extensive casting use.

Basically as the casting situation flexes the rod in both directions, so both sides of the rod blank are repeatedly stressed through a cycle of compression and tension – it is a little like the repeated bending of a paper clip; though that is producing metal fatigue, rather than resin fatigue.

Another aspect is the effect of UV light on the resins bonding the layers, and should there be very high exposure or a defect in the outer coating layers, then over time the resin breaks down to a slight degree. We see this outer delamination on a lot of very old rods that come through our workshop for refurbishment. On completion of stripping the blanks prior to new painting, we find that we might get rods that strands of carbon are loose on the surface, especially in the upper sections of the rod.

This outer layer exposure and resin degradation due to UV exposure is going to be an issue in time with a lot of blanks that went through the 'fashion' phase of being supplied without coating – or matt or stealth finish as the advertisers offered. Thankfully, the blank manufacturers have gone away from this raw finish style now, and most are supplying blanks coated is various forms of protection – hopefully more UV resistant coatings.

Of course neither of these situations are likely with more boat orientated fishing, as the rods are not under the same kinds of repeated loadings or exposure.

So, I would agree with the advise that you have been given, and in part disagree.


Cheers from sunny Africa


Jeri

[Bill Karr]

Thanks all. Very good info.

[SoCalAngler]

I will add a little here because I'm in a bit of a retro phase when looking at rods now for some of the types of fishing I do. When I say retro I mean going "old school" for some of my gear. I don't mean buying new rods desinged to have the older feel but old rods.

Jon and Alan covered the most obvious when looking at old rods and Jeri is spot on with the more use a rod gets the softer the bonds of the meterial making up the rod can become and in turn making it less "stiff".

One other thing that can happen over time is delamination of the meterial making up the rod. Several factors can cause this like the quality of meterials used, heat, UV, skill of the person who made that exact rod and others. With delanination of a rod it will become much more weaker and more fragile with age and this can be very hard to see. The best way to test this to give the rod a good bend and if you hear or feel alot of cracking or popping when you do this that rod may have issues. Now here is the tricky part, most older rods will have some cracking and popping feeling especially if they have not been used in some time and if you dont know to hold the tip of the rod corectly when bending it you may bust a perfectly good rod.

Let me say and I have and fish rods that were built around 30 to 40 years ago and I know some that even fish older rods.

[Ron Jones]

I have several Fenwick and Silo-Flex rods from the 60s and they are still running strong. In my experience the #1 thing that causes age issues with rods is UV damage. Lets say environmental damage because I'm sure someone is going to say that carbon pollution kills rods. Regardless, keeping your rods protected from the elements makes them last much longer than leaving them in open air rod holders. Obviously your going to run around on the boat with them staged, ready to go but otherwise they should be protected as much as possible.
Ron

[thorhammer]

agree with statement about high-use lighter rods maybe getting softer....we should all have that problem of fishing that much. i am currently rewrapping an 8' surfer for a buddy that i wrapped for him 20 years ago, and the rod was ten years old then. no issue in performance, he just smashed a guide but I'm doing a full repaint / rewrap. then again, this rods makes only several casts per trip and sits in a surf spike.

[Capt Ahab]

I have seen some of my high end LM bass rods get a little softer after a few year of use - I am one of those 1000 casts guys and fish them 4-7 days in season

I have also had some high end (20 plus year old) but very old rods just explode  - they de laminated from age and probably UV

Not much you can do about that -


All glass rods will certainly get softer and start to splinter with heavy use and time